The only way to change this country's direction

[Sarah Ibarruri]

Is for each of us to get involved:

1) to run for local offices
2) to take back our churches from that WHACKO Nazi theology which consists of anti-gay and anti-abortion brainwashing
3) to insist on strict corporate regulation
4) to have a REAL FDA again
5) to insist the rich be taxed at a pre-Reagan rate again
6) to protest till the war is stopped and the embassy shut down
7) to insist on laws to crack down on the entire health industry and to provide health care for those who lack it.

If we don't do these things, NOBODY WILL.

[Harkpark]

1. You miss 8

And no sell soul to highest bidder :)

[Sarah Ibarruri]

7. Yes, absolutely, but only when WEIGHING things intelligently

For ex., if you have two bridges to cross your family over to the other side and save them from an earthquake, you take the one that is less likely to get your family killed. You don't say, "Oh well, I'll keep them right here and get them killed because I don't like the look of either bridge." :thumbsup:

[Harkpark]

8. And you thanks god that there is 2 bridges

Choice of bridge up to self but lots of families need to cross too.
Get your family across and not stop to argue on which bridge best

[Sarah Ibarruri]

19. Amen, my friend, amen! nt

[progressive_realist]

2. Don't forget getting 60 seats in the Senate.

Very important, that.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

9. Yep! As for me, I'm starting small. I'm going to try and see if I can get into small govt.....

... don't know how, don't know when, but I'm going to try.

[stillcool]

3. getting our votes to count..

might be a good thing as well.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

10. Absolutely. We need two counts done always. (My opinion). nt

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

4. I Agree With All Your Points But Number 5. I Think The Rich Are Generally Taxed Enough.

I think the amount of waste in Government spending is so monumental that if it was brought under control, we'd be able to lower the tax rate for ALL brackets and still have more than enough to finance all the things that are necessary. I don't care how much money ya earn; I don't think anyone should ever have more than 30%, or maybe even 25%, of their income taken by the government.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

11. Before Reagan, the highest tax was 70%... Reagan cut that to 35 and it has never gone back

And it's time it went back. From Reagan to the present there has been a redistribution of money from the middle class to the rich, which now puts our economy at risk. The rich are always getting a free ride on the backs of the middle class. Government spending is huge but only because our tax money is given to the rich (in the form of corporations) as entitlements, to the rich as outrageous payments for their corporations supplying everything for this war-for-profit, and again given to the rich as deductions which the middle class then has to make up for or do without basic services.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

12. I Would Firmly Oppose Anyone Who Would Ever Steal Money Like That.

No way in hell should ANY American, EVER have to have 70% of their income taxed. That's robbery and grounds for revolt in my opinion.

No one should be taxed above 30%, and if Government waste was cut no one would have to be.

But to condone taking 70% of someone's income away, regardless of how much money they make, is a sickening concept to me. I don't know how the government had EVER been allowed to do such a thing.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

14. You're not thinking about it logically. The rich TAKE more ....

... of everything to do what they do, than the rest. That ADVANTAGE they're taking from this country, they must give back to. I think the whole idea that the rich must be coddled for the rest of the population to survive is an idea invented by the right wingers and I hope to help it die.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

16. Sure I Am. Money You Make You Should Be Able To Keep.

There is no argument you could ever possibly make that would come off as logical to me or justify taxing anyone, ever, at a rate of 70%. No way.

And the 'rich' are individual people. You are grouping them all together in almost a bigoted way, as if they are a single entity. I don't support that either.

I also never said to coddle the rich. I just said that no one should ever be taxed more than 30%, or even 25% for that matter.

Now as far as closing loopholes and having better regulation, I support that 100%.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

18. No. I'm not merely talking about closing loopholes. I'm talking about a progressive tax, as in

Denmark and many, many other awesome countries. Countries with progressive taxation are among the happiest nations. I understand you've gotten to like this oligarchy a lot. After all, rich people move here because preferential treatment is given to the rich here, and they are coddled as much as they are in third world nations. However, I'm not in favor of *merely* closing loopholes. I'm in favor of undoing whatever the Republicans did.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

20. Well, Thankfully, Your Notion Has 0 Chance Of Success, So I Really Don't Mind Your Holding It.

Progressive tax is ok. Progressive taxation that ends with certain people being taxed at a rate of 70%, is disgusting in concept in my opinion.

There are plenty of ways to make sure society is taken care of appropriately, without having to ever implement such heavy handed tactics.

No one, no matter how much money they earn, should EVER have to give the government 70 cents of their dollar.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

21. Maybe and maybe not. Pre-Reagan the taxation of the rich was far more normal.....

... I realize you no longer want that. I hope it will come to pass once again. It's unfair that the burden now is on the people that actually work.

[progressive_realist]

22. Three points

1. When people talk about maximum tax rates, they are generally talking about marginal tax rates. In other words, it is the tax rate applied to the last dollar you made. Under a progressive tax system, you don't pay the marginal rate on all of your earnings. For example, someone earning $500,000 in the U.S. in 2008 would pay the following, ignoring all credits and deductions:
10% of the first $8,025
15% of the next $24,525
25% of the next $46,300
28% of the next $85,700
33% of the next $193,550, and
35% of the last $142,300, for a grand total of $153,728.75 in taxes. This is 31% of total income, not the 35% suggested by the top marginal rate.

2. From 1951 to 1963, the top marginal rate was 91%. This was to pay for World War II, the fighting of which is generally considered to have been a good thing. But if you want to call it government waste, I suppose that's your prerogative.

3. If you rank all of the world's countries in order from highest marginal tax rates to lowest marginal tax rates, and then do a separate list ranking all the world's countries from highest standard of living to lowest standard of living, you might be surprised at the degree of correlation. In general, more taxes = better quality of life.

I'm afraid I'm just not on board with the "government wants to take MY hard-earned money so they can waste it" line of argument. Empirical evidence suggests this is not true. And it displays a profound selfishness that would seem to be incompatible with progressive ideals.

For the record, I live in a very progressive city that has a reputation for voting to raise taxes on ourselves often. And our local economy is still red-hot despite the national downturn. And it's a damn fine place to live.

[AndyTiedye]

5. How Do We Do These Things?

Running for public office successfully requires fabulous "people skills".
How many of us have them? I sure don't.

We have been doing a lot of "insisting" but nobody's listening.
Same with protests. Makes us feel good but nobody notices.

How do we take back "our" churches? (which were never really "ours" anyway)

[readmoreoften]

6. Or taking them "back" which implies that they were progressive, then went bad.

There have always been theocratic lunatics. We just kept them in check.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

13. Weeeell, there are people here in local govt. who have the personality of wallpaper...

So honestly, if they can be there (and they're not even rich), why can't the rest of us? However, it takes research and being present here and there, and studying local govt. (I'm guessing). I'm going to try. What's the worst thing that can happen if I fail? That I'll be laughed out of town? Nobody is going to shoot me for trying and failing, right?

As to taking back our churches, I'll tell you how to take them back. Go back to your church but speak openly. Disagree when you don't agree. Be totally HONEST. Even speak to the pastor, but to do that you *must* study up first on your topic and know what you're talking about. ;)

Yep, but if "nobody" is listening, we have to do this ourselves or we have to get TOUGH as diamonds.

[paparush]

15. How do we "insist" when we have no voice? When we are ignored?

I'm not arguing, but I'm wondering if you can give me some examples of how that works these days?

I feel like the country screamed in a unified voice in the 2006 midterms. And the echo fell silent....

[Sarah Ibarruri]

17. I completely agree with your frustration. I feel the exact same way.

When Clinton was being impeached, and the entire United States (it seemed) was right wing, I thought I was going to fall into the pit of depression. But I survived. I even survived seeing our country fall into further right wing fascism. I don't think I'm going to give up right now. I want so many things to happen. I want single-payer health care, I want the middle class to get tax cuts while the rich get tax increases, I want social security funds to be increased and untouchable so the old don't have to suffer so much, I want the war in Iraq ended with funds given to the United Nations to repair the damage we have done, and the money we'll save used for the needy and to build our decaying and falling infrastructure.

I also want total election reform so that NO candidate at any level ever has to make any promises to any corporation ever again!

I want SO MUCH! And I also (like you) want it right now.

Democrats elected right now have lived through our country turning right wing. Hell, even lots of Democrats turned right wing. I have spoken to people on here that sound about as right wing as Repukes.

How to change this country works like this: You make a PLAN, you become PART of that plan, rather than just sitting at home and watching everyone else do it, and you move forward, not giving up every 5 minutes. We've got a HUGE project ahead of us: doing away with all the damage of right wingerism from Reagan to the present. How it's done is how I said. Becoming PART of it, getting INVOLVED.