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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:38 PM
Original message
Saw John Dean last night
He was here for a book signing. His new book is called Broken Government.

http://www.salon.com/books/feature/2007/09/11/dean/index_np.html

He had some very interesting comments about our government and how it has been destroyed by bush and cheney. He compared the corruption today to Watergate and said no one was killed during Watergate and no one spied electronically on Americans after Watergate. He said Nixon was trying to get out of Vietnam while bush was trying to get into Iraq. Nixon tried to make the presidency a dominant power but he failed. bush has succeeded. His Unitary Executive Theory is basically "an imperial presidency on stilts and steroids". He said that the executive branch lost a lot of power because of Nixon and Watergate but by the second or third year of the Reagan term, those powers had been regained.

Dean also thought the secrecy practices by the bush administration are one of their worst offenses. He said cheney claimed the presidency was weak and used that as justification for the secrecy and draconian policies implemented by the White House under bush. He also said this goes against conservative principles, as most conservatives don't want the president to have too much power.

Dean talked about Kerry's campaign and said he thought the secrecy issue would be raised in the 2004 campaign. He said he called the Kerry campaign after the election and asked why they never brought up this issue and they said it was a process issue and in campaigns, it is an unwritten rule that you debate policies, but not processes. He said process is very important to most Americans and he thought it is a mistake to leave this debate out of campaigns. Dean said process is the name of the game and you only get good policy if you have good process. In his book, Dean discusses processes and goes into greater detail on this point. (I looked that part up last night in the book and read it first.)

Dean said all the problems we see in the executive branch today point back to dick cheney. He called him a "very talented man". Dean talked about how cheney manipulated and pressured Gonzales and has solicited opinions from the dept of justice that are the most dishonest legal opinions Dean has ever seen. He said this is "really bogus stuff that will never hold up in a court of law".

Regarding Congress, Dean said the republicans bragged about bills being written on K Street and then brought to the House floor. They were stunned that the Dems won Congress back last year. He also said Pelosi is trying hard to reduce the incivility and get Congress working again. He said Newt Gingrich won the House by tearing it down and the Democrats are now hard at work repairing that damage. Pelosi immediately upset the republicans by restoring the 5 day work week. So now the republican strategy is obstructionism to win back the House in 2008. They don't want people to believe that Congress is working under the Democrats. And they are being successful at keeping the Democrats from running Congress. It is not a given that the Dems will retain Congress in 2008, not in the least.

Three out of four Americans believe our government is broken.

Dean said the worst damage is to the Supreme Court. Nixon politicized the justice selection process. The era of the true liberal on the Supreme Court is over. We now have four fundamentalists on the SC and they are "far beyond traditional conservative radicals". They want to change the law and they fully embrace the unitary executive theory. These fundamentalist justices reject the idea that the Bill of Rights applies to the states. And with only one more SC fundamentalist, the court will re-write federal law. Dean said if another opening comes up on the SC before bush is out of office, it is imperative that he be prevented from nominating another justice.

Of the candidates running for the republican nomination for president, Dean thinks Rudy is the most likely to appoint a fundamentalist and Ron Paul is the least likely. But he said Ron Paul has no chance to win, and the next least likely to appoint a fundamentalist would be Fred Thompson, as he is the least authoritarian.

When it came time for questions, my friend asked Dean about the likelihood of impeachment. He said there is not much time. He pointed out that the special prosecutor helped further impeachment against both Nixon and Clinton. And we have no special prosecutor today, who really should have started investigations a year or so ago. Dean also pointed out that Pelosi took impeachment of bush off the table, but not cheney.

Dean said that Clinton was brilliant, probably one of the smartest men ever to serve as president, that his brilliance and the fact that he was a good president offended the republicans so much that they were determined to pull the rug out from under him. He said Clinton's impeachment was personal, not political, and the republicans knew all along that it wouldn't be effective but didn't care.

Dean said the best evidence for impeachment is that bush violated the initial war resolution. He was supposed to submit a report stating that no diplomatic efforts had been successful. But instead, he submitted false documents to justify the invasion of Iraq. That's what he should be impeached for. The signing statements are bad too but presidents have been issuing signing statements for 200 years and they are perfectly legal.

Then Dean said impeachment can occur AFTER bush is out of office and we should be going after the underlings to depose them and curtail their political careers. He mentioned a few in particular when we asked him privately after his talk. So impeachment activists - we got some research to do. PM me for more info. :)



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orpupilofnature57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:51 PM
Original message
Scum like Kkkarl still roam to & fro doing damage is dangerous...
Edited on Sat Sep-22-07 12:53 PM by orpupilofnature57
But Shrub represents us ,and we will live with the consequences of his actions ,which is why we need to, if nothing else communicate to the world ,He is not us.Impeachment is the last time we get to vote ,remember Poppy only won once ,but has imposed himself forever.http://tomflocco.com/Docs/63/BushJfkBookDepo.htm
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grasswire Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
1. an unwritten rule made by whom?
"He said he called the Kerry campaign after the election and asked why they never brought up this issue and they said it was a process issue and in campaigns, it is an unwritten rule that you debate policies, but not processes. He said process is very important to most Americans and he thought it is a mistake to leave this debate out of campaigns."

The "process" in question is executive secrecy. I don't understand this. Does this mean that Democrats will not run against the corruption of the previous administration and those who supported it?

Policies but not processes. What the hell does that mean?

BTW, thanks for the summary. Dean is my hero.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. I didn't get that part either
That's why I read about that first in his book. I still don't get it. Sorry.
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tularetom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
2. Every time I see him on Countdown I'm impressed
He has managed to point out directly and succinctly what the problem is.

I believe as he says that cheney is behind all the shit that's going on. Bush is a gulliblle naive little boy, mean, selfish and insecure. Cheney knew just what he was doing when he forced his way onto the ticket. With a weakling like bush in the white house, cheney and his mentor rumsfeld would have more or less carte blanche to put into place their cockamamie unitary executive theories that they had nursed ever since the Nixon days. And ironically when the shit hits the fan cheney won't step up to take resposibility for it. He'll let the boy king hang for the whole thing. Rumsfeld hass already practically denied ever meeting gw bush.

Someday it'll all dawn on the chimp what a sucker he has been played for. I eagerly await that day. It may bring on the long awaited meltdown complete with screaming, crying for mommy and wind up with a straight jacket.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. We saw our congressman today at breakfast and he said basically the same thing
He said he thought bush was a good person who has surrounded himself with very bad people.

He also said he knew that some of us wouldn't agree with that :)
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:15 PM
Response to Reply #2
14. This is very important stuff. We all need to get on target.
Now is the time for focus. I appreciate this post and this thread. Time is of the essence. But the task is bogged down with neocon goo. I just don't know how we're ever going to survive this.
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rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
3. This sentence I believe-----and worry about:



......It is not a given that the Dems will retain Congress in 2008, not in the least.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:05 PM
Response to Reply #3
6. Yes I believe that too.
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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
7. Thank you for the great report.
God Bless John Dean.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:12 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. You are welcome!
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EVDebs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:05 PM
Response to Original message
8. Anyone got that jpeg of the 5 SCOTUS justices in clown suits ? eom
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seafan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
9. More on impeaching as many underlings as possible:
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renate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:09 PM
Response to Original message
10. wow, you take great notes! Thanks so much for this detailed report!
It's pretty scary that he says it's not a given that we'll retain Congress. With so many scandals brewing, all with an (R) attached, I have to admit that anything other than gaining even more seats is a scenario I hadn't really imagined.
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:13 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. We can't forget Congress's approval rating
is lower than the president's.
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Demeter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. I Agree Completely
This campaign to take back America will proceed in the cracks and crannies and dark places of ordinary American lives. We need the light shone by such as John Dean to guide us.
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
12. John Dean is a god.
But he scares me with the truth.

I'm impressed with how well we've done on the forum. We really do have it figured out. But we cloud it sometimes. Like the Pelosi matter. That was good stuff from Dean.

And thank you for posting this. Very helpful. But very frightening. They live amongst us, the bastards!
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lyonn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:17 PM
Response to Original message
15. The worst damage is the Supreme Court
Edited on Sat Sep-22-07 01:25 PM by lyonn
..."it is imperative that he be prevented from nominating another justice."


This is an Absolute! They end up deciding the powers the President has. Imagine, the SC elected George!

Edit: He said, we have four fundamentalist on the SC now and they are radical (my words).

Thanks for your post! Dean is constantly reminding us of what is truly going on in our government.
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NJCher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:36 PM
Response to Original message
16. source of hate for Clinton
Dean said that Clinton was brilliant...the fact that he was a good president offended the republicans so much ... Clinton's impeachment was personal, not political.

That's interesting--I always thought that might be an element of why they went after Clinton so viciously but does he really think the VRWC is founded on little more than personal ire?

Thanks for the thorough report, Proud2BLib.



Cher
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Dean said he was called upon to be on several talk shows with the republicans
during Clinton's impeachment. And he had lots of time to talk to them back stage off the air. And they all agreed that they were motivated by hatred of Clinton.
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NJCher Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-23-07 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #17
21. did you see Alan Greenspan this a.m,?
He said Clinton and Nixon were the two most intelligent presidents he'd worked with.

I just wonder if Greenspan is aware of the financing of the Monica Lewinsky fiaso by Richard Mellon Scaife.




Cher
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
19. great summary, thank you!
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Rock_Garden Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-22-07 04:22 PM
Response to Original message
20. I'm glad that John Dean is enjoying a burst of popularity....
because his input is vital, now, and we need to hear it. I consider him our guiding light.
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CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-23-07 04:24 PM
Response to Original message
22. Next month, he's coming to talk here in CA!
I plan to be there, with my questions and my camera!

How lucky for you that you got to hear him, and talk to him!

I really hope I can do the same!

:patriot:
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