High Fructose Corn Syrup

[LSK]

Now that there is so much demand for corn, how come nobody is talking about removing this crap from most of our foods?

I heard that in the 70s and 80s they started adding it to a lot of our foods because corn demand was so low. Is that true?

How did we survive without HFCS? Maybe go back to those days?

[NashVegas]

1. Why, Just Yersterday at the Supermarket, I Was Thinking ...

"Corn is much too valuable as fuel to be used as a sweetener! What's this doing to prices?" as I tried in vain to find a marinade with plain old sugar.

[glowing]

19. Try your creative juices, and make your own marinades.. my husband

has become the king of the marinade.. I wish I could market half the creations he's created.

[NashVegas]

34. Yabbut

I specifically wanted hickory barbeque sauce ...

[SharonAnn]

59. ADM and the corn industry support sugar price supports so that sugar price is high in U.S.

Sugar is much cheaper outside the U.S.

ADM and the corn lobby support high sugar prices so that high-fructose corn syrup is cheaper. At least it used to be cheaper.

[guyanakoolaid]

2. Drink a Dublin Dr. Pepper...

Made in Dublin, TX, home of Dr. Pepper and usually only available in a limited area around there. They use "Imperial Pure Cane Sugar" instead of corn syrup... I would drink no other soda if I could.

[Horse with no Name]

20. I only drink Diet Drinks

But I WILL make the exception for Dublin Dr. Peppers. Yummy!
I actually found them in plastic bottles in Bonham. Was the first time outside of West Texas that I had seen them and then they were in glass bottles.

[newmajority]

28. The glass bottle does make a difference in the taste

It's too bad you can't get the Dublin Dr. Pepper outside of West Texas, but at least the Mexican Coke seems to be widely distributed.

It's almost too well distributed, really. (put on your tinfoil hats here :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: :tinfoilhat: )

I don't speak Spanish, but if I'm reading the labels of the MexiCoke correctly, they make it in Mexicali, which is a border town. Almost as if they picked that location specifically to export it to the US.

And seemingly out of nowhere, it's at Costco, of all places. Not exactly your neighborhood taqueria. Does Costco normally stock huge quantities of imports?

Is Coca Cola intentionally ripping us off here? As long as we're willing to pay twice as much for REAL Coke in a glass bottle, why wouldn't they keep up this import scam while continuing to pump out the HFCS version for the "mass market". In theory, this could be a much bigger scam than the one they pulled in 1985. And it's only us gullible Americans, because everywhere else on the planet, there's still only one kind of Coca Cola.

[yellowcanine]

3. Yes I believe it was related to corn demand. And sugar tariffs were linked in as well I believe.

Otherwise sugar would be cheaper than HFCS.

[cascadiance]

22. The U.S. also subsidizes corn products... That also helped them keep prices lower.

Read my post further down here that explains it and why it's a larger problem than just issues with health. It is really a part of our globalized economy strategy (those in charge of course, NOT mine!)

[TheWraith]

4. They used it because it was cheaper than sugar, and because

It acts as a kind of natural preservative. Products with it last longer.

Yes, it probably has outlasted its usefulness.

[guyanakoolaid]

6. Cheaper only because of the high sugar tariffs pushed by Archer Daniel Midlands

who just happen to make high fructose corn syrup

[LSK]

10. who now makes Ethanol..

[Califooyah Operative]

61. bingo. nt

[Frustratedlady]

5. I wish. I still think high fructose is responsible for the weight gain of so many.

They even have it in potato chips. Why?

The nutritionists warn about white sugar, but I don't think it is anywhere near the problem as high fructose.

I agree! Get rid of it.

[LSK]

11. Bill Maher is always blaming corn on our weight problems

If you look at video or pictures from the 70s and earlier, we were much skinnier back then.

[zbdent]

30. true, but ...

you had to get off your fat ass and travel to plunk your quarter into the local Pong machine (after waiting your turn ...)

[beltanefauve]

13. Not just potato chips!

Try buying a loaf of bread these days! Even Orowheat and other "whole grain" breads have it.

[LSK]

14. bread, pop, fruit drinks, candy, granola bars, its everywhere

[cascadiance]

18. A lot of people eat cereal that has it. Check your ingredients there too...

[LSK]

21. yeah that too, I try to buy Kashi products when I can

I am used to checking stuff for HFCS.

[LynzM]

29. And salad dressing, and canned tomatoes, and on and on and....

It's disgusting. x(

[IcyPeas]

55. Noticed this in the Orowheat bread as well

so I stopped getting that brand of bread -- I used to think that was decent bread... so disappointing.

[newmajority]

33. HFCS is so highly refined that there's nothing for your body to break down.

The same is true of bleached white flour. And since there's nothing that can be broken down, it's absorbed into the bloodstream and stored as fat. Hence the exponential rise, not only in obesity, but also in diabetes.

Imagine your typical fast food meal. Even if you go to Subway because it seems healthier than Mickey D's - and in many ways it is - you still end up with bread made of bleached flour (their "wheat" bread is not whole grain either) and most people will wash it down with a carbonated HFCS drink.

If "Jared" really lost all that weight eating there, he must have been on carb blockers.

[gimberly]

54. Glycolysis breaks down sugars to produce energy. Only surplus sugars are stored as fat.

The problem is quantity.

[Lorien]

53. Yep. I can't touch the stuff (hypoglycemic), and it's in almost everything. n/t

[Trillo]

63. Perhaps. But white sugar is sucrose,

which is 1/2 glucose and 1/2 fructose, chained together with a weak chemical bond.

Myself, I'll only eat jelly that says sugar on the ingredient label. It is getting easier to find than in prior years, but most jellies still use HFCS.

[Clark2008]

68. I just said that in another thread!

I fully think that's why we Americans are so much heavier than our European counterparts.

[DJ13]

7. Remember Coca Cola before the "New" Coke in the early 80's?

It used cane sugar as a sweetener.

New Coke came out in the early 80's with HFCS and bombed.

When they reintroduced Coke "Classic" it too had HFCS as the sweetener instead of sugar.

All non diet drinks sold now in the US use HFCS as the sweetener.

But if you ever drink a bottle of Coke or Pepsi made outside of the US you will see that the old sugar formulations actually taste better.

[underpants]

17. Kosher Coke has a yellow top on the 2 liters

you may still be able to find some. They distribute it this time of year.

[guyanakoolaid]

25. Oh yeah - Mexican Coke, too, uses sugar instead of HFCS

I can't remember what was in my sodas in the UK... although to be fair to my memory the local quik-e-mart always seemed to but their Coke from a different country of origin every time.

[Abies]

40. Not all non-diet drinks sold in the US have HFCS

Jones soda uses cane sugar.

http://www.jonessoda.com/

It's becoming more common and I've even seen it at Target. Whole Foods sells some other cane sugar sweetened sodas as well. Alaska Airlines recently switched to Jones drinks.

[Sequoia]

8. Across the street is a Mexican place that sells Coke bottled in Mexico.

And they use sugar so it tastes like the good old days of coke when you got them in green bottles in one of those rectangle floor fridge things with a bottle opener.

[cascadiance]

15. You can get it from Costco too... At least here on the west coast, not sure about other...

parts of the country. Saw these cokes up as far north as Portland, Oregon. Look for the cases of glass bottles with little sticker labels attached to the side of each bottle.

I also picked up a stash of Passover Coke which is made available in April around Passover which uses regular kosher and non-corn-based fructose instead of HFCS.

I'm going to try and have a blind taste test of Passover coke vs. Mexican Coke vs. U.S. coke in a future local Democratic Club meeting here in San Diego. Stay tuned.

[Sequoia]

23. Passover Coke? I never heard of it.

Let us know the outcome. Taste tests are fun.

[cascadiance]

24. It was mentioned in another post in this thread as "Kosher Coke"...

You might be able to find some if you look hard enough, though I think they're probably gone from store shelves by now. Look for the 2 liter Coke bottles with yellow caps.

[newmajority]

36. Haven't found the Kosher Coke yet, but my money's on the MexiCoke in the taste test.

Any kind of beverage - Juice, milk, beer, Coke, or even water - tastes better in a glass bottle than in plastic. And the Mexican Coke still comes in the trademark glass bottle. I really wish they would go back to glass bottles in this country. You would think the fact that plastic comes from petroleum would be reason enough. Of course, if we did switch everything back to glass, the corporatists would probably still invade middle eastern countries....... for the desert sand!

[Elspeth]

65. Damn! I didn't know that Coke was still made with sugar in some places

And those refillable glass bottles were a great way to avoid all the plastic and aluminum waste.

[cbayer]

9. There was recently a fascinating documentary on Independent Lens

called King Corn. Highly recommended and a real eye-opener.

http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/guide.html

[cascadiance]

12. I was just thinking the same thing the other day...

I think we should lobby to remove the corn subsidies with the cost of corn going up. Even with the subsidies, the price of corn-based products will perhaps be less competitive and our money will be going down a rat hole. Let's get real sugar back into our soft drinks and other foods again, and stop the added costs to treat diabetes, etc. we have now.

The problem is that subsidizing corn (and HFCS products) is I think a strategic goal of some of the corporate types in our government now. It is what fuels a lot of outsourcing and illegal immigration problems we have now too.

It works this way:

- A country like Mexico makes soft drinks with their own cane sugar they grow themselves like coca cola, etc.

- The U.S. exports Coca Cola and other soft drinks using HFCS instead to them at below cost. Mexico can't compete against those artificial prices.

- Many Mexican farmers are put out of work when they can't produce sugar for their drinks that are more expensive than the imported subsidized stuff from us.

- Mexican elites go in and buy up these farmer's land on the cheap. (Payback for signing NAFTA and other trade deals, etc. that reward our companies).

- Mexican elites turn around and lease this land to our multinationals to create "Maquilas" (or factories producing goods to export).

- These Maquilas pick up these same farmers that are now out of work and use them as cheap outsourced labor to make cheap goods to ship back to the U.S. This causes American companies to shift much of their labor to places like this instead.

- These same companies now find they can make their goods cheaper someplace else in the Pacific. Since they don't own these maquilas, just lease them, they pack up and go to these other countries in their "race to the bottom".

- Now these workers don't have jobs at the Maquilas either. What do they do to survive? They come up here to work! Immigration issues then start.


In the case of soft drinks, Mexico tried to fight back to charge a tariff on the artificially low priced soft drink imports if they weren't made with sugar cane. The WTO stopped this (and conveniently ignored that it was U.S. companies with subsidized products that were actually destabilizing the market, not Mexico's tariffs).

So, it might be harder than you think to lobby to replace HFCS with regular sugar. It plays too much into other global strategies for the corporatists. We need to find ways of defeating them at every stage listed here so then it becomes an alternative to switch to sugar. Then hopefully will we not only be protecting our health, but our jobs, etc. too!

[mainegreen]

16. Omnivores Dillema.

I suggest you read it.

[LSK]

27. add another one to the list

I need more reading time, I have a ton lined up.

[tonkatoy57]

35. I second your recomendation

It's the most important book I've read this year. Many thought provoking topics in the book.

The section on high fructose corn syrup will make you sit up straight, put the book down, and do some serious thinking.

It mentioned the only other time we had a corn glut in the U.S. was during (I believe) the 1820's. Farmers had to turn all that corn in to a value added product...so they made corn liquor. It of course led to serious alcohol problems but also to high levels of obesity and what we now recognize as diabetes. Sound familiar?

[Abies]

42. In movie form, that section of the book is King Corn

http://www.kingcorn.net/

It's a great documentary and Michael Pollan is in it.

[defendandprotect]

26. It's not good for you and in so much kids' stuff --- and other stuff . . .

you can't get away from it!!

[chaska]

31. Corn belongs on the cob, not in our tanks...

And screw HFCS!

[cascadiance]

56. I think some in South America are complaining that Brazil, etc. are chewing up the rain forest

to create farmland for this corn for making ethanol... And that contributes to global warming too as well as reducing the biodiversity in our rain forests that's needed to stave off environmental catastrophe later.

Sot it's kind of robbing Peter to pay Paul if you're not careful.

I still think ultimately if we can get to real renewable stuff like solar where we don't have to usurp some existing resource or part of the ecosystem heavily to make up for our oil usage would be the best thing.

[Beausoleil]

69. Brazil uses cane sugar for ethanol

which is quicker and 30% less expensive to produce than US corn ethanol. That's why they are on track to become energy-independent, if they're not already. They may be using more farmland to produce cane sugar, not corn. But your point is well-taken.

Interesting article from 2006:

http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/display.article?id=6817

Over the past three decades Brazil has worked to create a viable alternative to gasoline. With its sugarcane-based fuel, the nation may become energy independent this year. Brazil’s ethanol program, which originated in the 1970s in response to the uncertainties of the oil market, has enjoyed intermittent success. Still, many Brazilians are driving “flexible fuel” cars that run on either ethanol or gasoline and allow the consumer to fill up with whichever option is cheaper – often ethanol. Countries with large fuel bills such as India and China are following Brazil’s progress closely. The US is taking small steps towards the use of ethanol, but its process, relying on corn, is lengthier and more expensive. In addition, countries such as Japan and Sweden are importing ethanol from Brazil to help fulfill their environmental obligations under the Kyoto Protocol. Running cars on carbohydrates instead of fossil fuels may not be a new idea, and ethanol has drawbacks, but the fuel offers an attractive alternative as oil prices climb. - YaleGlobal

[Pisces]

32. HFCS is banned in Europe. They are always ahead on health issues.

[LSK]

38. they seem to be ahead on many issues

When are we going to stop wandering around blindly in the dark and see what they are doing?

[cascadiance]

46. They and Japan are ahead of us and Canada on issues with Mad Cow Disease too...

Which i believe is a snake that's getting ready to bite us big time now too.

The Japanese and European countries are smart enough to see that you shouldn't be feeding recycled cow parts to ANY animal, let alone other cows, nor other recycled animal parts to cows.

Our corporate dominated regulatory industry doesn't see anything wrong with this practice. It has been shown by researches that pigs and chickens can be CARRIERS of Mad Cow disease, even if they don't manifest it themselves. So if they are fed messed up cow parts, they can carry it and then transmit it if their "parts" are fed back to cattle.

Japan and Europe keep this from happening. Here in North America where we continue to try and make things cheap at the expense of our health, we don't take this precaution.

It WILL bite us folks! And given the long time this disease can take to show itself, it probably is a big ticking time bomb now too!

[Toucano]

50. Do you have a source for that?

I found people calling for a ban, and blogs where people say it's banned, but no actual ban recorded.

[LibertyLover]

37. Jones Soda

is made without HFCS and uses sugar. The flavors are interesting - Green apple, strawberry lime, fufu. Their creme soda is excellent. And they do have a cane cola. The soda costs more but it is good. I've run into sales on the cans (12 can packs) at Safeway at 2 for $6.

[cascadiance]

45. Virgil's Root Beer is also without HFCS..

I think they make a few other soft drinks as well.

[LeftyMom]

58. Virgil's is incredibly good. They also make a cream soda and ginger soda.

Other brands that make sodas with real sugar:

-Blue Sky (not all varieties, check the ingredients)
-Santa Cruz Organics
-365, Whole Foods store brand

They're all pretty easy to find at health food stores, and a six pack doesn't cost any more than name brand sodas.

[cascadiance]

60. Boylans is also good...

Periodically Costco gets special shipments of Jones, Boylans gift packs or Virgils as well. Buy them up while you can since those aren't regularly stocked.

You can get Boylans and Virgils at Trader Joes.

[guyanakoolaid]

49. Did you ever see their Thanksgiving soda collection?

I read a blog article where they taste-tested them. I think there was a green bean casserole soda, and for sure a turkey dinner soda

[newmajority]

52. Yeah, Jones has done some weird flavors

Haven't actually been curious enough to try them, but I've seen them. I'll stick to the Green Apple and the Cream Soda. Actually, their root beer is pretty good too.

[LibertyLover]

66. I heard about it

but never found it in stores. They did a Christmas and a Hanukkah collection last year as well. Jelly doughnut was one of the Hanukkah flavors. Again, I only read about it. However my husband did find a case of their Halloween collection last year at Sam's and got it for me - it had Candy Corn (sickeningly sweet, but damned if it didn't taste like liquid candy corn), Sour Lemon (really, really sour but very good), Strawberry Slime (yummy, the best of the collection) and Gruesome Grape (a very good grape soda). Apparently some were from the 2006 collection and one or two from 2007 one. The cool thing was that they were in what I call short snort cans, mini-cans with 8 oz. of liquid in them. Great fun!

[Initech]

39. HFCS should have been banned a long time ago.

It's nasty shit.

[distantearlywarning]

41. HFCS is a big peeve of mine.

I discovered last summer that I am intolerant to it. Not to mention that it's just really, really bad for you.

Unfortunately, now I have to spend all my time at the grocery store checking labels, because it's in absolutely everything.

Luckily I have a Whole Foods close to my house, and the money to shop there. I've never found anything for sale at Whole Foods that has HFCS in it, except for a few salad dressings.

I personally believe that *as a society*, the main reason that we all suddenly started getting fatter and fatter in the 1970s and 80s is because of HFCS becoming a significant food addititve to almost everything we eat.

[cyberswede]

43. Strangely, I just read this

from the Center for Science in the Public Interest; the article is entitled Chemical Cuisine: A Guide to Food Additives

http://www.cspinet.org/new/pdf/additives.pdf

High-Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS).
Sweetener: Soft drinks, many other foods.
This mixture of two sugars (it’s about half fructose, half
glucose) has largely replaced table sugar (sucrose) in soft drinks
and many other foods because it’s cheaper. Despite the urban
myth, it’s not worse for you than sucrose. Like other sugars,
it promotes obesity, tooth decay, and—in people with high
triglycerides—heart disease.

----------------
I subscribe to the Nutrition Action Healthletter, and I think it's pretty hardcore about what is healthy to eat vs. most of the food available to us. In other words, I don't think they're apologists for the food industry. Their descriptions of other harmful additives don't seem to pull any punches. So, they recommend cutting back on HFCS, not avoiding it (as they recommend for several other additives).

[KamaAina]

44. "about half fructose, half glucose"

Therein lies the rub. As I've heard it, a team of maniacal Japanese food engineers tinkered with the ratio and came up with 55% fructose, 45% glucose. The 5% difference, much like in an election :-) , seems to be enough to screw up the system (in this case, the digestive system).

[ProfessorGAC]

47. If You Could Find The Source Of That, Could You Share It

The body metabolizes both fructose and glucose more readily than it does sucrose, which is the primary sugar in cane or beet sugars.

I'd like to know why simpler sugars are worse than more complex versions, and perhaps your source would explain it.
The Professor

[KamaAina]

48. Source is a doctor back in NYC

who leans toward the alternative side of things. So, this might be just a bit "out there". :tinfoilhat:

[otohara]

51. In 80's Weight Loss Plan - Took Out Fat, Added Sugar

that's when weight started to go up in this country. Even now, like with Hagen Dazz light - they took out the fat and added HFCS.

Read the labels - If it has HFCS in it - don't eat it, don't drink it!!!

[galledgoblin]

57. industrial agriculture is slowly choking us (n/t)

[Dorian Gray]

62. I've cut out 85% of this from my diet.

(Though I'm sure that it slips in every once in awhile.) I won't buy any products with this listed as an ingredient right now. It's totally unnecessary.

And awful for you!

[Itchinjim]

64. That crap is making me fat.

And so is the beer. But what am I gonna do? Not drink beer or Coca-Cola? Sheesh, life sure can be a bitch sometimes.

[lebkuchen]

67. I talked to a NY Food and Drug lawyer traveling in France a couple years ago

He said the HFCS was very unhealthy, genetically modified, and was in everything. In Europe, aside from the UK, you don't see HFCS on labels. Raw sugar is used as a sweetener, I suppose mostly beet sugar, which is probably why everything tastes better across the pond. Much less obesity, too.