Another (lack of ) health care horror story

[proud2BlibKansan]

My best friend took in a roommate about 10 years ago, to help her pay her mortgage. He is a really nice guy. He was a mail carrier and then was injured in a car wreck so he had to quit working for the post office. He went back to school and went into IT. And for about 10 or 15 years, he had a good job. Then a couple years after he moved in with her, he got laid off. Right after that he got cancer. I forget what kind of cancer but he still had health insurance and he had treatment for about 6 months and recovered. Then he got another IT job that he had for a couple years but he got laid off from that job too.

For about 5 years now he has been unemployed most of the time. He has found a few temp jobs that lasted a few months but he hasn't had any health insurance for a long time. His cancer doctor has seen him every few months free of charge and has helped him find meds at no cost too.

He told me a few months ago that the IT field is just dead and the few jobs that are available aren't going to guys his age (he is 59). He spends a week or so looking for a job and then he just gives up for a few months and then he goes out looking again. He does all the housework and the yardwork. My best friend gets frustrated with him since he hasn't paid her rent in several years but she knows he has nowhere to go if he can't live with her. His family lives about 200 miles from here and she tried talking to his sister to get her to take him in but didn't get anywhere. So being the kind hearted person she is, she has let him stay at her house.

Then this week he got sick. Really sick. He thought he had the stomach flu but also complained that his side hurt. My friend asked him on Wed if he wanted her to take him to the ER but he said he thought he would be okay in a day or two. Then yesterday (Thurs) when my friend got home from work, she found him delirious and he was obviously very very sick. She knew he couldn't afford to pay for an ambulance so she called a friend who is a nurse and she said get him to the ER ASAP. So her brother and another friend came over and the three of them took him to the VA hospital. It is near her house and he is a veteran so she figured that was the best place to go, since he has no insurance.

Well the VA couldn't find his military records. They kept asking my friend if she was sure he had been in the military. She called his sister who said yes he had been in the army and she gave the dates he had served and where he had served but they still couldn't find his records.

By that time the hospital realized he was very ill so they went ahead and admitted him and immediately put him in ICU. All they know so far is he has an infection all through his body. And he might not survive. He is too sick to tell them anything, especially his medical history.

I kept thinking all day that this is just so sad. This is a guy who is a college graduate who had a good job with health insurance and now as he faces the senior part of his life he has nothing. If not for my friend, he would be homeless. And now he might die because when he got sick he couldn't afford to go to the doctor.

Life in 21st century America. Ain't it swell?

[NMDemDist2]

1. yup, sadly, it happens every day. check the story on 'getthisshirt' on my

sig line for another horror story.

my buddy lives in a 12x40 foot 40 year old trailer with a woodstove, no electricity and no running water. with brain and lung cancer. and $140,000 in medical bills

:banghead:

[proud2BlibKansan]

2. Yes too many stories like this

Way too many :cry:

[QueenOfCalifornia]

3. ...

And I thought my week sucked.

Very sad indeed.

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. Oh I know

Makes you count your blessings.

I need to call her and find out how he is doing. But I am afraid to hear the news.

[riderinthestorm]

5. You've probably already suggested this, but your friend needs to get the sister involved pronto

This shouldn't be just solely on your friend. The guy's family needs to step in here and locate his army records and get him some treatment. And then the sister or some other family member needs to take him in to recuperate, permanently.

Your friend is a saint but obviously this guy is at the stage that his family should be stepping up to their responsibility for him.

Health care in this country SUCKS!!! I hate reading stories like this. Just hate it.

Hugs to your friend who is probably very stressed right now. How awful.

[pitohui]

7. there;s a reason the family didn't give this guy a home over many years

the reason isn't because he's a terrific guy and a veteran

[riderinthestorm]

8. Good point. I hope proud's friend is very, very careful at this stage of things. nt

[annabanana]

9. (tremendous uncharitable assumption here). . . . n/t

[pitohui]

11. and yet i'm right

my assumption is based on life experience

we all know in our hearts why this "veteran" was never able to get any aid for the many, many years he has been freeloading off this woman

[annabanana]

12. Sorry. I refuse to accept your meanspirited "hunch" as fact.. . n/t

[proud2BlibKansan]

17. And what kind of aid are you suggesting he should have been trying to get?

[Rosemary2205]

44. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

He may have been mentally disabled and someone needed to fight on his behalf to get him the help he needed. If he was out of work for quite some time then he would be indigent and would be eligible for the VA. Downthread it was stated by the OP that the guy had trouble walking as a result of the car accident, so maybe could not do grung work anymore due to disability. A lot of people after disability need someone to help them fight for help.

[proud2BlibKansan]

16. The reason is that they live 200 miles away and he lives here

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. The sister is here

She came as soon as she got the call. Thanks for the suggestion!

[pitohui]

6. yes it's life in america in more ways than one

even con artists get seriously ill and supposedly at some point they even die

this con artist doesn't have a military history and your friend should step carefully to make sure that she somehow doesn't end up being billed for his care

it is a sad story and the last chapter has not yet been written but unfortunately having encountered this type before i know what's coming and i have hands in front of eyes

your friend is a classic example of no good deed goes unpunished

[proud2BlibKansan]

18. He is not a con artist and he does have a military history

His family arrived yesterday afternoon and they were able to help provide information that the VA used to find what they needed to treat him.

[varelse]

10. This is horrible

and your friend is a very compassionate person. I hope she comes out of this ok. It sounds unlikely that he will be able to go back to live with her, even if he does survive. He'll need care she can't possibly afford to give him.

[proud2BlibKansan]

19. Yes that is becoming more and more obvious

I am afraid his cancer may have returned.

[seriousstan]

13. He spends a week or so looking for a job and then he just gives up for a few months and

There is the problem. You cannot help people that refuse to be helped.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

14. Oh so even those of us who have looked for jobs for YEARS are refusing to be helped????

Where'd you get that cold hearted response?
So everybody who can't find a job, no matter how long they look, according to your logic, is just a lazy, worthless shitty bum???

Thanks a lot for the insults.

[proud2BlibKansan]

20. How often have YOU been unemployed?

[Kingofalldems]

24. Insult boy strikes again

[Rosemary2205]

21. This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever

the man is eligible for VA care all along but I'm supposed to feel sorry for him because he didn't have private health insurance? The man isn't in a crisis because he didn't have access to any healthcare. Obviously he did.

Edit to add, yes, I know the VA is a pain in the ass and has been made worse by Bush Inc. - but with just a little persistence and luck, the guy should have been able to obtain at least basic care at the VA all along.

[proud2BlibKansan]

27. Um no, the VA won't treat non combat related health care needs

I know this for a fact because DH is a vet and several years ago when he was out of work and had no health insurance, he went there for health care and was turned away. They said his needs were not service related and he wasn't indigent.

And my friend's roommate wasn't in need of health care until he got sick this week. Why would he have gone to the VA before this?

[Rosemary2205]

31. I thought you said he'd been out of work for quite some time

no income would make him indigent. My father has VA care. His medical needs are not service related but his income is low enough to qualify.

There is also SSDI and medicare/medicaid is he was too disabled from the car accident to work some sort of job.

No matter how you slice it, the man had medical care when he needed it. So I am unclear how this crisis is directly related to his not having private health insurance.

[proud2BlibKansan]

36. The car accident only prevented him from walking a mail route

He had to find a new career so he went back to school and got an IT degree. And he worked in that field for many years before losing his job and then another. He got cancer. His cancer doctor treated him for free once his health care ran out so he had no need to get health care elsewhere UNTIL HE GOT SICK LESS THAN A WEEK AGO.

I also know a guy who lost an arm and a leg working as an electrician. He went to college and got an accounting degree and a new job. But the state tried to take away the health benefits he had earned as a disabled person since he had another job. HE STILL HAD ONLY ONE ARM AND ONE LEG.

The system is about as compassionate as your responses have been.

[Rosemary2205]

41. I think you just don't want to hear what I'm saying.

This guy GOT medical care when he needed it. He got it under insurance, he got it for free, he got it from the VA. This is just not a good story to illustrate the health care crisis in this country. There is no doubt about a SERIOUS problem with the private health insurance industry. I live that nightmare every day and I feel extremely fortunate the insurance company has never tried to deny care based on my disability and "pre-existing" crap. I too became ineligible for medicare/medicaid when I became eligible for a group plan through my employer. But I DO have access to medical care. "The state" did not leave me high and dry with no access to medical care I "earned" as a disabled person. (How did I earn it any more than any other human does I don't understand)

I don't see anything uncompassionate about having myself and my employer jointly pay for my medical care, if we can afford to do so, instead of the taxpayers. Much more uncompassionate are the idiotic laws that allow private insurers to take the premiums and then refuse care for whatever reason sounds good today - or make the deductables and copays so high that people still can't see a doctor. If we are not going to have single payer universal access to medical care (and clearly we won't any time soon when even the Democrats aren't even discussing that) then we HAVE to put the smackdown on these insurance companies.

Give me a real discussion here that make sense instead of demanding I feel sorry for a guy that ACTUALLY DID GET THE MEDICAL CARE HE NEEDED.

I feel sorry for people who aren't college material, who work 2 or 3 or more jobs, who won't ever have shit in this world, never in a million years could afford even half the cost of just basic healthcare premiums even though they live in a singlewide or an effiency lodge, finally got a union job with barely good enough health insurance to keep the family from going bankrupt over a simple illness, and then whammo, either the job packs up and moves to china or else the insurance company does the switchero and drop kicks them refusing to cover it.

Talk to me about that and we'll have a whole other conversation.



Edit - changed "health insurance" to "medical care" in the first sentence to be more accurate.

[antigop]

22. Welcome to our world.

>>

I kept thinking all day that this is just so sad. This is a guy who is a college graduate who had a good job with health insurance and now as he faces the senior part of his life he has nothing.
>>

The job market sucks for older workers, especially in IT and engineering.

[proud2BlibKansan]

28. Thanks so much for understanding!

:hi:

[antigop]

38. I hope things work out for them. n/t

[flashl]

23. Good Karma for your friend and the roomate. nt

[Greyhound]

25. Are you as disgusted as I at many of these relies? n/t

:kick: & R

[proud2BlibKansan]

26. Yes but I am getting used to disgusting replies on these kinds of stories

I have my own theory about where these right wing talking points are coming from. And how soon they will be just a memory:)

BTW, just talked to my friend. Her roommate has a brain infection and is still in ICU in critical condition. Doesn't look good. So any prayers or good vibes would be appreciated, regardless of your feelings on personal responsibility. (Not talking to you necessarily, greyhound, but any other DUers reading for updates).

[Greyhound]

30. Sending light and good wishes his way.

November 5th?

[leftchick]

43. I know I am

:puke:

my prayers are with him and his family. :(

[varelse]

29. This is a guy who is a college graduate who had a good job with health insurance

and now as he faces the senior part of his life he has nothing. If not for my friend, he would be homeless. And now he might die because when he got sick he couldn't afford to go to the doctor."

He's not alone - there are hundreds and soon will be thousands of seniours in similar situations. My belief is that many of the heartbreakingly cold-blooded replies are based in denial and fear. Most of us would rather believe that this man's situation is something we can avoid, with better planning and better "life choices". Unfortunately, the only possible solutions to this will rely on all of us coming together and working together. A "Do it yourself" solution just isn't available for everyone anymore. Frankly, it never was...

[Greyhound]

32. There are at least hundreds of thousands and probably millions already. n/t

[Rosemary2205]

34. Seniors have medical care

no, it isn't cadallac care and yes it's imperfect and yes it's a pain in the butt, but seniors have medicare.

I worry more about younger people who's employer drops group coverage and with the private insurance industry total freaking out of control these folks are screwn no matter what they do because even if they are "covered" the deductables and copays can be so cost prohibitive they still can't afford to get sick.

There are A LOT of people in this country with no access to medical care - even people WITH insurance. Something has to done about it and I don't see ANY of our candidates talking about THAT.

This particular story is heartbreaking, but the man DID have access to medical care when needed it. It's not a good story to illustrate the problem.

[Vinca]

35. Medicare doesn't cover everything, sorry to say. Most seniors

need to buy additional coverage and end up paying through the nose when the cost of Medicare and the supplemental coverage is added together. My friend's father was paying a total of $900 a month toward the end of his life.

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. And you have to be 65

My friend's roommate is 59.

[Vinca]

40. Exactly. I hope the poor guy can get the help he needs at the VA hospital.

This country is such a nightmare. 18,000 people a year die from lack of health insurance and who knows how many with insurance die from denied care, yet there is no money available for a national healthcare program. A three trillion dollar war in a wrong response to 3,000 people dying on 9/11 and no money for the 18,000+ a year.

[Rosemary2205]

42. $900?

I have a friend who's 68 and has cancer. She is paying $245 a month for AARP's supplemental in addition to the premiums for medicare. It's a huge hardship for her to pay that much (it's more than 30% of her monthly income) but it's been EXTREMELY cost effective for her. Worth every penny. She has not paid a single dime in copays deductables or anything else - except for the medications she gets from the local pharmacy under part D. Only one, which was a month supply of a special antibiotic was pricey. The doctor has been limited in what chemicals she can use for cancer treatment by medicare, but no more so than private insurance would - and likely not any more so than single payer would.

Make no mistake about it. If we expect the same level of service from single payer universal that we currently expect then it WILL be expensive.

[warren pease]

47. Only in the US is lack of medical insurance a capital crime...

Make no mistake about it. If we expect the same level of service from single payer universal that we currently expect then it WILL be expensive.

With all due respect, BULLSHIT. And until the industry fear-mongering talking points have passed through your system and into their proper environment, I can only hope your flair for irony exceeds my ability to pick up on it.

In case you're actually serious, consider a couple of points about the relative costs/benefits of this for-profit scam contrasted with single-payer, universal coverage, as practiced by sane and civilized countries whose populations haven't been intellectually pulverized or ideologically poisoned by the hucksters who preach the fictional glories of the non-existent free market. That's the same free market that's supposed to elevate the American way of desperate hyper-consumerism into a position of global superiority simply by its natural proclivity to lift all boats on that happy, happy rising tide of economic prosperity. Speaking of which, how's that working out for you these days?

For starters, this 2004 study from the Institute of Medicine blames lack of medical insurance for about 18,000 deaths each year in the US. I've seen an updated study by the same organization that ups that number to 22,000, but I can't find it now so 18,000 will have to do.

Regarding the costs associated with this for-profit lunacy, the US spends far more per capita or as a percentage of GDP than any other country in the world -- in most cases, more than twice as much -- according to the World Health Organization's landmark 2000 study (statistical abstract linked here) comparing health care systems in 191 countries.

Here's a http://masetto.sourceoecd.org/vl=2352137/cl=27/nw=1/rpsv/health2007/5-1.htm">more recent comparison, a study comparing health expenditures per capita in 2005 among 31 countries tracked by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development. Notice that US residents not only paid the most overall (~$6,400), or two and a quarter times the average of OECD countries, but were among the biggest spenders per capita on publicly funded health care systems at nearly $3,000 apiece. Be sure to look at Chart g5-1-01 for details.

So in 2005, the US taxpayer shouldered the burden for just under 50 percent of all medical costs nationwide by being forced to fund health care programs such as the Federal Employees Health Plan and those for state and local employees as well; the Cadillac coverage our fine representatives and Senators enjoy (and which they say we can't have); the cost of covering ER expenses for those without insurance; Medicare; and the costs of various state-run Medicaid programs.

That means government spending per-person (via tax dollars) on health care in the US was higher than total per capita health care expenditures in almost any other country in the world – including those with single-payer, universal-access national health care systems. So we're paying for national health care; we're just not getting it.

Here's a shorthand version of the WHO's statistical abstract, updated in 2007, in which the US ranks 37th in the world in overall effectiveness of its medical system, right above that archetype of medical wonderfulness, Slovenia.

There's much, much more information that belies your positions in financial terms. For the simple human kindness quotient, I'd suggest a couple of sessions with various humanitarian philosophers who can discuss the interconnectedness of all humans -- and all other species as well -- and why it's your goddamn job to care what happens to this poor guy referenced in the OP. Better yet if you can manage to figure it out on your own.


wp


On edit: fixed broken link

[area51]

50. Great post.

:thumbsup:

http://pnhp.org

[warren pease]

53. PNHP...

Thanks for the kind words. I think that the PNHP site is the single most valuable gateway to the entire world of academic and organizational studies on everything from epidemiology to financial data on how various countries have set up and operate their national public health systems.

And the sheer volume of position papers and articles presenting logical, non-hysterical, cogent arguments in favor of single-payer and against this for-profit obscenity would overwhelm the opposition in any country not overflowing with co-opted idiots, wingnut demagogues, the triumph of PR and advertising over critical thinking, and blatant corporate bribery masquerading as campaign financing.

I'm a member and I also get the updates they send out to the press. Lately, that's consisted of an almost daily notification that some union or professional organization has come out in support of single-payer, universal-access.

It really doesn't matter, though, until the party that's supposed to take the peoples' side in this fight -- and woe to us for this sorry pack of craven democrats twits we're stuck with -- get their jowls out of the corporate feeding trough and stop taking their marching orders from the very bastards who profit from this deadly, immoral scam.

As Bob Dole said way back in 1983, before he became the Senate's leading parking spot for special interest money, "When these political action committees give money, they expect something in return other than good government."

Just so, and unless we move to public financing of campaigns and strictly regulate the back-door bribes and little off-the-record gifts -- like Kenny Boy loaning Bush a jet from the Enron corporate air force for campaign transportation -- we're going to continue to be stuck with the corporate answer to everything: social services that most countries deliver as basic governmental functions paid for with taxes will continue to be privatized and use a delivery model that makes corporate interests the most money in the shortest period of time.

Long answer to a two-word message, but I've always felt that it's negligent to use only a sentence or two when several long paragraphs will do nicely.


wp

[Tracer]

49. Perhaps your friend should investigate other supplemental programs.

I pay $86.88 per month for a Blue Cross suplemental (in addition to the Medicare deductible), and it covers EVERYTHING, including my own cancer treatments.

[susankh4]

33. Makes me fell sick, myself.

I had to leave nursing because of this kind of sh**. I just can't take it! And it's so much worse than it was a decade ago.

[antigop]

39. MIchael Moore SICKO: "WHO ARE WE? WHAT ARE WE?" n/t

[varelse]

45. Some of the assumptions being made here may not be accurate

This is a thread about our VA health care system - apparently, services have been greatly reduced. Also, I've seen one person assert that this man had access to health care, implying that his current tragic and life-threatening illness is therefore his own fault, and has nothing to do with a failure of this country's government to provide for the health and welfare of its people. It's obvious that his only access to health care was the emergency room. If he'd had access to yearly exams, etc, and to mental health care (for depression) he might not now be dying at age 59. He's not a seniour yet either. He may have been eligible for social services or health care support and simply been unaware of this, or he may not have been.

I say that the OP's point has been made, and been made well, and that this is an excellent example of why we should have a universal, single-payer health care plan in the US.

[Lars39]

46. Well said!

:thumbsup:

[warren pease]

48. Kick because the amount of victim-blaming on this thread is amazing...

... and because it's to this country's continuing shame that only in America is lack of medical insurance a capital crime. And since lack of medical coverage usually translates into either lack of a job that provides benefits or lack of enough money to pay the obscene premiums, it's just another way the peasants are losing the class war and the country is accelerating its plunge into a third-world banana republic -- except the republic part is questionable with fascists at the helm and an entire quasi-legal infrastructure in place should the proles get out of line.

The current system is also great for social control since it keeps people working at soul-sucking, mindless, personally destructive little corporate cube jobs just to keep their employer-based medical coverage.

Nice fucking system, designed by right wing profiteers to fatten balance sheets, enrich execs, vacuum money out of the pockets of tens of millions of people, separate the "good Americans" from the 50 million or so sluggards who don't have coverage and generally produce an alleged health care environment that triages on bank accounts rather than medical need.

As I say, nice fucking system and such a nice fucking country that treats its people this way.


wp

[Ilsa]

51. Hey proud2Blib, you pick the best of friends. She is so kind to have

helped this man for so long while he was trying to get back on his feet.

I hope, with his permission, your friend sends this story to all of our congresscritters, especially the two running for president. I wouldn't even bother telling the sister that his story is about to go public.

Sepsis can be very deadly. I'll think of him often today and hope he recovers.

[kineneb]

52. be sick and age 45 to 65, fall through the cracks

wind up in bankruptcy, or homeless

too young to qualify for any kind of public health care, often with too many assets, and often "too old" to be hired at a living wage (if there are any jobs at all)... spend down every asset, qualify for care, must live at poverty level to keep it... been there- not "fun"

...getting disability due to depression is better than nothing...

Or as I said to the nurse: "Do I have to threaten to slit my wrists to get some attention?"