I must reluctantly come to the defense of Bill O'Reilly.

[The Witch]

He's never done anything worthy of being defended, but I am a liberal, after all...

Juan Williams on C-SPAN's Washington Journal this morning said that basically, Bill was drawing a comparison between the *reality* of life in Harlem (vis-a-vis the restaurant he was in) and the life depicted in hip-hop music, etc. If that's the case, he really is getting a bum rap. (Not on anything else, mind you... just on this.)

Is there any other information to this effect?

Be nice to me, I had surgery on Tuesday.

EDIT: Thanks y'all.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. Bill O'Reilly's a blatant racist.

Both in his patronizing of black people, and his hypocritical attacks on black music.

[EFerrari]

4. His stage persona is also a blatant stereotype.

Which makes Williams' defense even more silly.

[IsItJustMe]

78. Straight up

[rockymountaindem]

2. If that's the case, then why the references to "it's just like a restaurant run by white people"?

If what Juan Williams said is really the case, O'Reilly would have compared it to, I don't know, the 50-Cent cafe or something. But no, he compared it to a "white" restaurant. If this was about hip-hop, he wouldn't have brought up white people.

I'm not buying one word of that.

[monktonman]

3. Bull shit

He's saying that after the fact.
everyone knows what he was saying
and if it was sooooooo taken out of context then why wont he play it on his show.
After watching Juan Williams last night, I have lost all respect for him as well.

Go to the DU video forum and listen for yourself.

[Richard Steele]

5. Sorry, no. That's a lame excuse that took days to invent. I'm not buying it. nm

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

34. I have to agree with the Witch on this one...

O'Reilly may be a bonehead and a racist bonehead to boot, but I don't think that was his intention here. I think the point he was trying to make is that if you listened to nothing but rap music and popular culture, you'd think that Harlem was a hell-hole of gangs and drugs and violence. The reality is that places like the restaurant where he dined were just as nice as anyplace else in New York City.

I listened to the long-playing version of his discussion with Juan Williams, and while his rhetorical skills leave something to be desired (pretty damned ironic for a guy who gets paid $50 million per year to talk), I don't think he intended his remarks to be racist. There have been plenty of times when O'Reilly has been racist, but I don't think this was one of them.

Which is not to say that watching him bloviate about being attacked by CNN aren't amusing as hell!

[LisaM]

6. Juan Williams, don't get me started

According to him, I was over the 2000 election early in 2001. Well, word to Juan, I'm STILL not over it, and neither are a lot of Americans.

[seemslikeadream]

7. just watch this

http://www.comedycentral.com/motherload/player.jhtml?ml_video=103650&ml_collection=&ml_gateway=&ml_gateway_id=&ml_comedian=&ml_runtime=&ml_context=show&ml_origin_url=%2F%3Fsicontent%3D0%26sicreative%3D524355040%26siclientid%3D1838%26sitrackingid%3D6314636%26gclid%3DCMC5zrHa5o4CFRcTgQodGzKBKA&ml_playlist=&lnk=&is_large=true

[The Wielding Truth]

8. Okay, Witch . Step back and look at the man, then say you

need to defend him. He talks to make money,controversy makes money he has very little altruistic views if any.

He is a caricature similar to Colbert. If you want to defend Donald Duck I would be the more sympathetic.

[AlCzervik]

9. oh no he was not getting a "Bum's rap" check out this part that wasn't talked about much

ok and then decide.

O'REILLY: You know, and I went to the concert by Anita Baker at Radio City Music Hall, and the crowd was 50/50, black/white, and the blacks were well-dressed. And she came out -- Anita Baker came out on the stage and said, "Look, this is a show for the family. We're not gonna have any profanity here. We're not gonna do any rapping here." The band was excellent, but they were dressed in tuxedoes, and this is what white America doesn't know, particularly people who don't have a lot of interaction with black Americans. They think that the culture is dominated by Twista, Ludacris, and Snoop Dogg.

Ok for real, O'Reilly Assumes his audience has the same view of blacks that he does, he is basically using his audience as "The children, think of the children" he keeps saying "That white america (the folks)" doesn't see black people in any other terms than Rapper, gang member or "Get me some more ice tea muthaaa fuckaa!" uneducated black patron at a black owned place of business.

In the end O'Reilly insults black people and his audience and just about everyone else.

[EFerrari]

19. That's pretty much his job description, I think. n/t

[chaumont58]

10. I wouldn't defend Shrill Oreally is he were protecting the Bill of Rights

O'Reilly is a no good son of a bitch, period, exclamation point.

[BootinUp]

11. Ok, nice to you but not BillO

you liberalism should allow you to see that this man is a professional communicator spouting horrendously bigoted views on our citizens, and smearing a whole race of people who have brains that work far better than his. Why would anyone think a restaurant should look like a hip hop music video? Black people work for a living, they watch listen to hip hop for entertainment just like people of all races. Why is he not confused in restaurants patronized/owned by white people that they aren't full of people acting and looking like they come out of a Brittany Spears video?

[ellacott]

12. He made a bad choice with his words and needs to admit it

He is acting like a fool by going on the attack against anyone who had something negative to say about his choice of words.

By saying he was amazed at the service even though it's run by blacks is the wrong thing to say. There is no debating this. All he has to do is say that the words came out wrong and apologize if he offended anyone.

He can't do that because he has too much pride.

[11 Bravo]

13. Fuck him. In the ass. With a red hot poker. Wrapped in barbed wire.

[Swamp Rat]

15. He'd like that.

[madeline_con]

87. Ouch! How very appropriate. n/t

[A HERETIC I AM]

14. He "Couldn't get over the fact" that the black patrons were just normal, decent folk....

These are HIS words..

"You know, I was up in Harlem a few weeks ago, and I actually had dinner with Al Sharpton, who is a very, very interesting guy, and he comes on The Factor a lot, and I treated him to dinner because he's made himself available to us, and I felt that I wanted to take him up there. And we went to Sylvia's, a very famous restaurant in Harlem. I had a great time. And all the people up there are tremendously respectful, they all watch The Factor. You know, when Sharpton and I walked in, it was, like, big commotion and everything, but everybody was very nice. And I couldn't get over the fact that there was no difference between Sylvia's restaurant and any other restaurant in New York City. I mean it was -- it was exactly the same, even though it's run by blacks, primarily black patronship; it was the same. And that's really what this society is all about, now...

<...> There wasn't one person in Sylvia's who was screaming, 'M-Fer, I want more iced tea.' You know, I mean, everybody was -- it was like going into an Italian restaurant in an all-white suburb in the sense of people were sitting there, and they were ordering and having fun. And there wasn't any kind of craziness at all."

(Bold and italics mine)

He might not have meant it the way it came out, but if someone is unable to "get over the fact" that black people out to dinner in a nice restaurant might JUST POSSIBLY act like decent WHITE folks act, "Even though it's run by blacks" then it is a racist mindset.

BTW, Juan Williams has jumped the shark, in my opinion. He has started to carry more and more water for Billo.

[freestyle]

62. That is the money line that shows the racism.

If he was shocked that Black people at a restaurant owned by Black people acted like people just out for a good meal, then he is operating from a racist view. Also if he knew nothing about Sylvia's after years in New York, then he is actively avoiding knowledge of or interaction with Black people. Sylvia's is famous.

[anniebelle]

16. Sorry, ain't buyin' on DU either.

Oh he does protest too much. Just like every little weasel that gets caught at their evil doing. Nope, he's still a bigoted POS.

[EFerrari]

17. This is how you know Williams is full of it, just like Bin Reilly.

O'Reilly isn't ten years old. How can anyone live in a city as diverse as New York and NOT know that all black people aren't anything? All any kind of people, for that matter.

This, imho, was a staged flap because that big jerk's ratings were low. He knew exactly what he was doing and what would happen.

[AlCzervik]

18. no kidding! O'Reilly was also a newscaster in Boston when i lived there, guess what?

Black people live and work in Boston.

Last point, if Juan didn't have a contract with Faux would he really be spending his time defending Billo?

[EFerrari]

20. Black people -- in BOSTON?!

LOL

Williams is a shill for BushCo and a disgusting human being.

[applegrove]

21. I was a terrible thing to say. Shows he's a victim of stereotypes. That

he really was out of his element in the restaurant. My sister had a school friend who moved to Canada from the USA years ago. She said that she expected indians to come riding by on horses for her first few months in the country. And this was a child talking. A child traumatized by a move to a new country. Bill O is a man and should not have been so vulnerable to a trip to a local restaurant.

[Mike Daniels]

22. Thats how Bill has been spinning it.

The perception of black culture as portrayed through rap music, videos, etc. vs. the reality of it as seen by a visit to the restaurant in Harlem.

Black culture seen on TV - loud obnoxious people yelling MF'er, pimps, hos, etc.

Reality - families sitting down at restaurant, nicely dressed, polite, courteous, civil, etc.


I didn't see/hear Bill O's original bit so I don't know if he's full of it or not.

[Dollface]

23. Thanks for asking. That was very liberal (anti-knee-jerk) of you.

But it was just more backwards justification by the folks who brought us 911, no wait WMD, oh yeah, Saddam's an evil brutal dictator, no I think its democracy yeah, that's it, we went to Iraq to bring freedom to the Iraqi's. No wait, its the Iranians, I'm sure now.

[alcibiades_mystery]

24. The really funny (if racist) thing is that you think "hip hop"

portrays black people acting negatively in restaurants.

Hip hop is a diverse and rich art form that has many branches and approaches.

It's a bit like saying I was "shocked" because when I went to summer camp there wasn't a deranged supernatural killer on the loose. Holy cow! No deranged serial murderer in the summer camp? That really shows yo how those horror movies are all lies!

:eyes:

[ellacott]

48. That's funny!!!!!!!!!! n/t

[Az]

25. What those who don't see the racism are missing

Is that he is stating that it was his assumption that African Americans were somehow lesser people and that they somehow managed to do something like a white person was amazing to him. Its a back handed insult. Its like saying "You are smart for a woman" or "You look good for a change". Its right up there with claiming some of your best friends are black. Stating that you expected a difference is the racism. That he was trying to state something positive does not hide the fact that he harbors racist thinking. Its the same as the racism tossed at Obama when it was commented that he spoke well for a black person and was clean. It was meant as good but it revealed an undercurrent of racist thinking.

[alcibiades_mystery]

28. Stating that you expected a difference is not racism

Stating that you expected a NEGATIVE difference is racism.

[Az]

30. Point taken

And it is clear from Billo's comments that he was "Pleasantly" surprised. ie He expected something lesser.

[alcibiades_mystery]

36. Oh, absolutely

Billo's a racist douchebag of the worst sort: he's a race baiter.

I'm just concerned that we recognize difference as positive and productive. We don't all have to be the "same" for there to be a racism-free society. In fact, quite the opposite!

[Mountainman]

39. Bull shit! Those are your words not his.

"he is stating that it was his assumption that African Americans were somehow lesser people" O'Reilly stated nothing of the sort!

[Az]

43. Did you read what he said?

He was amazed. Surprised. Those are his words. That is the racism. That is that backhand to his compliment. That is what the problem is.

[Mountainman]

45. He was not amazed at all! That is the problem! That is the interpretation put on the story.

O'Reilly was speaking as if he were one of the people who think of African Americans as only the hip hop / gangster culture. Those people who don't associate with Blacks much would be amazed that in the restaurant they act just as white people not gangsters.

I think the hate O'Reilly crowd is so strong here it doesn't matter anymore what the truth is. There is so much of that on this board that it makes some of want to stay away.

[Az]

47. I pay little attention to him

I am not a Hate OReilly member. I am an ignore him and most other media mouth piece member. But my reading of his comments suggests racism is inherent in his thinking. The key phrase was "I was pleasantly surprised". Why was he surprised? If he wasn't surprised then why say he was? Why give ground to the permissibility of people thinking such things? Why make a reputable black run company seem surprising?

Sorry but it just seems like a tip of his inner thinking rather than anything so nuanced as you are suggesting.

[Mountainman]

60. Well I will never convince anyone so it doesn't really matter.

[PDenton]

80. everybody has some degree of prejudice

or ignorance. I'm not sure it equates to racism for O'Reilly to say what he did. It was an emotional reaction. The brain is a stereotyping machine, we look for patterns and sometimes we see ones that aren't quite right. Sometimes the mind makes up shorthand ways of explaining the world. We also do not have perfect knowledge of everything (otherwise we would be God and not human).

I had a friend years ago when I was younger, an older friend of sorts, maybe what you'ld call a mentor (though really he wasn't a perfect role model- he kept getting married for trivial reasons and dumping his wives- but he did support his kids. However, he did like having fun, something my dad doesn't like doing much of). He was actually an aquaintance/collegue of my dad's at work. He just happened to be black. The first time I went to his house, I was surprised how much like every other house it looked like. I was expecting maybe lots of African touches... or something discenarble different, or something like that. No, it looked like every other house. Every white person practically carries around some of that kind of stereotypes. Is it racist? I don't know. But I bet alot of people have done the same things O'Reilly has done, they just don't 'fess up to it.

The only thing wierd about that guy was he didn't like cats, which seemed really odd. He said when he grew up, cats were assosciated with evil. Which I found odd. Maybe he was just aulurophobic, or maybe it was assosciated with being black, I don't know. See, that's an area I don't know something about.

So, the only thing O'Reilly is really guilty of is having stereotypes and not being as worldly as he claimed. Maybe he should be more reticent about things he doesn't know much about, like blacks, in the future. Humility is always a good thing.

[Az]

81. Its still racism

I agree its not outright blatant racism. But it is the very essence of racism. I won't be calling for his resignation over this issue. I don't consider it malicious. Merely indicative of his inner thinking.

We are indeed pattern recognition machines. But what we assign as meaning to those patterns is important. And understanding when something is racist (mildly or not) is important so we can educate people better as to how to avoid such thinking. And Bill O'Reilly has racist thoughts. Others who think like him have racist thoughts as well. Understanding that is necessary to overcome them. And that is where his lack of humility gets him in trouble.

This could easily have blown over if he had realized that his comments did contain racist notions and he had owned up to them. But he instead fought the charge and made an issue of it far more than it need to have been.

[PDenton]

83. here's the thing... if he were really racist

A person who is really racist towards blacks would have gone to Al Sharpton's favorite restaurant, and walk away complaining about the food and the music; they'd find something in their experience to demean blacks- not something in their lack of experience. He was just misinformed. He probably thought, mistakenly Hip Hop was how all, or many blacks operate... after all, that is a significant media portrayal of African Americans. In fact I watched a replay of a Congressional hearing to that effect on C-Span (with many good arguements pro- and con concerning Gangster Rap).

It seems to me what you are expecting of most people in terms of their non-prejudice is beyond the scope of the average human. It might even require inhuman powers of clairvoyance or omniscience.

[Az]

93. No, you are mixing things

The suggestion is not that he is a Clan member or anyone that dedicated to hating a particular group. The claim is that he sees black people as a different sort of class of being. Lesser than himself and others like him. That he was surprised at their civility is the indicator in play here. He is open to learning but he harbors racist views still.

[madeline_con]

88. Yes! Yes! Yes! ABSOLUTELY!

He implied that blacks would not be "ordering and having a good time" in a Harlem restaurant, sas if they were some "other type". It was SO transparent, how can anyone not see it? :bounce:

[Oilwellian]

26. Consider this...

the WH recently contacted NPR and said they'd like them to do an interview with Bush. But there was one catch...only Juan Williams could do the interview. NPR declined the offer. Ask yourself, why Bush specifically wanted Juan Williams. Bush wouldn't dare be interviewed by anyone who wasn't willing to toss the softball questions and Juan would have done just that.

I think Williams hurt Billo's case even more if he thinks the image of hop-hop defines all blacks. They're both equal opportunity bigots.

[Mythsaje]

27. So Billo's getting his impressions of black folks from hip-hop videos?

Does he expect all white folks to party like rockstars too?

[Schema Thing]

29. On one small portion of his comments, I'll defend him

When you read the transcripts, you see that his "no one was saying, 'give me more Iced Tea, Motherfucker'" comment was specifically in reference to famous black people who do indeed talk like that.

But his overall comments were crass and frankly, clueless.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

32. Uh, what?

""no one was saying, 'give me more Iced Tea, Motherfucker'" comment was specifically in reference to famous black people who do indeed talk like that."

And that's not racist how?

[FredScuttle]

53. Samuel L. Muthafucking Jackson

Now, this is the type of Negro ol' Falafel is used to.

[PDenton]

84. I wonder if Samual L. Jackson is aware of the stereotype

The stereotype he is creating? It's not exactly Mandingo (too sophisticated for that) not Steppin Fetchit (too smart), and not The Magical African-American Friend (more interested in kicking ignorant white ass than putting them on the right path)... but it's the "badass mo' fo". Not totally negative compared to the past, but it is becomming a stereotype of sorts.

[baldguy]

31. That's mighty white of you.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

35. Oh, you...

:rofl:

[baldguy]

54. WHAT!?!? That's a COMPLIMENT!

[Lucinda]

33. Wishing you a speedy recovery!

I'm usually all about defending people who are being virtually mugged if the facts are being blurred...but I think Willaims and BillO are just spinning this to try and save Bills arse. I believe he was genuinely impressed...but I also believe he is a card carrying moran. ;)

[Mountainman]

37. You are correct. I heard the entire interview and that is what was said by

both O'Reilly and Williams. I don't like O'Reilly as much as anyone else here but I don't like what people are saying about this more.

[renie408]

38. Aww shit. I was really enjoying this, too. God, I hate having to cut people like him any slack. n/t

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

40. Why cut him slack?

It's still racism.

[renie408]

49. Ok, I won't. I was already considering pretending I hadn't read this anyway. n/t

[TahitiNut]

52. O'Reilly uses faux parody to spread racism and hate. It's a fraud - a cover story.

If folks want to see parody, they can tune in to Colbert ... and the Comedy Channel. Those who use the pretense of "entertainment" to spread fascist propaganda are the lowest of the low - liars and predators.

[Justitia]

41. Juan Williams is an apologist for the forces of darkness, just a heads up. -eom

[Cleita]

42. Ah c'mon.

I'm Latina and when I used to tell people that I was Latina or they caught me speaking Spanish on the telephone to my mother, they used to come over and tell me that "gosh my gosh, we didn't know you were one of them; you don't look like them". Why? because I don't run around with a rose clenched between my teeth and fruit on my head (the stereotype of the day)?

That's like people of color saying to white people, "Wow, you aren't like them. We thought all white people had shaved heads, swastika tattoos and wore white sheets."

[Elidor]

44. Shorter O'Reilly:

"Black people! Eating with utensils! I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes!"

[Fading Captain]

46. I have to agree

I heard it broadcast late one night (In the Detroit area, it's a taped broadcast) and both people were talking about how people shouldn't think that blacks live the way they are portrayed in hip-hop videos.

Now, the "just like White restaurants" shows a bit of a racism, for sure, but the comments have been blown out of proporation.

[FooFootheSnoo]

50. I do too

I HATE Bill O'Reilly with a passion. His remarks were stupid. They were somewhat racist, but I don't believe he was trying to be racist.

[Cleita]

51. "Just like" are never acceptable words in comparing one culture to another.

We don't like it when the French or British snoot down their noses in referring to our "barbaric" American ways. I have been told by Europeans, but you are so nice and polite for being an American. I politely don't make an issue of what comes from ignorance, but it's not acceptable and neither were O'Reilly's comments.

[Fading Captain]

61. That's fine

But there is a difference between being promoting hate and being ignorant.

That's my poin.

[rucky]

55. Anybody have a transcript?

we can check the context.

[madeline_con]

90. A quote from the NYT....

“It was like going into an Italian restaurant in an all-white suburb in the sense of people were sitting there and they were ordering and having fun,” he said. “And there wasn’t any kind of craziness at all.”

[barronvonsloat]

56. Possible solution to Billo

Dont watch him.!!!!!!!! Ignore Media Matters and you wont have to come up with contrived liberal anger about something so meaningless.

[BlooInBloo]

57. I was shocked that I wasn't raped and killed by blacks yesterday.

[madeline_con]

91. Me, too. After all, some live right in my neighborhood!

:rofl:

[KharmaTrain]

58. "Some Of My Best Friends Are"

Imagine if O'Reilly had said he went to a Jewish restaurant and was surprised he didn't see people running around with horns on. Or at an Italian restaurant and was amazed he didn't see the Sopranos whacking people...or at a German restaurant and was amazed there weren't brown shirts serving the food. It's both ignorance and prejudice on the most subtle level.

I heard Williams this morning. He's carrying water for his meal ticket. What do you expect from someone on Murdoch's payroll?

What's worse is that BillO hides behind Williams and attempts to kiss up to Sharpton and Jesse Jackson as though they're the "king of the negros" or some other deity that will somehow absolve his racism. This was the same schitck Imus pulled. It's bad enough Sharpton and Jackson played into BillO's game and it flies in the face of BillO's attacks on those who exposed his comment.

One has to consider the source and context here.

[BlooInBloo]

59. Everyone knows it's racist. Some are just playing the "plausible deniability" card...

... Assuming that their white teammates will go for it. They have good historical reason for that hope.

[Brewman_Jax]

63. Don't waste your time

BillO no more listens to rap music than runs marathon races. If anything, the racist falafel whacker should be reminded of his call of a boycott against Pepsi for hiring Ludacris because he's a "man that degrades women." Funny that BillO can't be held to his own standards. :eyes:

[Disturbed]

64. Well at least African Americans are starting to think for

themselves and not allowing Sharpton & Jesse Jackson think for them That is major progress aint it?

[Brewman_Jax]

65. They always have

I think you forgot the :sarcasm:

[Disturbed]

66. Haha I didn't think I needed to add that.

It is obvious that Billo is a bigot, aint it?

[in_cog_ni_to]

67. Well now, this is a first. O'LIElly is a racist.

The man hates anyone who isn't white.


O'Reilly's Racist Slurs--in Context

By Peter Hart

In April 2003, Fox News Channel's Bill O'Reilly hosted a fundraiser for Best Friends, a charity benefiting inner-city schoolchildren. As reported in the Washington Post (4/15/03), O'Reilly was trying to fill the time before a singing group connected with the charity, called the Best Men, was set to perform, and quipped: "Does anyone know where the Best Men are? I hope they're not in the parking lot stealing our hubcaps." <snip>


The actual "context" of O'Reilly's slur is a history of making derogatory, stereotyping comments about people of color. Just a few examples:

* During an interview for Stuff magazine (11/02), O'Reilly opined that "the most unattractive women in the world are probably in the Muslim countries." O'Reilly later insisted (New York Daily News, 10/10/02), "There was no malice intended. It was just in jest."

* During a segment (2/9/00) about black athletes suing over the minimum academic standards for college admission, O'Reilly commented: "Look, you know as well as I do most of these kids come out and they can't speak English."

* Criticizing Democratic politicians who met with Rev. Al Sharpton, which O'Reilly compared to meeting with white supremacist David Duke: "Why would it be different? Both use race to promote themselves." (3/16/00) O'Reilly also equated the Black Panthers with Duke (1/11/99): "You were promoting your people, black people, and he's promoting white people. So what's the difference?"

* "We have black leaders in this country who blame everything on whitey, everything's the system's fault, and that gives a built-in excuse to fail and act irresponsible. 'Oh, I can't get a job. Whitey won't let me,' or 'I can't get educated. The teachers are bad, so I'm going to go out and get high and sell drugs. That's the only way we can make money here.' You know what I mean? And it's a vicious cycle" (6/8/99).

* "Will African-Americans break away from the pack thinking and reject immorality--because that's the reason the family's breaking apart--alcohol, drugs, infidelity. You have to reject that, and it doesn't seem--and I'm broadly speaking here, but a lot of African-Americans won't reject it" (2/25/99).

* "I've been to Africa three times. All right? You can't bring Western reasoning into the culture. The same way you can't bring it into fundamental Islam" (5/6/02).

After the "wetback" incident, O'Reilly wrote in a newspaper column (South Florida Sun-Sentinel, 3/1/03) that Americans "must realize that racial demonization is now organized and well-funded, and it will not end until everyday people begin condemning it." He wasn't talking about himself, though; he was referring to critics who label him a racist.

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=1147

[Kelly Rupert]

68. You know what? Thanks for this post.

That's a perspective I hadn't yet considered, and I appreciate you bringing it to our attention. I don't exactly buy it, but I'm glad you brought it up. Everyone deserves a defense--even the Falafel Bandit.

Recommended for bravery.

[WinkyDink]

74. "Everyone deserves a defense" pertains only to a court of law, not of public opinion.

[Kelly Rupert]

77. It pertains to both.

Nobody legally deserves to be imprisoned without trial, or morally deserves to be condemned without anyone attempting a defense.

[madeline_con]

92. Defense attempted, failed miserably.

[City Lights]

69. I don't trust Juan Williams.

Bush's Media Cherry Picking
By Dan Froomkin
Special to washingtonpost.com
Wednesday, September 26, 2007; 1:18 PM

How much control should the White House have over who gets to interview President Bush? Specifically, should Bush be able to dictate which journalists at which outlets he talks to?

Those are among the questions raised by the White House's recent offer to let National Public Radio analyst Juan Williams interview Bush about race relations -- and NPR management's insistence that they should get to choose who conducted the interview.

The end result: Williams did the interview for his other employer -- Fox News.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/linkset/2005/04/11/LI2005041100879.html

[acmavm]

70. O'Reilly is too stupid to know that life in black America ain't a hip-hop

video?

Then he's dumber or more racist that I gave him credit for being.

[Contrary1]

71. Putting aside whether it was racist or not....

He was stupid enough to say it. Reason enough for me.

O'Reilly is an idiot.

[Carrieyazel]

72. I detest O'Reilly as much as anyone, but he did two things here that give him cover:

1) He patronized a black-owned restaurant in a predominantly black community.

2) He attended a concert of a female black pop singer, who's fan demographic is 50/50 black/white.


How many racists would go to these two public places?

[WinkyDink]

75. His condescension reeks.

[WinkyDink]

73. Bwahahahahaha! Sure, Bill-o and Juan; suuuuuuure. ( Just a "bad rap", not a "bad hip-hop"? Har.)

[jeffrey_X]

76. the problem here is you are connecting all black people with hip hop and that...

is just really fucking stupid.

Unfortunately, shows like O'Reilly have polarized mainstream america's view of what "blacks" and hip hop culture are supposed to be. And why would he just narrow it down to harlem?

Is life depicted in Country music a reflection of white people? fuck no.

this makes no sense.

[PDenton]

85. Actually,

there are parts of the country where Country Music pretty much does reflect white people. Maybe not all of it, most people in Country Land don't spend much of their time at bars, for one thing (there aren't that many in Flyover Country), and they aren't picking up women. But I'd say it's a more favorable image, at least from a white perspective, than alot of hip-hop. It's amazing how diverse country music really is in terms of the themes. It's definitely a step above mainstream pop music, which is mostly just romance and breakup songs ad nauseam.

Another thing to consider is the exploitation of Hip-Hop by media elites and corporations. The target audience (as sold by corporations) for alot of Hip Hop now days is not African Americans but white teenagers and young adults. I was watching C-Span today and they had a rebroadcast of the Congressional hearings on African American images in the media, and it struck me that the white congressmen especially, were berating the black artists for their feelings, and not the CEO's that promote them.

I think an artists duty is first and foremost to the truth, to show the truth as they see it, wheather it is pretty or ugly doesn't matter as an aesthetic sense. It's the suits job to promote it and decide who gets to get funded and hear the music (what market it will be sold to- white suburbanites seeking authenticity to feed on like vampires, or real African Americans?), so they should have been berating the industry exec's, and not the artists. But that's a subject for another post in itself.

[silverweb]

79. Article in Time by Williams...

He states that Bill-O's comments were taken entirely out of context and twisted, which I don't think is entirely impossible.

I can't stand O'Reilly, but it could just be that this time he is being slimed unfairly.

An exerpt:

That was the heart and soul of the conversation between O'Reilly and me. The point of the whole exchange was to defeat corrupt, untrue and racist images of real black people.

So imagine how totally astounded I was when I heard O'Reilly was attacked on the basis of that radio conversation as a "racist." He was slammed for saying he went to a restaurant in Harlem and had a good time. He was slammed for saying the audience at the concert was nicely dressed. The suggestion was that O'Reilly had racist preconceptions about the restaurant and the concert crowd.

That twisted assumption led me to say publicly that the attacks on O'Reilly amounted to an effort to take what he said totally out of context in an attempt to brand him a racist by a liberal group that disagrees with much of his politics. But the out-of-context attacks on O'Reilly picked up speed and ended up on CNN, where one commentator branded me a "Happy Negro" for allowing O'Reilly to get by with making racist comments without objection.

This is so far from the truth of the conversation on the radio that it is beyond a matter of words being taken out of context. This is a pathetic cowardly, personal attack against me intended to damage my credibility and invalidate any support I offer to O'Reilly against the charges that he is a racist.

_full article_

[The Witch]

82. OP: Wow, what a gamut. Thanks for the very interestiing discussion, all.

I will not "decide" one way or the other on this.... but I will enjoy the debate, as its impact on the real world is minimal at best I figure I can afford to weigh both sides.

Thanks :)

[madeline_con]

86. He's an idiot, and everything he says is bullshit.

If he thinks Harlem is like a music video, why would he have his whitebread ass down in that particular 'hood in the first damn place?

I hope you feel better ASAP. :hi:

[Liberal_in_LA]

89. why aren't whites compared to the life of rock& Rollers? Double standard