Alex the Grey Parrot has died

[jgraz]

Alex was an African grey parrot who from 1977 to 2007 was the subject of a running experiment under animal psychologist Irene Pepperberg, initially at the University of Arizona and at Brandeis University. Alex passed away on September 7th 2007. According to lab personnel, he seemed healthy the day before, and was found dead in the morning. Currently, the cause of death is unknown, according to The Alex Foundation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_%28parrot%29
http://www.alexfoundation.org



:cry:

[redqueen]

1. Oh no!

:cry:

That's so sad... RIP fella.

[liberaldemocrat7]

35. No, he's just restin'

Restin' I say :)

[A HERETIC I AM]

59. "The Norwegian Blue loves kippin'on its back"

"E's tired and shagged out after a long squawk"



Sorry. Couldn't resist

[Ladyhawk]

80. That Python skit has always made me feel strange.

I love Monty Python, but I had trouble making myself watch the "dead parrot" sketch because I'm completely emotional when it comes to my parrot. :) I've seen a couple of versions of the skit. One uses an actual stuffed blue and gold macaw. I can barely stand to watch that version. The one with the obviously fake parrot isn't so bad.

[AngryAmish]

63. He's just pinin'

[Vanje]

65. DOOZY

Doozy material right here

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

2. It was a mob hit.

The bird was going to talk.

[Kool Kitty]

99. Omigod.

You mean, like they offed the bird on "Twin Peaks"? The bird whose name I can't remember that kept saying, "Leo, no. No, Leo. Hurting me. Hurting me."

[Rick Myers]

3. Do they suspect 'FOWL' play???

Oh, sorry, I just had to do it.

RIP Alex.

[XemaSab]

4. Aww...

:(

[no_hypocrisy]

5. He's not dead. He pining for the Fjords . . .

He's shagged out from the last big squawk.

[daninthemoon]

19. Beautiful plumage.

[yella_dawg]

29. You stunned `im!

[ThatsMyBarack]

6. So sad.

I love African greys. O8)

[The Straight Story]

7. A circuit city receipt checker beat him I bet

:rofl:

[daninthemoon]

30. Starting the outrage, again?

[musette_sf]

8. oh no!

i've seen Alex on several documentaries and was totally enchanted by him! so sorry to hear this!

(ps, when you and i were semi-flaming yesterday, i thought of Alex when i saw your sig... )

[zonkers]

9. I had a parrot for many years. He was very senstitive and never forgot a face. If you teased him

once, he never forgave you.

[backscatter712]

10. RIP to a very smart bird.

Who knows whether it's just classic Pavlovian conditioning, or whether he actually knew, but Alex could tell the difference between different colors, shapes, materials, etc. He could do simple counting. Definitely a lot of grey cells for a parrot.

[tblue37]

56. A friend of mine has an Afrcan grey, and I assure you,

he understands everything he says--and he says the most wonderful things!

[Maraya1969]

70. The story I will never forget is when his trainer, (Pepperdine?) came

back from a long vacation. When she went into Alex's room he said to her "tickle me" which meant he wanted to be petted. When she did he threw his head around and bit her bad on her finger. Then he sheepishly said: "Sorry"

That sounds like emotions and reasoning thought processes and even a little passive aggressive behavior to me.

I loved that little guy.

[nadinbrzezinski]

94. We had to leave two of the kids with my sister

when we went to Hawaii... to this day they have abandonment issues

What is more, they were PO'ed with us... we left them for three years

And the Sun. my husband went on deployment, for the first three months she didn't want to
do anything with me. Now she's my girl, but that is a whole different matter. When they got back I took her to the pier. The moment Tom's head came over the hatch she screamed so loud the sea of people parted

Yes, they have emotions and memory

[Ladyhawk]

104. Ouch. I would love to move, maybe even overseas,

but taking your parrot with you is close to impossible. The truth is my poor health probably won't allow me to move even a few hours away, let alone across the ocean. Still, escaping this right-wing fundy environment has made me entertain plans of leaving altogether. A huge factor in the equation has always been my Amazon. I just couldn't bear to part with him and with the recent scares over various bird diseases including Newcastle's and avian flu, I bet it's even tougher than it was to take your feathered friend with you. Gabby is like a child to me. I just cannot leave him.

I knew a lady who got a Fischer's lovebird while living in Saudi Arabia. She didn't expect to get quite so attached. Along with a collection of "No Women Allowed" signs, she brought back something else: the lovebird, hidden in her purse. This was long, long before 9-11, but even then, most folks had their luggage and purses searched. As she stood in line, waiting for her turn, she got more and more nervous. By some wild luck, the customs dude said, "Wow! You've been gone a long time. Why don't you just come on through?"

Later, she got her smuggled, illegal lovebird a mate. She never hand-raised the babies. Instead, when the babies were old enough, Papa would take them to meet the humans. (He was allowed to go in and out of his cage at will.) They'd line up behind Papa and he'd march right up the lady's pant leg, with all the babies in a line behind him. :) That's how she "tamed" her lovebirds. :)

[nadinbrzezinski]

108. Hawaii is a very special case

you can move them and once we were IN THE STATE we realized we could have brought the kids along

It is just a business for them.

They will quarantine birds for rabies, yesh I know

In the state we learned this is done at home... but before we moved they made us belief it was at the quarantine station

Tuky was 15 at the time, and we didn't think he'd make it

That tough old bird surprises us every day, but still

[Ladyhawk]

114. Hmmmm...my cousin recently moved to Hawaii and they wouldn't let her bring her dog.

I assumed a parrot would be impossible.

Could you give me some ideas should I develop a sudden need to move in with my cousin?

LH

[crikkett]

11. I taught my parrot 'tickle'

(on edit: that means "scratch my neck")
because I learned it from Alex.

RIP little buddy.

:cry:

[Ladyhawk]

74. Beautiful grey. :)

Greys are uncanny, aren't they? :) I raised baby greys for years. They are so sweet. I used to put the entire clutch on my lap--usually three, sometimes four, babies--and stroke their tails from coverts to tip. They'd get all dreamy-eyed and end up with their little butts in the air, half-asleep. Some parrots don't like their tails touched (my Amazon, for example), but the little greys all seemed to enjoy having their tails gently stroked. :) I wish I had taken pics. An entire clutch of half-asleep parrots with their butts in the air was a funny sight. :)

I have a 21-year-old Amazon parrot. LOL...he just removed the clapper from his bell and can't figure out why it doesn't ring anymore. :) Every so often I have to go and re-clapper that damn thing. :) OK. Re-clappered. :) I try to show him how the clapper makes the bell ring, but instead of paying attention, he gets pissed that I'm touching his toy. :) I love that little green guy. He's close by because I just found out entirely by accident that Alex had died and I want my own little buddy to be near me.

I was doing research on primates. Lately, I've been downright haunted by the nature of human beings. Why are we such assholes? I'm an atheist, so I've tried to approach the question naturally, by learning about human evolution and humankind's closest living relatives: chimpanzees, bonobos and gorillas. Gorillas are much more peaceable than chimps. And from what we know so far, bonobos appear to be more peaceable than chimps. Chimps and bonobos are the closest relatives of humans. If indeed bonobos are more gentle, is there something we can learn from them? Maybe we don't get enough sex. :)

So, I've been reading about the great apes of Africa, including the ones that have learned to sign. There was a link to Alex's wiki page. I clicked on it and it said, "Alex was"...past tense. I thought, "What do you mean 'Alex was'? Alex is, you tense-challenged idiots. Ah, Wikipedia, you can't live with...what the fuck? Died? When???? Yesterday???? OH MY FUCKIN' GOD!!!"

:( :( :( :(

When I scratch my parrot, I say, "Do you want a skritchle?" or "Skritchles?" I have no idea how that evolved. :shrug: Lately, I've been calling him "birdles" too. His nicknames change, frequently. :)

[crikkett]

90. Sorry you had to learn on Wikipedia.

I learned here that Alex died.

My parrot likes to chew up the ropes that hold up his swings. He can also untie the knots so I rig a few fakes to work on and use lots of half-hitches to protect the cording. He's famous for taking five minutes to tear apart a toy that took me 20 minutes to assemble. When he gets his nut he does this head-bob and hissing thing that I think is equivalent to giggling.

I'm trying to teach my guy "on" and "off" -- I want him to tell me to "turn on the light" or "turn off the light". I think he "gets" it, but no words as of yet.

Thanks for raising your birds, I know that my guy loved his breeder and I think it made all the difference in my experience as a newbie bird-Mom that he was calm and happy when we adopted him.

:hug:

[warrior1]

12. damn

that's sad.

[GliderGuider]

13. Crap. I saw Alex and Irene a couple of years ago at a conference. He made quite the impression.

It was partly due to Alex that my ex and I got a budgie that turned out to be Superbird. Casey was fully flighted and had the run of the house for eight years. He had a vocabulary of about 100 words and phrases that he used in context, like saying "Gooodnight, sweetheart, it's time to go to sleep!" every night at 9:00 as he settled onto his sleeping perch, his way of telling us to shut up and give him some peace and quiet. I always said that with his peanut sized brain he was smarter than most people I knew. He was sure a lot more fun.

If you can care for them properly, birds are the most remarkable companion animals in the world.

"Goodnight Alex, it's time to go to sleep."



Casey in his younger days...

[jgraz]

18. Budgies are extremely smart

Birdtalk listed them third in intelligence behind Greys and large 'Toos. Check this site out for an example of what a budgie is capable of:

http://www.parrotresearch.com/intro2.html

[tilsammans]

22. Thanks for posting that!

Most people don't have a clue what budgies can do.

[jgraz]

23. Yep, people treat them like goldfish

We rescue many that have gone insane from boredom. Some are very hard to bring back.

[tilsammans]

38. That's so tragic

I could just cry. Thank you for saving them. :yourock:

My 'keets (all adoptees/rescues, none from pet shops) have all had distinct personalities.

They're family, and I love 'em!

[Beetwasher]

48. Yup, Me Too!

I`ve got two and theyre members of the family.

[Ladyhawk]

76. It's really unfortunate.

I wish pet stores would warn people what they're getting into. You don't buy a bird on a whim.

[Marnieworld]

69. I had one

And he knew 100 words and phrases. So tame and sweet. Hope he's nice to Alex when they meet. :cry:

[Ladyhawk]

75. I like 'em all. :)

Some are too smart for their own good.

[Hissyspit]

36. Brain size as a measure of intelligence potential is over-rated. n/t

[133724]

42. Yea all you have to do is look at a Republicon n/t

[tblue37]

57. When I was a child we almost always had budgies. They are wodnerful

friends. Now I have three cats, so no budgies--but I do still love the little darlings.

[sandyj999]

14. Fly High Alex! RIP n/t

[Mojorabbit]

15. He was fairly young then.

Alex you and Irene were inspirations.
My Chuck says RIP

[jgraz]

16. I don't know how old he was when they started

I don't think anyone is quite sure of his age.

[XemaSab]

20. On their website it says Pepperburg got him from a pet store in 1977

According to the uncited internets, he was young when she got him. :shrug:

[Ladyhawk]

77. Nice grey. :) Looks like he made some "fun" for you to clean up.

I just gave my Amazon some pistachios and had a grand ol' time with the clean-up. :) Pistachios make a huge mess. :) The pistachios were given in remembrance of Alex.

[Mojorabbit]

86. Yes he is messy

and I don't mind a bit. He made me smile today. Hubby turned on the sprinklers outside his window and he said"Hey look, it's raining". Smart bird. LOL.

[Ladyhawk]

88. ROTL...too funny. :)

I was happy to clean up Gabby's "decorations" today, too. Especially today.

[seemslikeadream]

17. Alex vids

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcLLk-r1aSs

I think this is Alex also
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3107uQb3hTM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjimxmcCAI8


I don't think this is but it's very cute
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0T8mvUF6E3c

[Ladyhawk]

89. Here is a great video of Alex on Scientific American Frontiers.

http://www.pbs.org/saf/1201/video/watchonline.htm

Scroll down to "Entertaining Parrots" and click "Play Video"

The first YouTube is the famous Alex, but the others aren't. Alex is a very popular name for African greys. It was popular even before THE Alex became well-known: "Alexander the Grey" is kind of catchy.

I had six breeders: Tarzan (Lord Greystoke...hehe) and Jane (big "Cameroons"); Rhett and Scarlett (little "Ghanas") and Han and Leia. Han was a big, silver "Cameroon"; Leia was a small "Ghana." Tarzan and Jane were very prolific. Han and Leia turned out to be genetically incompatible. After I sold them, they produced another baby with a heart defect. I hope they were split up or retired for the babies' sake.

Mostly, folks just guess by appearance where so-called "Congo" greys are from. They tend to vary in size and color throughout their range. So the larger species, Psittacus erithacus erithacus are known as "Congos," "Cameroons," "Ghanas," etc. The little guys, Psittacus erithacus timneh, aren't divvied up quite so much, as far as I know. I once knew a Timneh that wasn't much bigger than a Senegal: Tiny Timneh. ;)

[Ladyhawk]

91. That last clip is really cute.

I'd be concerned for the bird; however, one of my baby greys ended up being the boss of a house full of cockatoos, dogs and cats. She was one of the most persnickety baby greys I ever raised and I was having trouble selling her because of it. :) She had a very high opinion of herself from the moment she hatched and even though she was already trying to say "hello," the folks who came to see her were more interested in upcoming clutches after she nipped them a few times. :) I had her long after she was weaned.

Now she rules the roost. She's fully flighted in a house with two umbrella cockatoos, several dogs and god knows how many cats. I'm told she has a several hundred word vocabulary.

[tilsammans]

21. What a character he was!

RIP, Alex.

:cry:

[buzzard]

24. That is sad, parrots are very interesting creatures here are my babies.

[jgraz]

26. They're gorgeous!

Here are my guys:

Gnocchi


Bialy

[nadinbrzezinski]

50. Also beautiful kids there you have

[nadinbrzezinski]

46. Beautiful babies

We have a twenty year old tiel

A fifteen year old Nanday and a seven year old sun conure.. who is as I type hiding inside my shirt

[Mojorabbit]

87. Besides our grey

we have a seventeen year old tiel and a sun conure named YOYO. The conure came to us with a piece of paper saying that he only understood german and liked a corn chip twice a week. I have no idea how old he is but he attacks brooms with a vengance. He is a real clown.

[Ladyhawk]

78. Ah, Amazons. :) My faves!

I guess I should post a pic of my guy. For some reason, he became fixated on a blue towel that needed killing. I took a series of pictures of him first eyeing, then displaying at, then finally killing the evil, blue towel. :) Pretty funny stuff. I posted about it here, but the pics probably wouldn't show up properly because I've changed around the stuff on my web space.

Gabby is permanently missing a tail feather, as you can see in the pic. (I speculated and worried about that, too, on this forum. It turned out the feather follicle was damaged. I'm not entirely sure when that happened. :( )

[katamaran]

97. We also have a Red Lored Amazon

Turkey is at least 30 years old, and he's been in our family for 28 years...since I was around 18 months old. He considers my mom his mate. Hates me though.

[tilsammans]

25. "My African Grey Is. . .

. . . Smarter Than Your Honor Student."

-- one of my favorite bumper stickers

[jgraz]

27. I want one that says "My Parrot is Smarter than Your President"

I have one for my dog, but not one for the birdies.

[eppur_se_muova]

37. LOL! nt

[tilsammans]

39. LOL! Yeah, I want one too!

But then, the Boy King is a "parrot" in a manner of speaking (parroting Rove, Cheney, etc. etc. etc.).

[Ladyhawk]

79. ROTFLMAO. I've thought of...

..."My Parrot is Smarter than the President," but "YOUR President" makes it funnier, especially around this right-wing town. :)

[StarryNite]

28. Very sad

:cry:

[jgraz]

31. Aw, can't we get one more rec for Alex?

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

32. Awwwww, he was beautiful! Recommended in memory. eom

[Lilith Velkor]

34. 5th rec because even though I didn't know of his existence,

African greys are just cool. This one died way too young.

RIP Alex :cry:

[mr_hat]

33. Parrot death mask.

[WinkyDink]

40. I'm heart-broken. I've loved Alex for years, but just this year found the Foundation.

Bought a T-shirt, and the book, which you can pay a bit more for to get autographed.

I got mine addressed to my husband, and signed, "Love, Alex." (Thank you, Dr. Pepperberg!)

RIP, little birdie. You were awesome.

[Hoof Hearted]

41. Oh no! Rest in peace little Alex. The lessons you taught us

may take a while to sink in, but your remarkable life made a difference.

Rest in peace, little soul.

[Greylyn58]

43. This is OT, but I couldn't help but notice your DU name

Could it be you are a fan of Keith Olbermann? He just played that clip again tonight.

Welcome to DU and if you are a Keith fan come join our group here on DU.

[roguevalley]

44. what a love he was. rip, little bird. they go straight to God's arms, birds.

[nadinbrzezinski]

45. Oh no, I loved readying about Alex

Their research actually drove our relationship with our feathered children

[RandomKoolzip]

47. Damn Karl Rove!

[nadinbrzezinski]

49. I noticed something in one of the vids

they were playing with copper keys

We no longer let the kids play with coins of any shape, regardless of how cute it is

Our sun got VERY SICK all of a sudden, and I fear she would not have lasted the night if we didn't place her on chelating agents after taking her ot the birdie ER.

And yes, she was fine one moment, the next my hubby found her walking sideways and unable to stand

Word ot the wise, don't let your kids play with metallic objects

Oh and these days, she's fine... and I hope this is not the cause of death for Alex or they will kick themselves to no end.

[jgraz]

51. Wow, I'm glad your Sun is OK

We had a scare with hidden zinc in a cage we bought. Luckily none of the birds ingested any before we replaced it.

[Ladyhawk]

81. Now that I've cried for a couple of hours, I want the necropsy results.

I had my little Anakin necropsied. I wanted to make sure there was nothing I could have done to save him. :(

Copied from the "Fuck, Alex is Dead" thread I started when I scared the bejesus out of myself by running across the bad news on Wikipedia:

I quit breeding for many reasons, but one of the main reasons was that the "failures" were so hard. Some of the babies ended up at less-than-desirable homes and met with preventable deaths. One of the final straws was the death of a little grey named Anakin. I'm a Star Wars fan and named a clutch of greys after Jacen, Jaina and Anakin in the extended universe.

A lot of young greys have a reddish tinge to their body feathers. Usually, these feathers turn a "normal" color after the first moult. Anakin's body feathers weren't reddish; they were purplish! He was beautiful and had a silly, playful attitude until nearly the moment he died.

The first vet diagnosed him, incorrectly, with aspiration pneumonia. The second vet diagnosed a heart defect. I knew Anakin was probably doomed, but I thought if I could get him past the weaning stage, he might have at least some good time. The problem is his body was rapidly outgrowing the capacity of his damaged heart. He had congestive heart failure. I kept taking him to the vet to drain excess fluid from around his lungs. In the meantime, I kept him in an incubator so his body wouldn't have to work at staying warm.

I arrived home after an errand with my nephew and the little grey stomped at us making "panting" sounds. If any of you have raised African greys, you know what I'm talking about. :) It's a happy, "let's play" sound of very young greys. Anakin was glad to see us. Just a half hour later he died in the vet's office, waiting for the fluid to be drained from his lungs.

[nadinbrzezinski]

95. I'm sorry about Anakin

they are all sweet birds... and they are all incredibly bright

Too bright for their own good

I posted the letter with the info to the Alex Foundation this evening. Zinc, after doing much research, is even found in bird toys

And PhD or not, you don't expect to find the damn thing in the toys you buy at the store

These days we are super careful in what we buy the kids

[Ladyhawk]

105. I'm going to have to look into this.

I've been acquiring toys and playthings for a huge play area I'm designing for "The Bir." I've been trying to consider safety issues. I may want to build a "cargo net" or two and will probably go with sisal rope because it doesn't snag birdie toes quite as easily if it gets frayed. I've also purchased quite a few leather toys (leather is a huge favorite) and some "hide-a-treat" playthings, as well.

Gabby especially loves bells. He grabs the top with one foot and rings them..."Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding." Sometimes he attacks them while ringing them. Sometimes he "feeds" them or does his "chicken dance" for them. If the clapper isn't secure, it usually doesn't survive a play session. :) He removes it and slings it on the floor, then can't figure out why the bell stops ringing. :) The bells with removable clappers are kept in his kitchen play area where I can easily find, retrieve and re-clapper the bells.

Anyway, the chains on two of the new bells I ordered look dangerous: just the perfect size to trap toes. I was planning on modifying the bells. Now I'm wondering about zinc...is there a zinc test kit? I used to have lead test kits on hand for the sake of my birds. There should be a zinc test kit as well. I knew that in large quantities zinc might be dangerous, but never really got worked up over the zinc issue. The description of your sunny's near demise (as well as Alex's death) have me concerned anew. Of course, we don't know what killed Alex, but I'm still a bit freaked out over the whole sudden death thing. :(

Maybe Alex had a heart attack or a seizure. :shrug:

Many years ago when I worked in a pet store, we had a very sad wild-caught African grey (also named Alex) who had seizures probably due to calcium deficiency. I tried to get Alex to accept a more varied diet, but he was a very stubborn "seed only" bird. The pet store was only concerned about the bottom line and wouldn't pay for Alex's treatment.

Every so often, Alex's former owner would come to visit him in the pet store and Alex--usually rather subdued--would start growling. Those who have heard the famous African grey growl know what I'm talking about. Even tiny, naked babies growl if something upsets them.

I doubt Alex's owner mistreated him. He probably just wanted to turn Alex into a pet and Alex did not want to be a pet. He didn't want contact with humans. Sadly, he was happiest when left alone. When other greys joined the group, he would hang around with them on a large assembly of branches, but he never seemed very happy.

The first time I saw Alex have a seizure, it scared me to death. He cried out, fell off his perch and lay fluttering on his side. I thought he was dying and was relieved when he seemed to recover. I was told by the other employees that Alex "sometimes did that."

I noticed a pattern. Alex would often seize within a day of his former owner showing up. Yeeowch. :( Any time something upset Alex, I would worry about him. He stayed alive (but not well) until the day I quit. He could still be alive somewhere, but I feel sorry for him. Birds like that need to be retired to a large aviary full of their own kind where there is minimal contact with humans.

(One of these days I'll have to get Gabby's bell-ringing behavior on video, as well as the "chicken dance." The chicken dance is sexual in nature. His feathers open up a bit so it looks like he's wearing an apron. Then he snaps his wings and vibrates his feathers while lifting first one foot, then the other, all the while making a strange panting / clucking sound. :) )

[RadiDem]

52. Parrot owner here - RIP Alex

[LeftishBrit]

53. Sorry to hear this...

He taught us a great deal.

RIP Alex.

[SoCalDem]

54. I hope they don't find it was from Chinese birdseed.

parrots live a very long time, and I would guess that Alex was extremely well cared for ..Poor Alex ..RIP :cry:

[tblue37]

55. SO SAD!! Alex has alays been one of my "heroes."

I have watched more video of Alex and read more about him than you can imagine.

[tblue37]

58. K&R for Alex.

[alfredo]

60. birds are good at hiding illness. I guess they don't want to be singled out.

[dommyluc]

61. I can imagine the sorrow

I have a dusky lory (a small parrot) named Clarence, and he is the smartest animal imaginable. He has been raised by humans since he was hatched by a breeder and has no conception that he is a bird. If anything happened to him it would rip my heart out. People who have never owned birds cannot realize how human-like they are, and what distinct personalities they can develop.

[nadinbrzezinski]

62. Welcome to DU

and yes I know the feeling, our Tiel and our Sun are children'

Now the Nanday, he was wild caught, so he knows he is a bird

He is still very gentle though

[pitohui]

92. i'm curious to know how old is your nanday

there have been no wild imports since at least 92, correct? (asking not telling)

i am curious to know how long they lived, years ago i lived in a neighborhood that had a wild, breeding population of nandays in new orleans, the neighborhood was destroyed by katrina and it's a little thing i know, but i wonder sometimes if the nandays were there up to that time and if they survived -- i know that many quaker parakeets survived, a friend of mine saw them flocking as he was preparing to evacuate, and i have seen them since, but never the nandays, not since the 80s

bright birds, adaptable, i'll tell you that

[nadinbrzezinski]

96. He is fifteen and we got him, dopey me

in 1990 I think

And I say dopey me, since I was ignorant and did not know that open ring means import

Nevertheless, we are patient, and he is the most communicative

He can tell me when he needs foor or water

He has a specific screech and he puts his talon on. That means change this.

I feel at times he's trained me.

[pitohui]

100. wow thanks for the quick answer

time flies, fruit flies, but he's probably 17 (not 15) if imported in 1990 and you assume he was in the first few months of life then

i've heard it is possible for conures to live to 30, i think i have a record of 35 (for a cherry head) but it's rather late at night at the moment so ain't gonna swear to it

they are sharp as tacks, yes, they do train us, don't they?

[nadinbrzezinski]

103. Well the vet told us

15 for tiels, is expected, our tiel is going on 20

And he told us 40 for a Nanday and the Sun about the same

So we have kids for a long time

And yes they train us...

Actually the way I see it, we learn to communicate with them

[Ladyhawk]

82. Yeah. It takes having your heart stolen. n/t

[Beetwasher]

101. Yeah, My First Budgie Was My Best Friend

I still miss him dearly and have loved all my budgies fiercely as members of my family.

Birds are the most underrated pets. They are incredible animals. In fact, I think of them as people.

[Behind the Aegis]

64. very sad news, indeed.

His studies opened many eyes to other forms of intelligence. My Willow says "Fly home, Alex."

[jgraz]

66. What a beautiful Pi!

My Bialy says hi :hi:

[Ladyhawk]

83. Pionus drive-by. ;) n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

67. Another beautiful kid

And just like you, those studies modified completely how we relate to our kids.

I think they and we are better for it

[Marnieworld]

68. Oh No!

I've been meaning to read The Alex Studies. I never thought that he would die before I did. Damn. What a shame. What a beautiful wonderful bird. Poor Dr. Pepperberg. She must be devastated. :cry:

[Ladyhawk]

84. Dr. Pepperberg is taking the week off, apparently.

I hope she's OK.

Here's the letter I wrote to her when I discovered Alex had died:

Dear Dr. Pepperberg and Staff:



A few minutes ago I was doing some research on primate language studies and just happened to click on Alex’s Wikipedia page. I was shocked to learn he died yesterday…just shocked. At first it felt like I’d been hit by a mack truck. Now there are tears running down my face.



I’ve followed Alex’s career for about 21 years: as long as I’ve been owned by an Amazon parrot named Gabby. Once when I was finishing my teaching credential, I called you, Dr. Pepperberg, and incorporated a description into my final paper of your success using the model / rival technique with autistic children. You were very approachable and helpful. It’s been about twenty years. I’ve lost the paper (got an “A” on it J ), but I never forgot your kindness. I never, ever forgot about you and Alex. Every so often I would check out The Alex Foundation or direct someone to that wonderful Alan Alda piece on Scientific American Frontiers.



I know Dr. Pepperberg is taking the week off…probably the rest of you wish you could, too. L



I am so very, very sorry. Alex touched the lives of many people who never even met him. I can only imagine what you feel.



I’ll give Gabby a nut in honor of Alex. He will be sorely missed.



Yours,



Ladyhawk

P.S. I’ll try to do something for the foundation as soon as I pull myself together a little bit.

[pitohui]

93. i don't blame her, 30 years of her life

the partnership of a lifetime, making discoveries never made before in tandem w. alex

it would be hard to get over something like this

[Marnieworld]

102. I cried for a long time yesterday too

As someone who has known the special consciousness and love of a bird friend I truly feel the loss of Alex. he was so special. We've all learned so much from him and her work. I still mourn my budgie who died almost 7 years ago. Only recently could I listen to a recording with only smiling and not sobbing. Her grief must be enormous. compounded by it being so sudden. So sad. Birdies are so fragile. You would think that there was no more cared for bird than Alex and then this happens. Someday I'd like to have another bird and I am anxious to find out what happened to him. He's still teaching us.

Fly home sweet bird,thanks. :cry:

[Ladyhawk]

106. Thank you for sharing that.

This thread has provided a somewhat safe place for me to grieve and I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who broke down. :) I don't cry very often due to "safety" issue, but Alex's death touched me deeply.

Maybe it was a bit like opening an old wound for you. You had a really special relationship with your budgie. I wish the little guys had longer lifespans. They also seem more fragile to me.

As I've mentioned elsewhere, I worked in a couple of pet stores. I had a lot of experiences, both good and bad, with all kinds of animals. The good experiences involved getting to know species and individuals and proper care. The bad experiences came either when some stupid human made a mistake or when the "bottom line" of making money clashed with proper care of animals. I could tell you stories that might leave you as haunted as they have left me. :(

Unfortunately, when a disease spread through the birds, the little birds were the ones who suffered the most: budgies, lovebirds and cockatiels. If a sick bird was taken to the "back room," it usually died there within hours or days. Sometimes the pet store owners would allow a more expensive large bird to visit a vet, but the little guys were at the mercy of OTC antibiotics and a staff of non-veterinarians who had no clue what they were doing. Very sad...and a rather pathetic look at human greed in action.

[Marnieworld]

107. Me too

As in I am glad that I found a place on DU with people who understand how I feel. If you have never known bird love you couldn't undertsand the loss. I have been thinking of getting another bird for a while now. One of the things that I promised to do before hand was read The Alex Studies first as well as some other parrot books. They are so fragile, physically and mentally that I want to be really prepared. It's been 7 years since my budgie died and I think I am ready to connect again to a new birdie. I am torn between Amazon and African Grey but now, maybe because of Alex, I am leaning more to the Grey. I have started preparing for a new work from home business and after one viable year my reward will be a new parrot. I'm rearranging my office to prepare for a cage today. It will give me something to work for. I don't want to get a bird unless I can give it attention and companionship. Not having that set up has prevented me so far.

Birds are like angels. Very special spirits that live among us. Any connection because they are so essentially wild feels, and is, miraculous. Alex was a miracle, a gift that we all have shared. Many will not ever realize his impact on understanding of cognition and the possibilities. He broke through the standard understanding of parrots, which is that they were just mimmicks. Alex proved that there is consciousness there, something that aware bird owners have always known. We are all in the same family, those that have bird friends. When one is lost we all mourn because we understand how special and magical the communication can be. It's always said when an angel leaves. the world is a bit emptier now.

yet it is making me step forward with hope of a new bird, a new connection, a new miracle. I guess in a way as a tribute to him.

Permission to PM you at a later date when I am more prepared to find my next birdie friend? Something tells me you know some stuff. :hug: :hi:

[Ladyhawk]

109. Thanks. :) I "know" some stuff, yes.

A lot of what I've learned is how little I know. :) I look back and see things I did wrong (often without knowing better) and cringe a little. There's a lot to know.

I like Mattie Sue Athan's book, Guide to a Well-Behaved Parrot, although some of her ideas may be a little too harsh for a very sensitive bird. You just have to play it by ear in some cases. Also, I'd look for anything by Sally Blanchard. There's another book I've been wanting to read: The Second-Hand Parrot. I'm curious about how well these little guys settle into a new home.

Dr. Speer wrote Birds for Dummies.

Many years ago, I had a fairly long conversation with Dr. Pepperberg on the phone. I met Sally Blanchard at a friend's home in Fresno and played with the famous Spikey Le Bec (or however you spell it). That's a funny little caique. I saved one of the feathers he moulted and pressed it into a photo album. It's a hoot to "wind him up" by bouncing him on the table gently. When you let him go, he goes "boing, boing, boing" across the table. Very entertaining. I took my birds to Dr. Speer once for a checkup.

So, sure...I could let you know what I "know." :)

[Ladyhawk]

110. I thought I'd add more since I used to breed African greys.

African greys are very special birds. I bred them for several years and came away from the experience convinced there are some very important things we don't know about African grey husbandry.

Some greys are both highly sensitive and highly intelligent. I have those two traits myself and I can testify that this combination can lead to severe depression. I have come to believe that very few people have what it takes to be a mama or papa to a sensitive African grey. And to be honest, I am not one of those people. My chronic illnesses would create too unstable a home for a grey. (One of the reasons I stopped breeding was my failing health.)

Tarzan and Jane, my most prolific pair, produced two to three clutches a year. All of their chicks seemed healthy, but as time went on, a few of their babies started plucking feathers at a very young age. :( :( :( :( This was absolutely devastating to me. I couldn't think of anything I had changed, so I started to suspect there is something we (meaning breeders) are doing wrong. After many years of thinking about the subject, I've come up with a few theories.

First of all, I wonder if it was wise to let Tarzan and Jane produce so many chicks. I'd read that some pairs would produce three clutches a year for several years, then take a break, so at the time I figured they would not breed if they weren't healthy enough. It's possible I (and other breeders) made a serious error. I am still not sure about this, but it's something to seriously consider.

A second possibility seems even more likely to me: I believe that breeders should let their chicks learn to fly.

It's very dangerous to let babies fly inside a home. I nearly lost a very large (and goofy) baby named Gilligan when he unexpectedly took his first flight and careened into the sliding-glass door. It knocked a bunch of feathers off his head, but he was fine. As soon as I was sure Gilligan would live, he, Skipper and Mary Ann got their first wing trim.

There was nothing else I could do under the circumstances. Allowing babies to fly would require a large "safe room." I had no such place, but I'm beginning to think such a room could be a necessity. There are breeders who do this now. Once the babies have mastered flight, they are clipped and settled into a more pet-like situation.

There are compelling reasons for keeping a pet bird clipped:

1) They could end up flying away. Once outside, birds lose their bearings. Even a pet that is trained to come when called is likely to freak out and fly far, far, away.

As a breeder, I often got, "I found a bird" telephone calls. One was a Senegal that had survived three months of pestering by scrub jays. A man had noticed the little parrot being pestered. He called to the bird and was surprised when it flew down and landed on his shoulder. A look through the classifieds identified the bird as one that had been missing quite awhile.

Some parrots are more streamlined than others. Amazon parrots are dumpy and--I think--prefer walking and climbing to flying. Others, like cockatiels, are built perfectly for flight. Every year, hundreds of cockatiels go missing because their owners let just one flight feather grow in.

2) They could end up smacking into a window, a ceiling fan or some other unsafe object.

3) They have access to items that are not bird-safe.

4) A flighted bird sometimes develops attitude problems. I'm serious. Sometimes all it takes is a clipping to turn that evil little lovebird back into her normal self. :)

STILL...

I'm wondering if some species--perhaps all--shouldn't be allowed permanent access to flight inside the home. This would require making a home completely bird-safe. It would also require diligent training to keep the flighted bird's attitude under control. While out, the bird would require monitoring to make sure he didn't destroy something valuable or get into something toxic. Those diapered flight-suits would come in extremely handy.

Perhaps an outdoor flight would do. :shrug:

One of the most well-adjusted greys I raised has two things going for her: 1) She isn't sensitive by grey standards. :) In fact, I had a hell of a time selling Mary Ann because she was very sure of herself and also very sure she didn't want strangers touching her. :) I was working on the "no bite" thing, but most of the people who came to see her quickly focused on the younger clutch of greys who didn't try to mince their fingers. I had Mary Ann a lot longer than most of my other birds. 2) Against my advice, her owner lets her fly all around the house. Yes, this can be dangerous...extremely so. But Mary Ann has a ball pestering the cockatoos, dogs and cats that share her home and getting into things she shouldn't. One day she took a felt pen and wrote all over the counter. I'll bet that was hella fun, although I wouldn't have wanted to clean it up. ;)

Another possibility is there is some aspect of African grey nutrition we aren't providing: some mineral or vitamin or fiber or who knows what. Focusing on how wild greys live could produce an answer if this is the case.

I am owned by an Amazon parrot. The general personality of an Amazon suits me fine. Amazons aren't as smart as greys and they definitely aren't as sensitive. Amazons tend to be extroverts that can entertain themselves. They love attention, but aren't as likely to pull out their feathers or hold a grudge if they don't feel you've paid enough attention to them.

My Amazon has weathered my illnesses very well. I feel sorry for him when he doesn't get enough attention, but after 21 years we've settled into a familiar, comfortable relationship.

Every once in awhile I get the "I want another bird" urge. I had to give up my Senegal due to my illnesses. She was very jealous of the Amazon and couldn't deal with being a second bird. So unless my health improves a great deal, I probably won't indulge the "I want another bird" urge. If I did get well enough, I think I would get another Amazon, probably a Panama Amazon. They are renowned for their talking ability and easy-going attitudes. For this reason, they're more expensive than napes, double yellowheads and blue fronts. True Panamas are hard to find.

[Marnieworld]

112. Thank you so much- you definitely know stuff

I was fascinated with Greys because of Alex but I have read enough to know how sensitive they are. hence why i won't even attempt to have one if I can't be around alot. Yet that whole feathe plucking thing is pretty scary. I read "The Parrot who Owns Me" Last year and it was about an Amazon and I have been thinking that they were a possiblility. Panama amazon sounds just perfect. I have two dogs, one a crazy pug and I wondered if the Grey would get too freaked out by him.

I also have bought Second hand parrot and Guide to a well behaved parrot already. I bought a whole bunch of books a while ago and promised myself that I would not get a bird unless I read them all.I haven't yet due to other things I need to study. That's when I will make a choice but I definitely will keep the Panama Amazon in mind because I am looking for a fun talker who doesn't fall apart if the doorbell rings. but then again Greys are just so fascinating. Much to ponder. Thanks for the info so much! :hug:

[Ladyhawk]

113. Well, a lot depends on the individual personality of the African grey.

In each clutch, there was usually one fairly extroverted baby. Some were just as full of themselves as Amazons. :) Incidentally, it was usually a bird I suspected of being female. Since I didn't have all the babies sexed, I'm not sure what conclusions one can draw from this. One idea is that the bigger, more gangly birds (which I guessed were male), are more clumsy as babies and perhaps less precocious physically. Greys are especially clumsy as babies, so any lessening of this (like a smaller, easier-to-control body) may make them more outgoing from the start. :shrug:

I really don't know.

I should post some baby pics when I get a chance.

I'll take some stills from a video or something. :) Maybe I should try to capture some footage of baby greys playing.

[Ladyhawk]

116. Dr. Pepperberg's Response

"Thank you so much for your note...it means a lot to me, even though I'm not able to manage to say much more than that right now....Love, Irene"

She must be grieving and has been inundated with e-mail, so I'm surprised to get even this much. Be well, Dr. Pepperberg. :)

[BrklynLiberal]

71. How sad. Parrots are incredibly loving & intelligent creatures.

I talk to and "tickle" Ariella, an African Grey, at the place where I buy my pet food every week. The owner just cannot part with her..even tho she was supposed to sell her when she was gotten as a baby. She looked like a little dinosaur.
I watched every feather grow in on her....She is a beauty. Talks, whistles, barks..and leans her head down so you can rub her.

[Gloria]

72. Godspeed, Alex! Let's hope they discover that his death wasn't

caused by something that can harm Grif or Wart.

[Ladyhawk]

85. Better not be something from China.

:grr:

[frogcycle]

73. Do they suspect fowl play? n/t

[jgraz]

98. Post #3

I don't mind the tasteless jokes but please, try to be original. :eyes:

[Ladyhawk]

115. I kind of do mind the tasteless jokes.

I realize no harm is meant, but it's the same issue I have with the Monty Python "dead parrot" sketch. I actually think the dead parrot sketch is funny, but the first time I saw it, it didn't sit well with me because I was too busy thinking about actual dead parrots I'd had to deal with (most while working in a pet store) and worrying about my own very much alive parrots. Once the shock had worn off, yeah it was funny.

Then I saw another version which utilized an actual dead blue and gold macaw (stuffed). That one isn't funny and won't be until I can be desensitized again.

It probably doesn't bother many people and I don't expect anyone to conform to my sensitivities on the issue. I just want them to be aware.

[Ladyhawk]

111. Press Release

Does this deserve its own thread? It is posted at The Alex Foundation. I hope there is a more thorough necropsy. I'm not content with "We don't know." :( :( :( :( :(

____

WALTHAM, MA (SEPTEMBER 10, 2007)—Alex, the world renowned African Grey parrot made famous by the ground-breaking cognition and communication research conducted by Irene Pepperberg, Ph.D., died at the age of 31 on September 6, 2007. Dr. Pepperberg’s pioneering research resulted in Alex learning elements of English speech to identify 50 different objects, 7 colors, 5 shapes, quantities up to and including 6 and a zero-like concept. He used phrases such as “I want X” and “Wanna go Y”, where X and Y were appropriate object and location labels. He acquired concepts of categories, bigger and smaller, same-different, and absence. Alex combined his labels to identify, request, refuse, and categorize more than 100 different items demonstrating a level and scope of cognitive abilities never expected in an avian species. Pepperberg says that Alex showed the emotional equivalent of a 2 year-old child and intellectual equivalent of a 5 year-old. Her research with Alex shattered the generally held notion that parrots are only capable of mindless vocal mimicry.

In 1973, Dr. Pepperberg was working on her doctoral thesis in theoretical chemistry at Harvard University when she watched Nova programs on signing chimps, dolphin communication and, most notably, on why birds sing. She realized that the fields of avian cognition and communication were not only of personal interest to her but relatively uncharted territory. When she finished her thesis, she left the field of chemistry to pursue a new direction—to explore the depths of the avian mind. She decided to conduct her research with an African Grey parrot. In order to assure she was working with a bird representative of its species, she asked the shop owner to randomly choose any African Grey from his collection. It was Alex. And so the 1-year old Alex, his name an acronym for the research project, Avian Learning EXperiment, became an integral part of Pepperberg’s life and the pioneering studies she was about to embark upon.

Over the course of 30 years of research, Dr. Pepperberg and Alex revolutionized the notions of how birds think and communicate. What Alex taught Dr. Pepperberg about cognition and communication has been applied to therapies to help children with learning disabilities. Alex’s learning process is based on the rival-model technique in which two humans demonstrate to the bird what is to be learned. Alex and Dr. Pepperberg have been affiliated with Purdue University, Northwestern University, the University of Arizona, the MIT Media Lab, the Radcliffe Institute, and most recently, Harvard University and Brandeis University.
Alex has been featured worldwide on numerous science programs including the BBC, NHK, Discovery and PBS. He is well known for his interactions with Alan Alda in an episode of Scientific American Frontiers on PBS and from an episode of the famed PBS Nature series called “Look Who’s Talking.” Reports on Alex’s accomplishments have appeared in the popular press and international news from USA Today to the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times. The Science Times section of the New York Times featured Alex in a front-page story in 1999. That same year, Dr. Pepperberg published The Alex Studies, a comprehensive review of her decades of learning about learning from Alex. Many other television appearances and newspaper articles followed.

Alex was found to be in good health at his most recent annual physical about two weeks ago. According to the vet who conducted the necropsy, there was no obvious cause of death. Dr. Pepperberg will continue her innovative research program at Harvard and Brandeis University with Griffin and Arthur, two other young African Grey parrots who have been a part of the ongoing research program.

Alex has left a significant legacy—not only have he and Dr. Pepperberg and their landmark experiments in modern comparative psychology changed our views of the capabilities of avian minds, but they have forever changed our perception of the term “bird brains.”