Debt Collection Done From India Appeals to U.S. Agencies

[Purveyor]

GURGAON, India — In a glass tower on the outskirts of Delhi, dozens of young Indians are on the telephone, calling America’s out of work, forgetful and debt-stricken and asking for cash.

“Are you sure that’s all you can afford?” one operator in a row of cubicles asks politely. “Well, how do you take care of your everyday expenses?” presses another.

Americans are used to receiving calls from India for insurance claims and credit card sales. But debt collection represents a growing business for outsourcing companies, especially as the American economy slows and its consumers struggle to pay for their purchases.

Armed with a sophisticated automated system that dials tens of thousands of Americans every hour, and puts confidential information like Social Security numbers, addresses and credit history at operators’ fingertips, this new breed of collectors is chasing down late car payments, overdue credit card debt and lapsed installment loans. Debt collectors in India often cost about one-quarter the price of their American counterparts, and are often better at the job, debt collection company executives say.

“India will be the only place we grow this year,” said J. Brandon Black, the chief executive of the Encore Capital Group, a debt collection company based in San Diego. India is the company’s largest operating area, with about half the company’s collection force of more than 300.

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Telephone debt collection represents new, more aggressive territory for India. “This is really a sales job,” Mr. Hughes said. “It is commission-intensive, and you’re paid on your ability to collect.”

Like many sales teams, Encore’s collectors in India gather for a daily pep talk before their shift. In one recent session, they were schooled on the intricacies of American tax policy.

“One hundred thirty million U.S. families will get a tax rebate this season” as part of the new economic stimulus package, Manu Sharma, the team leader, explained to a roomful of top-earning collection agents, most in their 20s. Those who qualify for the rebates will get as much $600 a person or $1,200 a household, he said, and “the I.R.S. is going to start paying this money in May.”

---EOE---

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/24/business/worldbusiness/24debt.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1&ref=world

[Deja Q]

1. If it's all about growth, what happens when the remaining undeveloped countries become developed?

Find little green men on Mars to badger Indians and Russians behind on their bills?

[magellan]

2. Best way to deal with debt collectors, and totally legal

Tell them to put whatever they have to say to you in writing, and hang up. You do NOT have to talk to anyone on the phone, and anything you say acknowledging the debt only makes things worse for you. And they know how to get you to talk.

Make them put it in writing and refuse to discuss anything with them. And make sure they're abiding by the law: calling only your home number, talking only to you, and phoning at reasonable hours. All this info is a google search away.

Arm yourself!

[dysfunctional press]

8. most of the laws apply to third-party collections...

i used to be a collector for a bank, and we were collecting on our own accounts- so we could call anywhere anytime. and we generally did.

[magellan]

9. Serious? That's messed up.

No one should be able to phone you at work or in the middle of the night to collect debt.

[dysfunctional press]

17. actually, if people paid their bills it wouldn't be a problem.

:shrug:

[magellan]

18. Yes, in an ideal world

But when they can't there ought to be some level of protection from harassment, on par with the laws covering 3rd party debt collectors. Putting people's jobs in jeopardy isn't going to help banks collect the money they're owed, is it?

[treestar]

24. If people can't pay their bills what good does harassing them do?

If they have a job and can pay, get a wage attachment and be done with it. If they don't, calling them isn't going to put $$ in their pockets.

[dysfunctional press]

25. when i was doing it, wage garnishment wasn't an easy step- i don't know how it works today...

but it's generally easier to get the deadbeats who could to pay-up without doing it.

we were mostly collecting on credit card accounts and auto loans- and i don't have a lot of sympathy for people who continually overextend themselves, because there are plenty of us who don't.

[TheWatcher]

27. Nice, heartless attitude there.

I'm absolutely sure everyone you called on was an irresponsible deadbeat.

Just unbelievable.

[dysfunctional press]

31. your comprehension "skills" leave a lot to be desired, huh?

i didn't say that they all were- i said that the ones who COULD pay were the deadbeats. there were also al ot of people who couldn't pay(it was during a strike at the catepillar plant, where we had a big chunk of customers), and those were the ones we'd be more willing to work with.

[melm00se]

36. wage garnishment

is not an available option in every state.

As a former collector, collections supervisor, collections manager and default management VP for banks: the number of people who get calls and credit dings are, historically, less than 5% of the total borrowing population and less than 1% of the borrowing population is compelled into repayment (via legal action).

Having done that work thru 2 of the 3 last recessions, the number of borrowers in default will increase but so does, at least with "smaller" banks, the willingness to work things out. The whole trick is to keep the money flowing, as much as you can. While you may be in default by the letter of the contract, most judges are loath to drop the bomb on people who are at least trying.

Yes, the FDCPA only applies to 3rd party debt collectors. Most banks adhere the the restrictions spelled out in it.

Finally, sending a letter and demanding that "they" only deal with you in writing is a gamble. They may try to work out a payment plan via email but more than likely, if you aren't judgment proof (due to situation or state/local/federal laws), the next written notification will be served upon you (and usually at your place of employment) and then you may be compelled to pay.

I am very happy that I left all that behind, the job isn't for everyone and it finally ground me down over 15 years.

[TheWatcher]

26. Wow.

People fall behind in their bills for legitimate reasons.

That's a piss poor argument.

Doesn't surprise me you used to be in collections.

It suits you.

[dysfunctional press]

32. actually it didn't suit me.

it was one of the worst jobs i ever had. the only halfway decent part of the job was when we'd go out on car repos. THAT was exhilarating.

[Gormy Cuss]

21. That's why some states have tougher laws than the Federal one.

In California they are restricted to 8AM-9PM calling times, for example. Of course, state law does no good for the consumer if the debt owner is in a different state.

[angstlessk]

34. are you saying India is not a third party for the US Government? what does that make them??

[madeline_con]

13. With caller ID, you can ignore the call. n/t

[Wizard777]

20. "Name not available." "Number not available."

They want to call you. But they don't want you calling them.

[dysfunctional press]

33. if they don't want you to call them, why do they leave their name and number on the voicemail?

:shrug:

[Occulus]

35. I stopped taking "No data" calls a long time ago

It's absolutely amazing. I know the "collectors" are full of it- if they really wanted their money as badly as they claimed to on the telephone, they could put it in writing. My CC company wasn't willing to do even that, so I'm ignoring them. I'm sending them money every month, just not as much as they would like- and my final payment, somewhere near the end of the summer, will be sent by certified mail, so I know when they receive it and thus know if they play any tricks with the date of receipt vs. the late fee date.

But it's all calls that are "no data" or an unrecognized number. If it's important enough, they can leave a message- and I'll get back to them. My CC company, of course, never gets a return call from me. If they're unwilling to put their policy in writing, as far as I'm concerned, the policy doesn't exist.

[rpannier]

3. Congress needs to put a curb on this practice...

However, they don't seem to care about corporate credit card abuse in this country, so why should they care about this

[Donnachaidh]

4. So much for our private information being protected from outside sources

WTF?

Our SS numbers are in databases in INDIA? Oh yeah, there's NOT going to be a problem with THAT now, is there? :sarcasm:

[jwirr]

5. "Gee sir, I am sorry but I cannot pay that bill as you have my job."

[TommyO]

6. Not a good idea, that statement is enough for them to say you confirmed the debt

[dysfunctional press]

7. the debts are usually pretty much confirmed by the paper trail.

not acknowledging them doesn't negate them.

[Purveyor]

12. Which when proof is requested, most collection agencies can not produce.

Demand upon first notification from a collection agency that they prove the debt, i.e. original credit agreement, justification of charges, authority to collect the debt, etc.

[madeline_con]

14. True story...

I had a guy tell me I owed $159.00 for a bounced check on a bank where I hadn't had an account in years. I asked him if he could tell me the check # and who it was made out to. He couldn't. I told him I would not send money to anyone just because they said to do so.

Never heard from him again.

[Romulox]

19. I once had a woman call me and demand $2000 for an unpaid student loan

I gave her my address and demanded she send proof of the debt.

It's been about 5 years now...

[dysfunctional press]

16. when it's a valid debt, they usually have the info...

i've had collectors try to scam me twice- once for a medical bill i didn't know existed- i had a mole removed, the dr. sent it to be tested, and the testing company mis-transposed my address, and i never got the bill, and my insurance company didn't pay quick enough apparently...i had a collector call me and tell me i owed $148.00, i got the info, called the testing company, and they told me that the bill was $5.25, since the insurance had since paid their share.

i would NEVER just take the word of a collector- but if it's a valid debt, not acknowledging it won't make it not exist.
HOWEVER- if it's under $100, ignoring it will often make it go away...most collectors won't put too much effort into a small bill.

[treestar]

23. But when you had it, you made a lot more

Who pays more when they can get the same thing for less?

This is the American double standard. We always want the lowest price as consumers, yet we expect the business person to pay the highest price (for the same thing).

This is a reality we are apparently unwilling to face.

Pay higher prices for the goods then, or don't buy them if we can't afford them, or be willing to work for $400/month. This is the advantage the Indians have. They are willing to do it because they can live well enough on it.

[cosmicone]

10. I am a bit astounded by the subtle bashing here

The Indians are just doing their job ... a job they were given by some American executive sitting in the US. They have access to information, yes, but that information contractually belongs to the creditor who has a fiduciary duty to safeguard it. My understanding is that the Indian call center workers are bound by a confidentiality agreement, are not allowed to write anything and are not allowed to take anything from the workplace. The data is probably more secure there than in some red states.

I can understand the frustrations of hard economic times but the Indians didn't cause them. Indians didn't make people take neg-am mortgages and overspend or get into massive credit card debt to buy plasma TVs and SUVs. Why blame THEM?

[CBGLuthier]

11. I am with you and yet not

I agree that blaming Indians for outsourcing is wrong.

On the other hand, debt collectors can all burn in hell. They would be better respected if they worked in whorehouses.

[madeline_con]

15. I don't think it's the Indians taking a bashing.

It's the companies who hire them instead of American workers in the U.S.

There used to be an ad here on DU about how you could rent an Indian worker to answer your business phone for $400 a month.

[treestar]

22. If they were American it would not be different

The debtors are still going to get those calls.

[Elspeth]

28. The irony of globalized collections to harass American victims of globalization

Globalization is a fraud and always has been.

[DFW]

29. Would you like chutney with your threats, sahib?

[Edweird]

30. Eh. I'll ignore them just like I ignore the American ones....