Seriously now. Why do Republicans STILL have a chance in 2008?

[HughBeaumont]

Just in case anyone needs to be reminded of the oh-so-awesome job Republicretins have done in 20 years of their time in office since 1980:

* Worst terrorist attack on American soil, arguably with the Bewsh Administration's foreknowledge.
* Two failed wars that have cost 4000 American lives and over 800,000 Iraqi lives (which McClown voted for).
* Business allies with totalitarian nations and sheikdoms with human rights abuse records a mile long.
* S&L scandal (which McClown was part of), among many . . MANY others.
* 70% of the current National Debt tallied under a Bewsh or a Reagan.
* Trade Deficit at record levels.
* A joke of a Gulf War I, which we started and gave the green light to, contrary to popular belief.
* Iran/Contra.
* Funding Saddam Hussein and Osama Bin Laden's terrorist organizations.
* The permanent installation of Supply Side Economics, a substantial disaster for anyone making less than $300,000 a year.
* The most dismal job creation records since the Great Depression.
* Intentional kneecapping of almost all social programs while increasing the Pentasewer's chunk to 51% of the Discretionary budget.
* Multiple Recessions (two in this administration alone, although no one in the media or government wants to admit it).
* Gladhanding of the wealthy and the corporations they run at the expense of everything else.
* Socialism of loss, privatization of profits.
* The shift of risk, via economic policy, from corporations to the workers.
* Out-of-control corporate welfare.
* Weakest dollar value since the 70s.
* Lowest approval numbers for any sitting president.
* Two election scandals, mostly swept under the rug and brushed off as "sour grapes by loony left conspiracy theorists". :eyes:
* Bailouts of banks while giving the middle finger to Universal Health Care.

It's been proven time and time again that under Republican administrations as compared to Democratic ones:

* stock market returns are worse.
* personal spending goes down while wages in real dollars remain stagnant.
* the national debt rises substantially.
* more country-damaging scandal and illegal activity occurs.
* damaging and tax-wasting invasions so the Pentasewer and their cronies can get rich off of Joe Sixpack at the price of his soldier son.
* more religious right empowerment happens.
* more fear-induced governing occurs (terr' alerts, anyone?).
* income disparity grows.

So again, WHY is this election still in danger of being close?

How exactly is America still accepting of Bewsh policy continued via Cotton Hill McClown?

Is the American voting public in 2008 still acting as the abused in ardent defense of their abusers, or do they really just not GIVE a shit about their futures or their kids?

REPUBLICANS.
Here's Hoping People NEVER Come to their Senses.
Otherwise, We'd Be In Deep Shit.

[Ordr]

1. Because it's April and the Democrats are STILL too busy devouring one another.

[zbdent]

8. I agree with Ordr ...

we're not trying to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory ... we've pumped its stomach and flushed out its colon trying to rescue defeat, with this infighting ...

[gratuitous]

2. They don't, really

But it's in the financial interest of some very powerful folks to pretend like they do for the next six months. Unfortunately, they just happen to run the major media outlets in the country, so we have to listen to their extended bloviations trying to persuade us that John McCain has a snowball's chance in hell of winning the presidency.

[underpants]

10. No they don't.

The MSM inside the beltway crowd completely had no idea that the 2006 election was coming at them and they stopped mentioning how corruption (basically their corruption) lead to the most dramatic election results possibly ever by Friday of that election week and I don't think they are either aware or giving any airtime to what is coming their way in November. I think the public finally has an alternative source of information and to an extent that the establishment has failed to examine.

[Trajan]

3. They still have a chance ...

Because Democrats have expressed NO vision, NO future ... NO pathway ....

You don't hear Democrats talking about what they believe in ... You don't hear them expressing a grand vision of what this country should be, what we should do, and what citizens should expect from the government of a mighty nation ....

Other than Obama, there are no great Democratic Orators out there .... Very few indeed ....

Another problem: Blaming the whole debacle since 2001 on Bush (or even on Bill Clinton as some overanxious Hillary Haters are prone to do): It isnt just Bush, but the ENTIRE CONSERVATIVE PHILOSOPHY that is defective, anomalous, and has resulted in our now broken country ...

1) Lack of expressed vision ... 2) Failure to couple the GOP to current problems by letting Bush take all the blame ...

[HughBeaumont]

11. That's why I included 1980 on.

And that's merely a surface scratching.

It's not just Bewsh. Bewsh just spread the cancer that Reagone and 41 started. Right-leaning backstabbing Dems (again, not just the Clintons) had a hand in it as well. Many of the ones we laud have questionable votes saddled on their records.

In conservative policy, there ARE no good guys.

[Xenotime]

45. I find your comments all BS

We will end the war, bring home troops, provide healthcare for all americans. Restoration of the US in the world's eyes is a very real vision for the future. What more do you want?

[mucifer]

4. The press likes to cover mccain the maverick and then has racist

anti-Rev Wright loops. Check out the international press and how they handle what goes on in this country as opposed to our press that like to cover pretty missing white young women and brittney spears 24/7. It's like brainwashing.

[whatchamacallit]

5. If they have any chance at all it's because

Americans tend to be an emotional, superstitious, lot, with very short memories. They oversimplify everything, and are covered head to toe, with huge red buttons. Republicans know this well and will do whatever it takes to keep the flock in the pen.

[leftofthedial]

6. Most Murkans are as dumb as rocks

[Ordr]

20. Blaming America in general is a cop-out.

I mean no offense to you but the Democratic party has failed spectacularly in the last 8 years. They can't even calm the egos in their own party. All the "dumb" Americans see is constant bickering, in-fighting, and duplicitousness coming from the Democrats. As ridiculous as the "Republican" foreign and domestic policies are, they're at least being touted and supported by a rock solid (compared to Hillary and Obama at this point in time) candidate who is getting backed by his party! Is that too fucking much to ask of the Democrats?

[leftofthedial]

46. "democrats" are miserable fucking failures AND

they also are Murkans and as ignorant and dumb as most of the rest of them.

[AdHocSolver]

38. More accurately, most Americans live in a fantasy world, are easily bamboozled, & ignore the facts.

The evidence:

The huge number of people who put thousands of dollars on their credit cards at usurious interest rates in order to buy a bunch of overpriced crap, and register surprise and disbelief when they have problems paying off the debt.

People who buy more house than they can afford because a bank gives them a three year adjustable rate mortgage at an artificially low interest rate that is expected to go up substantially, even though they have little savings to tide them over should they run into financial problems.

People who spend thousands of dollars on a large screen plasma TV so that they can watch American Idol in high definition.

People who still believe that Republicans are fiscally conservative even after the Republicans ran up the national debt into the stratosphere with huge spending programs (mostly for war and the military) and tax cuts for the wealthiest people who need it the least.

People who haven't a clue about how the economy works. They still have faith in the "trickle down" theory, "free trade", artificially maintained "low interest rates", that outsourcing is "good" because it makes the products that we buy "cheaper" (which is not true).

Even 75 percent of the people here on DU buy into this Republican drivel. It is true that Democrats have doubts about these Republican talking points, but they still accept these concepts as valid, even though these buzzwords are merely Pavlovian signals to stop an individual's thought processes and have no basis in reality.

How do I know that this is the case? Occasionally a poster will explain an economic principle in a way that should be understandable to anyone with a high school education. It is a sure bet that if a post accurately describes a fact or concept being discussed in the thread, then it will automatically be ignored. The rest of the thread will contain reponses to the topic that assume the correctness of the Republican talking points, even though those talking points are total nonsense.

In other words, Americans have a predilection for holding on to misinformation, error, and fantasy rather than searching for and finding out the facts. There is an abject terror in admitting a mistake, and an aversion to correcting a bad course of action. Even when presented with explanations and facts that illuminate a discussion, most people prefer to cling to their fantasies, rather than adjust their perceptions or correct their misperceptions.

One example is the Democrats in Congress refusing to keep pushing for a cut off in funding for the Iraq war. The Republicans charge that they would be "undercutting the troops". This is hogwash. A properly worded law would provide for the troops while removing funding, for example, for new contracts for Blackwater.

While leftofthedial's post is a bit simplistic, there is considerable accuracy in what he implies. The Republicans can't continue to keep bamboozling the people over and over again with the same tricks and lies, unless the suckers are complicit in the scam.

[leftofthedial]

47. dumb as rocks

stop any random 100 Murkans at the mall or the grocery store or wherever the masses congregate. Ask them three random questions about the world or current events--any three, just make them up. 100 people, three questions each. I bet out of 300 total questions you don't get ten correct answers.

[madokie]

7. Because the talking heads on the airwaves and the editors of our printed news

keep telling us they are, hoping some of it sticks. This will be the biggest blowout America has ever seen, maybe even in any country ever. I am ready like so many others, for a change and not just a change like putting a Woman in the whitehouse or a Black man, I want change. I'm not voting for Obama because he is a black person I am voting for him because he gives me some hope that things can be different, must be different and will be different from the status quo as either of the two other candidates would surely be. I am ready for a change, a big change in how business is done in washington. Obama best exemplifies my vision of what the world we live in should be like. This is going to be a year when people turn out in droves to vote for the party of change, of vision as the Democratic party is.

[AlinPA]

9. Because 'Murcans issues are God, Guns, Gays and Flags. (and more Flags)

[SammyWinstonJack]

15. !!!

:thumbsup:

[SpiralHawk]

12. "We know. Smirk." - Republicon Corporate Media Propaganda Borg

[screembloodymurder]

13. Because they own M$M and they're using it.

Propaganda is an insidious form of manipulation. This republican administration is adept at exploiting people's fears and prejudices. MSM reinforces what people are already prone to think or feel and thus provides justification for bigotry. We are facing individuals who have been conditioned to accept misinformation as truth. They will not listen to reason.

[AlinPA]

27. Just as a small example: today at the gym "The View" was on and they were

yammering over and over about Wright. They won't quit. Barbara Walters brought it up, and it went on for what seemed 20 minutes.

[elocs]

14. How did the Republicans win in 2000?

First, let's dispense with the "we was robbed" mindset. I think we were, but in 2004 Democrats were very aware that the Republicans would pick our pockets and it still happened. The "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me", adage applies. But in 2000 the election should never have been close enough to steal. We had a respected standing Vice President in economic good times and we were not at war under a President who was still quite popular. Bush was what? A two term governor who was, overall, a failed businessman, was not intelligent and managed to keep from serving in Vietnam and he had no foreign policy experience at all.

How can Democrats lose in 2008? Just like all it takes for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing, all it takes for Democrats to lose this year is for good Democrats to do nothing--to refuse to back our nominee because their choice did not win. They will be complicit in the evil that follows under a President McCain and although they will have blood on their hands and butter will not melt in their mouths as they proclaim their innocence saying, "We, we had nothing to do with the Democrat losing. No, not us." Meanwhile, more soldiers will be sent to fruitlessly throw away their lives and thousands of innocent civilians will lose their lives. Here at home, new Supreme Court justices who serve for life will continue to curtail and whittle away our rights and freedoms.

This is the year that Democrats should crush the Republicans to the point where that party will become so marginalized that a new opposition party could arise. If we fail to do this, then it is true: "We have met the enemy and he is us".

[HughBeaumont]

17. Good post.

I still contend that more than a great deal of Bewsh votes in 2000 were not FOR Bewsh, so much as they were against anything associated with the Clinton administration. That was one of Gore's many bad campaigning strategies - he tried to distance himself from Clinton rather than run off of the positive attributes of his administration, which there were more than a few. Plus Gore's choice of Lieberman as a VP really didn't help him at all.

I just figured people would have learned by now, but these poll numbers of either candidate against McClown are discouraging. Some have him winning, some have him losing, but not by much. I only hope when this nomination is finally decided, people will come to their senses. Unfortunately, I've been burned too many times to hold any optimism with American judgement of character.

[Burma Jones]

16. A Number of "Reasons"

McCain is not Bush and is being presented as closer to the "center" than Democrats. I'm pretty sure "not Bush" is sufficient for a lot of voters.

200+ years of White Protestant (with the JFK exception) Males serving as Head of State.

Many people think their vote will make no difference

Some vocal Democrats thinking 'Merkins are stupid - those so-called stupid 'Merkins exact revenge on the snobs every four years - do not underestimate this force for the Republicans, it's their most potent weapon.

Democrats often fail to understand the Presidency as Head of State - we elect someone that will dominate the news, it has to be someone that people want to see. Mondale, Dukakis and Kerry were very poor candidates for "Face and voice you always want to be seeing." I know it's disgustingly like American Idol - but it's crucial to electing a President. Bill Clinton had great appeal, certainly more than Bob Dole and Bush I - but it took Perot to beat Bush I. Obama scores very well in this area.....


I think that we will gain more seats in Congress - perhaps a helluva lot, but I am apprehensive about The Presidency.

[Wednesdays]

18. Two words:

Fox News.

[siligut]

19. Electoral fraud? nt

[Echo In Light]

21. I rarely ever bother with mainline media, but stopped on MSNBC the other day...

While their pundits were discussing the recent Gallop, with McCain apparently leading both dem candidates ... which, to be perfectly honest, I have zero trust in our elections to begin with, and polls are usually devices to coerce the public mind. However...

[brandon47]

22. Its simple

despite feelings about Bush administration, the american people respect john mccain.

[HughBeaumont]

25. Who embraces everything about Bewsh. And Bewsh himself.

Keep Kissing, Maverick!

[mmonk]

23. We live in a closed society drowning in propaganda.

[AlinPA]

26. The TV is your evidence. They will decide who wins the election. Perhaps any

election, anywhere.

[BlooInBloo]

24. Because the American public is mean, stupid, and bigoted.

[dysfunctional press]

28. they have at least as good a chance as they had in 2004.

how'd that turn out...:shrug:

[BreweryYardRat]

29. Because Republicans control 9/10ths of the media.

They might as well just put up giant loudspeakers spewing propaganda. Wouldn't be much difference.

[spanone]

30. they don't. if you look at the #'s of dems voting to rethugs, it ain't even close

[Firespirit]

31. Because people are stupid and short-sighted

It's really that simple.

(You left off "the deadliest natural disaster on U.S. soil since 1928.")

[Juche]

32. Lack of attention

I remember when I was 16 and couldn't vote, it was after the 1996 elections. I remember Bob Dole was doing some TV appearances and coming across as personable. I thought 'he seems like a nice guy, I'd vote for him'. Fact is I didn't know anything about his policies compared to Clinton. I sometimes forget that huge swaths of the electorate have never really gotten beyond that stage I was in as a teenager of voting based on party ID, superficial personality impressions or other largely irrelavant characteristics. The reality is most people don't pay nearly as much attention to politics as people on DU do.

That isn't to say all the Rs should become Ds, but if they were paying attention they'd realize something has gone horribly wrong with the R party. Most of the Rs I've met and debated with didn't really know what the R party was doing or stood for. All they had were talking points (tax cuts for the middle class, strong national defense, upholding personal freedom) all of which were totally false and can be proven as such.

Here is an extremely easy political quiz, and the average score is only 7/12.

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/601/political-knowledge-update

The point is that most people really don't care or pay attention as much as we do, and probably don't know what has been going on. If they really knew McCain helped filibuster an attempt to cut troop rotation, or that he opposed 7 billion for SCHIP but is ok with 3+ trillion for war their opinions may be different.

[Iggo]

33. Two reasons.

Obama and Clinton.

If we ever get this primary bullshit overwith, we can start rtunning a candidate for president. 'Til then, McOldman only has to play nice to creep up in the polls.

[warren pease]

34. Your own OP is an allegory for the problem and contains the answer...

In brief, you expect a level of awareness and engagement on the part of the electorate that I don't think is there, given pop culture poisoning and mass media manipulation. Like this:

- You expect voters to choose based on reason and logic, when the way to America's heart (and what's left of its mind) is through advertising and PR.

- The points you raise are tightly linked and the results of a failed ideology, but recognizing those links requires an understanding of context and background. However, most Americans get their news from the TV, where no context or background is ever provided. Instead, TV covers (using the term loosely) news as a chronological stream of isolated, unconnected events. So when you write "Income disparity grows" and "Out of control corporate welfare," consumers of and believers in the mass media critique of current events won't connect the two unless it's spelled out for them -- which it never, ever will be by US mass media because they're mainly concerned with protecting their advertising revenue by not pissing off the sponsors. Dissemination of accurate, timely, verifiable information to their audience is the absolute last thing they give a damn about.

- Understanding and appreciating your critique requires an attention span much longer than 15 seconds, whereas that's the usual length of a political ad today. Media buyers for leading candidates have enough money to buy an entire minute if that's what worked. They don't because Americans are seemingly afflicted with a kind of culturally imposed attention deficit disorder and, if they don't get the point in a quarter of a minute, they're not going to get it at all.

In fact, they'll probably use the remote at about 17 seconds and all that extra money for a minute-long ad will be wasted. Not that I necessarily blame them for switching channels; these ads are so horrible and insulting that I'd rather be torn apart by feral pigs than have to watch them.

- Americans' aren't real big on history -- and history here means everything from last week on back. Because they've been taught history the same way TV news present events -- a bunch of names and dates with no context and boring as all hell -- most seem to relate to history with some mix of complete ignorance, apathy, avoidance or hostility.

- The last thing that immediately comes to mind is the willingness to seek out non-US sources of information, contrast that with the drivel spewed by US mass media and make choices about accuracy, quality of reporting, factual nature of the content and so forth. As it is now, anyone who watches CNN an hour a day and thinks they're up to speed on current events is delusional, and dangerously so if you consider the consequences of adopting the CNN world view as the guiding principles governing, for example, their voting choices.

And that's how we get back to McCain. Too many forces pulling people away from reality and toward some idiotic fairy tale where McCain's a man of principle, a straight shooter, a truth-teller, a man of the people and the one man in all 300 million Americans who can turn this economy around, deal with the trade imbalance, "win" in Iraq, bring Iran to its knees, put the Chinese and Russians back in their places, conquer the dangerous populists in Latin America and reinstate some proper CIA-sponsored dictatorships, keep Americans safe from the perils of Canadian-style health care... all this and he's going to cure male pattern baldness and the common cold.

Oh, did I mention corporate voting machines and voter suppression? If none of the above works, a little of the customary GOP slime and filth will suffice. If Americans are just going to sit back and let the GOP steal what's left of democracy right out from under their noses -- twice for president, at least once more in 2006 that didn't quite work out -- then why shouldn't the GOP take advantage of this historic and unprecedented passivity?

Americans have become so damn good at letting thugs steal their stuff that it's become routine and acceptable. The GOP may be inhuman demonspawn, but they're not brain dead. They know an opportunity when they see it, and how to take advantage of it.


wp

[HughBeaumont]

48. You would have to cherry-pick . . .

The laundry list above is a mere surface scratching, as you and I well know. And as you said above, the average American news viewer is no more willing to sit through something they can't grasp in 30 seconds than they would going to get their teeth cleaned. But Americans, since reading isn't stressed in our schools anymore, can grasp things in factoids, unfortunate as that is.

I think the best strategy to get this kind of a message out there would be to take at least half of the points from that list and put them in a 30 second ad that matters. Modern political ads are shoddily made, which is confusing because most internet people (Eric from Bushflash comes to mind) who don't do such a thing for a living can make brilliant and informative pieces in under a minute's time.

Another problem is, how would you get the millions that still tune into network "News" to view it? Where would the money come from?

In the meantime, I think the end piece would make a great bumper sticker, if anything.

Great post, as usual.

[warren pease]

51. Use what works and modify it to suit the situation...

And here I'm thinking of the hideous Swiftboat Veterans for Truth, ironically devoted to spreading both the big lie and a thousand little ones. No matter what else you can say about them -- and I can think of plenty -- they were highly successful at poisoning the political atmosphere and changing the whole story of the campaign. What had been a referendum on Bush/Cheney's fascistic agenda and war/fear-mongering became a campaign in which their opponent was redefined as a coward, a liar, a traitor, an opportunist and a disgrace to the uniform.

It was truly a genius move and it filled so many needs at once, and at minimal expense. Not that the RNC et al have a poverty problem, but still... The Swiftboaters gave mass media a pre-packaged counter-narrative to bash Kerry with while appearing to report objective news sourced from a reputable third party. It took the heat off Bush/Cheney for presiding over an administration that a majority of Americans finally realized was a flaming disaster for all but the richest of the rich.

And worst of all, it created a rationale for claiming that the race was tightening up so that when the RNC/GOP stole another one, they didn't have to deal with a double-digit percentage differential, which would have been tough enough to hide that even the narcotized, complicit US mass media would have had to work diligently to get people to buy the lie.

So those kinds of allegedly independent groups, claiming to be driven by the cries of their consciences demanding they speak the truth, can be very useful -- which virtually guarantees the Dems won't think of it. But the Dems really need their own 527 sound machine putting up the money for a series of 15-second TV spots tying McCain to Bush/Cheney and making sure viewers understand voting for McCain is as bad or worse than voting for Bush/Cheney a third time.

Since I know literally nothing about TV or political ads or buying time or anything else remotely useful for this discussion. Therefore, I'll be the director and I'm thinking of an ad that would look something like this:

Against a backdrop of this disgusting Bush-McCain hug



About 8 or 10 of the bullet points in the OP (or something comparable) shoot out at the viewer, almost like a 3-D effect where the text starts as just a small colored block in the middle of the screen and blasts out directly at the viewer, fills the screen horizontally and then remains on screen for a couple of seconds -- or whatever the ad agency says is the ideal duration.

Then the words either dissolve, disappear or fade back to a small rectangular bar in the middle of the screen, where the next bullet point emerges from and repeats the above.

Since as I say I know nothing about any of this, I may well be completely full of shit as to the scenario above. Or maybe it's a great idea. That's up to others. We distort; you decide.

And thanks for putting things in the context of video and political ads, Hugh, which I obviously don't do very much.


wp

[walldude]

35. Wow.. good OP and good replies.. K&R

I believe that the Republicans really don't stand a chance though. There is mention in the thread of Murikans being well.. stupid, and that is true to an extent, it's also true that they have a short attention span. Sure many people are much more involved these days but the average American is too busy to deal with politics. But what they are not too busy to do is look at gas and food prices, rising interest rates, the collapsing economy, and outrageous health care costs. There is no end in sight to the economic woes we are facing and if there is one thing I have learned over the years and especially in 2004, Americans don't vote values or ideology they vote with their pocketbooks. Unless some miracle comes along and bails out the economy in 6 months, the Republicans are done. We may even end up with a veto proof majority.

[annabanana]

36. Because the press Lo-o-o-oves BBQ. . . . . n/t

[Tyler Durden]

37. Our Fabulous talent for snatching Defeat from the jaws of Victory.

We have the election in the BAG, and who do we start ripping ourselves apart over?

The two most controversial candidates in 30 years or more.

I swear, if we had just DRAFTED Al Gore, I mean INSISTED he take it, the Republicans would be saying "...who cares WHO we nominate?" at this point.

JESUS November is going to SUCK.

[OnionPatch]

39. The media. No doubt.

The modern day GOP has nearly completed their takeover of the media.

[Fireweed247]

40. this is true...

But our Dems need to use every possible means to get the truth out there. They can hold press conferences, they can speak the whole truth when given the opportunity on Meet the Press and such. They are the MAJORITY PARTY and should be making news with what they are doing in Congress.

When John Kerry ran against Bush, he should have used the media spotlight to highlight all of Bush's lies. He should have exposed what a lying corrupt SOB Bush is, but Kerry went easy on him, and we see far too much of that.

[Greyhound]

41. Because the Democratic Party has ensured it.

Through utter cowardice and their own greed, they keep the illusion of a "two party system" going.

Wake up. There is only one party and only one ruling class and they will/have indenture you and your children. It is the Global Central Banking System that is the real enemy. As long as we allow it to exist in this nation and support it around the world, we doom ourselves to inevitable servitude.

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." - Thomas Jefferson

They understood it then and tried to keep us out of it. We can still reject it, but the time is growing desperately short.

[nadinbrzezinski]

42. Because of the virtual civil war in the democratic party

and this is the best example of... it shouldn't happen, but lord we are good at wresting defeat from the jaws of victory

[Canuckistanian]

43. Because Democrats are FAMOUS

...for snatching.... well, you know the rest

[Echo In Light]

49. By always attempting to appease rightist ideals/propaganda with cowardly moderates

The vested corporate interests that run the show will never promote anyone who challenges their status quo.

[RB TexLa]

44. Of course, you have to look at the amount of ignorant we have here, people who's only question is

"what's on da tee vee tonight?"

[AP]

50. Because Bush isn't running and, as a consequence of 2000, a lot of people have perception that McC

is the opposite of Bush.