Taser Poll: who's to blame

[NightWatcher]

[Squatch]

1. Senator John Kerry bears 100% of the blame

IMHO.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blm]

8. He would if he DIRECTED cops to treat dissenters forcefully the way Bush does, but

we all KNOW that Kerry has a lengthy record of tolerating dissent, even when he was the presidential nominee.

Have you found any document of ANY Kerry appearance that has EVER directed dissenters be dealt with forcefully?

Kerry tolerates dissent more than 99-9% of DC - and this after decades of death threats against him.

If you can find where Kerry directed this to happen, then please present it and share with us your 100% certainty.

[Squatch]

10. "If you can find where Kerry directed this to happen..."

Can YOU find where kerry directed the cops to STOP?

[Ian David]

20. I don't think Kerry saw it. He was turned sideways.

But you sure seem VERY anxious to assume he saw everything.

[blm]

28. You avoided my point but I'll answer yours - yes - when he said he'd answer

which is when the cops and the man took to the ground and out of Kerry's view so he was blind to what was actually happening and unable to judge.

So - care to answer my point? Decades of appearances and known for tolearting dissent to the nth degree - and even being a dissenter himself who was arrested, and you want to run him down on THIS incident?

And if you think campus police aren't being extra cautious these days after Virginia Tech, then you haven't been paying attention. The media SKEWRED the campus police for NOT reacting quickly to control the shooter when he first started acting suspiciously.

Blaming Kerry is always good sport for the establishment in DC who have tried to shut him down overthe decades and even try to use the left to do it.

[H2O Man]

11. Mick Jagger

is fully responsible for the Hell's Angels killing the guy at Altomont. It's Mick's fault. If he had just sung "The Sound of Music," it never would have happened.

[Ian David]

18. Kerry actually ASKED the kid to be allowed to speak, despite time being up.

They gave him 1:45 to speak, turned off his microphone, and then, as he was walking away from the microphone, the cops took him down, hurt his ankles, and tasered him.

[Squatch]

21. You can exercise your rights, as long as you can squeeze it in between commercials

If not, we're going to beat the shit out of you.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RangerRK]

33. lengthy record of tolerating dissent?

from "A Kucinich delegate in Boston and the totalitarian democratic party"
http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=2305

The first thing I want to say is that the entire convention was a sham. Perhaps I was naïve, but I went in with the perspective of Duluth (the MN Democratic-Farmer-Labor Party State Convention in May), where there was lots of expression from the delegates, including wrangling over platform, motions from the floor, significant interactions with other delegates. None of that was true in Boston; there were no discussions of platform, no microphones on the floor at all, no negotiations of any kind, no input of any kind from the delegates. By the end of the first night, I was very deeply upset, muttering things about "Stepford delegates" and wondering why they didn’t just get the crowd as extras from Central Casting, instead of going through the delegate selection process they did.

"Lock-step" doesn’t begin to cover the management of delegates by our minders. Since we were told that we could not bring in signs, I didn’t, but I made a sign on-site that said simply "Peace." It was confiscated, and in a very clever way that left me with no possibility of confrontation. For the first two days, they were ambivalent about the pink scarves we had printed that said "Give Bush The Pink Slip; Delegate for Peace." By Tuesday night, they were confiscating them by the hundreds at the metal detectors, and then going around the hall taking them from individuals. We confronted them on that one and got them to back off, but it was a tense battle that carried the risk of being ejected from the hall.

[blm]

40. So his entire record is smirched because of the way DNC ran the convention?

Kerry wasn't making every decision regarding logistics and also wasn't involved with the way the secret service was handling protestors in the first post 9-11 convention, where BushInc was making SURE all alerts were on high level in and out of the arena.

Somehow you all think it's fine to attack a lawmaker with over three decades of tolerating dissent, encouraging dissent, and dissenting himself in degrees where he was constantly risking his own future.

How is this different than the swiftliars attacking him for his military service when his entire record showed a heroic service and one of great risk in the order to save the lives of others?

[NoPasaran]

3. No choice for Clinton?

[Toucano]

4. LOL! n/t

[onehandle]

6. Hillary Clinton kidnapped the Lindbergh baby!!!

I read it on the Internets.

[bryant69]

5. I don't think we can rule out the eerie mind controlling power of Nicolae Carpathia

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Labors of Hercules]

7. They didn't taser the kid!!! Damn people.

The kid was putting on a show. They threatened him with a taser but didn't use it.

Bloody hell, police use these scare tactics all the time effectively, but when people pretend to go nuts and start screaming, of course it's all their fault. :eyes:

[NightWatcher]

13. I am watching the guy being tasered

you can see the taser in the female officer's hand who is standing near his head. The light is on showing that it is being fired

[Heidi]

16. You obviously know more about the situation than the Washington Post knows.

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/offbeat/2007/09/university_of_florida_student_1.html

[demodonkey]

9. Cops to blame, but Kerry should take a stand.

Will be interesting to see if he makes a statement, or does something like contact the kid and answer his questions. IMHO that would be the stand-up thing to do. Not holding my breath.

As I said in another thread, if asking hard and pointed questions gets you dragged out of a public forum and tasered, this country is in worse shape than we can imagine.

[Ian David]

14. I agree. Kerry should say something to defend the kid and condemn the cops.

Silence is complicity.

He had better not be silent.

I'm going to be calling his office, and politely asking him to do that.

Otherwise, he is partially responsible, but I'm not stupid enough to hold him 100% responsible. That would take some kind of brain-dead moron or freeper troll to assert something like THAT.

[MiniMe]

42. He has condemned the use of force on the kid. It is on another thread in GD

Sorry, don't have the link.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

12. hrc

[Ian David]

15. You're not gonna blame The Clenis? n/t

[La Lioness Priyanka]

17. that too

[BuyingThyme]

19. Pelosi.

[aikoaiko]

22. I blame Tesla and his freaking inventions involving electricity.

[Ian David]

25. Yes! Let's sue Tesla, Edison, Watt and Vandegraff! n/t

[Indy Lurker]

24. You missed somebody

And that would be the person who asked the police to remove the speaker.

That's the person who is responsible. Most likely whoever was running the event for the school.

The police didn't decide the guy should quit speaking.

Once the police were involved, the speaker should have left without resisting.

We as a society, through our laws, have given the police the authority to use force on a person who does not comply with a lawful instruction.

This is the same, whether it is an ex-spouse who has been asked to leave a home, or a speaker who is asked to leave the building.

Should the police have used a taser? Maybe not, but would a nightstick be any better?


Or asked another way, how much resistance should the police tolerate before they elevate the amount of force in their response?

[Ian David]

26. The guy in the suit? He could have just been asking to have the mic cut-off.

They cut off the mic, and the kid started to walk away.

Who made the decision to take down the kid after he started to walk away?

[ieoeja]

30. Then the kid got to the door, and tried breaking away from the police rather than exit.

THAT is when they took the kid down. When he STOPPED walking away and tried escaping into the crowd.

[Ian David]

27. Video: Kerry asks cops to calm down. Kid screams cops will try to kill him

NEW! Footage of the nutcase arrested at the Kerry event...AFTER leaving the event
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1833205

Kerry CLEARLY asked the officers to calm down while the kid was being tasered and arrested.

And the kid was CLEARLY resisting the officers BEFORE he was tasered.

John Kerry tried to HELP the kid!

[liberalsoldier5]

29. It's striking and depressing to see how many people here

will so quickly abandon our liberals on the ground to support our "liberals" in power. Pretty pathetic. This kind of lock-step bullshit is typical of rightwingers- not progressives. At least there was a time when that was true..

The cops messed up BIG time. Ordinary procedure would have been to cuff the guy and drag him into a car. Did you see how many cops were there? They were big and build and could have easily cuffed and carried him out. They CHOSE not to.

I'm with the kid on this one!

(Oh and JK looked like his typical dipshit self too.)

Video of MSNBC's coverage here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCBcOQkUNjI&NR=1

[Laughing Mirror]

31. Never ask Kerry about conceding 2004, black disenfranchisement & stolen elections

and never ever bring up Skull & Bones to Kerry or Bush or this may happen to you too.

[donsu]

32. Kerry has equal blame

4 cops couldn't move him out of the hall?

I bet 4 women could have pacified him without a taser.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

34. The woman in the third row, sixth in from the left.

She bears 100% of the responsibility. She should have gotten the cops to stop. Also, she used her hypnotic witch powers to force the student to purposefully attempt to disrupt the event and get the cops to forcibly arrest him.

[Indy Lurker]

35. Kerry was just a guest

He had no authority over the the venue.

[truebrit71]

36. Silly poll...we all know that it's Bill Clinton's fault....

:sarcasm:

[sleipnir]

37. Kerry: If he hadn't conceded the election so soon, none of this would have happened.

That's the answer.

[Tejanocrat]

38. Why isn't Dick Cheney an option (he has as much responsibilty as Kerry)

[RangerRK]

39. The results of this poll are frightening

n/t

[Kelly Rupert]

41. Definitely Bill Clinton. n/t

[EstimatedProphet]

43. Other - Nikola Tesla

[Beelzebud]

44. The Citizens who CHEER when the cops treat them like livestock.

[L. Coyote]

45. Any time you have a crazy resisting lawful authorities like this, in a melee with armed officers,

paramount in the police training is making sure the crazy does not get one of the guns.

[ShortnFiery]

46. Although I have over a half dozen friends and family members in law enforcement

I must definitely be a *pinko namby pamby LIBERAL LEFTIST.*

Without a doubt, IMO, it was the supervisor in charge at the scene.

As much fun as it would be (I must admit if I were a cop taking him down I'd have been tempted), it's WRONG to *instill punishment* on a subdued subject. The subject was on the ground and the hand-cuffs were being applied at "the exact moment" when the supervisor said in a low voice, "taze him."

It's just wrong - punishment ONLY for intimidation's sake. I know that it was *seriously irritating* to tolerate the young man's loud mouth and taunting - but that's why we pay our COPS the BIG bucks. Oh wait! :blush: