The Draft with being gay the only deferment

[BOSSHOG]

Able bodied men and women (able to pass an entrance processing physical) between the ages of 17 and 50 who have not previously served in the military would be subject to a draft for the purposes of providing personnel for the Army and the Marine Corps. All potential draftees must be heterosexual.

Could the septic tank which is the republican party contain the fecal material produced by young republicans and patriotic chickenhawks after they received the above news?

I'm not advocating the draft but if the subject was brought up I'd like to see it structured as above. On the other hand, thanks to the cowardice of young republicans and "patriotic" chickenhawks it may soon become inevitable.

[Netbeavis]

1. how ironic that the only people who aren't allowed to fight

what the GOP call the most important battle of are generation are those who they need the most to add ranks to the military.




How funny would it be to see a family member of a prominent conservative GOP be drafted and sent off to the quagmire kicking and screaming while those who they despise & attack get to wave good-bye and "protect the home-front"



On a side note, a draft isn't happening. Whether there should or should not be a draft is a subject open for debate but its too hot a topic for politicians seeking election to even come near or bring up.

[Drifter]

2. You want to see the GOP ...

come outta the closet in record numbers. That's the way to do it.

Cheers
Drifter

[BOSSHOG]

3. And working for peace and helping your fellow Man would be the most Patriotic

things a citizen could do.

[Netbeavis]

51. Yep, want to "out" closet GOP? Re-enact the draft. lol. n/t

[madokie]

4. I'm not so sure if the third sex should be excluded

for the most part gays are patriotic too or I think they are

[BOSSHOG]

6. Oh I agree my friend

I just think such a pronouncement would put all the chickenhawk patriots in a tizzy. To get out of serving my country I'd have to swear on a stack of bibles that I am gay. Oh, the horrors. Irony of ironies, bad ass ass kicking patriots reduced to such an option.

I served with many gays in the Navy, some of the best in their business.

[madokie]

11. talk about getting panties all up in a wad

good idea.

[cgrindley]

5. It's about time women went into combat

I fail to see how it is fair and equitable for men to be the ones continuously asked to sacrifice their lives on behalf of the other 50% of the population.

The armed forces should be blind not only to orientation but to gender.

As far as the draft goes, I'm all for a draft for a 2 year term of national service (with a free choice between armed forces and peace corps and government organized civic service). I think this would be a great idea, but women should be just as subject to it as men (gay or straight). A couple of years of service would really improve citizenship and maturity in this country, not to mention health.

[BOSSHOG]

8. My proposal

calls for men and women to be drafted (I do not include gays just to piss off the fake patriots lurking today.) I served with many women in the armed forces and in a combat zone (although not in combat.) My wife served in the Navy and I could not possibly be more proud of her. If we had competent leadership in the white house we would not be having this thread.

[cgrindley]

10. But would your proposal be fair about who was exposed to real combat? (nt)

[PA Democrat]

14. Check out the website for Selective Service registration.

https://www.sss.gov/RegVer/wfRegistration.aspx

There is a box to check whether the registree is male or female with a note that CURRENT law does not allow females to register. Perhaps the people who designed the web form know something we don't about future plans to require females to register?

[BOSSHOG]

15. I believe

it is an affront to females not to allow them to register.

[madokie]

16. myself I really don't like the idea of women in battle

I guess I'm just soft hearted that way. I prefer the girls to be nurses and such helping to mend our beat up and broken minds and bodies. but then I'm a guy who doesn't like for my wife to have to put gas in her car or air the tires up etc. old fashioned I guess

[yardwork]

21. oh for crying out loud

I'm sorry - I'm sure you mean well, but your post is an insult to women.

[madokie]

24. ok if you think so

it wasn't meant to be

[yardwork]

30. I understand that. I said that I think you mean well.

Think about this, though. You like the idea of women doing "soft" things like caring for the wounded. Have you ever cared for a seriously wounded person? It's horrific. The idea that women are somehow incapable of combat, while being expected to take care of the sick and dying, is insulting.

[madokie]

33. the toughest persons who I have ever known are women, always has been too

My wife is a nurse who could hold her own on any battlefield
I was not insinuating that they are incapable or inferior in anyway, only that I don't or wouldn't want to see them in that roll. :hi: ;-)

[yardwork]

34. Why do you think that you get to decide the appropriate role for women?

Let individuals decide what role they seek in life, and drop all this gender stereotyping.

[madokie]

35. am I in trouble or what

are we reading in more than I'm putting in or what, ;-)

I don't for a second think anything close to that I was just saying what I think. I decide only for me and me alone
peace

[northzax]

44. myself I really don't like the idea of humans in battle

I guess I'm just soft hearted that way. I prefer the humans to be nurses and such helping to mend our beat up and broken minds and bodies.

[SammyWinstonJack]

47. ...

:thumbsup:

[Zookeeper]

38. Are you aware of women having been assaulted...

and raped by their fellow (male) soldiers?

Your idea is a good one, when you can guarantee that female soldiers are safe in the company of their male comrades.

[cgrindley]

39. A bit sexist don't ya think?

all men are rapists?

[Zookeeper]

41. Did I say that all men are rapists?

No, I didn't.

"I reported the rape within 30 minutes and watched my career implode."

As now seems clear, the Pentagon could not sustain its military presence in Iraq without women soldiers. However, activists say the military establishment has done little to protect its female troops. As the committee hearing broke up, Machmer told reporters that she came to trust the Iraqis more than her fellow soldiers.

As in the civilian world, the greatest threat comes from known colleagues, says Christine Hansen, director of the Miles Foundation, an independent advocacy organisation for victims of violence. "Predominantly, we are seeing that these are acquaintance rapes, that the victims and the alleged assailant know each other. It might be your battle buddy, or a friend of your battle buddy who is in another squad."

As of September this year, the Miles Foundation had received credible reports of rape or sexual assault (in the period August 2002 to August 2003) from 243 women serving in the US military in Iraq, Kuwait, Bahrain and Afghanistan. An additional 431 instances of assault were reported elsewhere. No figures are available for the rape of male soldiers serving in Iraq, although campaigners say there are such cases. Meanwhile, the Miles Foundation says it has charted a sharp increase in reports of domestic violence among military families with soldiers returned from the war.

Hansen believes the reported rapes account for just a fraction of the attacks. Most of the known victims were senior non-commissioned officers or officers - which Hansen says suggests that junior personnel are even more afraid of coming forward.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,3604,1335105,00.html


I can find more reports and links, if you need them.

[cgrindley]

43. Let me get this right

your argument is that since the armed forces cannot guarantee the absolute safety of female soldiers from rape the solution is to make sure that they never go into combat?

that's illogical.

[Zookeeper]

46. You were whining about men being the only ones sent to...

combat. My flippant tone was matching your whiny one.

Again, you put words in mouth. I didn't say the military should guarantee the safety of female soldiers against rape; I said, against rape from their fellow soldiers.

I don't know why anyone would demand that women serve in combat as long as they are vulnerable to sexual assault, not just from the enemy, but from their own comrades.

Kind of sounds like the guys who expect women to pay for half of everything, but still do all the housework.

[2beToby]

49. So why don't we put in a new rule for the military

if someone tries to rape you it's well within bounds to shoot that person.

If we put a stop to rapists there would be nothing to protect ourselves from them.

[Zookeeper]

52. That works for me. Good luck getting that rule approved...

though.

[Romulox]

55. Ummm, you can never guarantee a soldier is safe in a combat zone...

Rape is horrific and inexcusable, but soldiers risk horrific and inexcusable violence as a core requirement of their jobs.

[LanternWaste]

58. That really didn't dissuade African-Americans for volunteering for the 761st Tank Battalion.

Many black soldiers were assaulted after the integration of military allowed them to begin serving in combat roles late in WWII.

That really didn't dissuade African-Americans for volunteering for the 761st Tank Battalion.

[frogcycle]

7. what sweet irony that would be

all one would have to do is grab some guy's balls like Lindsey Graham and be scot free. Don't even wait to get enlisted - do it at the physical. Women would have to grab something else, of course.

Here's another idiocy: with so many females in service now, heterosexual activities are not uncommon. There is plenty of harassment; there are rapes, and there are consensual activities. There was a murder/suicide in August when a female tried to break off a relationship and the married guy ten years her senior shot her and then himself.

Sex is human; humans are sexual. Close quarters and stressful circumstances can bring out the worst in people. With the military focusing so on the "don't tell" policy, all they do is ensure that they have closeted gays in the mix. How does that avoid problems? It doesn't. Stuff happens. If it involves gays, then they make a big issue of it; if heterosexual, they try to sweep it under the rug. Larry Craig/David Vitter.

[BOSSHOG]

9. In the 70's, the Navy started

putting females on supply ships which instantly became known as the Love Boats. Females were becoming pregnant, had to be removed from the ships which, however slight, was a detriment to the ship's mission. I had several single parent females working for me who did an outstanding job of juggling their responsibilities. In 24 years I worked with and for and supervised many homosexuals, not a hiccup of a problem.

[11 Bravo]

17. You would never make it in today's GOP, BOSS.

You lack that fine mix of faux patriotism, seasoned with a robust dose of bigotry and hypocrisy.
However, if the draft is re-introduced under the conditions you describe, I think I see a business opportunity. First I would grab my camera and get a gay buddy of mine, and we'd head downtown. We would set up a studio where patriotic young Repugs who unfortunately have "other priorities" could come on down and cop my buddy's joint. I would provide them with photographic evidence which would serve to help them avoid service. They could then return to their day jobs of "supporting the troops".

[BOSSHOG]

25. Gosh, and I had such grandioise plans

I would modify your business venture. The patriots would actually have to be photographed with that buddy of yours cock in their mouth. Hey if your gonna get out of doing something for your country your gonna have to do more then touch it.

[TechBear_Seattle]

12. No exemption for conscientious objectors?

That would really stir things up against the war.

[BOSSHOG]

13. I'm trying

to create a scenario to aggravate homophobes and fake patriots. Although what would be worse for such a person, admitting you are gay or admitting you are a conscientious objector (beings how you are all patriotic and manly and such, while actually being a closeted coward?)

[TechBear_Seattle]

18. Consider the whole reason why the military has always acknowledged COs

The Society of Friends (aka the Quakers), Jehovah's Witnesses, Menonnites, Jains, Buddhists and various other religious groups have historically been pacifist; it is considered a sin to support war or violence in any way, shape or form. Any conscription which does not allow for conscientious objector status would create screams of "Religious persecution!" faster and louder than anything that homophobes could manage.

Added: I realize you are creating a proposal to annoy the chickenhawks. I just don't think you should annoy the honest pacifists. :hi: And you need not worry that the chickenhawks will try to weasle out of the draft by claiming CO status: historically, it has been difficult to prove oneself a conscientious objector to the draft board. Usually, one must present on-going (not recent) membership in a pacifist religious group and/or on-going (not recent) activities, writings, etc. which give evidence of a core value against war, violence or the taking of human life. More information on CO status can be found at http://www.serv.net/~techbear/writings/FAQ-CO.html

[BOSSHOG]

23. You are making it

incredibly hard for the chickenhawks. Core values proven by actual activities over a long period of time? I have to chuckle at their attempts.

Hey, I'm a pacifist and I have no intention of annoying me.

[TechBear_Seattle]

27. I'm not doing anything

Just pointing out the way it has been done for a long time in this country.

The keystone of being a conscientious objector is a core value against the taking of human life. Core values are not created ad hoc when threat of conscription suddenly looms over you. As a pacifist myself, I have very little respect for those who become a Quaker the same day their draft notice arrives in the mail.

[eShirl]

19. conscientious objection to war has nothing to do with being a coward

just sayin'.

[BOSSHOG]

20. Absolutely correct

but I proclaim chickenhawks cowards who would use that as a reason to avoid serving their country. They put up a facade of manliness and machismo which should manifest itself in Marine Corps Boot camp. So this scenario makes them scummier then I usually proclaim them.

CO - not a cowardly proclamatoin
CO - used in a highly dishonest manner by real cowards to avoid actually doing anything for their country.

[yardwork]

22. lol! It looks like you've touched some nerves this morning, BOSSHOG!

:headbang:

[BOSSHOG]

26. Its our wonderful fellow DUers

who intellectually think through things and consider other options and try to read motives into a post which might not be there. If I had posted this on free republic they would have been more straightforward, "fuck off ya dope smoking liberal scum." Not much curiousity there.

[TechBear_Seattle]

28. Thinking things through is a horrible fault of mine

Apologies for spoiling your fun. :toast:

[yardwork]

31. I don't think that you spoiled BOSS's fun, and his post is a glowing compliment to DU

[BOSSHOG]

36. Thinking

is a blessed trait of liberals my friend. And I greatly appreciate the varied feedback. I do it myself. No fun spoiled at all. Its sad but conservatives would lose a war of intellect against us and also a war of brawn and bravery.

[TlalocW]

29. If there is a draft all I can say is...

I'm glad I speak Spanish, and I'm glad I have many, many friends in Latin America.

TlalocW

[TheUniverse]

32. It those were the requirements for the draft.

I would become a gay man very quickly!

[Parche]

37. Hey Boss

They will have a hard time with the so called 'Log Cabin Republicans' :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:hi:

[backscatter712]

40. If there's a draft, see ya in Canada!

The draft is evil. It is worse than slavery. At least with slavery, people are forced to work relatively mundane jobs. With the draft, people are forced to take up arms and commit acts of homicide. Certainly, if we're talking about killing people, the ones doing the killing should be volunteers.

I fail to see why so many people on DU support bringing back the draft. The draft is despicable.

[SammyWinstonJack]

48. "The draft is despicable." I totally agree with you. War, especially unprovoked war is

despicable and I don't support bringing back the draft.

[electron_blue]

50. I totally agree with you.

[mmonk]

42. What about the learning disabled?

[BOSSHOG]

45. They would probably

be weeded out by a military entrance processing physical which does medical as well as physical screenings.

[maveric]

53. How would one prove to be gay to get a deferrment?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm???

[Contrary1]

57. That was my first thought as well.

Being married with children is no indication of heterosexuality.
The Republics have proven that beyond a reasonable doubt. :patriot:

[napi21]

54. THAT was one of the reasons for exemption back in the days of

the draft! I remember because several of the guys in my graduating class used that excuse and pretended to be gay when they went through their physical.

[BrotherBuzz]

56. Methinks the 2-D defernment will remain unchanged

2-D Registrant deferred because of study preparing for the ministry.

I visualize all those Midwest Podunk fundy bible colleges will suddenly become certified and will become a safe heaven for our young republican chickenhawks. Bank on it.