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"Iraq, the media, and Shannon's Dad" by tasered "attention whore" Andrew Meyer

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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 02:52 PM
Original message
"Iraq, the media, and Shannon's Dad" by tasered "attention whore" Andrew Meyer
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 03:00 PM by Bluebear
We hear it on the news almost everyday.

"At least 18 people were killed when two car bombs exploded in a busy market…”

It happens so frequently at this point that we have become desensitized to the message.

“Eleven more died when a minibus blew up in the Karrada district, while a suicide attack…”

Iraq is thousands of miles away from the United States. When a suicide bomber strikes in the middle of a crowded Baghdad street, leaving mayhem and carnage in his wake, America is largely unaffected. The only thing we hear in the States is the same tired story. Yeah, yeah, suicide bomber, 20-something dead, we’ve heard this one before. But in Baghdad, no one is “over” these attacks. Every new bombing is a deadly and frightening jolt, a senseless thunderbolt of destruction bringing the city to its knees and death to its inhabitants. Yet we in America are so far removed from Iraq, so jaded to the tales of violence in its streets, perhaps the only time we truly feel the human cost of the War in Iraq is when it hits close to home.

Shannon Timmann is a friend of mine. On January 7, 2006, her father was killed outside of Mosul, the biggest city in northern Iraq. He was in one of two Black Hawk helicopters that lost contact with base. “Human error in a storm,” they called it. They don’t know what happened. The helicopters just went down. They just crashed.
In exchange for the life of her husband, Shannon’s mom received this letter from the government:


“Dear Mrs. Timmann:

I extend my heartfelt condolences on the death of your husband. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family. I am grateful for Robert’s service to our nation and to the Department of State. His dedication and bravery should serve as an example to us all.

Sincerely,

Condoleezza Rice.”

Nice words from our Secretary of State. But that is all they are. Words. Nothing can bring back Shannon’s father, nor the 3,566 other Americans who have died in Iraq to date.

I asked Shannon what she thought of the letter sent from our government. She said it was nice, but, “I mean ….but how many of those do they send a week? It’s just copy.”

Shannon had another letter, sent to her from the Iraqi chief of police. It was heartfelt, and genuinely saddened for the loss that Shannon and the world would feel from Bob’s death.

I watched a video that Bob Timmann filmed in Iraq before he died. He was a good man, and he believed that America was doing good work in Iraq. But what exactly are we accomplishing over there? America invaded Iraq on false pretenses, bogus intelligence that Saddam had WMDs and links to al-Qaeda.

When Cho Seung-Hui killed 32 people on the Virginia Tech campus, it was like a knee to the stomach of Americans across the country. It was the only story on the news for days, and everyone felt affected, whether they had family or friends at Virginia Tech or not.

If 32 Americans died in a bombing in Iraq today, would the media give the story the full-court press that Virginia Tech got? Would every kid on facebook change his or her picture to a ribbon with the message “We support our troops”?

The story would get lumped in with every other Iraq story, mentioned for a day, and then swept under the rug and forgotten.

Virginia Tech was a tragedy, but you can see that death toll almost everyday in Iraq. And for what? For democracy in Iraq? As if anyone in the U.S. government really cares about the Iraqi people? We are there to make money for Vice President Cheney’s corporation, Halliburton. We are there for oil. When insurgents or terrorists or whatever you want to call them blow something up in Iraq, and kill Americans, its not big news – for a reason. The powers that be do not want a true audit of the War in Iraq, and the cowed American media is more than happy to accommodate them. More than anything, the mainstream media is part of the problem. Now here’s a real tragedy - what it takes to get play in the mainstream media. Billions of dollars are missing from the department of defense, eight U.S. attorney generals were fired in an unprecedented political coup, and the biggest news stories of the year are Paris Hilton and Anna Nicole Smith.

It’s enough to make you think about what the real goal of the news is. Is it to keep the populace as educated and up-to-date on America and world affairs as possible, or is the news like any other business, with the chief goal to make money. The news is designed to keep viewers watching and sedated and not thinking bad thoughts about America, because that would be bad for the economy. Stories about a severely unbalanced budget are out, train wrecks like Paris and Anna are in. A train wreck may be senseless and pointless, but Americans sure do love to watch.

Is it “news” when a toddler accidentally drowns in Lake Michigan? It’s a tragedy, to be sure, but does it affect the world as much as, say, the decisions of the U.S. Federal Reserve, which drastically affects the value of money? The news is a crock of spit, mostly of the bull variety. People need to stop assaulting their brains with garbage, and start educating themselves with books.

If you truly want knowledge on the world around you, try picking up a book. The great thing about books? They have authors who have to do months of research, and actually know exactly what they are talking about. (Unless the author is Bill O’Reilly or Sean Hannity, in which case they can say whatever they want because their audience is a bunch of self-deluded ignoramuses who want to be told what they think they already know.)

Do you care about what’s going on in Iraq? Do you want to know the truth? Start reading. Just now, I typed “Iraq Book” into google and found this: Target Iraq: What the News Media Didn't Tell You. Without even reading this book, I can all but guarantee you that this book has more information than every news story NBC, ABC, and CBS did in 2003, when invading Iraq was still up for debate.

“Deftly separating truth from propaganda, Target Iraq is a hard-hitting expose of the harsh realities and consequences of the pending war and the media's failure to present the full spectrum of issues to the public.”

Why wasn’t this stuff on the news? It isn’t necessarily corporate malfeasance hiding facts. Maybe they just think critical reasoning and big words and knowledge will drive away viewers. Whatever the case, the war in Iraq is still going on, and most of America still doesn’t know why we went there in the first place, or what we’re doing now to get out.

Americans might not care, like when they hear about “just another bombing” in Baghdad, but I’ll bet you a Prius that if Iraq was negatively affecting the price of gas, people would start to give a damn. Maybe they’ll care next time around, when Bush starts talking about “consequences” for Iran. You know, one of two “Axis of Evil” countries that actually has nukes? The one that’s secretly funding the Hamas takeover of the Gaza Strip? Maybe Iran should start getting some attention. If only they were run by a millionaire debutante famous for nipple slips and a sex tape. Then they might even be news-worthy.

by Andrew Meyer, Sunday, July 15, 2007
(Yeah, the very same 'attention whore' who got 'what he wanted',
a taser shot and 'attention'. No wonder the media is touting that
it was all 'staged'.)


http://www.theandrewmeyer.com/columns/iraq_the_media_and_shannons_dad.asp
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 02:56 PM
Response to Original message
1. edited title
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. Today we are all nutjobs and attention whores and drama queens
when you taser my friend and fellow human being Andrew Meyer you taser me.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I think it's enlightening to read his essay. You could see it any day here at DU.
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 03:46 PM by Bluebear
If he were a member here, would people be calling him a drama queen and an attention whore? Well, yes, probably, but you know what I mean.

People bitch when people don't "take it to the streets", then when somebody does something like this they are criticized.
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:46 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Edited
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 03:47 PM by WilliamPitt
Mistaken identity. Sorry.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. edited: What? My papers are in order!
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 03:48 PM by Bluebear
:hi:
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:50 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Heh
Thought you were a different bear.

:P
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DancingBear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:42 PM
Response to Reply #7
41. Nah, today is my day off from here
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 05:42 PM by DancingBear
I'm reading real journalists all day.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
6. Police report..
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 03:54 PM by stillcool47
with witness statements....
http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2007/images/09/18/offense.report.072274.pdf

On the above date and time the defendant Andrew Meyer was being lawfully detained for
inciting a riot and disrupting a school function, (Accent productions presented Senator John
Kerry) at the University Auditorium. Upon contact with Meyer, he began acting in a violent
manner pushing the officers involved, including lifting me off the ground and screaming
obscenities. Meyer was told on several occasions to comply with the officers and stop resisting,
in which Meyer did not.
Meyer was arrested and transported to AC/DC.
-----------------------------------------------------
edited to edit out..people can read the report...
...he may be a great guy, with good intentions, but whatever he was going for it obviously did not work, or maybe it did.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:54 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Did you expect the police report to tell Andrew's side?
It is a police report. The police report will justify everything the police did, it is in the nature of a police report.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. did you read it?
I was more interested in the witnesses reports. I am perplexed by this whole thing. The use of tasers is a topic unto itself...but the actions, and reactions that led to this disturbance I would think..would be pretty easily discerned...considering there were so many witnesses.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #14
30. yes I read it. it is a police report. Did you expect it to tell Andrew's side?
By the way, the charge they finally decided to arrest him for so they could also arrest him for resisting arrest was 'inciting a riot' which is total bullshit. There was no riot nor was he inciting one.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #30
40. No. I did not. I expected...
an account of what went down. If this discussion was about the use of force that would be one thing. But...it is not. I understand very well the use of words..to incite. It seems to be all the rage now...the world is full of Bill O'Reilly bullies, screeching like Pat Buchanan demanding to be heard. I don't know that what this kid did, deserved the attention he got. I don't know. But I do know I've spent way too much time paying attention to it.
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. They're preparing for a lawsuit
which they deserve.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:03 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. "arrested for inciting a riot" Hooboy.
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. oops..
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:16 PM by stillcool47
wrong one..
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. You don't think arrest for "inciting a riot" is a little much?
Disorderly, whatever , but inciting a RIOT!?!
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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. I don't know what to think..
So far I have only read bits and pieces...
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
9. He's a good writer
and I'm glad he did what he did.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Kind of humanizes this nefarious tazer-magnet
21 years old is not a "full grown man" either, as according to some here. Trust me, I was a 21 year old male ;)
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. And there is the other side of Andrew....who deserved to be heard as the OTHER STUDENTS he shoved
out of his way did.

But that wasn't how he felt - he felt what he had to say was superior to the voices of the other student as he shoved past them.

And sometimes his erratic behavior that scares bystanders is SCRIPTED for a result he craves. Did they deserve to be fearful because of his PERFORMANCE?

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6000eliot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:07 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. Oh then I guess he deserved to have deadly force used against him.
What I wonder is that if this happened at a Bush function would people be defending the police and condemning this kid. I teach at a university, and this disturbs me just on the basis of academic freedom. It doesn't matter if it was a Democrat or a Republican speaking.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #16
24. Bush DIRECTS that force be used against dissenters. So do others.
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:34 PM by blm
Big difference from Kerry telling cops that he'll answer Meyer's question because he doesn't FEAR tough questions, and would not hesitate to take the opportunity to calmthe situation.

There is an enormous difference between Bush's directed response to dissent and the way Kerry has always handled dissent in his 30 plus years of interacting with the public.

But - what did Meyer's choose to do for his performance? Ratchet up the erratic behavior to cause a scene that he could add to his collection, meanwhile those students made fearful because of their proximity to a MAN acting erratically in a charged situation deserved that fear, I suppose.
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:33 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. Kerry didn't tell the cops dick. "I'll handle this" whas what he needed to say
Everything else is pathetic - including your attempt to use Bush as ethical standard to make Kerry look better. Am I really supposed to be impressed that Kerry looks better than Bush?
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #25
28. No - but I'm not the one insisting that the two are the same - I'm saying they're
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:43 PM by blm
exact opposites.

Kerry DID say he'd answer the question to hold off the cops - what happened while he was answering was MEYER'S CALL - because he didn't really care about that answer - he cared about his script playing out the way he scripted it.

What's pathetic is that so many would dump on the one lawmaker who has dissented seriously and turned himself into a target of the powerful, corrupt administrations who would dog him for over 30 years - the one who encourages dissent - and the one who advocates for open government against those who would close it to the citizenry in order to protect the secrecy and privilege of the powerful.

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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 10:47 AM
Response to Reply #28
51. No, what's pathetic is that a dissenter, a good man with conscience turned into
an impotent mass watching his questioners abused by the police in front of him and not using his microphone, brain, authority, whatever to stop it. And even more pathetic is that other people who, probably also protested at one point, and would agree with the questioner if say, X was on the podium, are siding with the police because loyalty to their guy trumps their belief in freedom of speech, free elections and everything else.
Me, I've been accused of lacking integrity in this debate - yet there's no person in the world for whose sake I'd change my ideals.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 06:46 PM
Response to Reply #51
69. Newsflash - Meyers SPOKE OUT - he was not arrested for speaking out - he was arrested for
his deliberately exaggerated erratic behavior that he performed to get the result he wanted from the police. He goaded them, and pushed and shoved at other students whose rights were being violated by MEYERS - and still Kerry invited and answered Meyers question - the oNLY PERSON acting appropriately. So you have to distort what happened just to smear him - as usual.


And suckers are claiming Meyers was arrested for speaking out. Completely oblivious of the fact that Kerry INVITED Meyers question and was answering it when Meyers ramped up his act.
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Marr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #16
53. The problem I have is that he escalated the situation so intently.
Edited on Thu Sep-20-07 11:04 AM by Marr
It seems like he would've gotten away with cutting to the front of the line and asking a forceful question or two. He seemed intent upon provoking this response from the outset, first by refusing to pause and listen to the answer and just going on for as long as he could, and then by physically resisting the cops.

Really, if this exact same thing had happened at a GW Bush function, I think I'd have a similar opinion. Once the cops show up, your choice is between cooperating and collapsing. That's it. Struggling is always going to provoke a physical response.

For the record, I am not a John Kerry fan and never have been. I agreed with Meyer's questions wholeheartedly-- and I really would like to have heard an answer.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #16
72. "Deadly" force was NOT used
If it was, he would be dead.

Would you support a student acting like that in your classroom?

He got the desired result, and his fifteen minutes are up.
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:28 PM
Response to Reply #12
23. The man with the working microphone could have easily handled that.
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:29 PM by The Count
Such as interrupting him: "How about I answer your first question and we give some time to the other students?" and to the cops: "I'll handle this" - and actually handle it.
Instead of sit there like a lump while the questioner is hauled by cops and yells: "Help! I am being tasered" then say "I have no idea he was tasered"
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:11 PM
Response to Reply #23
33. He wasn't - he was answering the PERFORMANCE ARTIST'S question and the
performance artist wasn't agreeable to listening to the answer and the cops believed his erratic behavior was reason to swarm him.

But keep on crapping on Kerry because you handle everything perfectly from your pov that is 20/20 no matter where you are standing and how much you hear.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:15 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. PERFORMANCE ARTIST? ARE YOU SERIES!!!1111!11!11!!!!1111!!
THIS IS HUGH! TASER THE MIME!

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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. .....
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #33
39. Performance artist?
I'm really disappointed in you blm.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 12:44 AM
Response to Reply #33
44. Performance artist?
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Dukkha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #33
56. i've seen better acting in mexican soap operas
fuck that asshole and all his supporters. the whole non-issue is a diversion and a colossal weaste of time
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Bluerthanblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #23
45. he continually tried to get a word in edgwise but Meyer was
on a tear, and wasn't letting anyone interuppt him.

As for the Tazering- Meyers was screaming continually once the police began to usher him out- he began with "oh your arresting me!!"- who knows if they would have done anything other than escort him out of the meeting had he not over-reacted.

I despise the use of violence and force to achieve an objective, but if Meyer wasn't willing to risk being tazered (and possibly worse) he shouldn't have pushed the envelope that far-

He is not a 'small' person, and he is not going to get the same kind of lee-way that a smaller less agressive person would. Not fair, but it is a fact of life.

As for your description of Sen. Kerry as having sat there "like a lump"- would you respond like this if the questioner was * ?

Or is it possible you have some unresolved issues with Sen. Kerry that color your perception?
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 09:10 AM
Response to Reply #45
46. 'As for the Tazering- Meyers was screaming continually once the police began to usher him out'
So screaming is the bar set for tazering now?
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Bluerthanblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 10:26 AM
Response to Reply #46
49. no- i never said that ...
... nor do I believe it-

Please don't twist my words and use them to justify your outrage.

I've come to expect better from you.

Read my post again please.
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superkia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #12
29. Maybe the rest of the kids only asked softball, feel good questions?
He may have sat there like we do sometimes when we watch the news and think, why dont they ask some real questions instead of the easy everyday ones, fuck it, there going to here me? Who knows. I would have liked to have seen him make a scene somehow at that damn you tube debate and ask a serious question to the candidates, that would have been fun.

The riot part is the best, the system is afraid that people will ban together and stand against a corrupted by money and power system that they will do what they have to in order to discourage others. Zap bitch, any of you watching try something like that and we got 100,000 volts for your ass.
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girl gone mad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:14 PM
Response to Reply #12
34. Maybe he did deserve to be heard more.
Some issues are more important than others. If he believes war with Iran to be imminent, and hundreds of thousands of voters to have been disenfranchised, then his push for answers was justified, in my opinion.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 06:00 PM
Response to Reply #34
42. If that were true he would know Kerry speaks against war w/Iran and has
made speeches regarding the RNC 's legal maneuvers made to suppress votes.

I heard Kerry speak about Bush ramping up war with Iran in July 2006 and he's done so at many of his appearances - and says that we shouldn't believe them when they say anything about Iran's nukes as all the intel is clear that Iran is FIVE YEARS from having that capability - 4 now - but that US has those years to get the diplomacy right.

Now - if he was so keen on that subject he would stay abreast of the lawmakers who side against action in Iran as well as those pushing for it.

BTW - other students DID question the election fraud. Meyers wasn't listening to them or the answer.

And his aggressiveness to other students WAS inconsiderate in that he was fully aware of the increased tension on campuses, and he chose to use that fear to beef up his film footage.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #12
47. Being rude doesn't make you less deserving of liberty.
Nor does it qualify you to have your Constitutional right stripped away.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #47
48. Thank you.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 10:30 AM
Response to Reply #47
50. But it does make his rights superior to the rights of the other students, does it?
You and he refuse to respect the rights of those he shoved aside waiting to exercise their right to speak.

You would be offended if he did this in a movie theater where once you enter that theater you respect the rights of all there for that same purpose. Or does ONE person have the right to usurp that time for themself or shove through the line to get the seat THEY want?
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #50
52. Should I call the police every time I am offended?
Give me a break. I can't believe you are really trying to say that this guys freedom of speech is null and void because he cut in front of some people in line.

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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:04 AM
Response to Reply #52
54. He did it in an exaggerated agitation ginned up for filming - and students
had the right to be glad he was being apprehended for shoving them aside as they sought to exercise THEIR right speakout and their right to enter a theater with everyone accepting the rules of that theater's event.

They also deserve to be on a campus that DOES respond to disturbances appropiately and quickly. Virginia Tech is still on the minds of many whether you want to pretend it doesn't.

After living thru a 7.8 earthquake, I still get jumpy when a large truck drives by my house. I can feel those vibrations even when others don't.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #54
55. You know...
that their right to speak was NOT take away from them don't you?
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #55
57. Meyers' speech wasn't denied - Kerry INVITED his speech. Meyers did USURP the attention
and did shove those other students aside who were WAITING according to the ACCEPTED RULES when they entered that theater.

WhatMeyers chose to do AFTER his questioning became the problem - and it was caused by HIS OWN exaggerated erratic behavior.

Kerry acted appropriately, the way any speaker should, and he is taking your hits for it.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #57
58. Deservedly he is taking hits for it.
The man's 1st amendment rights were squashed on. He was arrested on bogus charges and Kerry stood there and DID NOTHING to stop it. To make matters worse he cracked a joke at the student's expense while this student had 6 policemen holding him down.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #58
60. Kerry gave Meyers the opportunity to speak AND be answered but MEYERS
didn't respect that opportunity and EXAGGERATED ERRATIC BEHAVIOR to assure the police would become more involved.

Kerry tried to stop it from ramping up from his position on stage and Meyers had a different outcome planned and he succeeded.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #60
61. But but but...
Edited on Thu Sep-20-07 12:28 PM by lateo
But nothing...he was excited and passionate about what he was saying. I would have been too. Maybe you haven't noticed but since Kerry took a dive in 2004 America has been going to hell in a hand basket. We are being spied on, ripped off and our Constitution has been shat on. If you aren't pissed off you haven't been awake. Good for Meyers for showing some passion. Good for Meyers to finally have someone to ask Kerry why he BETRAYED the people who voted for him.

Kerry didn't do enough to stop these thugs from taking him out. In the face of seeing someone get their Constitutionally guaranteed rights crushed Kerry didn't do jack shit. He just stood there silent until...he made a joke...he made a fucking JOKE about this. He said "I'd like to answer his question but he isn't here to swear me in as president." Was that appropriate? No, not at all. When he said that Meyer had 6 cops on top of him.

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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 02:35 PM
Response to Reply #61
62. Kerry is the one who stopped the cops in the first place and invited Meyers question.
Spin it all you want but I don't care much for spin specifically concocted to distort the events that transpired in such a way that it attacks the one person who acted appropriately.

BTW - spend some of that blame on the Democratic party who made sure that Kerry had no legal evidence to make a court case because they sat on their ass for the four years the RNC was working to control the process at every point the votes are cast and counted.

And did so deliberately, imo - they didn't want an anti-corruption, open government Democrat in the oval office any more than the GOPs did.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #62
63. How do you spin...
the joke that Kerry made while the police where sitting on this young man? It was callous of him to make such a remark and it showed that Kerry had no intentions of answering the questions. He was basically mocking a man who just had his Constitutional rights suppressed.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 04:02 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. That was not in Kerry's line of vision at that point - he had heard the question
and started to answer to the AUDIENCE - you wanted him to judge the police action again AFTER Meyers was exaggerating his erratic behavior to goad the police into further action. The policewoman should not have drawn her taser and used it, but that is what she did in response to his actions.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #64
65. Are you saying that Kerry...
Edited on Thu Sep-20-07 04:44 PM by lateo
didn't know the cops dragged him out? It may be that Kerry couldn't see the cops piled on top of Meyer but he surely saw the police drag him out. So Kerry KNEW this guy was no longer around hence the comment "he is no longer here to swear me in as President".
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #65
67. I'm saying that after Kerry calmed things initially and was answering the
question, he did not see what the cops were seeing in Meyers exaggerated antics at that point.

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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #67
68. That is some might fine...
tap dancing you are doing there. You are completely avoiding what I said.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #68
70. You are defending someone who WANTED the result he got.
And blaming Kerry for it when Kerry was the only one acting most appropriately.

Sell it someone with an IQ that will fall for an act like Meyers.
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #70
71. Yes...
that is like saying that woman who wore the short skirt deserved to get raped. Sorry try again.
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blm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 07:48 PM
Response to Reply #71
73. When a woman sets up a scene of violent sex as part of her fantasy fulfillment
and gets it filmed to pursue her dreams of being a porn star.....THAT is a more accurate description of what went on here then your reach for a scenario.

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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #73
74. Riiiight...ok...
Keep spinning. Blame the victim.
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Kelly Rupert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:05 PM
Response to Original message
15. You know, it is indeed possible
to have an enlightened political worldview AND to be a narcissistic attention whore, you know. They aren't self-contradictory.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:11 PM
Response to Reply #15
17. No arguments here.
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:16 PM by Bluebear
You can be both but I do think his political worldview is interesting, though, in light of some of the comments directed at him.
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #15
26. You mean, like calling oneself a liberal and advocating torturing dissenters
when it reflects poorly on your guy? That kind of contradiction?
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Kelly Rupert Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:36 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Look at the silly strawman. Isn't he contradictory?
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #15
31. yes we have been told repeatedly that all public dissent
that fails to meet the very high standards here for location, dress code, and content is evidence of the dreaded attention whore affliction.

The best form of dissent it seems then is that which garners no attention at all.
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #31
36. Apparently that's the case with some
Dissent is only commendable if it doesn't inconvenience anyone or garner public attention.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:20 PM
Response to Original message
21. I posted this earlier on its own thread and it seems that there
Edited on Wed Sep-19-07 04:21 PM by OmmmSweetOmmm
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The Count Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:25 PM
Response to Original message
22. Activism without media coverage is not possible. The whole point of making
an impact requires attention grabbing. The difference between say, Paris Hilton and activism is the WHAT we're drawing attention to. Is it relevant?
Thanks for posting this.
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endarkenment Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #22
32. your attempt to grab attention is duly noted.
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #32
37. As is yours
:hi:
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lateo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #22
59. One!
One good point

aah ha ha ha ha!
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JackRiddler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-19-07 06:07 PM
Response to Original message
43. k & r
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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-20-07 04:46 PM
Response to Original message
66. I like this guy
and how he stands up.
wish there were lots more like him. time for change. the kid gloves and polite silence isn't working, folks.
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