I think the real issue with the taser incident is authority overreach. Mike

[rodeodance]

Malloy, after dissing kerry for 2 hours (and I hear Randi Rhodes did this afternoon also), finally
Rubbed elbows with this issue. It seems there is just too much ‘crackdown’ on conduct last few years-----and police have the authority to limit what we can do. Abc eve. News addressed this issue also—they framed it as free speech limits---they mentioned Salley fields getting bleeped and arresting people for wearing political t-shirts at rallies. They mentioned a few others also which I do not recall.
But also recall that Rev. getting brought down a few weeks ago by 4 policement.

What do you think?

[blm]

1. I think Virginia Tech made campuses alot edgier on top of the tightening post 9-11 atmosphere.

But, Malloy really should hear the firsthand acounts of what went n from students who were there - it's the responsible thing to do for someone with a microphone wielding influence. We hate it when the RW machine lies and spins - not fair for the left to ignore the facts, too.



Ted Donaldson (Rollins) wrote
5 hours ago
"If you want to hear it from someone that was there:

The disturbance did not begin with Andrew asking the question. He caused quite a scene by bursting into the room in the middle of Q+A, rudely interrupting Kerry answering another question (what was supposed to be the last one), and demanding to be heard. The cops followed him in (I have the feeling he had been giving them a hard time outside as well)

John Kerry responded by asking him to calm down and wait his turn, that his question would be answered next.

As some of the videos show, his question was long and rambling without much focus, less of a question if you will than an outburst. John Kerry remained calm, tried to guide him to the direct question he would like answered, but Andrew continued. After Accent cut his mike off, the cops tried to guide him out and as you can all see the real event began.

I was sitting in the back row of the auditorium- less than 5 feet from where he was restrained and ended up being tasered. (you can see my green shirt next to my friend in the striped shirt on most of the videos) He WAS NOT handcuffed yet when they did it. He was still attempting to get up and resist the police officers and would not put his hands behind his back.

Within close range, I have to say that I didn't feel it was the safest situation. I did not feel like they had him under control at all- and was scared that if he did manage to get up- he would have started getting riled up again. I personally was in a location that if he had started flailing around again- I would have been at risk.

Now- my opinion- I think Andrew had intentions to be disruptive and was not going to leave peacefully. I am by no means a proponent of violence, but the way the UPD handled this situation was completely appropriate."

-Stephanie Sims, former UF College Democrats PresidentReply to Ted
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Post #2Erin Decker (UF) wrote
4 hours ago
Thank you for posting that. I was also at the forum and completely agree with that account of the incident. I also felt unsafe because Mr. Meyer was being excessively aggressive and violent. I am thankful that UPD was finally able to control the situation and think they acted properly.Reply to Erin
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Post #3Chris Agard (FIU) replied to Ted's post
3 hours ago
I'd like to also thank you. I wasn't as close to him, but agree that his actions were meant to disrupt, and make a scene. He deserved what he got and UPD did what they had to, and had they not handled it as professionally as they did, they wouldn't be doing ther jobs. Being that it was Sen. Kerry the police also had to act accordingly.



http://uwm.facebook.com/group.php?gid=4943984636

[rodeodance]

6. you should send this to Mike M.

[blues90]

17. and Ted and Steph are reliable ?

[blm]

18. When you add Kerry's lengthy history of encouraging dissent and protecting dissent and

open government, and factor in as well, the history of the man who puushed and shoved his way through the waiting students, and view the incident from ALL andles available, what IS a reliable conclusion, blues?

How would you judge this if it was YOUR JOB to make a judgement on ALL the evidence?

[blues90]

20. I would have held back on reporting this

Until it was clearer what happened . Still with what I have heard and read I feel the taser was going to far and Kerry should have said something to stop this from getting out of hand .

I would imagine this will be talked about for weeks and even then we will end up with 15 different stories as we always do .

I certainly don't have all the answers , who does ? I was not there and have no idea what the feeling was so I pass no judgement other than what appears to be security going a bit to far .

[blm]

21. Kerry DID - he told the police he'll answer the man's question. THAT stopped them

for a minute and they went back into swarm mode again because of the way the MAN was acting.

[MonkeyFunk]

2. I think people have to stop conflating

the stopping of deliberate disruption with the squelching of free speech.

[rodeodance]

3. yes, that is true also.

[tekisui]

5. not as much squelching free peace

as another example of police using excessive force. people have died from being tazed.

I agree that everything he did was deliberate and stupid, but he did not deserve to be tazed.

[sailor65]

9. Yeah he did

It's easy to tell he was getting increasingly violent.

[Bobbieo]

7. A question here might be were " Mr. Meyer's actions

putting other people in danger?"

[MonkeyFunk]

14. The better question

is did the police have a reason to believe that his behavior might put other people in danger?

[Bobbieo]

15. What do you think , Monkey? Did they?I don;t know ,I wasn't there!

[MonkeyFunk]

16. From the video I saw

his behavior was questionable.

[Robb]

4. Cops are understandably nervous

...And the taser is a false lightning rod. It's become a numbers game.

You swarm on a guy weaponless, one time in four you break his arm or leg. Cop death possible, injuries likely.

You swarm on a guy and someone hits him with a nightstick on the head, sometimes he dies. Cop injuries likely.

You surround him and zap him, he can die but it's still more rare than blunt force to the head with a club. Cop injuries very unlikely.

What's the choice? You still have a mandate. Imagine the worst case for a department: you leave one guy be in a thousand, he shoots someone. So hell, you can't do that.

Here's the truth: you take a guy in, maybe break him, maybe zap him, he's probably not going to die. You take 30 down and they probably won't die. You take a hundred and you might kill someone.

And that option is much better than the possibility of what happens if you don't, they figure.

You want to effect change? You deal with that perception. Not the taser, not the club, not even the jumpy officers with boots on the ground.

[Hangingon]

8. Appearently this guy used his allotted time at the microphone...

and refused to yield it. Most universities have a procedure for thi. It appears to me the university cops then followed their procedures. He got the 15 minutes of fame he wanted. So, who give a fuck.

[Bobbieo]

10. Wonder if he has learned that you don't mess with cops?

[Rick Myers]

12. "Don't taser me, bro..."

Wanker.

[Mojorabbit]

11. Everyone

keeps saying they know what this college kid's motivation was but I haven't heard it from his own lips.
He was surrounded by four or six cops depending on the articles and need not have been tazed. We are creating a society that condones this and after this it will be another tool in law enforcement's arsenal such as the microwave thing the military developed Then as society becomes conditioned to think that that is ok the tactics get more egregious. A slow boil.

[originalpckelly]

13. Nothing like freedom fried college guys to make people wake the fuck up.

I've been sayin' it for a long time, and no one really listened, the people on our side at the top are just as crooked as theirs. We just put up with the BS because they say things we like to hear, but when the fuck did they do something really dramatic and important to keep up with their bullshit promises? Iraq benchmarks? Tell that to the poor people who died in Iraq today, they really appreciate the Congress almost getting them out of Iraq. I've never been too fond of Kerry either, damn asshole's stiffer than a Republican in a men's room. And then this bullshit happens.

Way to go Senator, let a poor kid get tortured right out in your audience.

I have to say we've finally gone lower than fucking Russia. I remember seeing this video from 2000 with a mother or wife of a Kursk submariner "acting up" to an Admiral at a press conference. At least they just drugged her ass and then removed her, we fucking electrocute our "problems".

I'd take the drugs any day over being electrocuted. I know how it feels, it fucking hurts, and my shock was only a fraction of a second and lower voltage. I can only imagine how much pain that poor guy went through.

We need to outlaw these damn Tasers except in circumstances where a only gun could be used instead.

Why didn't the campus police use fucking batons on him? Wouldn't you rather have a blunt force trauma than electrical torture? It hurts, but not as much.

Poor kid sounded like a wounded animal, I've only hear that sound three other times in my life: 1) Nick Berg execution, 2) that poor Indymedia reporter being shot and eventually killed in Mexico, 3) an episode of cops where potentially lethal force had to be used. Oh and that other inappropriate tasing video of another college kid.

All but one of those resulted in the person dying, save for the other tasing victim. If these devices produce pain on a level of someone dying, I think it's inappropriate to use it for simple disciplinary matters.

[Cobalt Violet]

19. It's clearing overreach to me.

Hundreds have died from being tasered.