Pandemic Flu - pardon my skepticism

[Stinky The Clown]

Today, after hearing pretty much nothing about flu since the government short changed us on vaccine some years ago, I heard not one, not two, but three separate radio references to it.

One was a story about there being plenty of flu vaccine available this year.

Second was a PSA from some doctor (a woman) saying that there's no reason for adults not to get flu shots ... they're available, they're very safe, and they're effective. I did not catch who she was speaking for/sponsored by.

Third was another PSA, this one from the CDC and HHS. It outlined all the things we need to do to 'protect' against the 'disruption' to the Pandemic Flu. It talked about getting flu shots. but more than that, it spoke about keeping a water supply on hand .... and extra food ..... and over the counter flu meds ...... They didn't mention duct tape or plastic sheeting, but I was expecting it as I listened. They spoke of civil disorder and food and fuel shortages and other consequences of mass debilitation. The whole tone of the PSA was decidedly creepy.

So ...... a few things that come immediately to mind .......

(three tin foil hat rating -----> ) Is the Pandemic Flu the next 9/11? Are we being set up for it?

(one tin foil hat rating -----> ) Is this simple governmental CYA in light of the vaccine shortage cited above?

(four tin foil hat rating -----> ) Is the setup for martial law that many seem to think is coming in advance of the 08 elections?

(zero tin foil hat rating -----> ) Am I wrong to be suspicious? More personally, in that I am well into geezerhood and now a heart disease sufferer, should I get the damned flu shot? I never have before because, frankly, I never trusted it. (Flu vaccine is made a year in advance and is based on guesses about the actual flu for which it should provide protection.)

[TomInTib]

1. You should worry more about stepping off curbs.

Those fuckers will get you for sure.

Don't worry about influenza.

Remember when swine flu was gonna kill us all?

Last year it was avian flu.

It's all a diversion.

If flu comes to town, just stay hydrated.

[Stinky The Clown]

3. More than me getting the shot or not .......

..... I'm wondering why I heard these things. I don't trust these bastards to have anything close to honorable intent.

[hedgehog]

5. Ever hear about evolution? It's not just for dinosaurs. The more we learn about

viruses, the more clear it becomes that sooner or later a bad flu virus will emerge. The avian flu hasn't gone away. Governments all over the world are watching for it and trying to stamp it out whenever it appears in domestic flocks. So far, they've suceeded.

[beberocks]

7. Good point. People overlook the ability of viruses to mutate

And if you look at human history, pandemics happen periodically. Even with our modern medicine, nasties like Ebola and AIDS emerge, and we've been lucky that they haven't been easy to spread from person to person. A flu can spread easily person-to-person.

[Deja Q]

9. Exactly. There is a legitimate concern about the avian flu.

And kudos to EVERY person and government that has responded to it, which is ALL of them.

[TomInTib]

14. Hyno Toad, it is all about Universal Models.

Without going into too much unnecessary and revealing detail, Monsanto is working with a group of universities and Pharma on both a universal poultry model and they already have a universal swine model which is up for patent right now.

I know some people working on this.

All this flu buzz is about forcing acceptance of poultry and pigs all over the world. Just the same as GM crops. The boilerplate is set.

I don't know exactly why I am even using the energy required to type this.

But I always respect your views.

And influenza is a motherfucker.

But you should know that the Real Story is the Story behind the Story.

And I am going to PM you a short sentence (or two).

[Vilis Veritas]

15. Genetic Modeling for the ages...

Modern biotechnology involves molecular techniques that use whole or parts of living organisms to produce or improve commercial products and processes. It is a relatively new and rapidly evolving branch of molecular biology, which started with the creation of the first recombinant gene 30 years ago. These techniques are, in many different ways, changing the way we live by improving the foods we eat, the beverages we drink, the clothes we wear, and the medicines we take. They also have enhanced other aspects of our lives through the development of new detection methods for early diagnosis of many diseases such as arteriosclerosis, cancer, diabetes, Parkinson’s and, Alzheimer’s. The application of biotechnology methods in the food and agricultural industry is one of the many aspects of biotechnology that has great impact on society. By the year 2050, it is expected that more than 10 billion people will beliving on this planet, and it is also believed that there may not be enough resources to feed the worldpopulation (UNFPA, 1995). Hunger and malnutrition already claims 24,000 lives a day in the developing countries of Asia, Africa, and Latin America (James,2003). Malnutrition however, is not exclusive to developing nations. Many people in industrialized countries, although mostly well fed, still suffer from lack of proper nourishment. Biotechnology is the scientific field that offers the greatest potential to stop hunger today and help avoid mass starvation in the future. Through biotechnology, scientists can enhance a crop’s resistance to diseases and environmental stresses, allowing crops to be grown in relatively unproductive and unsuitable land. Recent developments in biotechnology will allow the production of more nutritious, safer, tastier, and healthier food. Advances in genetic engineering are revolutionizing the way we produce and consume food, and it is quite possible that in the next decade a large percentage of the food we eat will be bioengineered.

Link: http://www.ctahr.hawaii.edu/mbbe/faculty/files/Recent_advances_in_food_biotech.pdf

Peace

[TZ]

19. Wrong wrong wrong! This is not a conspiracy!!

I AM in the industry (in fact I work for a LARGE biotech that does both regular flu vaccines and is working on bird flu). Monsanto is NOT a significant player in this field.
I have NEVER met anyone who has a knowledge of pathology (whether they work in academia or industry) that isn't extremely worried about the avian flu. Its spreading world wide in both the poultry industry and in wild birds. It has YET to make the jump to human to human transmission on a large scale.
Have you already forgotten SARS? That came about because of unhealthy practices in China. Well let me tell you that nothing much has changed in China! WHO (the world health organization- and they are the EXPERTS in this field) is really worried about the pandemic possibilities. Pigs are natural resevoirs for mutating viruses that were animal pathogens to human pathogens. The Chinese are still keeeping pigs in dangerously close conditions with birds and humans. There are many experts who believe that its a matter of time before H5N1 goes from bird-pig-human and becomes deadly. Look at the flu pandemic of 1912. That happened from an influenza virus that we had no immunity from. Itst the same with H5N1. We have no immunity.
Please read some science before making ignorant statements like the one above. The scientific community is in agreement that H5N1 is a HUGE threat.

[Wiley50]

2. Fear And Ignorance Are Pandemic n/t

[hedgehog]

4. Are you suggesting that the flu shot is actually spreading pandemic flu?

Given your age and heart condition, you SHOULD be getting the flu vaccine because you are high risk for complications from influenza. Best case, the shot protects you against this year's virus. Worst case it protects you against the wrong virus. I don't even get a sore arm from the shot, so I don't see a downside.

Flu can be really serious. I still remember how sick my kids were with it. They were sitting in a row on the couch so tired they couldn't move! I thought they all had bad colds until their eyeballs turned red and I took them to the doctor! We've all been getting annual flu shots ever since one of the kids was diagnosed with asthma. None of us has had a bad reaction or gotten sick in about 18 years. The college students were especially glad I nagged them about vaccinations when they saw so many of their friends miss a week or more of classes. Influenza should not be confused with a stomach virus. If you get a good dose of it, expect to take a good 4 to 6 months to be fully recovered.

Why did you hear three references to the flu vaccine today? Because the first doses have been distributed to doctor's offices and clinics. Now ids the time to get a shot to build your immunity before flu season hits.

[Stinky The Clown]

6. My post was actually an attempt at skeptical snark

I don't trust a damned thing this administration says.

I can honestly imagine them trying to parlay a flu outbreak into some political gain .... at the cost of real lives.

[hedgehog]

10. I blame them for failing to solve the vaccine crisis because they are

so committed to the "free market" Can't have governmnet manufacturing or buying vaccine! Not having vaccines already costs real lives:

The CDC doesn't count adult deaths, but states 68 children died from influenza last year
http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/qa/0607season.htm

Other sources stste that flu lills 35,000 annually.
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/WhosCounting/story?id=1432589

[Mojorabbit]

8. It is a possible threat

and I have been following the news on it every day from around the world for the past few years plus I am on an email list comprised of infectious disease docs and researchers from around the world....
but...
So far it still is mostly in birds with only a few cases of human to human transmission. The reason for all the news now is the govt had given out money for projects a good while back which had to be completed near the end of this year and it looks like the agencies waited till the last minute to get their stuff out.

The flu shot may give you no protection from a pandemic but it would help weed you out from those who have a pandemic strain if one breaks out. Some studies say it might give you limited protection. I guess we won't know for sure until one happens.

Australia and Africa have had a worse than normal flu season with an above normal amount of deaths in the past few months. Nasty strain with a long recovery time and their hospitals were overwhelmed with patients. I think they are worried we might get this strain too when our season starts.

I'd check with your doc if you have any questions.

[oldlady]

11. I understand your concern

and can't really guess why the sudden bombastment of info/ads. But, I wanted to chime in as my husband, who did receive the flu shot, just missed a week of work and was hospitalized due to the flu. They kept him in hospital just to get the white count down and hydrate him, but he was totally immobile. Hope it skips the rest of us. yuk.

[pinto]

12. Apparently there are 130 million vaccines available this year.

That's up from about 100 million available last flu season.

The ads are the start of an annual campaign. This is 'National Adult Immunization Week', hence the PSA's.

2007 marks the 20th consecutive observance of NAIAW and is a great opportunity for individuals and organizations to promote the importance of adult and adolescent immunization.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/events/naiaw/default.htm

[hedgehog]

13. Don't take my word for it:

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/professionals/acip/background.htm

There is a PDF you can reach from that page that really goes into detail.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. The PSAs are done every year

severeal high risk populatiions need the vaccine every year

[Mojorabbit]

17. Here is a little more

re the US worry we might end up with the nasty strain Australia had.
snip
Perhaps of more concern, CDC is closely monitoring whether a new strain that emerged near the end of Australia's flu season will cause illness here - a strain that this year's vaccine doesn't specifically target.

Each year's vaccine contains protection against three influenza strains - two Type A strains, an H1N1 and an H3N2 version, plus a milder Type B - that experts predict will cause the most illness. The vaccine isn't always a perfect match, and this year's contains a different H3N2 version than the newly emerging one, nicknamed H3N2/Brisbane-like.

Get vaccinated anyway, Gerberding stressed. The other two strains in the vaccine are causing illness around the world, and even if the newer one travels here, too, the vaccine should provide some cross-protection

from
http://www.wtop.com/?nid=104&sid=1252554

[Hoof Hearted]

18. get your flu shot! I take my mom for one every year.

The older you get the less Influenza is something to roll the dice on and while the shot isn't perfect it IS a valuable tool in your defense. I don't think any credible entity has shown the least bit of credible evidence that the flu vaccine was or ever could be harmful. I know people around you have old wives tales about getting sick with the "flu" after their shot but quite frankly, that's a pile of crap. They may have (coincidentally) caught a common cold or they could just be the "I need attention" types. The proof is always in the pudding, and in this case the pudding is the blood work. NOBODY gets Influenza from a vaccination. Evah.

I would never, ever let my Mom get the shot if it wasn't worth it, or if there was any legitimate questions about the risk.



Oh, yeah. About the whole "bird flu" thing?

IMO? Total and complete bullshit. On the scale you have provided, I'd go with zero plus just a bit of additional commentary. They will use whatever kind of fear they can. Don't let the FEAR infect you. That is much more worrisome.

[TZ]

20. WHO FAQ on bird flu

http://www.who.int/csr/disease/avian_influenza/avian_faqs/en/index.html
Unless you think the world renowned organization on infectious diseases is owned by the Bushies even though they are based in Geneva, Switzerland.
Why the WHO is worried about China:
http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/World_Health_Organisation:_China_engaging_in_bird_flu_cover_up

Me, I think I would trust epidemiologists and microbiologists and pathologists to know their stuff.