What The Hell Was The "Medication" This Guy Stopped Taking That Might Have

[orleans]

contributed to this attack on NIU?

"The gunman who shot dead five people at a university here was identified Friday as Stephen Kazmierczak, 27, described as an "outstanding" graduate student with no signs of a troubled mind.

"He was an outstanding student," Grady said. "We had no indication at all that this would be the type of person to engage in this type of activity."

"Kazmierczak had been on some unspecified medication and stopped taking it, becoming erratic in recent weeks.
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5j1_BXJRnyH0hIIBBI0WNnhBDSpaQ

i know some anti-depressants are harmful to kids/teens and make them suicidal--

this guy was a graduate student enrolled in a social work program--

i want to know what legal, fda approved drug he had been on.

[wuushew]

1. Do the dead have a constitutional right to privacy?

:shrug:

[JanMichael]

3. Not when they take a bunch of unwilling people with them.

it's a valid question; the public has a right to know about the side effects of the medications designed to alleviate depression, etc.

[orleans]

6. not when they murder people.

the public needs to know what the fuck provoked this --
and if it is traceable to some fucking drug (approved or not by the fda--)

[Bill McBlueState]

21. dead people are dead

It's hard to see how a corpse could have any rights. Maybe you act a certain way out of respect for his family, but dead is dead.

[wuushew]

22. No, that too is my opinion

Perhaps it was unclear from the manner in which I raised the issue.

But on the other-hand copyright law bizarrely continues 70 years after the death of the author, so I have basically stopped trying to find consistency in the world.

[Bill McBlueState]

25. that's a good point about copyright law

And that mystical number 70 is only likely to increase, the way things are going.

[BoneDaddy]

31. Sorry, he abdicated his humanity with

such an act as that. How can you possibly even come from such a position.

[BoneDaddy]

32. duplicate

[Bright Eyes]

2. Perhaps a Bi-polar med?

If he stopped taking it, he might have become manic.

[pitohui]

4. that's what popped into my mind immediately EOM

,

[Phx_Dem]

5. or an antipsychotic drug to treat schizophrenia. nt

[orleans]

8. i remember a piece on 60 minutes or 20/20 that was on prozac

years ago. it sounded absolutely wicked when people were trying to get off the shit.

[mntleo2]

50. But, but, but it's not addicting ...

...to me, if you go whacko going off a med it IS addicting or you would not have any such reactions.

Several years ago, when they were prescribing that stuff for practically everything, bad hair, toothache, whatever, they put me on that stuff. I was fine as long as I was on it, except as a poet, all my poetry went away and has never come back, but then my insurance went bye-bye and I had to go off it cold turkey. It was scary because the craziest things seemed SO sensible and sane, and while I did not kill anyone or anything, the anger came out as if I had a volcano in there, ready to explode. That was enough to tell me, I will never take them again. Scared the crap out of me!

So DON'T tell me they aren't addicting, they are. Just because you don't go into a classic drug withdrawal such as what opiates do to you, does not mean people do not get addicted to those things. If it were so not addicting, then why oh why does it do such things to people as what happened to if they have to go off them cold turkey?

Excuse me? Thank-YEW FDA, you people really know how to make things safe ~ especially when you are being bribed errrrr funded by big pharma to say so.



Cat In Seattle

[Warpy]

10. Suddenly stopping an SSRI like Paxil

can make people go completely wild, too. They need to be tapered slowly.

There are a lot of drugs that could have been stopped suddenly. He could have been on anything from SSRIs to bipolar meds to antipsychotics. Any of those would have provoked wild mood swings and huge behavior changes if stopped suddenly.

[Bright Eyes]

14. I'm on an SSRI.

My doc and I are tapering off very slowly for that reason.

Apparently, a Bipolar person misdiagnosed as having depression and suddenly stopping the SSRI can cause a hypomanic (very bad) episode.

At this point, it's pure speculation. It's possible the drug had nothing to do with it. But hypomania seems reasonable.

[Warpy]

17. Hypomania or even mania

I know perfectly reasonable people who skipped a couple of days of their SSRI because they, like all of us with chronic illness, just got sick of taking pills. They were wild, with incredible mood swings, rages, all of it.

As much as you might want to get some drugs out of your head quickly, you need to know it can be dangerous not to taper them slowly.

[wuushew]

19. Is it a conscious decision to stop taking meds?

I mean viewed from the standpoint of "rationality" are the downsides judged to be more than the guilt or fear of harming others?

[Bright Eyes]

27. It's funny you should say that.

I was off my SSRI for about a week because I couldn't afford the prescription. It's possible he didn't want to stop taking the meds, he was forced to

[wuushew]

28. That is a distinct possibility...

We really don't have enough information to have a well informed discussion on this tragedy.

[Warpy]

34. I've found it stems from just being sick of being sick

and what better reminder that you're sick, not NORMAL, than having to take pills every day?

I get a wild hair every once in a while and start tapering my Prednisone. I soon realize it was a bad idea, because no matter how slowly I taper it, I get to a point where I can barely walk.

I go back on the maintenance dose, walk fine, and gain any weight I lost right back again.

[blm]

7. Could be schizophrenia meds. Many can perform highly in educational settings

while on medication.

The problem is that they can also easily tell themselves they are doing so well they no longer have a problem and stop taking their medication.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. Uhh...

Have you considered the possibility it may have been a mental condition the shooter was taking the medication for that lead him to snap? And that he would not have if he had continued his treatment?

[orleans]

39. um--no. well, yes, until heard about him off meds.

? (i like to blame big pharma first, people second)

[Jeffersons Ghost]

11. don't blame the FDA...

There's a wide variety of drugs proscribed to mental patients that radically reduce symptoms associated with particular mental illnesses. When Kazmierczak decided to discontinue medication, he chose to let symptoms (perhaps delusional) return. A temporary insanity plea won't really get him off the hook, even if he is successful in proving himself not guilty with that plea, which is rare. He'll likely spend the rest of his life in a facility for the criminally insane, if found not guilty by reason of insanity. People with mental illnesses are not necessarily stupid ("He was an outstanding student) and they might appear normal ("He was a fairly normal, unstressed person," the police official said.) much of the time.

[orleans]

13. well, he killed himself. there won't be a not guilty plea.

i'm just thinking he was on some sort of crazed anti-depressant that has bizarre side effects during withdrawl

[notadmblnd]

12. You know. I aksed that question last week when the female shooter story

broke and I got flamed about dissing people that suffer from mental illness. What are the meds these people are on/off that is making them do this?

[Cleita]

15. Having recently dealt with a person whom I believe is

bi-polar, the incidents of near violence compared to the moments of calm where the person is pretty normal and agreeable were astounding. Also, the episodes of violence were triggered off by imaginary slights multiplied into huge offenses in the mind of that person. I believe that much of this is a chemical imbalance in the person's brain that can be controlled with drugs. I'm not a person versed in psychiatry or mental illnesses so maybe someone else here might be able to fill in the blanks.

However, if this person stopped taking his medication because he couldn't get his meds for whatever reason, is another thing that points to the failure of our health care system. A lack of affordibility is the reason most people stop taking needed meds. In the case of a mental patient with tendencies to paranoia and violence the results can be tragic.

[emilyg]

16. I had a bi-polar neighbor

She stopped her meds and attacked a neighbor with a knife.

[WinkyDink]

18. SSRI's.

[Blaze Diem]

20. This can happen in adults also.

I am bothered when reports limit this behavior to kids/teens. There is no sudden age cut-off that suddenly changes the effects of anti-depressants and such. They just do not tell us of the adult cases that occur. Anti-depressants in certain people react this way, whether it is overdosage by the dr. or suddenly stopping the meds.
Everytime I hear of a shooter on a rampgage like this, I first wonder what kind of meds he/she was taking, and as in the case of the Omaha Mall shooter, he also stopped taking meds.
But you will never get the Pharma Corp to voluntarily reveal the bizarre side effects or dangers of the trial & error method of prescribing their drugs. Most are intended to alter the chemistry of the brain, and many have limited time as to trial studies. They are approved for use before trials can determine side effects.
I hold this kids dr. and big Pharma accountable in some part for this behavior.
It happens too often to place blame only on the crazed shooter.
There is a recurring thing happening here and many who have issues with the way Pharma tests & markets their goods have been left with little voice.

--------

[El Pinko]

23. Good student=good person?

I am always a bit annoyed when I hear this on the media:

"He was a good student, never would have thought he would do something like this"
"He was a regular middle-class guy, never would have thought he would do something like this"
"He was active in sports, never would have thought he would do something like this"
"He was a churchgoing Christian, never would have thought he would do something like this"


WTF is that about? So people who are less than stellar in school, or of limited means, bad at sports, socially awkward or non-Christian are associated with killing?

I hate that. Christian, well-off, smart (white!) - NONE of those things would make me think a person is less likely to kill, and I sure as hell don't think of all the rest of the world as more likely to kill either.

[kineneb]

26. people do not understand that brilliance and insanity...

can go hand-in-hand. Smart/rich people are considered "eccentric" whereas less intelligent/poor people are considered "lazy" or "crazy". It is a class thing.

I am fairly bright (ok, really bright), but I also suffer from life-long dysthemia and bouts of clinical depression. Intelligence and sanity are products of different brain functions.

[fascisthunter]

29. I Understand What You Mean, However

it let's the public know that you can come from these "background" and still be susceptible to mental illness. In other words, this can happen to anyone regardless of who they are, or what they do in life.

[El Pinko]

52. Then they should say "It's not surprising given his good grades and middle-class background"

Seems like an awful lot of mass killers are middle-class white guys to me anyway...

[kineneb]

24. let's not blame the medications, folks

There are those of us who must take psych meds. If a person, for what ever reason, suddenly stops taking their medication, they can completely unwind. Think going "cold turkey' off of necessary brain chemicals. I have forgotton to take mine occasionally, and by the afternoon, I can tell things are going wrong. Two or three days off and I would probably attempt suicide.

It is not the medications, but the lack of taking them properly that causes the most problems. Sadly, most people outside the psych world do not understand the difference that proper treatment and consistant medication can make.

[Blaze Diem]

30. Beg to differ.

It happened to me. Until I know the whole story as to why he stopped taking the meds and what it was he was prescribed I will be suspicious of some drs. who are too eager to prescribe based on positive promo from the Pharma salesmen. All is true as to stopping meds and repercussions. Maybe the meds themselves made him feel 'un-normal" so he stopped.
It isn't as black & white as one may think when a person is dealing with a change in their brain function.
Clearly this was out of character for the young man. Something happened to cause the sudden violent behavior.
As in the case of the Omaha Mall shooter, he had stopped his meds because he was cut from the State insurance when he truned 19. He worked at McDonalds, and on that simple wage, his meds were most likely more costly than he could afford. Which opens a new topic.
(Can no longer site a link to this reference however.) sorry.

I've heard many times that a person taking anti-depressants (SSRIs specifically), remark that they make them feel disconnected from what they once held dear. Depersonalization, I believe it is called. Their family members say the same thing about the person who was once engaged wholeheartedly in the family.
UK had suicide warnings on antidep labels long before the same pharma maker was mandated to label the same drug sole in the USA.
In my research after a bizarr episode of Zoloft, I found that the Pharma did a 6 week study before presenting to the FDA for approval. Six weeks may be long enough for a patient to say 'yes I feel better', but hardly long enough to monitor side effects such as those some people cannot tolerate, based on their brain chemistry.

Its not all black & white.
Been there also.
---------------------

[kineneb]

35. no, not black & white, but...

Psychopharmacology, and psychiatry, for that matter, are still in their infancy. There is much that is not yet known about brain function and mood disorders. But blame only the medications, without taking the care into consideration is a false argument.

We, as patients, must be willing to communicate honestly with our doctors and therapists. Medications only control symptoms, they do not repair the mind. They cannot do the thinking part of healing. The only way someone with mood disorders can get "better" is to work with the professionals. The sad part of these disorders is the patient often is unable to know what is actually "normal".

I choose to be on my medication; to try to function without them could lead to suicide. My great-grandmother went that route, by drinking a bottle of poison when my grandmother was 4. I do not want to become another statistic. Not feeling everything is far better than feeling so much that I become non-functional.

[Mountainman]

43. I think we make a mistake when we never talk about the successes of SSRI's.

I take anti depressants. My life was hell before. I bothers me when they are given negative press because a lot of people who could be helped never will be. They hear anecdotal information and decide it's better to live with mental illness than to be treated. That was me at one time.

[EFerrari]

33. Exactly. And for that matter, out of control diabetes can cause psychosis.

Things are a lot more complicated than that.

[Blaze Diem]

36. That is true also..had a conversation about

just that two days ago. My friend was talking about his diabetes and his family history. The subject of psychosis related to the disease came up briefly, I was not aware of this related condition and now that you say it also I have to do some further reading on this.
All I know is that there are some powerful drugs being prescribed for similar conditions involving a persons thought process. I know that many can only funtion best when taken as prescribed along with dr. monitoring.
But there is a serious case of over prescribing that goes straight to the Pharma promo dept.

Corp profits in a corp world.
Sad for all involved.

[EFerrari]

41. I don't know that it's over prescribing at all. If anything, most people

who need access to mental health care either don't get it or have to settle for a facsimile.

Big Pharma plays a part. But so does the insurance industry that largely dumps these folks, that won't fund their care. Those are the two titans in the struggle.

Not to mention, the latter day Puritans in our society that are mental health issue deniers.

[Blaze Diem]

51. Mental Health Issue deniers is absolutely correct.. That's true about the

Ins Companies that determine who gets treated & who does not which is of course determined by how it all affects their own profit margin.
Good luck to Hillary or Barack in changing the way these corps do business. I truely mean that. Best of luck & I hope either succeed, because they will be the David up against the Goliath.
Either way, humanity suffers and someone makes millions for it.

Mental health issues needs to lose the oppressing stigma.

[sandnsea]

40. People are pin-pointing the problem

It's very important to try to find a way to correct the problem of so many of these incidents occurring after someone has stopped taking meds. In addition, we need to look at why only young men are committing these shootings. What is happening to young women who stop taking meds? People need to be more aware, that's a good thing.

[SoCalDem]

37. Just hearing a few snippets of this story leads me here

The guy was 27 years old and still in college
He apparently had to drop classes because of work
Those two issues alone could be depressing.

At 27, most people would want to be out of school and into their "adult" lives
Many people these days are buried in debt and perhaps he saw no way out of it.

Did he have medical insurance that paid for the drugs he took? Was he desperate because he could no longer afford them?
If they were drugs for a psychological problem, they can be very expensive. and can cause problems while on them or withrawing from them.

We may never know.

[Blaze Diem]

38. His personal story is beginning to sound like that of many

in the US anymore.

This makes me so sorry fo rthe people who are in a same situation, where alternatives seem absent.

[dysfunctional press]

42. he was working on an advanced degree...

so i don't think that being 27 and in school is that out of the ordinary for that situation.

[SoCalDem]

45. Except for the fact that he probably had crushing school debt

and may have only had part time work..and at 27 he may have felt overwhelmed.. Assuming that he started college at 18, he would have had NINE years in college.. that's a lot of school loans these days

[dysfunctional press]

47. is there anything that said he has student loans?

i didn't read anything about that.

[SoCalDem]

48. Not that I have seen, but I expect to see more come out n/t

[leftchick]

44. "suicidal/homicidal tendencies" on the warnings

many anti-depressants have that in the warning labels. I remember Prozac murders a few years back.

[NMMNG]

46. It could have been any number of things

It may have been a psychotropic med like an antidepressant, antipsychotic, anxiolytic (anti-anxiety) medication. Stopping any of those, particularly after routine use, could cause erratic behavior. Cessation of other meds such as some Alpha-channel or Beta-channel blockers (blood-pressure meds) can even have the same effect. Same goes for certain anti-convulsants (anti-seizure medications) which are also used for bipolar disorder as well. The list goes on and on.

In other words, until they find out for sure it's a guessing game.

[paparush]

49. NRA quickly makes sure THIS is the reason this slaughter happened...

it was the MEDS...not the GUNS...

[BadgerLaw2010]

53. You suddenly stop any psych med and it can causes serious problems.

Doesn't really matter which one it was.