a legal question regarding impeachment

[historian]

if bush is impeached or merely steps down can he then be charged with a class action suit of murder begun by the parents of soldiers killed? Of is asshole simply going to walk away with a large pension?

[NYC Liberal]

1. Yes, either way...

"Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law"

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Impeachment and CONVICTION in the senate

opens him to all kinds of legal liabilities of both civil and criminal nature

Oh and the pension is gone

[lpbk2713]

5. He'll have to sell the Paraguayan water fields.

:rofl: :rofl:

[Ichingcarpenter]

6. It can also happen when he is out of office

There are no rules on time.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. Exactomundo, Impeachment has no term limits

but we only get one bite

[Ichingcarpenter]

11. this is a critical point that fucking Conyers doesn't get

Although I think he does, but is one of his major liar points to the public on his reasons not to impeach.

He could start the fricking procedings now and tie up the supreme court
before and even after the election.


I find Conyers disingenuous.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. You are being nice.. at this point in time I expect the next

administration to KICK IT under the carpet... PERIOD, for the tranquility of the people

I mean, we must move forwards don't you know?

:mad:

[Ichingcarpenter]

19. tranquility of the people by the time of elections

will not be easily pacified. The economic meltdown will
demand either token scapegoats or justice for their plight.

The meltdown that is coming can no longer be hid
by those in power. By Fall it will be nasty.

I'm glad that my Dad lived through the Great depression
in Oklahoma, I am beginning to understand the frugality
he tried to teach us all his life.


I think even some democrats in cohoots with the power structure
don't get what is coming down.

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. My dad lived through WW II

and he always told us, DO NOT buy anything on credit

Well we have followed that example, even if we have to wait at times for years.... to buy something

But the coming disaster, we are readier than most

[Ashy Larry]

3. I think they call it "wrongful death" in civil court.

That's what OJ was sued for.

[papapi]

4. But if dick 'Brut' cheney replaces him he will pardon him...

we need to get rid of both of these bastards at the same time or boot cheney first. Pelosi is second in line for the White House if dick and dog go.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Pardons are not active if they are given to hide a crime

at the very least it will end up at the USSC... and yes I am aware who is in charge

[tritsofme]

14. How do you figure?

In the past, the presidential pardon power has been described as absolute and unreviewable.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. If you read the statue... at the very least it will end up

in a court of law... and it should be changed and this is what it might take

Anyway, of we don't do a thing... our economy is in shambles and the world will get creative to get these people to a court of law

Ah many ways to skin a cat, and none of them is preferred if you are the cat.

And I am almost positive I heard one of the legal eagles Keith interviews regularly mention this as well

[TahitiNut]

17. Presidential pardon power is unlimited with respect to federal crimes.

The only FEDERAL action that cannot be pardoned by a President is impeachment (of anyone). Pardons may be PREEMPTIVE or done at any time before or after conviction ... even before any formal recognition that a crime has occurred.

The chances are (imho) 99% that Dubya will pardon everyone in his administration (esp. himself, Cheney, Gonzo, etc.) before leaving office. The only way to prevent that would be to impeach him and remove him from office, along with Cheney. Even then, he could conceivably pardon himself and Cheney against any further prosecution.

The ray of (far out) hope I see is that War Crimes are INTERNATIONAL (beyond the pardon power) in nature and could be prosecuted in one of several countries that claim universal jurisdiction for such matters. Since neither the U.S. nor Iraq were signatories to the I.C.C., the 'normal' standing doesn't apply. However, one the "coalition" countries could claim standing based on their own military deaths.

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. And if he pardons himself and later on we have impeachment

I can bet this will end up at the USSC

But he will never be able to leave the country... Pinochet's fate will be his

[MonkeyFunk]

22. huh?

Where is that in the constitution?

[Jack Rabbit]

9. If he is impeached and removed, he may not get a pension

Otherwise, from Article 1, Section 3:

Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law.

[TwixVoy]

10. No

Because he will pardon him self and everyone in his cabal before he leaves office.

[sandnsea]

12. I don't think the military can sue

Parents might have to get creative and find some kind of abuse of property statutes.

[nadinbrzezinski]

15. They could over property, how medical docs are now getting sued

over malpractice...

In that sense you are right... but.... charges from Iraqis before the World Court are not that far off

[Ichingcarpenter]

21. I was gonna write an OP on this

My Dad who is 93 called me tonight and we talked
about the great depression and the times at hand.

He sees parallels in today's society that alarms him, and he's a conservative
in the old school way.

He said even though he made $2 a day during those times
he could still go to college and he did.

He made us turn off unnessary power in the house throughout our lifes
and conserve things.

I use to laugh at him in the late 80s when he put
zip lock baggies in the diswasher to recycle them
when he made $60 thousand in retirement from his years in the military.

Now, it is not a joke.