Can we talk about high grocery prices?

[CoffeeCat]

I am astounded when I walk through the grocery store.

I pay very close attention to prices. For several years, I've watched all
of the ads, and when I go shopping, I go to three or four different stores--buying
the loss leaders and getting the best bargains at each grocery store. I know that's
a bit pathetic, but I am always aware of what is a good price and what isn't.

With that said, I am completely in shock about grocery prices. All food, fresh
fruits and veggies and paper products--are through the roof.

Why is this not being reported or discussed?

In many cases, I've noticed that prices on many items have more-than doubled in
the past 18 months. Milk prices have nearly doubled--but the prices of other
items like yogurt, pasta, eggs, cheese, cereal, paper towels, pretzels, chicken,
orange juice, soup, etc--have gone up at least 50 percent. Furthermore, the packages
are getting smaller. Cereal packages have shrunk significantly.

I'm astounded that no one talks about this. These prices must be cutting into
the budgets of most Americans. I just can't imagine that these skyrocketing
prices haven't impacted nearly every family in America.

With high grocery prices and gas prices, high heating bills, an imminent recession, the housing
crisis--it feels like the walls are closing in.

[Jed Dilligan]

1. There was a post on this earlier tonight from more of an econ POV

I'll see if I can hunt it up for you.

Yes, the walls are closing in.

on edit:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x2867840

[lonestarnot]

2. $60 bucks for cat food and milk and OJ tonight.

Unbelievable. Oh and the cashier says, "you saved $11.00 bwwwwwwwwwwwahahahaha :rofl:

[Jed Dilligan]

3. That's gonna be one big, nasty float.

[lonestarnot]

5. LOL

ackey. Besides, you don't cook floats, I have to cook everything before I eat it. :rofl:

[Avalon Sparks]

142. LOL LOL

Good one! LOL

[Kitty Herder]

48. Man, how much did you buy? nt

[lonestarnot]

131. 2 little dinky sacks of Fancy Feast.

I think they were $7.?? a piece.

[Medusa]

167. 5 pounds of dog food for my little beastie? $10 bucks

[femrap]

69. My cat is 15 years old and so I

know about the price of Fancy Feast (all he'll eat). It has gone from 25 cents a can to 46 cents a can. And at Kroger's (which is IMHO the most expensive story), it is 63 cents a can. It's cheaper to buy canned tuna...which I do and mix it with his Fancy Feast.

[Lorien]

71. You might want to consider canned chicken instead of canned tuna

cats can develop health issues when eating too much fish (especially mercury laden fish), and you'll need a taurine supplement if you feed more than a spoonful or two a day. Fancy Feast is hard enough on your cat's system, and it's addictive because of the corn products used in it, which drive up his insulin levels and make him crave more. For much more on human grade vs. feed grade pet foods, and some possible cost effective alternatives, see this thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=243&topic_id=4388&mesg_id=4388

[gateley]

119. Nero's prescription food is $25/5 lb. bag.

The other day I got him his cat food, some chicken baby food, and got myself Top Ramen. I'm not kidding.

[Lorien]

132. Lemme guess; Science Diet or Waltham?

Unfortunately, most of those "Prescription diets" are a scam and sometimes do more harm than good. Hill's in particular has an agreement with many vet schools in which they provide free "nutrition training" to young vets. The vets are then trained to be reps for Hill's Science Diet (or Waltham, Purina One, Eukanuba or Iams) and end up as distributors, carrying the products at their own facilities.

I used to do pet rescue and the place where I did my adoptions only carried human grade pet foods. I met so many pet owners there who had come in to find healthy, natural alternatives to those "prescription" diets that had done little to improve the health of their pets (most of them at the urging of new vets). Science Diet was the brand with the most complaints. One of my own cats had died while on a prescription of Science Diet years ago, but I didn't make the connection at the time. At my pet sitter's urging I read this: http://www.api4animals.org/facts.php?p=359&more=1 then switched my remaining cat to a human grade food. The difference was astonishing! The new diet seemed to take ten years off my 16 year old boy (not to mention the 12 extra pounds he'd been lugging around). I and others list some of those human grade foods here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=243&topic_id=4388&mesg_id=4388
but there are many more to choose from now. Just Google "human Grade pet food" and you'll be amazed at what's out there.

Good luck to both of you. I've been on the Ramen diet. Not fun!

[gateley]

136. No - Royal Canin Urinary Formula.

(But for some reason I'm thinking Waltham bought Royal Canin...not sure, though.)

He had PU surgery and this formula is promoted as fighting both oxalate and struvite crystals. Even after surgery, cats can get blockages which are life threatening, and he's been doing well since his operation 3 years ago.

Prior to his surgery and this prescription food, I would got the human grade foods for him. Problem was, I couldn't get him to eat any canned food! And ALL of the dry stuff has ingredients and fillers I'm not wild about.

I supplement his diet with chicken baby food (he won't eat any other flavor :eyes:) so he can get SOME human grade food.

After having almost lost him, I'm not too willing to pull him off this and begin experimenting.

I'm a firm believer in nutrition being the best medicine as I've experienced the miraculous results first hand.

Thanks for your good wishes and EXCELLENT info!

Didn't you rescue those breathtaking cats that looked like leopards (you know what I'm trying to say)

[Lorien]

138. I had a cat that went through that, and I also nearly lost him

he was an outdoor kitty who came with the house when I bought it and would never come inside. When he became blocked he hid in the garage. I looked for him for days and finally found him under a box. He spent three days at the vet's, poor guy. I put him on human grade wet food with raw food medallions mixed in (I prefer Prairie Nature's Variety chicken canine/ feline diet) and he managed to live to the age of 19 without any further problems.

I've also been told that this additive will keep the crystals away: http://www.revivalanimal.com/store/p/1995-Doc-Roys-Potassium-Citrate-Cranberry.aspx
oddly enough, I just sent the same link to my mom today. Her three year old male is having the same problems.

Just be sure that the Royal Canin doesn't contain corn (or corn by products), brewer's rice or wheat. Brown rice is fine, but the others can cause additional health problems.

Oh, and yes! I did rescue a serval hybrid. He was (and is) quite a handful!

[gateley]

144. I don't even have to look at the ingredient list -- I KNOW there's corn and

cornmeal in there -- and pretty high on the ingredient list, too.

I'll check out that supplement -- thanks.

Good luck to your mom!

When they first suggested that if Nero's problems continued I might have to consider that surgery, I thought no way. But in the end it was the only option and I'm thrilled to say he's been doing well ever since. SO, if your mom has to go that route - let her know that there's one happy cat and his devotee out here who can give a positive endorsement!

And yes - that's the one - the serval (couldn't remember the breed). Breathtaking.

You're a very special person. :pals:

[Lorien]

146. Thanks Gateley

:pals:

Yeah,my Jasper had to have the surgery for it too. He was so toxic from having his bladder backed up for so long that it took some heroic efforts by my vet to save him, but he never had an issue with it afterwards, thank goodness!

[Buns_of_Fire]

154. The term "human grade pet food" is a trifle disconcerting, these days...

I've always been a "Gravy Train" man, myself. With an occasional Milk Bone for dessert, if I didn't mess the floor or chew up someone's underwear.

[femrap]

122. He only gets the human tuna on occasion...

maybe 2 cans per month. I fix him real chicken breasts and turkey breasts...he eats the same as I do, but I mix it up with his food. He likes beef as well...very lean, of course. And yogurt, too. I don't give him very much. And he likes bread...but not sourdough. He seems to like whatever I'm eating.

Thanks for the link...lots of good info.

I wonder if feeding a cat baby food would be good for them...add some chicken or turkey. And I would need to get some taurine, too.

[Lorien]

129. Baby food is fine as a treat. As a food, it does need added nutrients

but there are some good do-it-yourself cat food recipes online that can give you a list of those.

:hi:

[Contrary1]

100. My cats get a spoonful of 9 Lives Tuna Select mixed with their dry food...

I think this is canned by a tuna fish company. It does not have the same pull-off lid, I have to use a can opener. It looks like "chunk dark" if that makes any sense.

Anyway, it runs between 25 and 35 cents a can most places. You might pick up one on your next grocery trip, and see if your cat likes it.

[Poll_Blind]

4. This is not generally being reported because the walls ARE closing in.

  And there isn't anything that anyone can do to stop it- at this point. M$M is going to continue not reporting on it until, over the course of a week, say, they're all going to start talking about how bad things are. That will be after the other shoe has well and truly dropped. But not, I suspect, before the election- no matter how bad things get.

PB

[Warpy]

6. On the bright side, the newest batch of organic asparagus

was in Wild Oats today. Yes, it was $3.00/lb, but that beats the $8.99 they'd been getting for the out of season stuff.

I know what you mean. I've been making up the difference at the checkout stand for other folks, especially elderly folks and young families, a lot more often when they run short. I don't think people are going to be able to stand much more before something gives and we start seeing riots here and there.

In the meantime, it makes me happy to read every upbeat story by happy GOP media bobbleheads because I know it's making at least one more person furious every time they do it.

People need a good dose of fury. I haven't seen it in a long time and we're way overdue.

In the meantime, people who pride themselves on never cooking are going to have to learn in a hurry.

[CoffeeCat]

9. I would love to learn how to make my own bread...

I make my own pancake syrup. It's so cheap and delicious.

If anyone is interested, this is an ESSENTIAL and awesome website for learning
how to live, cook and eat cheap. Funny name, but very informative and a
great resource!

www.hillbillyhousewife.com

[Warpy]

28. Here is a link to the easiest bread recipe in the world

It's the lazy person's recipe, just make the mix the day before and ignore it for at least 18 hours.

You do need an oven proof Dutch oven to bake it in. I have a heavy cast iron jobbie, but I've successfully done it in a cheap tin spatterware job, although the crust wasn't as crunchy.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/08/dining/081mrex.html?_r=1&oref=login

You will need to register to get the recipe, but registration is now free.

Trust me, there is no way to screw up this recipe. It's the best beginner's bread recipe out there, easier even than throwing a mix into a machine.

[KamaAina]

92. Register, schmegister

Thanks to the handy-dandy NY Times Link Generator, just click here:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/08/dining/081mrex.html?ex=1320642000&en=a55ab31eb6c5a47d&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss&pagewanted=all

and enjoy!

[Warpy]

103. I've been registered since god was a boy

so I don't think about it any more. They don't spam me. I just get to read the stuff I want to.

I had no idea your link existed. Thanks for posting.

[KamaAina]

105. As have I

but I always thought She was a girl. :P

I post those as a service to those less news-obsessed (or NY-oriented; lived there '96-'00) than myself.

[sarcasmo]

115. When was that, six thousand years ago? LMFAO

[Baby Snooks]

46. Awesome indeed!

She should have called it Healthy Hillbilly Housewife!

[RebelOne]

50. Buy a bread maker. It's easy to make bread.

Just throw all the ingredients in and the bread maker does the rest.

[pitohui]

80. there is simply no reason to eat bread at all, cut it out and save 100 percent

in the same thread where people are talking about the skyhigh price of groceries, they are still clutching at reasons and wherefores and tricks so that they can continue to eat junk fillers like bread and cereal

prices are simply too high to be eating food without value, and carbs with no appreciable level of essential fat or protein should be the first to go

we haven't bought or baked bread in about 20 years, maybe that's one reason why i still fit into clothes i had in high school

bread, cereal, baked goods...no one needs any of that, what scares me is the price of things that can't be done without, eggs, dairy, meat, green vegetables (at least i can somewhat easily grow green veggies year round in my area) -- yet to be honest, i believe there are more people who never eat a vegetable than there are people who never eat bread, it needs to be the reverse if we're interested in eating for health

[gateley]

120. Unfortunately, the "good" food is often out of financial reach. For a dollar

you can buy an orange or a McDonald's double cheeseburger.

Bulk spaghetti and bulk canned sauce vs fresh fruits, veggies, meats, eggs.

The cost of food is contributing to the obesity and disease rate of our citizens.

[kevinbgoode]

124. You are absolutely right. I live on a student budget. . .

and I know how to eat "right". . .I worked out for several years and had a lot of information from nutrition and dieticians...and the "good" food is so pricey that I do have to purchase things that aren't as good for me.

This situation is even worse for seniors. My parents are both elderly, are now diabetic, have to watch their sodium levels, etc. which rules out most processed foods, especially frozen entrees and canned goods. And since they live on a tiny pension and social security, they rarely can afford even the smallest "treat". . .We've started sending them special things for birthdays, anniversaries, holidays...instead of fancy knick-knacks, they get gift cards for the supermarket and the pharmacy or a department store, special treats like a sugar-free cheesecake, or fresh fruit.

When my grandmother was alive, the last few years of her Christmases it became a special project for me to start in late October and make her a food basket. It was actually fun. . .and I took great care not to make it look like charity at all. . .I'd mix small cans of tuna, roast beef, chicken and turkey and small canned hams with some very special gourmet treats like hot chocolate and small rum cakes - things she never had the chance to have herself. Then each year I'd include something different. . .like a set of nice cloth napkins one year, or a couple of nice coffee mugs...

My mom told me a few years ago that she loved those baskets - they were practical in the winter because sometimes she couldn't get to the grocery store (my grandmother didn't drive and my parents couldn't always get out in horrible weather) and she always discovered some kind of treat she could experience that she had never had before. Even better, it helped cut down her food expenses for a month or so. . .

Gosh..I didn't mean to wander off the subject, but I do think that one way to help people is to design gifts like this as to help others, especially those with low income.

[gateley]

126. What a wonderful suggestion. Thank you! nt

[kevinbgoode]

130. Oh...well thank you! But I left out one part of that suggestion. . .

I always started in October in order to keep my costs down. . .it was much easier for me to pick up a couple of things for her basket each time I went to the market to get my own food, and it didn't seem expensive that way at all, even though by Christmas it was quite a large food basket. But it is amazing how important small cans of fruit or tuna can be for someone on a limited income and dressing it up with some special treats (I would drop by a kitchen/gourmet shop once or twice each fall when they would put out the small boxes of plum puddings or rum cakes) really made it an individual gift. . .while doing holiday shopping for the rest of the family I'd look for napkins or mugs or nice potholders to add. It was likely quite expensive by the end of the season, but I didn't really notice the extra expense because I spread it out for so long.

I'm not a real creative person...meaning I can't make things very well...like I never advanced beyond the handprint ashtrays and stick figure drawings in school. But I had fun coming up for ideas for her basket each year - and doing it yourself is much more economical than purchasing those gift baskets from retailers.

[gateley]

133. And being made by you makes it that much more special. nt

[pengillian101]

170. Wow - kevinbgoode

"When my grandmother was alive, the last few years of her Christmases it became a special project for me to start in late October and make her a food basket. It was actually fun. . .and I took great care not to make it look like charity at all. . .I'd mix small cans of tuna, roast beef, chicken and turkey and small canned hams with some very special gourmet treats like hot chocolate and small rum cakes - things she never had the chance to have herself. Then each year I'd include something different. . .like a set of nice cloth napkins one year, or a couple of nice coffee mugs...

My mom told me a few years ago that she loved those baskets - they were practical in the winter because sometimes she couldn't get to the grocery store (my grandmother didn't drive and my parents couldn't always get out in horrible weather) and she always discovered some kind of treat she could experience that she had never had before. Even better, it helped cut down her food expenses for a month or so. . ."

```````

kevinbgoode - wow - you are an inspiration for other young folks! You make your family proud!

[DFW]

182. That depends on your diet

Due to my cardiac near-miss, not only can I do without eggs, dairy and (red) meat,
but I must do without them if I want to live. Cereal (as in oat flakes, flax
seed, wheat germ, not sugar-bloated crap from General Mills or Kellogg's) is
an essential. Fresh vegetables are also essential, but we get them from the
year-round farmers market that sets up in our town three times a week. I get
my protein from poultry and fish, although fish is sky-high here. Either you're
stuck with aquacultured stuff flown in from Vietnam (questionable as to whether
or not contaminant-free), or fresh North Sea fish, which usually starts at €2.50 ($3.70)
per 100 grams (less than a quarter pound), and goes up from there.

[progressoid]

14. I had to do that for a elderly lady at the gas station last week.

She couldn't get the pump to disconnect and pumped more than the $10.00 she had budgeted for gas. She was nearly in tears when she found out she was over.

People say it feels good to help others but it mostly pissed me off seeing her in that position. Plus she looked like a strong wind would blow her away. I got the feeling she had to choose between food and other necessities often.

[Warpy]

27. Yes, it infuriates me, too

I generally try to do it without comment, but if they get all gushy and profuse, I just tell them their pay should have been raised a long time ago so they could afford all their food and everything else they need.

I keep the focus on the owners and the bosses.

[kevinbgoode]

125. Those gas pumps are awful like that, too. . .

I know that I have to watch it like a hawk because the money numbers roll so fast that it is extremely hard to stop it at the amount you've budgeted for gas.

Thank you for helping that lady out. . .even though I share your anger that she had to be put in such a position. I have very limited income yet have found myself helping with a dollar or two at the supermarket or drug store. It seems like things are getting so bad that it is stripping away the pride of people who have worked hard all of their lives. . .

[AngryAmish]

157. The NY Times bread is delicious

I use a slightly different recipe from Vogue. Look this up on the internets, experiment.

Put some sea salt on the top before baking. Salt makes everything taste good.

One more time: Make this bread. It is awesome.

[progressoid]

7. I saw a brief bit on TV newz a few weeks ago.

Not surprisingly it was short and uninformative.

[CoffeeCat]

12. I think many people feel isolated...

They're trying to stay afloat, and feeling like they're failing--because
no one else is talking about the high prices and how hard it is to
make ends meet.

When the media doesn't report on this, it compounds the problem, because
people feel alone and like they've done something wrong.

No one else appears to be complaining, so people figure that they're
failing while everyone else is just fine and dandy.

[Lorien]

37. I've brought up the topic three times with cashiers in the past few months

and every time the cashiers pretended they didn't hear me and said something like "having a good day today? Good"! Either they are sick of hearing customers comment about the prices, or they've been instructed by management to stay mum.

[momster]

52. What Do You Expect?

They're cashiers...they have no control over pricing and, unless they're union, they aren't making a whole lot either. Add to that the increase in 'do it yourself' check out and their jobs aren't very secure either.

You got complaints...go to the manager. He won't have any control either but maybe he'll give you a coupon.

[Lorien]

62. I didn't frame it as a complaint, only a comment

They need to buy groceries too. I thought that they might have some of their own theories as to why the prices have jumped so dramatically in such a short time, and if they did I wanted to hear them. No one is talking about it in the media, and I think that makes everyone feel as if they and they alone are experiencing it.

[knitter4democracy]

67. Really? All the cashiers here agree and look mad.

They buy groceries, too, and they deal with people getting upset that they can't afford something and have to put it back.

I shop mostly at Meijers anymore, and the cashiers there are nice and helpful and always look so angry when I mention how much a full cart costs anymore.

[Lorien]

70. I only shop at Publix here in Florida

because the employees are given stock in the company. I haven't asked cashiers at any other chain what their thoughts on the high prices are, that's why I'm wondering if Publix employees have been ordered not to discuss it. It would be strange if so, since the prices aren't the fault of the chain (Publix is much less expensive than Albertsons, for instance).

[knitter4democracy]

74. That is odd, then.

It must be word coming down from management.

[Andy823]

75. I agree

The media plays a big role in this. They need to get out the info more, but since they are owned by the came "big corporations" that are jacking up the prices, they won't!

Gas prices have more than doubled since Bush took office. When gas goes up, so does the price of everything in the stores that is trucked in. Big meat packers higher illegals to work, increase their profits, and then raise the price of their products to get even "higher" profits, same goes for all the other big corporations that own any business that sells food products, or for that matter any product they make!

Bush and his gang have made it easy for corportae america to bleed the people of this country dry. The rich stay rich, and everybody else becomes poor! It works great for them because we "have" to have gas to get to work, to the grocery store, etc., and we "have" to have food. They can raise the price all they want, we have to pay.

My solution for food has been to grow my own during the summer so I can put things up for the winter. It helps, but I know everyone can't do that. I also am trying to replace my vehicles with ones that get better gas mileage, but that takes some time, and is not something everyone can do. I also buy my meat from a local farmer and have it cut and wraped locally. This saves some money, and I know where the meat came from.

Untile we get someone in the whitehouse that will stop the madness, it will continue. I just hope and pray that we can get a dem in that will keep their promises, and actually work for the people of this country instead of the big corporations!

[Greyhound]

8. Sodas 64%, baked goods 20%, frozen vegetables 28%, etc.

and that is for people like us that pay attention and buy cheap. The average schmo is easily paying double those numbers.

[TankLV]

10. No.

next guestion...

[CoffeeCat]

13. If your personality was a color...

...what color would it be?

[buzzard]

33. It would be green without a doubt and don't ask me how I know because I don't, but it is.n/t

[lonestarnot]

17. hmmmf. Have a dog bisquit.

[tandot]

11. $3.99 for one loaf of Sara Lee whole grain white bread

My husband doesn't like any other whole wheat bread or homemade breads.

[CoffeeCat]

15. Holy buckets!

Where are you located?

$3.99 for a loaf of bread! Wow.

I've heard that bread is supposed to double in price, and that would
be double from what I paid last time I bought bread.

Three weeks ago, I got a great deal on Sara Lee bread and milk using
coupons. I bought 4 loaves and 4 gallons of milk--but that was a while
ago.

I guess things have changed since I purchased bread!

[tandot]

24. Northern California (NE of Sacramento).

Prices for everything are through the roof. Sometimes they have the "buy 2 for $5" deal. So, we'd still pay $2.50 for one loaf. Sooner or later we'll have to buy a freezer to buy stuff whenever it is on sale. I rarely eat that bread and buying 4 loaves just for my hubby wouldn't save us anything. It would go bad before he could eat it.

[Habibi]

65. Are there any bakery outlets in your area?

We have a Friehoffer's outlet nearby. Older breads and baked goods, many well under $2.00 per. Not as cheap as homemade, probably, but still affordable. For now.

[knitter4democracy]

68. That's where I get a good bit of our bread.

We have a local bakery outlet where all the bread and English Muffins are $0.79 each every day, less on some days or certain tables. That place gets busier every time I go. I've even been when the shelves were bare.

[tandot]

72. I haven't seen any bakery outlets here. However, we'll be moving in 2 weeks

and I have to check out what grocery stores we have in the new area.

[Mojorabbit]

97. My BIL

works for a food company that supplies ingredients for Sara Lee among other bakeries. He has had to raise prices for them all as the price of wheat has gone thru the roof. Nobody is happy in the industry.

[Warpy]

29. Holy shit!

Once again, here is the recipe for the lazy person's no knead bread:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/08/dining/081mrex.html?_r=1&oref=login

You will have to register, but it's worth it. I bake this stuff when I'm feeling lazy and just want something to hold my peanut butter in the morning.

There is no way to screw it up.

[tandot]

30. I love homemade bread but my husband won't touch it

I finally got him to eat bread that has a bit more fiber than the regular soft white bread. If I could bake home-made bread as soft and fluffy as the store bought bread, he might reconsider. However, all the bread I've baked so far turned out too dense.

[Warpy]

91. I did the nutritional labeling for a commercial bakery

and you'd be surprised at the number of chemical "yeast enhancements" that go into making that squishy balloon bread. It was appalling. I understood why my own efforts turned out so different from Wonder Bread and all its clones. I became a whole foods, homemade bread convert.

My advice: buy one loaf of balloon bread a week and keep it in the fridge for your picky hubby. Everybody else can live on homemade bread. That will save you bread money every week and his highness can avoid the inconvenience of getting used to something different.

If I seem unsympathetic, it's because I was a picky eater who was forced by years of poverty to learn to eat a whole lot of new stuff and eventually like it.

[tandot]

96. Thanks for the tips.

I kinda figured they'd have to put all kinds of artificial crap in it to make it that way.

I never heard of putting bread in the fridge. I'll try that.

His picky eating stems from some kinda weird smell/taste/texture perception (so he claims). Certain foods make him literally gag. He eats raw broccoli but he can't keep cooked broccoli down. Same with many other vegetables. His mom said he was always like that and she just gave up on feeding him the foods he'd throw right back up.

So, it is kinda hard for me to get him to try new things since he was conditioned from early childhood on to be a picky eater and to get his way :)


He has lots of other great qualities which make more than up for his finicky eating habits.

[Warpy]

101. I still can't get liver past my nose

There was a time during a period of very real hunger that a coworker staked me to a meal in the company cafeteria. It was liver and onions. I ate the onions, cut the liver into very small pieces, and tried to swallow it like pills. I just couldn't do it. My throat closed up and wouldn't let it pass. I got the slimy stewed okra and tomatoes down, I demolished a huge dish of collards seasoned with lard. I just could not do that liver.

My ex loved liver, so once I caved and cooked some chicken livers for him. When he saw me lean over and hurl into the wastebasket next to the stove, he knew that wasn't going to happen again, and just resigned himself to ordering them when we went out.

I guess we've all got something we just can't cope with. My guess is that your hubby will gradually come around after eating his ghettoized balloon bread for just a little too long, especially if you start baking variety breads for everybody else.

[gateley]

121. I keep my bread in the microwave - kind of an air-tight bread box. nt

[coalition_unwilling]

112. I call it "toilet paper bread" as you can just as easily use it for that

purpose as you can to derive nutrtion. Come to think of it, toilet paper may be more nutritious.

[Mojorabbit]

98. Here is a recipe that

is like store bought. My hubby loves it.
http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Amish-White-Bread/Detail.aspx

[tandot]

109. Thanks for the link, Mojorabbit. I'll try that recipe.

:hi:

[Mojorabbit]

117. You are welcome

if you read the comments beneath the recipe it recommends cutting the sugar back which is what I do. No way it needs the amt called for in the recipe.

[Lorien]

35. About the same here. I found that Costco sells TWO for that price

although it's not Sara Lee; it's their locally baked "artesian" whole grain bread. Very tasty, but it only lasts about a week.

[tandot]

64. We love Costco, but we hardly finish up one loaf in a week.

We'll move to a bigger house in two weeks and are planning to get a freezer. This way we can buy in bulk and freeze whatever we don't eat right away.

[dysfunctional press]

110. your husband needs to be less fussy and particular...

what's he going to do if sara lee goes out of business, stop eating bread entirely?

[JCMach1]

155. You might want to ask, why is bread 4x more expensive than a country

that produces 0 grain.

In a free market (UAE), bread is around $1.

The great swindle of the American people continues.

[AlCzervik]

16. i now do most of my food shopping at Trader Joe's, the food quality is better

and the prices are lower and in some cases much lower.

[lonestarnot]

18. No china food there.

[AlCzervik]

19. and more non meat alternatives, i stopped eating meat on dec. 26th after

having a giant swine fest on Christmas, Trader Joe's has been a good source of vegetarian food for me.

[lonestarnot]

23. I wish I didn't like it so much, but I do. Like those vegies too and fruit.

And I'm not Catholic, so I don't plan on giv'n it up until I have to do so.

[AlCzervik]

25. i needed to, i had what you could call a bacon problem. My vegetarianism

may not be a permanent state of being but honestly i don't miss meat, even bacon which is still kind of a shock, my blood pressure also went down and i've lost seven pounds. I'm not looking to covert people either, it's just something i thought i should try for awhile and so far, so good.

[lonestarnot]

26. Well good luck and keep goin'!

:toast:

[RebelOne]

49. Try the Morningstar Farms bacon.

It's fake, but tastes almost like the real thing.

[Lorien]

38. Yep, but they aren't in many states

My closest Trader Joe's is in Atlanta, and I live in Orlando. :-(

[MissB]

123. Ah, that is just a wee drive.

Well worth it, I'm sure.

[Trajan]

166. Let's hear it for Trader Joes ...

Many think it is a high end, 'Lah Ti Dah', yuppie oriented store ... But they do have some REALLY good deals .... Their dairy prices (butter, margerine, cream, eggs especially) tend to be 80% or less than grocery stores .... Their olive oil is WELL below grocery store prices ... Their veggies are prepacked, so it is WYSIWYG, but the prices on some items are still less than mainstream groceries.

We also go to WINCO, which is an employee owned chain in the northwest .... They have some lower quality, generic products, where a picky shopper can get decent products for good prices, and where we can obtain the basic staples, and well priced produce .... They also have a bulk section where we can get dried fruits, nuts and grains in bulk ....

Toss in BiMart, another employee owned store in the NW .... and we in Portland Oregon can put together a decent week's meals at price minimums ....

Pricing has gotten out of hand, and until people SAY something, and stop buying high priced items, the big groceries will ignore your plight ....

[AlCzervik]

169. We have a Winco right down the street, the only problem is the parking lot

it's an awesome place to get jumped.

[Trajan]

174. Yikes ....

I have no fear of getting jumped, even though it is true anyone can be jumped anywhere at anytime ....

But I don't normally have to worry about it .... The last time someone I knew got jumped (my brother was robbed), was about 15 years ago in Norwalk CA ....

I buy for 3-4 people .... my total is at about $80 per week.

[AlCzervik]

175. it's not the store itself it's just the location, it's right off the exit and i think thats added

to the problem, the whole are is just under going some weird growing pains. I was mugged once when i worked in downtown Boston and it left an impression on my so i tend to syat away from Winco.

[Muttocracy]

20. Data from USDA's Economic Research Service

Before the data link, my own 2 or 3 cents. Tons of energy goes into food production, particularly meat, processed foods, anything trucked long distance, refrigerated, etc. I'm surprised the lag from gas prices going up to food prices going up took as long as it did (in my unscientific impressions anyway). There have been lots of stories in the media in the past year about ethanol production (or speculation about it) eating up the corn supply or otherwise driving up the price of corn. Corn is in nearly everything in the supermarket (read Pollan's Omnivore's Dilemma or his other related articles for an intro to that topic, other good authors on it too), and is heavily used to feed livestock. Corn production is also notorious for sucking up lots of energy and lots of fertilizer (and producing inorganic fertilizer in turn takes tons of energy).


http://www.ers.usda.gov/Briefing/CPIFoodAndExpenditures/consumerpriceindex.htm

Food Price Outlook, 2008

In 2008, the Consumer Price Index (CPI) for all food is projected to increase 3.0 to 4.0 percent, as retailers continue to pass on higher commodity and energy costs to consumers in the form of higher retail prices. Food-at-home prices are forecast to increase 3.5 to 4.5 percent, while food-away-from-home prices are forecast to increase 2.5 to 3.5 percent in 2008. The all-food CPI increased 4.0 percent between 2006 and 2007, the highest annual increase since 1990. Food-at-home prices, led by eggs, dairy, and poultry prices, increased 4.2 percent, while food-away-from-home prices rose 3.6 percent in 2007.

edit to add next paragraph:

December 2007 Prices

The CPI for all food increased 0.2 percent from November to December 2007 (the same percentage increase as in October to November 2007) and is now 4.9 percent higher than the December 2006 level. Similarly, both the food-at-home and the food-away-from-home indices increased 0.2 percent in December. The food-at-home index is now 5.6 percent above last December, while the food-away-from-home index is 4.0 percent above last December. The all-items CPI increased 0.1 percent and is currently 4.1 percent above the December 2006 level.

more detail on that web page

[kath]

113. So grocery prices only increased 5.6% from Dec 06 to Dec 07?! Bull-fucking-shit!!

I'd say it was at LEAST double that overall, with prices increasing 20-25% or more on many of the items I buy frequently.

[Muttocracy]

151. did you read on the page link? some items went up more

so it depends on what they put in their calculation (which may not be what people really eat, not sure if that is linked from that page or not). And these are all national generalizations. I'm sure produce has gone up faster here in the frozen north than in the south. Where energy costs are a factor for stores (heating and cooling) -- that could vary regionally too.

Also, if I remember corretly, on the page it talks about the 06-07 increase being on top of a substantial 05-06 increase - so depending on when it hit each area, again it could feel bundled together.

The main point I was trying to provide was that food is going up fast, will continue to do so, and I'm sure it's going up faster than most of us are getting for cost-of-living increases if any.

[kath]

152. I wasn't saying bullshit to you, but to the jerks that always jimmy the numbers to make the economy

look better than it is.
I appreciate your link. My point is, and I think most would agree, that 5.6% increase sounds WAY low, and we're sick as hell of them playing games with the numbers.

[Muttocracy]

156. oh, I didn't take it as a slight. just that things like dairy ARE way up

[Ediacara]

21. Out of control oil prices are leading to the insane grocery inflation

Plus, most produce in the USA in February is from Mexico or farther south, so is really expensive since it's being shipped half way around the world.

[Lorien]

36. Also, biofuels

and add to all that increased demand for corn due to their use in Biofuels.

[Retrograde]

106. and the declining dollar

isn't doing much for prices, either. Throw in farmers growing grains for biofuels rather than foodstuffs and you can see why prices are going up.

[Muttocracy]

22. and about that economic stimulus package

I didn't follow every twist and turn but I think the final version lost any provisions for food stamp increases. As welfare goes, at least we know what food stamps are being spent on. And compared to other consumer spending, more of food $$ staying the country I would think (but I'm not an economist so correct me if I'm wrong) compared to say most consumer goods.

[Hatchling]

108. It would've made more sense in my case.

If I had gotten food stamps I would have had to spend it on food. But since the cost of buying food has gone so high, I'll be spending my $300 "tax rebate" on filing bankruptcy instead. See how that helps the economy, you congress assholes!

[philly_bob]

31. Some increase is due to competition between food & ethanol ...

and I supported ethanol research for years, because it looked like the best chance for getting away from petroleum dependency. Politically, ethanol had support from farm states.

Farmer with a bushel of corn can either sell it to a food company or an fuel company.

But now look. Not sure crop-based ethanol was the best choice.

[casus belli]

42. Yep. Sometimes things look better on paper.

I'm still all about tranferring to more eco-friendly fuel sources, Ethanol included, but the process needs to be done steadily and responsibly - and we shouldn't be looking to put all our eggs in one basket. Ethanol has terrific benefits, but we shouldn't be developing the technology if it means we are just transferrring dependence to another fuel with limitations and not exploring other truly renewable sources for energy.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

32. Interestingly enough, prices at my food co-op are often lower than the super markets

and haven't changed much since I moved here more than four years ago.

On my way home from choir practice last night, I stopped off at a supermarket along the way to buy a bunch of things I needed for breakfast, since the co-op was al. I spotted my favorite brand of natural yogurt. But the price brought me up short. $4.79 for a 32-ounce carton? I didn't need it that badly.

The next day, I went to the food co-op and saw the same kind of yogurt for $2,99. Organic free-range eggs are cheaper at the co-op, as are many other healthy foods.

[casus belli]

43. And as it increases in demand, it will become cheaper

I couldn't be happier about this new wave of organic consciousness that seems to be taking hold. Mostly because, as a consumer of organic goods, I realize that the more people who demand the goods, the more demand will increase and prices will inevitably fall into line with the cheap processed junk that commercial groceries and food manufacturers have been pushing on us for the last 40-50 years.

I think behind all that there's another benefit. I'm from the school of thought that many of our modern illnesses and disorders could be a byproduct of rampant pesticide use in our food products. As the demand for commercial food products and produce diminishes, the level of pesticides contaminating food and water supplies will diminish, and people will begin to see improvements in their overall general health.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

60. Except that the places where organics are "new" products charage more

A lot of ordinary supermarkets are starting to carry some of my favorite products from the co-op, but the supermarkets invariably charge MORE. The difference isn't always as striking as $4.79 at the conventional supermarket and $2.99 at the co-op, but it's always at least 10 cents more at the conventional supermarket.

[napi21]

34. There are a lot of things that influence your food prices.

Probably the biggest one is fuel prices. EVERYTHING that you buy is moved via truck, train, ship, or plane. Fuel prices have doubled or more in the last year. Those costs are added to the cost of pricessing at each stage. People LOVE the idea that they can buy almost any fruit or vegie in their produce department all year long, but THAT means the things that are not available in your local climate are shipped srom somewhere far away where the growing season is longer, and much different than yours. Shipping affects that a lot! The drought across our country has hit the grain, beef, hog, lamb, corn industries very hard! Many fields either never grew or were burned long before they reached maturity. Beef producers had to cull their herds because they couldn't buy enough to feed them. I could go on, but you get the pic.

[DaveJ]

39. Fake food: the problem is worse than most realize

Most grocery stores stock low quality food that was at some point pumped up with hormones or mixed with chemical fillers to make it look like you are buying more 'food' than you actually are.

Natural boneless porkchops (4 of them) that my wife bought a couple times cost $14 at an organic food store. A hamburger I bought at a restaurant that serves quality food cost $8.90. Of course McDonald's may still find ways to sell burgers for a dollar, but that's not real food as we know it.

[earth mom]

40. Who's gonna talk about it? The corporate media whores aren't gonna say nothing!

They don't give a DAMN about you or me or any of us!

Didn't they made that crystal clear when they ignored Edwards the way they did when he was the ONLY candidate that spoke for those of us who are living paycheck to paycheck or living as the working poor or who are just flat broke poor?!

The corporate media whores don't give a flying f about any of us!

WAKE UP AMERICA!!!

The corporate media whores are ALL about profits 24/7!

There is NO profit in telling the truth and telling the people that we are being screwed up one side and down another!

There is NO profit in telling people that grocery prices are rising because if they do then people won't spend a dime on nonessential purchases like that shiny new car or that pretty new handbag!

There is NO profit in the truth ya'll!

:rant:

[sarcasmo]

116. Excellent Rant. Corporate Media doesn't give a SHIT about you are me.

[OneBlueSky]

41. wheat-based products (e.g. breads) are going to increase dramatically . . .

in the coming year . . . the futures prices on wheat have reached unprecedented levels, and they're still going up . . .

[momster]

53. Glad My DH is Gluten Free!

No wheat products for him and I may give them up myself!

[pitohui]

81. good for you both, lots of good reasons to go wheat free

my DH is low carb but in practice avoiding wheat is one of the best things we've done for ourselves

i've noticed that my health and digestion improved a great deal once i cut out the wheat products

traveling with someone who has celiac disease and noticing the huge change in her digestion (that's describing it mildly) when there was nothing to eat but wheat was most instructive also

i don't think this is the best food in the world, it might have been the best we could do when it was discovered 6000 years ago or wherever, but i don't think diet with lots of wheat is a good thing for people who expect to be living in the same bodies for over 60 years and working until they're almost 70...it was probably okay when the average life expectancy was 40

[newportdadde]

56. Yep... wheat is up something like 20% since the fisrt of the year.

[ordinaryaveragegirl]

44. I'm ready for the Farmer's Market to open here...

First week of April! I like to buy local when I can, because it's better for my budget and the local economy. And it's right down the street. No corporate BS, just local growers.

Consumers aren't the only ones to notice the huge spikes in food costs...I work in the restaurant industry, and it's hitting us hard too. Menu prices have gone up in a lot of places. Our Culinary Manager was just noticing the spike in produce when we got a shipment a few weeks ago. I'm sure the fuel prices have to do with the uptick in prices - it costs a lot more $$$ for the carriers to get things from place to place.

And who's laughing all the way to the bank on this? Big Oil...remember, it was widely reported that ExxonMobil profited almost $12B in the last quarter of 2007. Meanwhile, we're getting robbed blind on everything else.

[GliderGuider]

45. Self-delete, wrong place in the thread

:blush:

[GliderGuider]

47. Food price inflation is a global problem

Reports of food price inflation are coming out of India, Pakistan, Indonesia, Canada, parts of Europe... Even the UK is reporting double-digit food inflation percentages this year. Across the board, inflation is being blamed on rising food and energy prices.

The place I worry about most is Africa. 28% of all African food calories are imported, and almost half of that is wheat. 2/3 of their food imports are wheat, rice and coarse grains like corn, all of which are experiencing massive global price inflation. With low GDPs, a rapidly rising population, very high transportation costs, and declining farm production due to climate change and AIDS, Africa is primed for a Malthusian catastrophe the likes of which the world has never seen, probably starting within the decade.

I suspect the world is about at its food limits. Be very grateful that your nation is a net exporter of food.

[pitohui]

82. your comments about africa sound right on to me

i could not understand why there would be places where the only breakfast is a parisian type breakfast of french bread, butter, jelly, coffee -- unhealthy and also i had to wonder where the wheat was coming from

if it's imported or donated, it's a really fragile situation

[End Of The Road]

51. Does anyone have a good alternative to using...

some plastic items like Glad Tall Kitchen garbage bags? The price has skyrocketed and I don't know how to do without them in the kitchen. I remember as a kid you could buy paper kitchen can liners that had been waxed. They were smaller, so you had to take them out more often, and I don't know if they'd be cheaper today anyway, but I haven't seen them in 30 years.

And how did people wrap things for storage (like cheese) before cling wrap?

[momster]

54. China Cheese-keepers

Which sounds like a rock band but is really a dish with a lid designed to protect cheese from air. You can still buy them. Check e-bay or Victorian Trading Company. Also there are vinyl bowl covers, originally used in the '50's (they look like little shower caps) that you can wash and reuse. Find those at the Vermont Country Store.

[pengillian101]

173. Keeping cheese

I've had a foodsaver vacuum package machine for 6-7 years or so. Haven't thrown out any cheese since. It's good for keeping most foods fresh for about 5 times longer than usual. And for freezing food - vacuuming eliminates freezer burn. Just plain sealing (not vacuum) chip bags etc. keeps things fresh. My machine is older, but I wouldn't be w/out one ever. It's paid for itself more than I could imagine.

Just for fun, I just looked at ebay. There's a whole system for next to nothing. Not that I condone ebay shopping. I just mean a second-hand item should be more reasonably priced than new.

http://cgi.ebay.com/FoodSaver-Vacuum-Sealer-VAC1075-Elite-w-Extras-Bags_W0QQitemZ320218969105QQihZ011QQcategoryZ63510QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[eilen]

58. I just had to buy trash bags too, I bought the store brand

Glad was to expensive-- I think over $5. I am thinking of going back to getting plastic shopping bags and using them for most of my garbage. Soon it will be Spring and I can get the compost going again. Things like cheese, I use storebrand ziploc plastic bags, or plastic bags from the produce dept. after I've used the produce.

I am totally planning a garden this year. I am new to it so it will probably start out as mostly an herb garden but I plan some tomatoes, peppers and potatoes. We belong to the CSA which will be starting up next month.

I stopped drinking milk, I use Almond milk which is still expensive but my son drinks milk like it's going out of style. Luckily in NY our prices are much lower than down South because of the dairy compact. We are doing more soups. There is almost always some kind of soup in the slow cooker everyday. The leftovers get put there. Bread is expensive because my dh and I eat the sprouted grain stuff but it usually lasts over a week. We are eating more beans.
I like the hillbilly housewife site too. There used to be another one with what to buy if you have $5 kind of thing. If I can find it, I'll post it.

[End Of The Road]

59. Our CSA starts up soon, too

It's one of the best things we've done, I think. I'm really looking forward to some nice spring greens.

I really had not thought about produce bags as an alternative to buying plastic wrap - but it's a great idea. Thanks!

[eilen]

143. I just received our CSA brochure in the mail today.

This year I think I am going to do a working share.

[RebelOne]

73. Do you have a Big Lots near you.

I buy trash bags for about $1.50 there.

[End Of The Road]

77. Yes I DO.

In fact, it's close to my grocery. It's a filthy disorganized place, but if their trash bags are that cheap I can deal with it.

[pitohui]

85. what i did when i was REALLY poor

i guess it sounds disgusting, but what i did was i didn't use garbage can liners at all, instead each day when i emptied the kitchen trash can i brought the entire kitchen trash can outside and rinsed it down with the garden hose after dumping the contents into the outside garbage bin

in those days though my monthly water bill was about $8-12 dollars a month tho! and it's rather unpleasant to do this chore in icy cold weather

but it did mean that i didn't have to buy the liners

i put my cheeses in re-usable containers that are in turned stored in the meat/cheese bin of my refrigerator

again, any time you do something that doesn't involve a disposable product, there's more cleaning, but i think you still save money

[dysfunctional press]

104. i use the plastic shopping bags as garbage bags.

just one more reason to love them.

[lumpy]

114. We buy Kirland brand 10 gal. garbage liner bags at Cosco

They are much much cheaper than Glad bags; lighter weight but strong enough to handle kitchen waste.

[Mojorabbit]

118. I have a worm farm

and a compost pile. It has really cut down on the amt of trash I have to put out.

[newportdadde]

55. Yes its very noticeable, we are a family of 6.

Although its noticeable its also very understandable. Some of it I see a bit more clearly as my father is a farmer.

1) Higher energy costs to produce, process and get to market. Fertilzer is very very high now, my father typically puts on 40 bucks an acre now.

2) The ethanol joke - ow gas is high.. I know lets shove the stuff we EAT into the gas tank that will help the wallet. This of course raises the cost of corn... which raises beef and hogs etc. To make matters worse taxpayers also subsidize the hell out of the ethanol.. its a joke.

3) The Feds attitude towards money... our currency is getting killed. We continue to dump more and more liquidity into the mix and consequently more and more costs go up as there are more dollars to chase those goods. Then of course we get the stupid rebate checks... you know lets just drop the prime rate to 0%(it worked for Japan right?) and send a check for a million out to each American? Come on print some more monopoly money. College tution.. food, housing... etc etc. Savers and those on a fixed income get mowed down.

Keep in mind your aren't going to hear anything about it. The nightly newscasters aren't going to have trouble buying food and they are too busy attending parties with the political elite they are suppose to be watching and reporting to us about.

[tbyg52]

57. >>Why is this not being reported or discussed?

Same reason the things that actually matter to the little people have been cut out of the "official" inflation reports....

[elizfeelinggreat]

61. You are so right

it's not being discussed. Just like yesterday's majority movements against the President's tantrums in the Senate and House were not discussed.

But it will be.

As soon as a Democrat is President, it'll be nothing but "Bad News! Bad News! Bad News! We told you this would happen!"

[gollygee]

63. I've been astounded too

in some cases the prices go up, in other cases the size goes down, and in some cases the size is smaller AND the price has gone up. It's amazing.

[femrap]

66. The smaller packaging just pisses me off...

These Greedy Corporations think we're stupid?

I am a bargain shopper...use coupons and buy things I use ONLY when on sale. And it's going to get much worse, I'm afraid. Watching the Commodity Markets, wheat is way up.

I am trying to buy as little of processed foods as possible. Who needs the fructose and other chemicals, right?

And I'm going to start looking at ways to prepare beans in a variety of ways. Beans are extremely nutritious and filling. And add just a bit of apple cider vinegar to the beans to eliminate that 'problem!' lol.

Maybe you don't hear about it because people just don't feel they can do anything about it.

[Marrah_G]

76. Heat, Gas, Food...these are what is killing the working class

I am now barely scraping by with the of help from my parents.

Feeding 3 teens, even while shopping carefully is horrible......AND there is nothing left over in the budget for fun food or entertainment.

My Gas, Heat and Food Bills have doubled..... my income has stayed the same.

If these things are a small part of our monthly expenses then you are probably doing fine.

For those of us for whom these are the major portion of our monthly bills.....we are slowly drowning.

As a single mother, there are days where I am close to the breaking point.... today is one of those days.

[DaveJ]

78. To be honest, I eat too much anyway...

Probably at least 3 times more than I have to. The best thing for me would be to cut back.

Plus I've shielded myself from a lot of these problems. No kids. Rent has free heat and electricity. Public transportation to work. I don't know how everyone else makes it.

Normal people do not want to spend every waking moment thinking about their finances, but it is becoming a necessity.

One has to be incredibly thrifty to get by these days.

[Tindalos]

79. Prices are starting to creep up here.

Canada has been fairly insulated from the rising prices due to the strength of the loonie but that is changing. The local news mentioned that wheat production is at the lowest its been since the 1970's. They even floated the idea of rationing or some products simply being unavailable in the stores.

I'm going to plant some veggies when it warms up. I grew tomatoes last year and they were yummy!

[Orsino]

83. Gasoline prices.

All that fresh (or frozen, for that matter) produce has to be flown and/or trucked to you. Even local produce depends on gasoline and petroleum-based fertilizers.

[Bentcorner]

84. Get thee to a Wal-Mart Supercenter where prices for groceries is much cheaper

[RebelOne]

88. Also, the prices at a Super Target are much lower

than the supermarkets.

[Dora]

149. They're not at the one near me. nt

:shrug:

[AZBlue]

179. Some regular Targets also have expanded grocery sections.

There's no Super Target here, but one or two of the new stores have large grocery sections - their prices are shockingly low!!!

[TommyO]

111. I would debate the "much lower"

I generally shop at Wegmans, a privately owned, higher end grocery store, it happens to be right across the street from a Wally World Super place and the price differences are minimal at best for the products I frequently use, for some things Wally is more expensive than Wegmans.

The major differences are in the cost of meat, poultry and seafood, but the quality of the Wegmans products more than outweighs the difference in cost, especially with all of the Select grade meats that are enhanced with water solutions that Walmart sells.

Wegmans also has much better labor policies, has butchers and fishmongers on staff, and consistently is in the Fortune Top 100 companies to work for (as judged by the employees themselves, they have been #3 for the past two years).

[Bentcorner]

158. I used to shop at Wegmans when I lived in New York

and it was definitely higher priced when compared to what I pay for groceries at Wal-Mart. I could care less about select grade meats or having butchers on staff. I don't eat red meat. Wal-Mart sells the exact same groceries that are sold in the other grocery stores here in Maryland, but at a much cheaper price.

[TommyO]

160. To each his or her own

but I prefer shopping at a company that treats their employees well, and one that isn't the single largest contributor to the "Made in China" label.

[Bentcorner]

161. I thought the discussion was about high prices at the grocery store

You clearly must have enough money to shop at a high-end grocery store with a staff of butchers and fishmongers. Good for you.

[TommyO]

163. it is about high prices

But sometimes paying a few pennies (and that's literally what it is in my price comparisons) to support a company that treats their employees well. Walmart is the last place I would choose to shop at because of their labor and sourcing practices.

[Bentcorner]

181. A few pennies? A statement like that makes me wonder if you've ever even shopped at a Wal-Mart

Supercenter. The savings is a lot more then just a few pennies. Granted, they may not have a team of butchers or fishmongers, but not everyone needs stuff like that in a grocery store. Some of us are just looking to stretch a buck.

[TommyO]

183. I have price compared, for the products that I use regularly

(not including meat, chicken and fish), WalMart and Wegmans (right across the street from each other) are within pennies. The price difference is not enough for me to choose the lesser of two companies to shop at.

[TommyO]

164. In addition, I am concerned about food costs

I just placed an order with Angel Food Ministries (http://www.angelfoodministries.com/) to see how good their selection is.

[KitSileya]

86. There's nothing pathetic about it.

when I go shopping, I go to three or four different stores--buying
the loss leaders and getting the best bargains at each grocery store. I know that's
a bit pathetic, but I am always aware of what is a good price and what isn't.

It's simply good sense. You should be proud you have control of your grocery expenses. Too many do not.

As for the coming disaster that looms ahead - it's going to get ugly. Very ugly. Africa, of course will be worst hit, as was pointed out up-thread. But Americans will have major problems as well. That may cause increased civil unrest, and the only hope is that this unrest will cause revolutionary changes, rather than man eat man.

One source of cheaper solutions and recipes that I can recommend is Amy Dacyczyn's "The Complete Tightwad Gazette". Though her newsletter was published from 1990 to 1996, it's still very relevant. Especially the articles on economic philosophy should be mandatory reading.

[leftofthedial]

87. the oligarchy better pay attention

Throughout history, we serfs put up with every insult but hunger.

We starve and we start guillotining wealthy people and divvying up their shit. (historically speaking)

[pitohui]

89. actually that isn't true at all -- quite the opposite

when people are hungry, they don't have the energy to do anything about anything, this is why for most of human history people have seemingly just accepted their lot as starving serfs and it shocks us that they did so little about it

revolutions are led by upper/middle class people who don't think they're getting their share of the pie or who think their share of the pie has just been snatched away (french revolution since you mention the guillotine, people saw an improvement in lifestyle and then just as suddenly they saw their lifestyles going back into the crapper because of the huge expenses/budget over-runs from the excesses of french royalty)

poor/starving people just kill each other, the rich are out of reach -- and here is one of the motivations for why rich people resent the middle class and heap contempt on "strivers" and try to pull up the rungs so that there will be more poor people and fewer middle class

if you live in a gated community, you don't have to worry about the homeless guy under the bridge, you have to worry about the person who at least at some point had the wherewithal to buy into your gated community with you and now sees it slipping away

there are literally billions of poor people in the world and yet the tiny rich minority hardly ever experiences a moment's discomfort because of them, most war/revolution is the battle of rich against rich (example osama bin laden and rich saudi shieks funding attacks on the world trade center and rich usa capitalists) or rich against rising classes

if we are all hungry, we will quickly need many more hours a day for sleeping and will be completely ineffective

the oligarchy is deliberately picking our pockets, if anyone still believes that it's some mistake that gas prices have tripled under bush/cheney and that grocery prices have followed, well, they just aren't paying attention i guess -- this is not incompetence, this is a deliberate policy to get what money we have and leave us at their mercy

at the very beginning of his reign, bush said he would follow a "soft dollar" policy and so he has, the dollar has lost half its value against the euro, when a man says he will do something and he does it, let's take it out of the realm of "coincidence" and just admit that evil exists and that these are deliberate actions

[leftofthedial]

90. the French Revolution

was triggered by famine

The Irish Revolution was triggered by famine

our apathy is, in part, an artifact of our contentedness. no food, no contentment . . .

[pitohui]

139. no it wasn't, sorry

you can track the many famines all thru history and see what happens, not much, hungry people can't fight

the french revolution in particular was a fight between the aristocracy and the bourgeoise, any sympathy for any poor starving peasants is nothing but a side issue, the problem was the ridiculous taxes on the middle class and the obscene lifestyle of the aristocracy


hungry people can't and don't fight, which is not to say that people who want to make their side look good (say the bourgeosis of the french revolution) won't gleefully pretend that they're cutting off heads to help the starving

it's about as "real" as osama bin laden or the saudi princes funding terror and this is somehow helping a poor person in a camp in palestine, it's bogus, it's propaganda, and it's a story they tell the weak-minded (and hungry people ARE weak-minded, they are not in a position to lead but to follow)

we had better take hunger seriously, it is not going to be some wonderful spur to change, at least not any positive change


rich people laugh behind their hands when we stomp our feet and pretend that we're suddenly going to rise up when we're hungry, no, if we didn't rise up when we were strong, we won't rise up when we're weak, they know it and the student of history knows it

[autorank]

93. Can we talk about ethanol? n/t

[Blue_Roses]

94. Just got back from the grocery store and I couldn't believe

how much my cottage cheese had gone up. It was like half the price this time last year. It's cheaper to buy a generic bag of chips than something healthy.:crazy: Fruits and vegetables are off the charts.

Ridiculous.

[RebelOne]

95. I am a single person and I spend about $85 to $100 a week

for food for me and my two dogs. And I'm a vegetarian, so I don't even buy meat. The only item I pay a really high price for is dog food. One of my dogs has a food allergy, so I must buy special foods for him.

[txaslftist]

99. This is how we are paying for the wars.

And the budget excesses, and the runaway spending, and the tax cuts, etc, etc.

Inflation is a hidden tax. When the federal reserve lowers interest rates to increase borrowing, they increase the amount of money in circulation. The more money is in circulation, the higher prices go, because the supply of money is increasing while the supply of goods is not (the reasons for this lie in the arcana of "fractional reserve" laws, which basically say that if you borrow money from a bank, they can use your promise to pay the money back as collateral/money to loan to other people - so long as borrowing increases throughout the system, more money continues to be created, because the money is collateralized by promises to pay); supply/demand, right?

So how does the war figure into this? Well, you know you didn't get a tax increase when the war started, right? You know that the other items in the federal budget weren't decreased, right? So where did the money to fight the war and the money to spend on the other increases in the federal budget come from? It would be simplistic and inaccurate to say that the government "just printed it". They didn't, because the government doesn't actually have the authority to print money. The Federal Reserve Banks (who are a private organization) loaned the money to the government, this money is collateralized into more loans, more money is created, and the war is financed by debt.

The debt's increase is reflected in the higher prices you pay at the grocery store (and everywhere else).

Fiscal irresponsibility has funny consequences.

[dysfunctional press]

102. learn to shop for sale items.

i almost never go grocery shopping with a list of what i MUST have.
i buy what's on sale, and adapt my menus for the week to whatever items i happen to bring home.

and we eat very well.

[KayLaw]

127. I agree

I wait until I get the fliers from the stores and then decide what we want for dinner. There are ways to beat inflation. We buy second hand everything and shop aggressivly for everything including groceries.

[dysfunctional press]

128. i also stock-up on things on super-sale prices, and check for discontinued/damaged/clearance stuff..

even the high-priced brands have really deep discount prices once or twice a year...i love breyer's ice cream, but it's up over $6 bucks for 3/4 of a half-gallon(btw- it REALLY pissed me off when they lowered the amount, and referred to it as "space-saving packaging" :mad::mad::mad: ) however- meijer's just had it on sale for $2- so the freezer in my neighbor's garage(we share it, since i loaned him some large coin last year) is stocked almost to the brim.

people need to pay attention to pricing- not just go to the store, throw all the same stuff as always into the cart, and then have fits when the price at the register has skyrocketed.
it really doesn't take much effort to shop smart AND economically.

[pengillian101]

137. That's a really good idea, QuestionAll

"so the freezer in my neighbor's garage(we share it, since i loaned him some large coin last year) is stocked almost to the brim."

~~~~~~

Sharing and bartering with neighbors is a time-honored tradition.

Good job.

Mother Earth News magazine was borne around 1970. We all can still learn from it. Folks have bartered for exchanging goods and services between each other since forever. I think Mother Earth News revived it :-)

It's easy and fun if you live in a community where you are small enough to know and barter with each other.

It's a very casual swap/exchange. No one keeps 'track' of who owes who.

[VotesForWomen]

107. i've been noticing that for a long time. nt

[meow2u3]

134. Skyrocketing gas prices cause the spike in food prices

1. The grocers are passing the increased cost onto the consumer because the oil companies are ripping off everybody.
2. Food and energy prices are conveniently excluded from the core inflation rate of about 2-3%, just to lowball the actual inflation rate of about 20%.

[Name removed]

135. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pengillian101]

140. Post those recipes, if you got them., wouldja?

"I go to the bulk store and make everything from scratch.
From one 50lb bag of flour you can bake bread, bagels, pizza dough, cinnamon rolls, calzones, bread sticks,tortillas, donuts,cake,brownies,cookies etc.

From one large can of tomato paste you can make spaghetti sauce, ketchup, salsa, tomato soup, pizza sauce etc.

I have a soy milk maker(gotta get soyajoy) with which you can make soymilk,chocolate milk,tofu for less than 25cents."

~~~~~~

Flour, tomato paste and soy milk.

~~~~~


Wow-Please share your recipes with all of us.

You don't mention at all about all the other ingredients involved in making anything from those things you say you buy in bulk.

I made home-made ketchup from home-grown tomatoes - ONE time. Way too labor intensive. Start off w/a bushel of tomatoes - cooked to maybe a pint of ketchup. So much liquid to get cook off.

[MissB]

147. I don't know what happened to that poster

but I kinda get what they were saying in terms of being able to bake items that seem complicated from scratch using basic ingredients.

Many of those items can be found in cookbooks such as Make-A-Mix by Karine Eliason (things like bagels, english muffins, cinnamon rolls, cake, and brownies). The basic idea of the cookbook is to take bulk ingredients and turn them into a variety of mixes that can be used for different items. I highly recommend the english muffin recipe- cooked on a cast iron griddle, they rival any of the finer english muffins sold at the grocery store.

I also use a cookbook called Frozen Assets by Deborah Taylor-Hough that uses a simple and inexpensive recipe for pizza dough. I don't freeze it like I could, instead making it fresh the evening that I need it. It isn't terribly difficult to do once you get the knack. A bit of milk, some yeast, salt, an egg and flour.

I use a Moosewood Cookbook by Mollie Katzen that has recipes for focaccia bread and pita bread. Both use the same basic ingredients, with minor tweakings. The focaccia bread uses water, salt, yeast, flour and rosemary. The pita bread leaves out the rosemary, adds a dash of sugar, and gives an option for replacing half of the flour with whole wheat flour (which I use - super yummy). It takes a bit of effort to get them right, but once you've figured out how to make them puff, you'll be amazed.

I once calculated that it cost me 13 cents a loaf to make focaccia bread or one 12-pocket batch of small pita bread. That assumes that one buys the yeast in the pound brick package at Costco for about $3. The price of flour has gone up slightly at Costco, but not nearly as bad as it has gone up at the grocery store.

I've used a soy-a-joy soymilk maker before. It was loud, and I could never quite get the soy milk to taste like it the shelf-stable stuff at Costco. It can be done, I'm sure, but I gave up on trying different sweeteners and soybeans.

I've never cooked down tomatoes to paste or ketchup. I've grown my own and canned my own and frozen my own for use in sauces later. I totally agree that it would be a huge pain to make ketchup or paste with tomatoes. Unless I had a farm and a huge excess of tomatoes, I don't think I'd try. :rofl:

[pitohui]

168. there are entire cookbooks on this topic full of such recipes

i feel like i used to have them all, until i wised up and realized that there was no reason on god's green earth why i should be eating bread, pizza dough, cakes, calzones (!), doughnuts, cinnamon rolls, and other carb-heavy crap at all


you save 100% on products that you don't buy and eat at all

[bagimin]

141. Our groceries easily run $800 a month

for a family of four...I don't know how the "lower class" gets by.

[TommyO]

148. I'm a single guy with a pretty good income and food is definitely getting pricey

My food budget has grown quite a bit over the past two years, I don't know how my brother is doing it with his family of four. I was talking with him and their food is running at least $800 for the four of them, and my nephew is only four, I can't imagine when he's a teenager! Some of their added expense comes from the fact that my nephew is lactose intolerant so the soy-based products for him are definitely more expensive than their milk-based equivalents.

I'll be placing my first Angel Food Ministries (www.angelfoodministries.com) tomorrow to check out the quality of their protein sources primarily, I'll be adding some of the specials into my order.

[Orwellian_Ghost]

145. Grocery store prices are unimportant

I'm driving to the store and some idiot on NPR comes on to give us the economic report I think it was the GPI index or some such thing. He reports that the rise in the index was 6-7%, I can't remember the exact number, and that this was extremely high. He says, however, that this is MISLEADING. Did you get that MISLEADING!!

The reason that the number was so high, according to this wonk, was due to HIGH FOOD COSTS and HIGH ENERGY COSTS. Take away those numbers and the economy is fine says the wonk.

So do you get what these people think!!!!

As long as we poor plebes don't need to eat or heat our homes everything is Okey-Dokey in LaLaLand aka WallSt.

Time to storm the castle yet?!

K&R

[FlyingSquirrel]

150. How to combat high prices...

One way is to get yourself a cheap freezer and put in the garage. Whenever frozen stuff goes on sale you can really stock up - a lot of times you just can't fit enough in your fridge freezer. That big one'll pay for itself in a short time, and then you get the savings (and convenience of being able to make fewer shopping trips)

[kath]

153. well, out here where the temp goes over 100 for at least several days each summer, and goes over 90

for months on end, the garage gets pretty freakin' hot. Seems like it would cost quite a bit to run a freezer under such circumstances... A nice cool basement is a whole 'nuther story, but sadly we don't have one of those. :-(

[FlyingSquirrel]

162. Good point... you could use up most of food in spring and turn off

freezer during summer maybe.

[BluePatriot]

177. Idea

My Dad took the door off a hallway utility closet and put a freezer in there. He must have run an electrical box, but if you can find someplace with a plug that's close enough it might be a good way too keep it inside. My mom was thrilled.

[Skittles]

172. nice if you HAVE A GARAGE

:o

[Saphire]

159. Oh, I've noticed. Hubby and I with two teens...I've seen our bill

go from $75.00 per week to $130.00 per week. I try to create healthy meals but don't always succeed. I know we're eating unhealthy, but we still gotta eat.

[HCE SuiGeneris]

165. Tomatoes --$4.00 a pound.

Isn't that what N.Y. steak used to cost?

[Alexander]

171. Sure. But they're directly linked to gas prices.

Truckers have to eat.

[pengillian101]

176. I am astounded when I walk through the grocery store.

I am astounded when I walk through the grocery store.

I pay very close attention to prices. For several years, I've watched allof the ads, and when I go shopping, I go to three or four different stores--buying the loss leaders and getting the best bargains at each grocery store. I know that's a bit pathetic, but I am always aware of what is a good price and what isn't.
----------------


Well hey, be thankful that you can still drive and walk through the grocery store to shop. ;-)

We depend on food delivery quite a bit. Like Schwan's.

[w8liftinglady]

178. it's a lot of work,but I take advantage of triple coupon offers at my grocery stores

I keep a folder with my coupons catagorized and look for the items on sale every week.I usually save 100.00 or more.I also try to get buy-one-get-one-free with my coupons and get things for almost nothing.It doesn't help much with veggies and meat,but every little bit helps.
a few links
http://www.terismessageboard.com/
http://www.dmoz.org/Home/Homemaking/Frugality/

[tavalon]

180. I haven't noticed my prices going up much, but

since I do all of my shopping at Whole Foods, my grocery costs have been so mindnumbingly high these last six years that I don't think I would notice anything but a huge increase. I just assumed it was because my kiddo who has autism and is on a gluten free/casein free diet, has begun eating for five.

[defendandprotect]

184. Picked up MEDICINE yesterday . . . up about 7% . . . .