Pope John Paul the Great

[MonkeyFunk]

That's what a monsignor on CNN yesterday called Pope John Paul II a few times. Is this an organized effort to get historians to call him that, or just an overly-zealous priest?

I'd never heard of him called that before. Reminds of Rush calling Reagan "Ronaldus Magnus". People want Caesars, it seems.

[Richardo]

1. I don't think that's a Church-sanctioned title or organized effort...

If he was an analyst on CNN, I'd vote for overzealous. And a bit over-the-top.

[hlthe2b]

10. CNN? I'd vote MORONS (MORANS, as the case may be)

[Vickers]

2. Does he say it in a Tony the Tiger voice?

Then it would be kinda cool.

[MonkeyFunk]

4. LOL

that WOULD be cool!

And we need a Pope Tony.

[Ikonoklast]

16. Waddayu lookin' at? Think my hat's funny?

Hows about I sends a few of da boys from the Curia to over discuss a little matter of a 'contribution', know wadda I mean?
Now kneel down and kiss my ring, or I swear your melon's gonna get thumped.



'Pope Tony' would be a riot.

:rofl:

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

20. I see there has been NO Pope Anthony ever. Odd.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_popes

[glowing]

3. I don't know.. I know they are trying to make him a Saint.. Perhaps that

has something to do with it.. but reminds me of some other "greats" that really weren't great at all.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

5. let's see.

falling attendance at church
massive shortages of priests
massive losses due to litigation about decades of sexual abuse of kids. By priests. Nuns, church workers
massive cover-ups
stupid policies about birth control and transmission of aids.
out of step policies about modern society (except for their recent pollution positions)

geez. no wonder they want a figurehead to be portrayed in a good light, despite the truth. Just like the GOP and Ronnie.

[Rosemary2205]

6. John Paul was almost universally loved by Catholics.

One of his few failings was not bitchslapping pedophile priests and throwing them under the bus for the law to deal with. That fact puzzles me, because John Paul was not the sort to condone such things. But yes, the love Catholics have for John Paul borders on worship rather than admiration.

[hlthe2b]

11. I agree JPII is, by contrast a much better figure as Pope, but !!!!

"his few failings was the pedophile priests issue?"

No word on his blatant misogyny and attitude towards birth control that kept millions of poor women impoverished and without hope to control their prospects for a better future for themselves and their families?! (not to mention quite a few other issues).

Again, by comparison, he was a far better figure, but all this revisionism that is now being extended to Ratzinger is really beyond the pale to me... Yup, I'm lapsed, but not intolerant to Catholicism (nor blind to its faults)...

[Rosemary2205]

12. I totally disagree with you on John Pauls role of freeing women

He is LARGELY responsible for bringing women more fully into participation in the church. He created an environment where priests felt free to "ignore" certain rules and allow divorced women to remarry and participate the church. Men and women stopped being actively condemned for using birth control and it became a matter that was simply not discussed. The Catholic was free to settle their own actions with their own faith. John Paul took a very active role in pushing freedoms for all people, including women, all over the world. While he didn't manage to get the church to change it's stance on birth control, or married priests, or homosexuals actively engaged in church life, he did make a point of rarely discussing those things, leaving it for the next generation.

The Nazi will hammer at all these things and push the church away from John Paul's more liberal views. That's his job and that is why the cardinals picked him.

[hlthe2b]

13. Yes, Ratzinger is all about rolling back Vatican II and asserting

his authoritarian control over the Jesuits and other more liberal thinkers among the church.

As to JPII, it is a relative appraisal. That he took some baby steps into a far more relevant church for the 21st century, I don't argue. But, in the last years of his life, (likely due to the intervention of Cardinal Ratzinger and his compatriots), that not only ceased but regressionist policies began to be the norm.

Had the first JP lived and been able to preside with some support, I think SO much would be different now, but the misogynist factions continue to win out.

[Wizard777]

22. Not just catholics. I didn't agree with him entierly. But he was great man and leader.

Here in Maryland we had a teenager that shot the priest that abused him. The local police even covered up the complaint of abuse. But any way, the kid just wanted an apology from the priest. When the priest refused to apologize. The kid shot him. He was convicted of gun charges. But the jury refused to convict him for actually shooting the priest. The judge gave him probabtion. At Christmas John Paul II Excommunicated the priest. It was kind of a beautiful Christmas gift to the people of Baltimore. So yes he did bitchslap the pedophile priests. As you put it.

:applause:

[stahbrett]

7. I found this on wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_John_Paul_II#Posthumous_recognition_and_cause_for_canonization

Since the death of John Paul II, a number of clergy at the Vatican and laymen throughout the world have been referring to the late pontiff as "John Paul the Great"—only the fourth pope to be so acclaimed, and the first since the first millennium.

His successor, Pope Benedict XVI, referred to him as "the great Pope John Paul II" in his first address from the loggia of St Peter's Church. Pope Benedict XVI, then Cardinal Ratzinger, stirred excitement by some devotees of the pope when in his published written homily for the Mass of Repose, he referred to Pope John Paul II as "the Great."

[msongs]

8. so who was the pope just before the molestors became such big news? nt

[baldguy]

9. When the molesters were being protected by the Church, you mean?

Why, it was Pope John Paul the Great. Why do you ask?

[noel711]

14. It's a church-y thing... when the 'powers-that-be' want to

rush canonization, they add on 'the great' to their
name... IF you go thru Church history, you'll notice
plenty of these 'the great's..

No biggie.. How about we start calling our president
"St. George... the Great....(dumbass)" ??

[Thepricebreaker]

15. No... This pope elevated his name to "The Great" which is one step tword saint-hood.

[MonkeyFunk]

17. I've never heard that before

regarding the path to sainthood. Do you have a reference?

[Wizard777]

21. Me either. But Benedict does have JPII on the "fast track" to sainthood.

They have an office dedicated to just working on his sainthood. They are waiting for the miracles to come rolling in.

[Stinky The Clown]

18. Bush as Ceasar Disgustus

[AngryOldDem]

19. That's how some see him.

And I don't know the process for adding "The Great" to the title. But for my money, the fact that the sex scandal basically broke under his watch forever taints him and disqualifies him from that honor. Doesn't mean I didn't like or respect him, especially in comparison to who's in the chair now.