OK guys, I have an Obama v McCain dilemma

[woodsprite]

I'm a member of a "moms" group (about 100 moms strong) and a few are lamenting that they don't know what to do come election. To make a long story short, they are feeling he has no experience and he is purely a media creation - no substance.

What can I say that will help them to see why it's important to cast their vote and not tie it to a certain VP, which is what some are trying to do?

I wanted to specifically address the Obama 'experience' comment - I have to search more, but I thought there was a previous thread that addressed that here on DU. If someone could point me to it, I'd appreciate it. I'm at work and the darned search is taking forever. Don't know if it's DU traffic or something on my system slowing things down.

I thought of just telling them why I'm *FOR* Obama, but that still leaves the experience issue still out there unanswered for them. BTW, I'm for him because he is change, he is not DLC, he is not one of the DC inner circle dynasties or one of their cronies, etc.

[Happyhippychick]

1. Simple. George Bush has a lifetime of political experience - what did that get us?

That's what I say to my friends who question Obama's experience. They have no answer for that other than "yes, I see your point."

[AlabamaBrightBlueDot]

2. Voting party lines here...

Because who (personally) holds the office is less important then what party affiliation appoints the next judges to the SCOTUS.

[zanne]

3. So they're willing to vote for the Republican instead?

In my opinion, people who site his "inexperience" as a reason to vote for McCain probably wouldn't vote for him if he had several decades of experience.

[H2O Man]

4. Easy.

They should read his books, and the biography by a journalist who knows him from Chicago. If they have not read these, they lack the "experience" needed to make an educated decision.

[flying_wahini]

5. I don't think being a "professional" politician is a good thing.

then I go on to talk about how the reason we are in the mess
we are in is because of "professionals" who don't live in the
real world. McCain is about elitist as they come.

[Mojorabbit]

6. Here is his legislative

record from illinois
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4379566
senate
http://www.votesmart.org/bio.php?can_id=BS030017
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/2/21/164117/783/290/461422
There is a better senate site but I can't find it

[logosoco]

7. For me, the whole idea that Obama has no "experience" is what I find appealing

crazy as that sounds. For too long we have had people with "experience" and i think the whole system has become stale, the "same ol', same ol'". Let's try something new. Nobody could make it any worse than bush has (except maybe mccain!).
Since this is a parents group you are talking with, you may want to point out that many people have little experience with kids, but they turn out to be very good parents!

[treestar]

8. Point out it is not a job

George Washington had very little political experience - He had never been elected to an office. He had presided over the Constitutional Convention.

Military experience - point out that military leaders get unquestioned obedience. The President does not. When Perot was running, some people thought his experience running a successful company was good, but others pointed out that as a CEO you don't have to persaude your underlings, who you are paying, to do things. They will do them because they are underlings. Congress will not be an underling.

The President has to be inspiring and persuasive, and anyone can have that ability without having been in politics before. Obama is a lawyer, trained to be persuasive. He is obviously inspiring.


Here is his resume: when you get down to reading it, it is impressive.
http://obamasresume.org/

[DogPoundPup]

9. What 'substance' does McLame have when he cast his first wife aside

for a rich younger woman?

[treestar]

10. And also his so-called experience can be used against him

Contradictory positions on issues, of which he has quite a few. Support of bills that now would be unpopular.

[DogPoundPup]

15. Absolutely!! Fact check everything McLame claims in his 'experience'

AS IN: McCain's Katrina claim gets rapidly fact-checked

At a press conference today in Louisiana, McCain was asked why he had voted against launching a commission to investigate the government response to Katrina.

His response: “I have supported every investigation and ways of finding out what caused the tragedy.”

But, as both the DNC and Obama campaign are quick to point out, he opposed proposals in 2005 and 2006 to create a congressional commission. (The Obama campaign notes that Senator Clinton co-sponsored both Senate amendments.)

The McCain campaign says that he didn't know about the specific votes....
http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/0608/McCains_Katrina_claim_gets_rapidly_factchecked.html

McLame is an "experienced prevaricator" (liar) just like his hero 'Lil Bush.

[crikkett]

11. Anyone but McCain

If your group is Moms...

...McCain's campaign is run by lobbyists, one of whom was hired by a French Bank to lobby for legislation to help them (the F.Bank) through the subprime meltdown. So he's not helping Moms with their houses, his advisers/lobbyists are helping the banks.

...McCain's campaign is run by lobbyists, one of whom worked up until recently for the Junta in Myanmar. Remember the Buddhist monks of Myanmar? So he's not for religious freedom, he's for transnational corps.

...McCain doesn't respect life. He was a hotdogger in Vietnam (it's not as cool as it is in Top Gun, now, Hot Dogging is dangerous and costly and it got his ass shot down in Vietnam) and he is a hotdogger now: remember the stunt of walking through the streets of Baghdad? Safe and sound with only an entire battalion of guards and six helicopter gunships just off-screen? The next day 21 innocent shopkeepers were killed in retaliation. He KNEW that this would happen and didnt' care, or he DIDN't KNOW this would happen and is the most astonishingly stupid veteran I've ever known and I speak as a vet.

I could go on about the lobbyists, there are more tricky situations with lobbyists (abramoff?) who aren't involved in his campaign at the moment, but I have to go clean out my fridge before the trash is picked up.

[Richardo]

12. Remind them that Abraham Lincoln was a one-term Congressman

...who had been out of office for over a decade when he was elected President. No other President has been more tested in office than he, nor more successful. Conversely, some of the most 'experienced' have been among the worst Presidents.

President of the United States is not a job anyone can fully prepare for. You have to have the ability to think quickly and rationally, multi-task like a bastard, articulate your vision and have incredible physical stamina. Which of the current candidates fits THAT profile better?

[Th1onein]

13. Pretty simple to answer. Here you go:

In his first year in the U.S. Senate, Barack Obama authored 152 bills and co-sponsored another 427. These included:

The Coburn-Obama Government Transparency Act of 2006 (became law)
The Lugar-Obama Nuclear Non-proliferation and Conventional Weapons Threat Reduction Act (became law)
The Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act (passed the Senate)
The 2007 Government Ethics Bill (became law)
The Protection Against Excessive Executive Compensation Bill (in committee)
Since entering the U.S. Senate, Senator Obama has written 890 bills and co-sponsored another 1096.

For more on Senator Obama’s legislative accomplishments, see: factcheck.barackobama.com

On edit: You know, this bullshit talking point is just like any other bullshit Repug talking point--no substance to it. Barack Obama has one HELL of a track record.

[ColbertWatcher]

14. The election isn't until November.

"...a few are lamenting that they don't know what to do come election. To make a long story short, they are feeling he has no experience and he is purely a media creation - no substance."

If they are good citizens, or want to be, they have all summer to do research on the candidates.

If they want to be fair, they will go to their web pages and read up.

If they want answers to some questions, go to a rally and demand some time with the candidate or write letters.

They have all the time to undo the illusion created by the media.

If they want to do it.

[lonestarnot]

16. Here, give them this.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=6180527

[underpants]

17. Being wrong for 20 years isn't GOOD experience

and any time someone goes negative just ask what McCain has to offer

[Richardo]

18. Touche!

:patriot:

[underpants]

19. that reminds me

I need to sign up as a volunteer for Obama

We have a world to save !!!

[Lars39]

20. Do these moms not care at all about their reproductive freedoms?

They can kiss 'em goodbye if McCain is elected.

[woodsprite]

21. Many of them have gone thru major infertility issues, so I would think 'yes'. n/t

[Lars39]

25. Somebody just posted his position on Roe v Wade:

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/95b18512-d5b6-456e-90a2-12028d71df58.htm

[lame54]

22. Show 'em this pic...

[woodsprite]

27. Ewwww! Looks like Rush Limbaugh with white hair. n/t

[harun]

23. Others have cited excellent reasons but I would also bring up that being

a politician in Washington as many years as McCain has been there makes a lot of enemies. Getting anything done with a Dem House a Dem Senate and another Repub veto machine as President will be next to impossible. They want Health Care reform, forget it. They want good Supreme Court Judges, forget it. They want the occupation of Iraq to end some day, forget it. They want something done about the high cost of college education, forget it.

The Repub's and Dem's would just sabotage each others bills for another 4 years with McCain. I don't think any of those mothers could be optimistic about that kind of future.

[Orsino]

24. You can ask them what good "experience" has done in recent years.

I consider a lack of Washington experience to be a distinct asset these days. "Experience" nowadays is just another word for business as usual, and business as usual has terrorized, destabilized, pauperized and tyrannized the country for many years.

Do moms want more of the same?

[woodsprite]

26. You guys 'wrote' this letter, so I wanted to let you know how it was received.

It 'exploded' the threads in a good way! Thank you so much! Here is how I compiled and edited everything you guys gave me, plus some stuff that I told them. Hope you don't mind I used alot of your words. Some of the moms said "I had no idea" and said they'd definitely look further into Obama before making any decision. Other's told how they felt so strongly over this election and Obama's running for change, that they voted absentee for the first time ever, instead of just not voting. Even some of the pubbies said they didn't realize those things about McCain. I also added links to DU, all the links you included, plus a few others.

Here's what I sent them.
-------------------------------------------------------
Moms,

Being a professional politician is not necessarily a good thing. They
look at politics as a 'business' and money-making machine for themselves
instead of representing the people who elected them. Think about it, most of these 'professional' politicians do not live in the real world that we live in on a day-to-day basis.

Our current pres. has had a lifetime of political experience, but what did it get us? A few refunds on our taxes, over 4000 soldiers killed in Iraq for oil, loss of jobs thru outsourcing or closing companies, loss of regulations on imports/food products/drugs, sky-high groceries, gasoline and diesel - even the darned time change and mattresses (you need a prescription to get a pesticide and flame retardant-free mattress since 2007). This admin has f'd up everything they have touched - unless you're a defense, pharma, or oil contractor or one of their investors. I'm afraid a McCain presidency would be nothing more than a 3rd term for Bush Co.

Obama is a lawyer who comes from a community service background. He
worked his way up to the Illinois Senate where he sponsored more than 800 bills. In the 2006 Congressional Scorecard, he was voted as one of the best US Senators for Children, as was Hillary. In his first year in the US Senate, Obama authored 152 bills and co-sponsored another 427 - some of which were the Gov't Transparency Act, Nuclear non-proliferation threat reduction act, Immigration Reform Act, Gov't Ethics Bill, etc. Since entering the US Senate, he has written 890 bills and co-sponsored another 1096 bills.

I'm for Obama because he represents the change that needs to take place in DC. He ran a fairly clean campaign. He's not a member of the DLC
(Democratic Leadership Council), which has turned into nothing but a
republican-leaning chapter of the Democrats (created in part and supported by my senator Tom Carper and the Clintons). He's also not a member of the DC inner circle dynasties. I think a break from that is a good thing. If Clinton had won, we would have been under either a Clinton or Bush for over 20 years. Obama also didn't vote to put our service members in harms way in Iraq.

McCain's campaign is run by lobbyists, one of which was hired by a French bank to lobby for legislation to help them thru the subprime meltdown, another one who until recently worked for the Junta in Myanmar, with more info trickling out daily. He was recently asked why he voted against investigating the govt response to Katrina. He said he supported every investigation and way of finding out what caused this tragedy, but in truth, he opposed proposals in both 2005 and 2006 - both co-sponsored by Clinton. If McCain is elected, will he go ahead and "Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran" or solidify his desire to keep our soldiers engaged in the Middle East for 100 years?

Our founding father had very little political experience when he became
President, except presiding over Constitutional Convention. One of our most beloved Presidents, Abraham Lincoln, was a single-term congressman who had been out of office for over 10 years before being elected, while some of our most politically 'experienced' have been among our worst Presidents.

President of the United States is not a job anyone can fully prepare for. You have to have the ability to think quickly and rationally, multi-task like a fiend, articulate your vision and have incredible physical stamina. It's the admin under the Pres who carries out that vision.

This is just the tip of the iceberg AND just the start of the general
election campaign season. There are alot of places to find out additional information regarding both candidates. Don't take only what they say as truth - research and read all sides.

Truthfully, we also have to be concerned with what party affiliation
appoints the next judges to the Supreme Court, so that should be a factor in decisions also.

[mdmc]

28. Just turn them on to Bob Barr

and wait until we have a veep:kick:

[JNelson6563]

29. Similar experience to that one loser...what's his name again...?

Oh yeah, Lincoln.