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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 01:43 AM
Original message
A New Kind of Neocon?
This is an older article from last year, but the topic is pertinent to today's discussions, IMHO.

In late September, the National Interest convened a meeting to consider “What a Post-Bush Foreign Policy Might Look Like.” Gvosdev invited two foreign policy experts, one a Republican and one a Democrat, to predict how an administration of, say, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) or Sen. Hillary Clinton (D-NY) would change U.S. global strategy, and in particular, whether they would reverse current policies. The conventional wisdom in Washington is that a Republican president like McCain might embrace a “Bush lite” approach (that's the best-case scenario—some say a Republican super-hawk would try to “out-neoconize” Bush), and a Democrat like Senator Clinton would adopt more sensible and internationalist diplomacy, à la Bill Clinton.

To the surprise of some of those attending the National Interest event, it was the speaker representing the Democratic perspective, Will Marshall, president and founder of the Progressive Policy Institute, who ended up “out-neoconizing” Bush. ...

That a Republican conservative was urging a more realistic and less interventionist foreign policy and a Democratic liberal was advocating a hegemonic global strategy aimed at strengthening American military presence abroad as well as at promoting “democracy” worldwide should not shock anyone familiar with the history of U.S. politics and foreign policy. ...

~snip~

But at the same time as realists and conservatives in the Republican Party are hoping to challenge the dominance of the neoconservatives over their party's foreign policy, many leading Democratic activists and liberal intellectuals seem to be calling on their party to embrace an even more “pure” or radical version of the neoconservative ideology. Indeed, during his presentation at the National Interest event, Marshall insisted that his party does not and would not advance anti-war sentiment or hopes for military disengagement. “Our party needs to show it can take on the job of defeating Islamic extremists if we want to win the next election,” said Marshall, editor of the recent book With All our Might: A Progressive Strategy for Defeating Jihad and Defending Liberty. “We need to fight for liberal principles abroad as vigorously as we fight for them at home,” he said. He stressed that Democrats “shouldn't abandon democracy as a goal.”


Criticizing the Bush administration for declining to expand the military it relies on as a major policy instrument, Marshall proposed that a Democratic administration would grow the American military by 40,000 troops to better meet the demands of Iraq and Afghanistan. Not everyone liked this idea; in response to Marshall's comments, one participant responded: “If the first item on the Democrats' plan for foreign policy is making the military bigger, color me Republican.”

~snip~

Moreover, as New York University historian Tony Judt pointed out recently, many hawkish liberal intellectuals and policy analysts who have ties to the Democratic leadership and are affiliated with newspapers and magazines such as the New York Times, Washington Post, New Republic, and the New Yorker and with think tanks like the Brookings Institution and the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, have acquiesced to Bush's foreign policy agenda (see “Bush's Useful Idiots: Tony Judt on the Strange Death of Liberal America,” London Review of Books, September 21, 2006). Not unlike Marshall, they seem to be promoting the idea that the Democrats need to adopt the ambitious neoconservative creed while trying to “improve” it by making it more marketable and workable. They seem to suggest that the neoconservative doctrine was fine—it's just that the Republicans lacked the talent and the imagination to turn it into a success.


http://rightweb.irc-online.org/rw/3584
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Mythsaje Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 01:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. We need a smaller, more mobile, and better trained military...
Edited on Sat Sep-29-07 01:46 AM by Mythsaje
More elite forces and less reliance on old-school ground troops.

On edit: That sort of focus would probably help restrain more imperialistic goals and still allow swift response to the things that NEED responses.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. Ok, Rumsfeld.
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. .
:spank:
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eagler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-30-07 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. We are doing that now . It doesn't work.
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Jade Fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:04 AM
Response to Original message
2. Consider the source here.....
From what you've posted, it sounds like a crock.
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I trust Rightweb as a credible source
Is there any reason you do not?
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:14 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. They Do Sport An Impressive Rogue's Gallery, Ma'am
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #4
14. You're so proper and polite, Magistrate
and I commend you for that. :hi:

It seems their gallery has expanded recently.
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SheWhoMustBeObeyed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #4
16. Damn, that's just about the whole shooting match
And I use the word "shooting" with the most innocent of intentions.

O8)
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Jade Fox Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:18 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. See post #4
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The Magistrate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. That List Is More In The Nature Of Targeting Package, Ma'am
This is what they offer for sale:

http://www.irc-online.org/books.php
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. That is the list of people they profile, not the people who run the site. n/t
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:36 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. Noam Chomsky used to be on their board
Edited on Sat Sep-29-07 03:16 AM by Emit
http://www.irc-online.org/content/chomsky/0503toothpaste.php

About Right Web:
Right Web, founded in 2003, is a program of the International Relations Center (IRC) that tracks the work of those, in and outside of government, who have been instrumental in shaping or supporting U.S. policies in the global war on terror. Right Web explores the many ties that link the main players, organizations, corporate supporters, foundations, educational institutions, and government representatives in what could be described as a new architecture of power. Right Web aims to shine a spotlight on how these links influence the direction of foreign, military, and homeland security policies, and to illuminate this web for the public.

Many of the organizations and individuals profiled by Right Web are affiliated with the Republican Party, but not all. Efforts to push militaristic policies cross party lines, and so the Right Web project examines rightist organizations and figures, as well as leading liberal hawks. Reporters, researchers, and analysts have come to rely on Right Web for its well-documented research and analysis provided in the form of hundreds of dossiers, policy reports, op-eds, and news commentaries.

The IRC has worked for nearly three decades to illuminate the causes and consequences of U.S. policy and “to make the United States a more responsible global leader and global partner.” Right Web represents a revival of a former IRC program called GroupWatch (1985-1991), which profiled more than 125 private, quasi-governmental, and religious organizations that were closely associated with the implementation of U.S. foreign policy, especially in Central America.

By establishing Right Web, the IRC hopes to add to the growing national movement of concerned citizens who are working to check the militaristic drift of the country. We invite you to join the IRC, and we encourage you to become part of our effort to expose the right's architecture of power and its alarming cultural and political agenda.
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/about.php

CIP's staff and board: http://ciponline.org/staff.htm

edit typo
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. Here are some Right Web Publications - Not "Crock", not right-wing.
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/
Highlights from the IRC Right Web Program


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Iraq After Petraeus: The More Things Change ...
John Isaacs | September 19, 2007
David Petraeus and Ryan Crocker's defense of the "surge" strategy confirmed the divide in Congress over the Iraq War. While their testimony may have given President Bush some breathing space to avoid making hard decisions on the direction of the war, pending legislation in on Capitol Hill will undoubtedly put Republicans in an uncomfortable situation. Although many voters may be disappointed over the lack of congressional progress regarding the war, they are unlikely to swing back to Republicans if more than 100,000 U.S. troops still remain in the country 14 months from now.

The Surge Scam: Getting Rid of the Goat
Commentary by Leon Hadar | September 12, 2007
A vague commitment to end the surge in Iraq, coupled with the supposed credibility of General Petraeus, could buy President Bush more time to pursue his military offensive in Iraq and leave the mess there to his successor in the White House. But anti-war critics question Petraeus' credibility, arguing that he is not only identified with the failed U.S. strategy in Iraq but also that he has become a political ally of Bush and of Republicans. Democrats have failed to mount a serious challenge to Petraeus, allowing him, and by extension the Bush administration, to set the terms of the current debate on Iraq.

Iran and the Enduring Stockpile
By Anthony Newkirk | August 24, 2007
The Bush administration and many of the 2008 presidential hopefuls often highlight the threat posed by Iran's potential to develop nuclear weapons. Left unsaid in the rhetoric is how the U.S. nuclear arsenal, seen by some as a violation of international agreements, provides cover for countries that are looking for convenient justifications for going nuclear.

Dangerous Delusions
Commentary by Leon Hadar | August 15, 2007
The president and some of his advisers seem to occupy a parallel universe that one might call "Neocon World," where the "surge" is working, the United States is winning in Iraq, and peace will soon come to the Promised Land and to the entire Middle East. It is a dangerous delusion.

The United States and "Regime Change" in Iran
By Stephen Zunes | August 7, 2007
The record is clear: Imposing democracy and freedom on other countries is less effective than internal, civil society-led movements. Freedom and democracy will one day come to Iran, but it will be in spite of—rather than because of—the policies of the United States.

Whither the "Global Democratic Revolution"?
By Tom Barry | July 31, 2007
Promoting democratic change is a worthy foreign policy goal that has deep roots in both the Republican and Democratic Parties. The challenge is to promote that policy in the post-Bush era so that the ideal is not tainted by narrow national interests or ideological agendas.

Democrats Controlling Congress:
A Six-Month Assessment
By John Isaacs | July 25, 2007
The Democrats took over both houses of Congress six months ago with ambitious foreign policy and defense agendas aimed at turning back many of the perceived mistakes of the Bush administration and reining in some of its more ambitious and controversial weapons programs. The Dems have had mixed results thus far, but it seems likely that nuclear weapons production, the Iraq War, missile defense, and the breadth of the "war on terrorism" will remain on the congressional agenda for the duration of President Bush's time in office.

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bobthedrummer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 01:28 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. I trust Right Web so much that I started a thread in Editorials and Other Articles forum today
based on one of their profiles. I've used links to Right Web here at DU for years without any objection whatsoever.

IMPEACH CHENEY FIRST
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 05:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
18. Ah. War with Iran. Abram Shulsky. That's a good one to start with.
I added Ledeen. I'll update that in a bit with some more recent info in what he's been up to lately with regard to his march on The-Root-of-all-Evil-Iran.
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leveymg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
8. The DLC wing and the PPI are not "liberal". They follow in the Cold War Scoop Jackson wing of the
Edited on Sat Sep-29-07 02:54 AM by leveymg
Party. These are the people who brought us the Korean War, Witch Hunts, loyalty oaths, and permanent twilight wars of the 1950s and 1960s. The Vietnam War is also part of the right-wing Democrat's political legacy.

They're back, today they're pushing a war with Iran with AIPAC's urging and money, and Hillary is their vehicle to power.

They need us, the Left Netroots to get back into the White House. But, once there, we'll be swiped aside and most likely placed under security surveillance, which will be given a renewed lustre of legality, but continued. There has been and is a very deep divide within this Party. We shouldn't deny it.

Here's a blog that discusses the split between what are identified as the PPI and the Kos wings. http://www.democracyarsenal.org/2007/08/ppi-vs-kos.html
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Oct-01-07 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #8
25. I forgot to say thanks, leveymg
for weighing in on this topic. :hi:
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alofarabia Donating Member (65 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 03:06 AM
Response to Original message
11. "Maybe if I focus on
little nits and nats of the organization I won't have to answer the OP's question".
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 10:33 AM
Response to Reply #11
12. It is a tactic, for sure.
Maybe she just saw the word "right" and assumed it was a right wing source? :shrug:

Welcome to DU, alofarabia. :hi:

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 10:53 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Zodiak Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-29-07 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
17. Will Marshall is a signatory to PNAC.
Edited on Sat Sep-29-07 01:44 PM by Zodiak Ironfist
So I would not say that the "Democrats" are trying to out neocon Bush. Bush has adopted THEIR policy, that of PNAC. This element in the Democratic party makes me absolutely sick and does not need to be part of our party. No tent is big enough in the Democratic party for warmongering assholes who are already responsible for th death of over a million people.

He is slime, and not a Democrat. Just a mole to make sure that PNAC is bipartisan and therefore, inevitble.
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-30-07 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. Therein lies the rub.
The right-leaning Democratic Leadership Council (DLC) weighed in with a fair amount of its own criticism of Moore. After last year's election, Al From, the DLC's CEO, pointed out that Democrats must "repudiate, you know, the most strident and insulting anti-American voices out there sometimes on our party's left ... We can't have our party identified by Michael Moore and Hollywood as our cultural values."

Will Marshall, the President of the Progressive Policy Institute, the think tank of the DLC, added: "You know, let's let Hollywood and the Cannes Film Festival fawn all over Michael Moore. We ought to make it pretty clear that he sure doesn't speak for us when it comes to standing up for our country."
http://www.workingforchange.com/printitem.cfm?itemid=19717
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warren pease Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-30-07 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. And he's a co-founder of the DLC...
According to this profile on Rightweb: Will Marshall

Just the guy to be speaking on behalf of the Democratic party and its approach to ridding the world of the stain of BushCo.

What a fraud, and an asshole to boot (if that's what one does with an asshole, and it should be).


wp
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-30-07 11:54 AM
Response to Reply #22
23. And he's a
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