How Dare You (Kinsley)

[H2O Man]

I hesitate to post this quote from Michael Kinsley’s commentary from this week’s edition of TIME (10-1-07; page 25). I know that many people were deeply offended by the MoveOn ad that Kinsley speaks of. Years from now, historians will likely recognize the publication of the ad as a turning point that marked the beginning of the end of western uncivilization. However, if an Iranian madman can speak at a top university, and an American madman can address the UN, I’m hoping that we can all sit down and read this:

"Goodness gracious. oh, my paws and whiskers. Some of the meanest, most ornery hombres around are suddenly feeling faint. Notorious tough guys are swooning with the vapors. The biggest beasts in the barnyard are all aflutter over something they read in the New York Times. It's that ad from MoveOn.org — the one that calls General David Petraeus, the head of U.S. forces in Iraq, general betray us. All across the radio spectrum, right-wing shock jocks are themselves shocked. How could anybody say such a thing? It's horrifying. It's outrageous. It's disgraceful. It's just beyond the pale ... It's ... oh, my heavens ... say, is it a bit stuffy in here? ... I think I'm going to ... Could I have a glass of ... oh, dear .

"Welcome to the wonderful world of umbrage, the new language of American politics. You would not have thought that the likes of Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly would be so sensitive. Sticks and stones and so on. Yet they all seem to have taken one look at that ad and fainted dead away. And when they came round, they demanded — as if with one voice (or at least as if with one list of talking points) — that every Democratic presidential candidate must "condemn" this shocking, shocking document. ….


"The Republican front runner, Rudy Giuliani, is another tough guy who has seized the opportunity to reveal his easily bruised soft side. He is running TV commercials saying Hillary Clinton "stood by silently" while MoveOn.org ran its despicable ad. Another way of saying this would be that she had nothing to do with the ad. But Rudy accuses her of "joining with" MoveOn.org and "attacking" General Petraeus, although the only evidence he can muster for this accusation is a clip from Clinton telling the general at a hearing that his reports of progress in the war "really require the willing suspension of disbelief." For this, Giuliani demands an "apology," not just to the general but to all American troops in Iraq. He accuses her of "turning her back" on America's brave soldiers "just when our troops need all our support to finish the job."

"When we try to untangle this web of accusation and innuendo, Giuliani appears to be suggesting that it is unacceptable for a Senator to express skepticism about anything said by a general in uniform. If he believes that, he does not understand democracy. I am shocked by this. In fact, if Giuliani doesn't apologize, and if the other Republican candidates don't condemn this commercial, I think I'm going to faint.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1663424,00.html

[AuntPatsy]

1. the longer this goes on the worse we look, stupid is as stupid does I guess.

[H2O Man]

2. Oh, I think that

David Shuster had a wonderful way of showing what is important last night. I don't think democrats look stupid because of an independent group's ad.

[AuntPatsy]

4. Nor do I at all, it is those people attempting to ensure they do that end up showing

themselves to be stupid.

the very fact that the repubs have called any and all Liberals Dem's and anyone who does not agree with their agenda Betrayers to America is what makes this newest hypocrisy mind numbing.

[H2O Man]

7. Okay.

I wasn't sure what you meant. Thank you for clarifying. There are a few people here that are quite concerned that polls show more than 150% of Americans hate democrats because of the MoveOn poll.

[Me.]

10. I Was Thinking The Same Thing As I read Your Post #2

The polls do not support Move-On's ad overall, with it having a 28% favorability. But why would we expect otherwise? The Republicon noise machine has been blovating with umbrage over the progressives for years. But aside from the obviousness of the ad pointing out admin lies via Petraeus, I think the important thing is it may signal a sea change, that the gloves are, finally, coming off. With the ad, Shuster last night followed by KO, maybe, just maybe we are going to start giving as good as we get.

[H2O Man]

11. Right.

I did not think the ad was very good. I think that DUers have listed a couple rather obvious ways it could have been 100 times better, with but a couple of changes.

However, I agree with the basic message. And I am concerned with the attacks of the republicans. Hence, I got out the old check book, and mailed a donation to MoveOn.org.

[dmr]

22. I had the very same reaction

Between the professional Noise Machine and the Senate's 75-25 vote last week, this idiocy sent me to my checkbook too. From the looks of the donations sent in, you and I are not alone.

These games get old pretty quick. We aren't in the 90s anymore, and the tricks of 2000 thru 2006 have worn old. Compounding that with the constant, and I do mean constant 'cry wolf' din each time they find themselves losing control, especially when Americans (left & right) are not afraid to speak the truth. The Noise Machine may garner support from closed-minded Americans, but lately, it isn't working very well with the apolitical Americans with half an ear to what these loud, disagreeable people are saying. Too much water, jobs, prosperity, civil liberties and lives have passed under the bridge and while the Noise Machine is majoring in the minors, nobody is doing anything to at least salve our wounds.

[burythehatchet]

15. No, they only look stupid when they join in the bash-fest.

[Toots]

5. Telling the truth is definitely a very stupid thing to do in this new Amerika we live in

:shrug: Besides it's a well known fact that truth has a serious Liberal Bias.

[FredScuttle]

6. Who keeps bringing it up?

Republicans seem to think this is the issue to reverse the public's increasing hostility to this war. I say let 'em....when they fillibuster bills to give our soldiers more rest and then, a week later, announce investigations into a friggin newspaper ad, they are exposed for what they are: shrill, caterwauling clowns who are more concerned with protecting their Dear Leader and his insane war than actually giving a shit about our troops.

[acmavm]

3. I agree with Kinsley. And if people were offended by this ad,

they need to go to a military morgue the Baghdad morgue and see how that tweaks their sensibilities.

[cspanlovr]

8. The repubs are like all bullies - they can dish it out, but they can't take it.

[annabanana]

9. "swooning with the vapors"

I saw this article and laughed out loud. ("manufactured outrage" doesn't convey it nearly as well as umbrage)

[oasis]

12. A big K&R for an excellent Mike Kinsley piece.

[porphyrian]

13. It's amazing more people don't see how ridiculous their reaction is.

It exposes them as the glass-jawed bullies they are. I'm surprised there haven't been any more swings at them yet.

[yardwork]

14. Glass-jawed bullies!! I haven't heard that in ages. That's perfect.

That totally sums up the Republican Party.

[nashville_brook]

16. have you noticed that all the outrage lately has to do with speech rather than actions?

"They shouldn't have said that (in the ad). He shouldn't have been rude at the podium. Columbia shouldn't have let him speak." Something about this situation smells of cowardice -- as if we've all been rounded up and someone in the back is shouting "show us your credential or let us go." The rest of the crowd turns their anger to the one who spoke rather than the ones who have "rounded us up."

There's a lesson about courage in here somewhere. It's easier to take umbrage with the lonely protester than to address concerns to the source of oppression. Castigating the speech itself shuts down the critique of oppression/corruption. Going after the speaker is exactly what the Limbaughs and the Roves want us to do.

I thought the primary freedom we fight for in a democracy is the freedom of speech. It's UNPOPULAR speech that needs protection -- not the kind that everyone agrees with (kittens are cute; cake is yummy).

What's happening (again) is that progressives are making a mad dash to "the middle" because "we're just THAT 'reasonable.' See how I don't support unpopular speech! See how we can find 'common ground.' See how we're on the same team."

Indeed.

[CrispyQ]

17. Your post is worthy of it's own thread.

:thumbsup:

[TahitiNut]

18. "It's UNPOPULAR speech that needs protection" ... EXACTLY

As I've noted repeatedly (despite asshat dissent), political protest is by its very nature UNPOPULAR. It is even more unpopular when its morally well-grounded protest - because people take umbrage at having their immoral behavior spotlighted.

Its ludicrous that anyone would think DU is an exception to the "popularity rule" - since we're some of the most self-righteously defensive folks on the planet when it comes to criticism. That comes with the territory when you're part of the established political opposition - a role that's jealously guarded.

[Raster]

20. By all means, if you can't attack the message because your position is un-tenuous,

then attack the messenger and/or the delivery. We should be hitting back HARD! The issue should NOT be Patreus/Betray Us, but the content. Patreus IS a lying sack of shit and a water carrier for cheney*/bush*.

And you are more than correct--it is unpopular speech that needs protection, AND the right to be able to express it. The issue that should a chill down EVERY AMERICANS back is that Congress voted to censure free speech. That is unconscionable.

Wake up America!:kick:

[Kurovski]

19. K&R. (nt)

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

21. Nobody was deeply offended by the Moveon ad.

Just a bunch of posers pretending to be offended.