Have We Had Too Many Christian Presidents?

[Leftisalwaysright]

Here's a good article about our history of Christian Presidents; something that has always bothered me!

http://www.underneathpolitics.com/opinion301215200630.html

[BridgeTheGap]

1. You can't have too many christian presidents in a christian country can you?

hehe

[shaniqua6392]

2. I am not sure if very many of them were ACTUALLY Christians.

I am sure that the moron in the White House for the last 6 1/2 years is definitely NOT a Christian. He is the one God warned us about. Just my opinion. I am off to read the article now. Sorry to rant prior to reading it!

[Bill McBlueState]

12. which religion do you think he is, then?

if he's not Christian? :shrug:

[BreweryYardRat]

16. Hardcore Satanist who doesn't realize it yet.

[Goblinmonger]

19. I'm quite sure

that the actual Satanists on DU would rightfully take offense to your categorizing of "satanists" as "bad people that we don't like." Perhaps such broad-brush smears don't bother you.

[shaniqua6392]

27. He is as close to the devil as you can get.

He uses the Christians to gather votes for the Repukes because there are so many of them who will vote for the party that says they will outlaw abortion and gay marriage. I am a Christian and I have seen this first hand with most fellow church members and family members. They overlook everything else that is sinful done by Repukes....war....killing....etc. just hoping to get rid of abortion and homosexuality.

[Cha]

37. bush worships at the altar of

greed and power and calls it "Christianity" like the liar he is.

[SidDithers]

39. You get to decided who is and isn't a christian?...

So, sugar or not on your porridge?

Sid

[Rosa Luxemburg]

3. It would be nice to see some Native American presidents

[AuntPatsy]

4. Wrong question. I care little about ones personal faith, my main

need for the leader of this country is competence.

[emilyg]

6. Same here.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

5. No. n/t

[IndianaJones]

7. the problem is we've had too many white Presidents. nt.

[driver8]

8. Too many RICH, white, male Presidents. n/t

[Forrest Greene]

13. Too Many Presidents. nt

[PDenton]

14. Gimme a nice white, rich president

like Jefferson any day over some of them we have had.

After all, you could have a woman like Margaret Thatcher... which was pretty much the same as having a man for the Brits. They had a joke for her but I won't say it in polite company.

[Aristus]

20. Well, I'm only polite in public. PM the joke to me, please.

B-)

[PDenton]

36. In England

... Margaret Thatcher's detractors were calling her the "cast iron bitch" and made jokes about her being unfeminine. She deserved them... I think she said one time there's no such thing as a society, just families and individuals. Classic Randian/Reagan-esque thinking.

[flamin lib]

9. Not too many Christian Presidents, just too many Christians period. nt

[LanternWaste]

10. What's the precise figure for "too many" or "too few"?

What's the precise figure for "too many" or "too few"? How do we arrive at that number? Who decides what that number should be?

[Bill McBlueState]

11. one could make a decent argument to that effect

I think we can all agree that a nation's leadership should reflect the people who live in it.

The US is 77% Christian. If the religious beliefs of our Presidents mirrored the religious beliefs of the people they serve, then 77% of Presidents would be Christian. There would have been 10 non-Christian Presidents and 33 Christian Presidents. (This doesn't account for shifting religious demographics since 1789.)

I can't think of 10 non-Christian Presidents from our history. Perhaps now would be a good time to adjust the balance a little.

[0rganism]

25. the US system is "winner takes all", so it's about as reflective as it can be

Going by pure percentage-wise reflectivity, about 5 of our presidents "should have been" black, and half of them "should have been" women. Even if we discount the periods where those groups lacked national voting rights, there should be about 3 blacks and 6 women and even 1 or 2 black women. So if we're clearly not seeing demographic proportions with respect to these characteristics, why would we expect religion to be much different?

Frankly, given the lockstep loyalty of the fundamentalists and their amenity to mixing politics with religion, we've been lucky to have had some moderate and skeptical people take the reins from time to time. And even the less religious presidents had to alter their behaviors in office to appear more religious than they really were. The hypothetical premise (religious beliefs of our Presidents mirror proportionally the religious beliefs of the people) is false, but at least it corresponds to popular proportions somewhat more than race and gender.

The real balance required for adjustment is the "77% Christian" number, or at least the subset unwilling to vote for a non-Christian. Then the national leadership proportions will follow naturally. How much it needs to change is sort of difficult to say; last I heard, Protestant fundamentalists represented about a third of Christians, or 25% of the general population. They are also relatively likely to vote, likely to do as their church leadership instructs, tend to be enthusiastic volunteers, and can be categorically written-off by a non-Christian candidate. This is not a demographic to take lightly in any election, and it's basically taken over the GOP.

[WinkyDink]

15. Too many FAUX-Christian Presidents, yes.

We could use a few more with humility and charity, clothing the naked, feeding the hungry, helping the poor.

[driver8]

17. You are exactly right.

If Little Lord Pissy Pants is a Christian pResident, then I'm the Queen of England!

[warren pease]

18. One is too many...

...when these phony proselytizers wear it on their sleeves while ordering the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians -- a ghastly percentage of them kids.

And when they use their alleged moral compasses to cut social programs and replace them with federally funded "faith based" initiatives -- which is just a fancy way of saying "fundie nutcase indoctrination camps."

And worst of all, when they talk to god and god talks back to them. On the streets, these people are called schizophrenics. In politics, apparently, they're called "men of principle" and "George W Bush."

Ahhh... tell it to the Diaper Boy and Mr Wide Stance and Foley the Page Fondler and the rest. Fucking hypocrites, every single damn one of them. I'm so glad they're being outed and publicly disgraced. I hope that DC-area blogger who threatened to out four more gay GOP hypocrites within a week or so is still in business.

Let the ink flow and the cameras roll as they beg god's forgiveness (which always seems to be granted), tearfully apologize to their families (who put on tight, brave little smiles while secretly hoping for his immediate death) and pledge to enter rehab -- just as soon as they get back from their next junket to exotic tropical locales to study the Fijian and Tongan health care systems.


wp

[Goblinmonger]

21. Can we please stop with the "Bush isn't a Christian" bullshit?

Please? The man is a Christian. He claims his belief in JC, attends church, and says he is a Christian. You saying he isn't is no different than the fundies telling Catholics they aren't really Christians because they worship Mary, pray to saints, or any other bullshit.

I get it. Bush is an ass and you don't want an ass identified with your beliefs. Tough.

[warren pease]

22. "Yep, Ahm a Chrischun..."

"Now watch this drive..."



wp

[Goblinmonger]

23. So being an asshole

stops you from being a Christian? So is one person saying another isn't a Christian makes them not a Christian, who's left?

[warren pease]

24. Being an asshole disqualifies you from claiming to live your life according to the principles...

laid down in the new testament by jesus christ. Being an asshole who sanctions the murders of vast numbers of innocent people, many of them children, around the globe while claiming to be guided by christian principles is beyond contempt.

He's no more a christian than are my cats. But at least they lead decent, harmless lives and exhibit much love for each other and for the humans who feed them.

And I say all this as a lapsed catholic (15 years of catholic school, the last seven with the Jesuits) and a current agnostic -- which means I'm not courageous enough to be an atheist but prefer to hedge my bets in case that horrible story about pearly gates, pass or fail, the eternal fires of hell turns out to be real. Man, would I be fucking astounded...


wp

[Evoman]

29. Pfftt...if we are going by your idea of what a christian is, then

there has only ever been one christian, and he was a jew! I have yet to meet one christian that doesn't at least break one of the principles of Jesus Christ.

[warren pease]

32. That's fine, but...

How about a phony president, who's apparently been selected by that vindictive, petty, violent old testament megalomaniac to implement his message of continuous war and aggression, mass slaughter of innocents, genocide, fascism, ecocide, continued enrichment of the Pharisees, letting the money changers run the temple, destroying the lives of the poor, fostering religious intolerance, stealing other peoples' goods, fostering fear, bigotry and xenophobia, oppressing those who lack power, giving not two shits in a cesspool for the common welfare...

Sounds like a batshit crazy fundie's wet dream. The rest of us, however, could use either a little less malevolence disguised as religiosity from the executive branch, or a little more vigorous application of new testament principles -- which last I heard was part of the bible, too -- by these frauds and hypocrites.

And maybe you're right; there has been only one christian in history. I've always maintained that christianity is a great theory, but that it's never actually been practiced on earth. Nothing Bushie has done has changed that opinion; in fact, between Bushie and his fundie base, I'm more convinced of it than ever.


wp

[WinkyDink]

30. "He claims" being the operative term. I don't believe anything ELSE he says; not starting now.

[Goblinmonger]

33. How convenient

that you ignore the "he's a member of a Christian sect."

So if someone tells me they are a Christian on DU, I have the right to make claims that they are not based on my feelings toward that person? You seriously think that would fly?

And who is it, exactly, that made you the judge of who is and isn't a Christian? Didn't your Jesus make a few statements about judging?

[ProfessorGAC]

42. I Don't Think So, Goblin

I think the point is that WE DON'T BELIEVE HIM! He says he believes in Jesus. I don't believe it.

He says he's born again. I don't believe him.

He attends church, and i think it's all for show.

The point isn't that i want to distance myself from him for any faith issues. I simply have so little confidence in his ability to tell the truth that the faith thing appears to be just another lie.
The Professor

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

26. Too many presidents.

An office that should be done away with and replaced by a parliamentary system.

[johnfunk]

28. Short answer to simple question: Yes.

n/t

[baldguy]

31. Too many claimed to be Christians without actually being Christians.

Clothe the naked, shelter the homeless, feed the hungry, visit those in prison, give to the poor, don't be a hypocrite, etc etc etc

[DemBones DemBones]

34. Besides Jimmy Carter, who else was really a Christian?

Going to church doesn't make you a Christian anymore than going into a garage makes you a car.

I know a woman who grew up with the Carters, went to school and church with them. She's the real deal, a true Christian, and she thinks a lot of Jimmy and Rosalynn so I believe the Carters are also true Christians.

[SidDithers]

41. True christians!...

:rofl:

Who gets to decide which christians are true, and which are false?

Sid

[H2O Man]

35. No.

Maybe some of the wrong ones, though.

[Courtesy Flush]

38. I don't care what religion they are

But it bothers me that the MUST be Christian if they want to get on the ballot.

[Kelly Rupert]

40. This is a stupid, and vaguely-bigoted headline.

No, we haven't. In the case of virtually every US President, their Christianity has generally had little to do with their policies. I can't think of why a Jewish or Muslim President would be somehow guaranteed to be better.

This is a predominantly-Christian country. People are going to elect Christians, because that's what they're comfortable with. I don't see why a Christian is going to be any worse than anyone else.

[The Vinyl Ripper]

43. Let's see 1.. 2

Yep..