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flamin lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:07 PM
Original message
The surge is succeeding?
I keep hearing that the “surge” is succeeding. Really?

There are still 2400 attacks from insurgents every month. Those attacks kill 1000 Iraqi civilians and 75 US soldiers every month.

This must be a definition of success with which I am not familiar.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. in the fact its keeping us there it is working
prolly stealing their oil like it was going out of style all the while too
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winter999 Donating Member (530 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:16 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Well, if they're steeling oil, we're not getting it.
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madokie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. I doubt that stealing their oil will lower the price at our pumps, if that is what you're saying
otherwise I'm not sure what to think :hi:
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Botany Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:12 PM
Response to Original message
2. The surge is working is the big lie that "they" are selling
http://warnewstoday.blogspot.com/

Tuesday, February 5, 2008
War News for Tuesday, February 05, 2008
Baghdad:
#1: Shi'ite militants kidnapped three Iraqi national police officers from a police checkpoint on Saturday in Ur district in northern Baghdad before releasing them hours later, the U.S. military said

#2: Two civilians were injured in an IED explosion that targeted an American convoy in Palestine Street east Baghdad around 12:00 pm.


Misan Prv:
#1: The first officer was a colonel who was a Lieutenant Colonel who was killed in al Askari neighborhood downtown Umara city.

#2: The second officer was a Major who was killed in the new buildings neighborhood downtown Umara city

#3: the third officer was Lieutenant who was killed in his car while he was returning back home in al Uroba neighborhood downtown Umara city.


Taji:
#1: A suicide bomber killed eight members of an anti-Qaeda front as he triggered his explosive vest at a checkpoint outside a Sunni tribal sheikh's house in central Iraq on Tuesday, police said. The attack took place outside the home of Sheikh Shathr al-Obeidi, leader of a tribal "Awakening" group ranged against Al-Qaeda in Awad village near Taji, about 40 kilometres (25 miles) north of Baghdad, a police officer said.


Tikrit:
#1: At least three Iraqis were killed and one child was injured after American soldiers stormed a tiny one-room house north of Baghdad and opened fire, U.S. and Iraqi officials said today.


Samarra:
#1: Iraqi forces found the bodies of 55 people allegedly killed and buried by al-Qaeda loyalists in a mass grave near the northern Iraqi city of Samarra, a police officer said Tuesday. A police force backed by tribal units made the discovery while conducting a search operation in al-Jazira west of Samarra, 120 kilometres north of Baghdad, Colonel Mamduh al-Bazi from the city police told Deutsche Presse-Agentur dpa. The bodies were of middle-aged men in plain-clothes, who seemed to have been hurriedly buried at different times.


Kirkuk:
#1: Monday A roadside bomb aimed at a police patrol wounded two civilians in Kirkuk, 250 km (155 miles) north of Baghdad, police said.


Mosul:
#1: Monday Gunmen killed three policemen in two separate drive-by shootings in Mosul, 390 km (240 miles) north of Baghdad, police said.


Tal Afar:
#1: Iraqi security forces and U.S. troops killed three al Qaeda gunmen during operations on Friday, near Tal Afar, 420 km (260 miles) northwest of Baghdad, the U.S. military said.



Afghanistan:
#1: One woman, two children and two men were killed on Monday when their taxi was blown up in Lashkargah, the provincial capital, said Mohammad Hussain Andewal, the provincial police chief. Another civilian was wounded in the attack, which Andewal blamed on the Taleban.

#2: Meanwhile, another roadside bomb struck a police vehicle in the neighboring province of Kandahar late Monday, said provincial police chief Sayed Agha Saqib. The attack that took place in Kandahar city also left three more policemen wounded, Saqib said.


Casualty Reports:

Staff Sgt. Larry Teakell tackled the soldier in an attempt to smother the flames, but the fire kept reigniting because of a large amount of fuel sprayed on her. He first used a uniform top and then his bare hands to extinguish the flames. As a result, he suffered second-degree burns.

The rocket-propelled grenade that exploded about 13 inches from Spc. Kevin Spangler's face shortened his Army career. But the blast that almost killed the 21-year-old soldier, leaving him deaf in his left ear. A member of 3rd Heavy Brigade Combat Team, 4th Infantry Division, Spangler was serving as top gunner on a Humvee in a small town northwest of Baghdad on Feb. 6, 2006. "The next thing I knew an explosion happened right next to me and knocked me right next to the turret," Spangler recalled. "I saw the blast. I kind of heard it, but not really heard it. It knocked me out, but I was still reacting to everything. "The blast blew a hole in his eardrum, while pieces of shrapnel sliced off the lower half of his ear, cut open his shoulder and pierced his lungs and spleen.
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. "75 US soldiers every month?"
That doesn't seem to fit the data.
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flamin lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. From icasualties.org. Average of 2.5 soldiers a day. nt
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Teaser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. I would have used a moving average
centered around each month.
better estimate of time varying trends. Just averaging over the whole ensemble kind of distorts things.
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onenote Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 01:23 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. not for the last four or five months
Whether it has anything to do with the "surge" is debatable, but it doesn't help to misstate the facts.

http://icasualties.org/oif/
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mwb970 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
5. When we passed the current violence level on the way up...
it was deemed unacceptable. Now that we've come back down to it, it proves that we're "winning".
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backscatter712 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
7. It's succeeding in that...
It slightly lessened the violence, down to a level we've gotten used to (only a few thousand killed. Gee, what progress...)

It got the violence out of the news, so Faux Noise can concentrate on Britney and Heath Ledger.

In essence, it's yet another frog-boiling tactic. It was never intended to win the war (we don't even have a victory condition that we could satisfy to claim a win.) It was intended to delay the inevitable end past the end of Bush's term, so they can blame they Democrats for losing the war.
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tuckessee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Feb-05-08 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
9. The surge is an overwhelming success where it counts.
That's on the domestic propaganda front.
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