I am so raging mad I could puke...

[PCIntern]

I'm really sorry to do this to the community, but I can't help myself. I trust you guys more than anyone I know...( a sad state of affairs, but what the heck?)

I took my car (Toyota Camry) in for 'routine' 5000 mile service. I had not had a single problem with the car at any time. I had prepaid the oil changes and so I figured that there wouldn't be any other charges, since all was 'included'. The young lady came out and informed me that not only did my tires need rotation for another $25.00 but that my emergency brake needed 'adjustment'. Well, I never ever set my Emergency Brake for a variety of reasons. Ever. I informed them of that fact but to no avail, it was 'required' to keep the warranty in effect. Another 25 bucks. OK, OK...typical dealer crap ya gotta admit that they have to cheat you to make a living, they're just like everyone, or nearly everyone else, in Big Business.

This is not why I'm mad...

24 hours after I checked the car out, the 'low air pressure' light came on while I was driving home from work - I stopped and checked that the right rear tire was about half flat. I added air and drove home. I happen to have an inflater so I topped it off at 32 lbs. and went to bed.

In the AM, the tire pressure was 20 lbs. I walked to the train in 16 degree weather with a mild case of the flu, and called the dealership. Once I told the 'gentleman' what had happened and the time line he became very short with me. "What do you want me to do about it?"

He picked the wrong person: I'm a dentist and I argue with all kinds of people who are trying to take advantage of my good nature and generosity. I told him in no uncertain terms that what he was going to do was to tow my car into the dealership, examine the tire, and repair it...that I don't necessarily believe in coincidences and that his response should have been, "let me take care of that for you and I'm sorry that it happened". He reluctantly agreed, and the car, according to my wife disappeared from the driveway about an hour later.

5 hours later, I called the dealership to find out what the cost was and the different man told me that the tow truck driver couldn't figure out what I was talking about so the car's just been sitting on the lot. I asked the rep what the job description of the tow truck driver was and when he hesitated, I told him that I have a flat tire, and couldn't they just fix a flat? Did they think that I had the car towed as a joke? A slow leak doesn't manifest itself like an exploding car in a James Bond Movie. (This guy had no sensayuma) He said he'd get right back to me. Half an hour later, trapped at work with multiple broken teeth and cleanings to check, I called Mrs. PCIntern who is wonderfully assertive, who went over there and was shown a tire with a 5 inch carpenter's nail exiting near a sidewall. What could she say but 'replace the tire' to the tune of 202 dollars - towing was 'free'. Ha ha.

I left out a whole bunch of details concerning my urgent needs to have the car back for tomorrow, an inability to get to work in a timely fashion on Saturdays due to limited public transportation where I live, etc. They are not relevant to the discussion at this time.

So here's the question: has anyone else heard of any type of scam where tires are compromised during routine service procedures? I just do not believe that it was a coincidence...I just don't. It's way too convenient. Any thoughts? Thanks in Advance,

Your friend in Democracy and Socialized Auto Repair,

PCIntern

[Ishoutandscream2]

1. Find a mechanic you can trust. Never take your car to a dealership

That's the best advice I can give you. I'm sorry they did this to you.

[shadowrider]

19. I've had good luck with dealers

One in particular which I won't name here, but here's the deal

I took my truck, a F150 V8 Triton taken in for a recall on the cruise control. A few months later, the cruise ceased working. I was working in St. Louis and decided to take the truck in for service since I also had a shimmy in the front end when I hit the brakes. The dealer informed me I needed brake pads, new rotors and a replacement for the recall cruise since it went bad. The problem was though, Ford refused to cover a new cruise control part since the recall was over, no matter how much he pleaded with them. He felt so bad the part was defective but Ford wouldn't do anything about it, they replaced the rotors and charged me for the cruise replacement, but did NOT charge me for brake pads or labor to put them on. They never appeared on the invoice. The truck ran like new UNTIL 3-4 weeks later when I made a left hand turn and the truck started to sputter. The get up and go done got up and went. So I called the same dealer who told me to bring it in (this was on a Friday) and they'd TRY to get to it in the afternoon. I took the truck in, checked in with a different service manager who had my truck in and the hood up in 10 minutes. A coil was replaced on my Nr. 5 cylinder (which wasn't cheap) but I was in and out in an hour.

I don't take my truck in for service often since it's extremely reliable, but this dealership, in my opinion, has one of the best, most courteous service departments around.

[Warpy]

22. Exactly. I've avoided taking my car in for its routine

checks (and I'm nowhere near the mileage for the first check thanks to a corneal transplant keeping me from driving much) for fear of being nickled and dimed to death while they threaten the warranty.

In fact, the only thing I ever intend to use is in dire emergency, that free road service.

Dealers are notorious for cheating their customers, but it's not usually as transparent as a nail in the sidewall. That is obvious vandalism. Unless you'd rounded a corner on two wheels, there is absolutely no way you could have picked it up on the way home.

It's time for a letter to the local BBB. Trust me, that gets their attention FAST.

On edit: you can do the complaint to the BBB on your computer. Been there, done that, got really fast action.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

2. My husband worked for dealerships for about ten years

Though they can be shady and crooked, they usually don't pull obvious stunts like this one. You may wish to contact your state Attorney General and see if there have been any consumer complaints lodged against this dealership.

Oh, and BTW--my husband says extended warranties aren't worth getting. No tech likes warranty work (they aren't paid as much as regular work), and if the tech isn't one who takes pride in their work, they can tend to do a less than stellar job.

[Sherman A1]

3. I just bought a Toyota

and would suggest you contact their district office and complain not so much about the nail in the tire, but your level of service. Then I would get road hazard insurance from the tire manufacturer.

[Neecy]

24. I would, too

The radio on the Celica I used to drive went out and was past the warranty period. I took it in to the dealership, they replaced it for free (shocking), and about two weeks later I got a call from Toyota regional asking if I was happy with the dealership's service. I almost fell over. They DO care and I would certainly contact them. I've driven a lot of different cars and Toyota service was far and away the best.

[Common Sense Party]

4. I think you drove over a nail.

Just my $0.02

[PCIntern]

8. This is why I'm so angry...

I agree with you 49%...the other 51% is very suspicious. Sort of like the Bush Administration...if you concede the recount, then everything else follows and it certainly did.

If You're right, then it is what it is. But then again....

[Andy823]

16. I bought a Kia van about 6 years back

I found out after I bought it, from another Kia owner, that you had to take them back to the Kia dealer every so many miles and have them do "service" work on them, at a good price I might add, or the warranty was void! I was not really satisfied with the van, and traded it off a year later, before it cost me much. It seemed like every time you took it it for scheduled maintance, it cost almost twice as much as the last time!

I have since found a good local dealer that is really good about taking care of problems, and never charge for things they don't call me about first. I also think you simply ran over a nail, last year I had 3 flats in two weeks on different vehicles, but the tire rotation and emergency brake adjustment sound like a scam to me.

[Flabbergasted]

5. Sorry about your troubles...

I'm just wondering if you've considered the possibility of a coincidence?

You're probably not in the mood for that question. Sorry.

[rzemanfl]

6. The flat was a coincidence. The emergency brake was a scam

the charge for rotating tires is outrageous as is the price of the tire. Dealers will cheat you every time.

[wtmusic]

7. You never know for sure.

I have always gotten service from dealers until recently, when I've been socked with huge bills. Now I go to a local guy, who I trust. I think.

There is really nothing you can do about it except try somewhere else, and have yourself a stiff drink in the meantime.

Good luck.

[PCIntern]

10. I did...

Vodka Gimlet with a fresh lime....

But my head still hurts!!!

[wtmusic]

12. Repeat as necessary.

:toast:

[PCIntern]

14. THANKS...

:evilfrown: :evilgrin: :hippie: :party: :toast: :bounce: :mad: :puke: :eyes: :smoke: :think: :crazy: :silly: :wtf: :argh: :freak: :dunce: :hangover: :nopity: :hurts: :boring: :spank: :wow: :beer: :grr: :nuke: :scared: :thumbsdown: :thumbsup: :hi: :dem: :kick: :shrug: :puffpiece: :loveya: :donut: :tinfoilhat: :hug: :grouphug: :cry: :pals: :headbang: :yourock: :banghead: :dilemma: :blush: :rant: :sarcasm: :woohoo: :applause: :hide: :popcorn: :rofl: :spr:evilfrown: :evilgrin: :hippie: :party: :toast: :bounce: :mad: :puke: :eyes: :smoke: :think: :crazy: :silly: :wtf: :argh: :freak: :dunce: :hangover: :nopity: :hurts: :boring: :spank: :wow: :beer: :grr: :nuke: :scared: :thumbsdown: :thumbsup: :hi: :dem: :kick: :shrug: :puffpiece: :loveya: :donut: :tinfoilhat: :hug: :grouphug: :cry: :pals: :headbang: :yourock: :banghead: :dilemma: :blush: :rant: :sarcasm: :woohoo: :applause: :hide: :popcorn: :rofl: :spray: :patriot: :yoiks:ay: :patriot: :yoiks:

[tularetom]

9. That's a slimey dealer - they aren't all that way

I have a 2005 Toyota Tundra pickup. I bought it 3 years ago brand new from our local Toyota dealer and have taken it back there or each of it's 5000 mile service visits. Everything has been on the up and up and they have actually done a few extras for me. I think they have rotated the tires at least once at no extra charge.

Of course it helps that I'm retired and have the time to sit there and wait for them to finish the service. I'd have to say that their service department is better than any other dealer I've done business with.

Is there another dealer nearby? I wouldn't go back to that place.

[DaveJ]

11. A towing company slashed our tire once

When they brought the car back there was clearly a knife stab on the inner side of the tire. I guess that's how they handle people who are not polite enough to them. Total slime.

Normally, I would not expect a dealership to do this, but based on what else you said about them, I'm not that surprised.

I also had trouble with a Toyota shop and repairs. They refused to replace a simple cheap little piece of plastic that came off the windsheild wiper hinge under the warranty. It apparently just wasn't worth their time. Same uncaring rude gruff attitude. Eventually I complained and the manager agreed to do it.

Have you talked to the actual manager for compensation? If that doesn't work talk to his boss, and so on....

[PCIntern]

13. Yes...the service manager was engaged by Mrs. PCIntern

and he was instrumental in the 'closure' of the 'situation'. The Mrs. was appropriately pissed off and questioning and just hung around the desk until they ascertained that the tow truck driver hadn't diagnosed the problem correctly.

[DaveJ]

23. I don't believe in coincidences either

Given we've both had bad experiences, I wondered whether Toyota service is generally bad. So I looked it up.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings/service-ratings

Toyota gets 3 out of 5 stars, not horrible but not very good either. We have a Pontiac and at least we have 4 stars.

My gut feeling is that half the Toyota shops are great, and half are horrible, and as a result have an average rating.

Personally, I'd just stop buying Toyota from now on, or until they bring up their score.

[taterguy]

15. Oh great, just what the world needs. A dentist that's pissed off.

Glad I'm not your patient.

:hi:

[PCIntern]

17. Yeah..I was so mad that I used a denture acrylic bur

to excavate a tooth.

Ouch!

[backscatter712]

33. Let's start with the wisdom tooth.

Just sit down in the chair, and we'll RIP that tooth right out of there.

We're gonna have to use the drill.

Oh, the drill's rusty?

It's an antique.

They don't make 'em like they used to.

Sturdy, heavy, dull...

I'm gonna want some gas for this one.

Oh, the gas isn't for you, it's for me. You see, I find that a little GIGGLE gas makes an extraction much more pleasurable.

I'm gonna have to use my special gas mask...

[IowaGirl]

18. I am so sympathetic......

I don't believe in coincidences either. I took my volvo in on a recall at the dealer. After I got it back, the cruise control wouldn't work consistently for the first time ever. I had had no problem prior to that recall visit which was supposed to be just some sort of computer adjustment. I called the dealer and they said nothing they did would have affected the cruise control--must be just "coincidence." So I just struggled along with the goofy cruise control but shortly after that I started noticing a bumping noise. I was having somebody else change my oil and they said that they thought a strut was broken but it was okay to drive. Subsequently, I took the car back to the dealer to get this strut fixed and, low and behold, after that the cruise control worked again. Now I can't help but wonder if somehow they managed to do something to break the strut when I had it there before. I, too, just don't believe in coincidences. I totally believe in scams during routine service procedures but the tire one is new to me. Have you done a search on "routine service scams" or "tire scams" or "auto garage scams?"

[Hepburn]

20. Toyotas are great cars...but get a Honda!

If you want a Japanese car. I used to drive NOTHING but Cadillacs or Lincolns....until I got my first Honda. I have lived in various places in Southern Calif and one reason that I have stuck with Honda is not only are they are great car, but the service departments in any Honda dealership I have used is absolutely great. I have NEVER had anything like that happen like they did to you.

Here is an example of why I like Honda and Honda service: I took my car to the dealer for regular service. They happened to spray water on my car and get it spotted...they offered to COMPLETELY detail my car for their mistake ~~ not just have it washed. My car is a 2001 CRV and this just happened. It is not like this is some brand new car still under warranty...or that I am some fancy, rich customer.

I am tell ya, I SWEAR by Honda!

[DesertFlower]

26. we had a 1980 honda prelude

which was stolen.:(

we've owned 6 toyotas. great cars. i was really nervous when i bought my mazda miata, but i really wanted that little car. i have it more than 3 years. so far -- so good.

[Journeyman]

29. The transmission on our Honda Odyssey went out less than 2000 miles over warranty. . .

but because we'd used the dealer for all our service, they put a new transmission in for no cost -- and we had over 100,000 miles on the vehicle!

And contrary to what I originally thought, service from the dealership hasn't been any more expensive than it would be at any other reputable auto repair.

My first Honda, a 1989 Civic, lasted 16 years, had over 150,000 miles, and had given me no untoward problems the entire time I had it. I sold it in good conscience and with complete disclosure to a guy who needed cheap transportation, and he's been very pleased with it since. Since I purchased that vehicle, everyone in my family has purchased nothing but Hondas.

[DesertFlower]

21. i take my cars to

"Jiffy Lube". their computer prints out what service the manufacturer suggests you have according to the mileage.

i have a mazda miata. i did take it to the dealer for the first 2 oil changes. they were good, fast and priced right. the problem is i have to make an appointment. with jiffy lube i can just drive up and if they're busy come back another time.

hubby has a new porsche. now that he will take to the dealership.

sorry you had such a miserable experience.

:hi:

[PCIntern]

25. THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING THE HETEROGENEOUS,

great, multi-experiential group which we are..I am truly appreciative of the responses so far...at least I've calmed down a bit...B.P. was getting high...

[Junkdrawer]

27. My wife's 15K car "required" 4 new tires to pass Pennsylvania inspection...

That, and the 15K service, set me back a cool grand...

I guess car sales are slow...

[blues90]

28. The nail could be coincidence , the parking brake is

I worked at dealerships for 33 years , usually if when they deliver a car to the customer someone should check it over . The nail who knows how that happened .

Brake linings wear and are the parking brake , whether you use it or not it all has to do with brake wear .

Dealerships have all sorts of extras they try to sell you . If they checked your brakes during this service the wheels are off so they should have included the rotation in the cost .

If you have a warrenty maintainence plan see what is included at the mileage intervals . If the rotation is included then they own you $25 .

There are service writers who know what they are doing and many who don't . They all get paid a commission based on labor and parts that they sell . Some only pay the writer off labor .

The entire auto dealership repair field has gotten cheap with pay . I worked 12 hour days and sat 8 hours and an oil change paid me $1:50 for all the paper work this is what I got .

It does not matter how good you are at your job other than scores on warrenty repairs , this is where you are judged and your pay % can change from one customers complaint , it's not easy work and people are calling all day .

I did my job and gained many new customers for this and I was laid off and they kept the lazy crook writer .

[PCIntern]

30. Interesting...

thanks.

[blues90]

35. No problem , I hope it helps some

[RedCappedBandit]

31. I never take my car to the dealership.

Firstly, I usually do the work myself anyway. However, if there are circumstances which cause me to be unable to do whatever is required, I always bring my car to a trustworthy mechanic who APPRECIATES my business.

[lonestarnot]

32. Here maybe this will cheer you.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080228/ts_afp/irelandbritainhealthoffbeat

[PCIntern]

34. Boy that is weird...

thanks!

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

36. Dealers are always sketchy

They size you up to see what they think they can get out of you, then angle for it. I took my car in for a routine brake job and once they get the car up there they tell me I need new rotars because the old ones don't smooth properly and could vibrate when I brake. I flat out tell them I don't have the money for any more work, that they've already maxed out my credit card with the current work being done. Of course after they tell me it's not a safety issue and probably won't be a big problem.

Usually, however, their scamming is just about charging more than the average place. I've never heard of sabatoge as a way of getting you back in although I guess it can happen.

[pansypoo53219]

37. why i liked old used.

my low miles 72/73's olds in the late 80's-90's served me well.

[Skittles]

38. we will see more and more of this kind of thing, PC

the less money people spend, the more they try to squeeze it out of you - in some ways that are not legal