The Marginalization of Kucinich as some "Looney Leftist" in this country just shows how...

[Solon]

conservative this nation is. In any other Western Democracy on the planet, and quite a few other democracies in the World, Kucinich would be labeled as a mainstream social democrat, left of center, but not radical or anything. But here in the United States, we are "different", our nation is so conservative that Kucinich is routinely marginalized as some radical leftist when he is anything but that.

This just shows how fucked up our nation is. When the guy with the correct ideas is marginalized, and the idiots run this nation, all I can say is that we're fucked.

[Eric Condon]

1. Moreover, it's even more sad considering that he's what every politician in this country could be

if they'd just show some backbone sometimes.

Dennis is my hero, and as long as he is ever in any presidential campaign, I'll support him. I can't even begin to imagine the possibilities this country could have if it were led by Dennis and people like him.

[Truth2Tell]

2. I'm not sure

it shows how conservative the people are, or just how conservative the media is. If the MSM made the choice to "play this up" instead of ridicule it, my bet is a majority of people would clamor for more.

I think people are just compliant to zombie TeeVee, not necessarily conservative.

[Solon]

4. That's a reasonable argument, and the media does have an influence on the "tone" of our politics...

So a conservative media equals a conservative body politic. The problem is that it doesn't help that both political parties are complicit in this situation.

[Truth2Tell]

6. I don't think there's really conservative

ideology at work with the American people - just compliance with the conventional wisdom expressed by opinion makers. If the same people told America to be progressive tomorrow, I think we would be.

[southerncrone]

12. The MSM is certainly driving the boat when it comes to control of the minds of most Americans

but I don't think the media itself is conservative. More that it has been bought out by conservatives.

And anyone who doesn't think that the media is owned by the conservative right, need only look to today's news. I watched all the MSM news channels & NEVER saw a story about Kucinich entering the impeachment articles into the record. Not even on any of the screen crawls. Hidden on their websites if on there at all, too.

But more than the MSM, the conservative Republicans have used the churches to do their campaigning for them. If you want to control an individual, then influence his belief system. The Repubs have indoctrinated the Christian citizens to believe if you don't support Republican candidates, then you are not a "good Christian". Very sly, but very effective.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

37. Mostly the evangelical/fundamentalist churches

My (Episcopal) church's parking lot was a regular display of Kerry stickers in 2004.

[southerncrone]

40. I can understand that. Looking at your username that makes sense.

But look at my name.....you know what I've got to deal with down here!

It's suffocating! The repubs have USED these people so bad!

[bananas]

9. "Political Compass"

Most of the Dem candidates are right-wing authoritarians.
http://www.politicalcompass.org/usprimaries2008

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

18. How do I upload an image from my hard drive?

I want to post a response to the above chart.

[bananas]

19. tinypic.com

http://www.tinypic.com/

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

20. Here's my response!

Economic -5.12, Social -4.87:



As expected, I'm well to the left of the Democratic Party establishment.

[RufusTFirefly]

11. Bingo! Truth2Tell has it right.

Sadly, the MSM defines how many people think. The implicit assumption is that if what DK did and said was truly important the MSM would cover it. If they don't, the sad conclusion from many (even intelligent people who should know better) is that what DK did was unimportant. Next!!!

Besides, he looks like a Keebler Elf. And everyone knows that one's resemblance to a Keebler Elf has a direct connection to the veracity of one's ideas and policies. It's just that simple.

[SergeyDovlatov]

3. he strays too far from the safe center

I do not believe it is left vs. right issue.
It is more, do not rock the boat, issue.

You want everything to be orderly, nothing radical from either left or right.

[LWolf]

30. If that were true, GWB wouldn't have been president.

Of course, when you arbitrarily move the "center" to the right wing, then your point holds.

[SergeyDovlatov]

34. people go by what politician say, not by what they actually do

I remember debates Gore vs Bush.

Bush was a dove. He was against military intervention abroad. Humble foreign policy, no nation building. Criticizing Clinton for interventions in Haiti, Kosovo, Somalia, etc. (and then decided to invade the world)

He was against big government (and then increased government spending 200% not counting emergency war spending)

Sure. After they got to power they used all of their power to scare the heck out of the people so that they will be bamboozled to vote for him again in 2004.

[eridani]

5. So, who gets to define the "center"?

Eisenhower perhaps?

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children."

"A preventive war, to my mind, is an impossibility today. How could you have one if one of its features would be several cities lying in ruins, several cities where many, many thousands of people would be dead and injured and mangled, the transportation systems destroyed, sanitation implements and systems all gone? That isn't preventive war; that is war."

"Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes you can do these things. Among them are H. L. Hunt (you possibly know his background), a few other Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or business man from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid."

"It is my personal conviction that almost any one of the newborn states of the world would far rather embrace Communism or any other form of dictatorship than acknowledge the political domination of another government, even though that brought to each citizen a far higher standard of living."

[Fire Walk With Me]

7. Gas is $4.50 average in LA right now. I call Kucinich a hero for saying "BULLSHIT" to BushCo.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

8. Well I don't think the pendulum can go much further right

Trust me, we've come about as far right as we can without the consequences slapping the American mainstream in the face. Actually, they already are. It's just that most (60%) of Americans haven't quite figured out what is wrong yet. Would the hard core conservative agenda stand up in the event of a really severe recession? Or if the income distribution continues to spread apart, will supply side ideas be able to hold on to hearts and minds?

The pendulum has drifted about as far right as it will go. The tension that our current economic and military scenario (not to mention the disproportionate power of the Religious Reich) has brought is bound to backfire. Even if the GOP manages to hold the White House for four more years (heaven forbid that actually happens!) their agenda is simply not sustainable in the long run.

I'm quite a bit like Kucinich: by European standards I would be considered very slightly left of center. Here, however, our "conservatives" like to think of my ideas as looney, utopian, and somehow treasonous. Maybe they should take a trip to Europe and try speaking their mind over there - at least they'll get a reverse version of what I experience as an American!

[Breeze54]

10. You can thank Raygun and others for pulling this country to the right....

Neoconservatism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoconservatism

Neoconservatism is a political philosophy that emerged in the United States from the rejection of the social liberalism, moral relativism, and New Left counterculture of the 1960s. It influenced the presidential administrations of Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush, representing a realignment in American politics, and the defection of some liberals to the right side of the political spectrum; hence the term, which refers to being 'new' conservatives.

The term neoconservative was originally used as a criticism against liberals who had "moved to the right"

------------

The term liberal hawk refers to an individual generally described as politically liberal who supports a hawkish foreign policy, as opposed to a foreign policy of not using force to intervene with conflicts around the world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Hawk

Modernly the term is most frequently used to describe liberals and leftists who supported or still support the decision to invade Iraq in 2003, which was authorized by the United States Congress and ordered by a conservative president, George W. Bush.

I can name a few and HRC comes to mind, right off the bat.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

38. We can thank Reagan and the many "moderate" Dems who supported him

every step of the way. Only a few lonely voices consistently spoke up against the economic war on the poor or the suppression of Central American popular movements--and this was when the Dems had a majority in both houses of Congress.

[Breeze54]

39. Exactly but I was to tired last night to mention names and

get in a board war... :eyes: Thanks for saying the rest! ... and better than I ever could have! ;)

[LibDemAlways]

13. "the idiots run this nation" What's pathetic about that is that

it's the average uninformed ignorant voter who makes elections close enough for the idiots to steal in the first place. If we had an electorate with half a brain the Bush Crime Family would never have gotten anywhere near the WH and it wouldn't be necessary for one of the few elected representatives who takes his job seriously (Kucinich) to draw up articles of impeachment. Dennis is just doing the job he was elected to do. Wish there were hundreds more like him.

[flvegan]

14. The word is "stupid" not "conservative"

Seriously, the bought-n-paid for media aside, it just shows how stupid the masses are.

Vote Republican, it's easier than thinking.

[Mr. Blonde]

27. Ever think

that the reason we have trouble attracting people is because we are condescending towards them? "You voted for Bush? You fuckin' moron! I don't know if I can have anything to do with you. Seriously? What is your problem? Did you eat paint chips as a child?"

Not exactly a constructive way to bring people into the fold. Or effective I might add.

[Nihil]

43. Yeah ... honesty really isn't a good move at election time is it?

> "You voted for Bush? You fuckin' moron! ..."

I'd also add "And after four years of shit, you voted for him again?!".

Unfortunately, when nobody "dares" to counter the problem it is
taken as acquiescence and so nothing changes (regardless of the
details of the various election slogans).
:shrug:

[Mr. Blonde]

54. Honesty works

but I think it should be far more focused on the postives of the Democratic party rather than the negatives of the Repbulicans.

And regardless of what we think of Bush voters, we need them to win. I suppose it is possible to win without them, but that involves getting people who didn't vote out. If they weren't willing to vote last time who says they will this time.

I know Obama has done very well in getting youth out to vote for him so far, but that is a very rickety basket to put eggs in. And I say that as a youth (I'm hanging on that title for a little longer).

[TreasonousBastard]

15. Well, there are several things going on here...

not the least of which is that marginalization of the left-- the modern version of the project has been going on at least since FDR made his first enemy, but its roots go way back. Anybody remember "Governor Moonbeam"? They made that moniker sound like a good thing.

No matter what we would like to think, this has always been a very conservative country and what we would now consider "liberals" in the past have not fared well overall. Periodically they had an effect, but soon enough things went back to normal. It's just that in the usual streetfights of US politics, money beats the shit out of ideology every day.

Thing with Kucinich, though, is that only a few of his ideas are looney, and most of them really should be given a fair hearing. Problem there is while the ideas aren't looney, Kucinich is.

So, we gots us a largely conservative population that may have caught on that Shrub is an asshole, thief, or both, but still has fond thoughts about Reagan, and believes Clinton and Carter were liberals. Don't blame it all on the press-- the problem goes a lot deeper than that when you have maybe half our college students not knowing who their Senators are, or what Senators even do.

And heeeeere's Dennis, walking right into this maelstrom of ignorance not having the slightest clue that most people don't have the foggiest idea what he's talking about, or give a shit about it. And him not having the slightest clue how to get any of the movers and shakers who can get any of this on the table on his side.

[ConsAreLiars]

16. Not "our nation" but "their media."

Transnational Corporate Capitalism controls everything you see on the TV and hear on radio, with very, very few exceptions. This shows how fucked up THEY are, not us. We are getting fucked, but that doesn't mean we, the people, are fucked up and implicitly at fault.

[Dammit Ann]

17. Bingo.

It is beyond me to stomach the stupidity any longer.

[earth mom]

21. No you've got it wrong. The corporate media is conservative & they control the message.

Not only that but corporations are running this country and they say what goes and Congress follows those orders.

The corporate bastards are the ones who are marginalizing Kucinich and the majority of the liberal and caring people in this country-EVERY FUCKING CHANCE THEY GET.

I have NO doubt the majority of this country is liberal and that they would Impeach * & Co in a nanosecond given the chance. :grr:

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

22. I dunno...

Yes there are plenty of liberal ideas out there that aren't getting their fair voice. But the fact is that on many issues, the average American IS more conservative than the average European.

However our corporate-dominated media and right wing think tanks have exacerbated the difference even further.

[Solon]

23. I think you underestimate the media's influence...

not to mention the conservative culture of this nation. For example, Americans are extremely nationalistic, and, as a consequence, they are easily manipulated on a number of different issues. Name a social program conservatives hate, and they will call its socialist and "un(anti-) American) and people fall for that framing, every fucking time. The media aids in this farce, and as a result, we have almost half the eligible citizens do not vote, and while other half do, against their own self interests about half the time.

In foreign policy, this is even more obvious, most Americans now oppose the Iraq war, and that's great, except for the fact that they oppose it only because they see no gain in it for themselves. If Bush were to guarantee that gas prices would drop 2 dollars a gallon as the result of a new war, the American public would buy it, hook line and sinker.

This isn't to say the American people are stupid, quite the opposite. The problem is that they are burned out, Americans are being, quite literally, worked to death, trying to make ends meet on inadequate pay at multiple jobs, and most of them simply do not have the time to keep themselves informed on the issues that most affect them. Indeed, because of the media's outright denial that any such issues exist, the American people are largely kept ignorant.

On a related note, yes, a majority of Americans support many liberal issues, but there's just one little problem with that, they need a liberal political party to actually represent those issues, and there is no such party in this country that is viable. This could be why we see so much institutional baggage in our own government that prevents changes from occurring.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

24. If we could do an ideological 'purge' of the Democratic Party...

If we can find a way to get the conservative Democrats out of power positions, then maybe we can see more change. But part of the problem has to do with the more liberal wing of the party being afraid to take bold positions.

All this assumes, of course, that the electorate does not react negatively against a more solidly liberal stance within the Dems.

[Solon]

25. Purging the Democratic party will guarantee a minority status for it...

for something close to a decade, then the purge would have been for nothing. A large part of the problem is structural, with our first past the post districting system, we are locked into two political parties that more resemble coalitions than cohesive political parties. This leads to confusion, hell, half the time, even I don't know what the Democratic party, as a whole, stands for, because it stands for nothing, just like the Republican party. This is part of the reason why, when you talk to independents, they talk about voting for the person, not the party.

The fact is that people in this country come in all varieties, but that isn't reflected by the two political parties we have, but actually by the various factions WITHIN each party. The fact that people attach labels such as "Democrat" or "Republican" to themselves is actually meaningless as a benchmark to figure out what they stand for.

[LWolf]

31. I don't think that's accurate.

If it were all the media, we wouldn't hear supposedly "liberal" politicians espousing centrist and even right-wing themes repeatedly.

While someone recently called Obama "the most liberal senator," he is as centrist as they come, and further right than any democrat should be, imo, on some issues.

[Truth2Tell]

44. "liberal" politicians espouse those themes

because they have been sold a phony bill of goods by the professional consultant class that infects the Democratic Party. Much of the conventional wisdom about finding the center and "swing voters," etc. is political baloney.

There is an element within our Party (DLC etc.) that has managed to successfully spread the false meme that it's politically dangerous to be very progressive. They do this because the mythology serves their policy interests.

[LWolf]

52. I can't argue with that.

Unfortunately, I think you are correct. :(

[Lorien]

36. Bingo. See post #35. n/t

[1]

26. dennis could and should have edited himself on the impeachment points to the most important...

bring up the iraq war, torture, valerie plame, domestic surveillance....

present these strong arguments in 30 minutes or less. clear. concise. strong. to the point.


when he goes on and on and on for hours and hours and hours about pat tillman and global warming and 9/11 first responders he looks like a fucking idiot about impeachment.

less is more, dennis.

dennis has a heart of gold but he is clueless as to how to connect with the common man.

[eridani]

46. If that's the case, how come he got some of the loudest cheers in the debates?

Specifically the union one.

[MiniMe]

28. Shirley Maclaine and the right-wing media did a little of that by hyping up the UFO question

What Kuch said is that he saw "something", but he doesn't know what it was.

[BlooInBloo]

47. And that they talked to him.

[Echo In Light]

29. While discussing politics last week in an elevator with a dem woman who is a lawyer, she exclaimed

...that DK "is crazy." She offered nothing to back it up. Her father was present, informing me she had gone to the same law school that Obama attended.

In my estimation, this mindset speaks volumes about the conditioning of the public mind here in the states: many, even those card carrying dems, seem to move further and further away from progressive/leftist ideals the higher up the $uccess ladder their egos prompt them to climb ... which is exactly what the prevailing social systems encourage - SELL OUT.

[windoe]

32. Politics trumps Truth and Justice--

Kucinich was my first choice, because he speaks plain truth. And the fact that he admitted he saw something in the sky was simply that is what happened--he tells simple truth. It is truly sad that people cannot tolerate or simply recognize a truth teller. Truth is not left, or right--this distortion of reality marginalizes those that represent us.

How corrupt is Washington when someone who stands up for what is right is made into a clown?

How vast is the power of the military industrial corporate complex?

Obama certainly has to act within the rules, or he is out of the game like Kucinich, he too would be marginalized. How dangerous a game is he playing in this bid for presidency?

[rudy23]

33. It's the Fallacy of the Middle--Repubs know how to play it, and we are suckers for it every time.

The Fallacy of the Middle is a common fallacy that's at the center of our political debate today.

Example: If I drive my car off the road, and knock down someone's $1000 mailbox, I should owe them $1000, right? Well, if I claimed I owed nothing, and the owner wanted $1000, and we settled on $500, the owner of the mailbox would be screwed out of $500. The middle isn't always right--it really has little to do with truth.

The Repubs know this, and that's why they have no qualms about setting the goalposts in radical territory. They know that the compromising Dems will keep following them to the "center" until they look down and realize they're as far right as the conservatives they grew up railing against. They're suckers--it's the same trick every time. Even intelligent friends that I have fall for this, routinely. It's so frustrating!

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

48. That's the big problem, and the only way to fight it is to...

Take a tough stand in favor of progressive and leftist ideals, completely willing to defend them on moral grounds and everything else.

[Lorien]

35. Our media has sold us all a lie about how "conservative" we are:

The Myth of Conservative America by Mike Hall

Ever since Newt Gingrich & Co. came on the scene in 1994, we’ve heard the following drumbeat over and over: America is not just swinging to the right, it’s rushing to the right. American voters are more deeply conservative in their views than ever before. It’s time to kiss progressive politics goodbye when it comes to economic and social issues.

Just because something is loudly repeated over and over, doesn’t mean it’s right—or should we say correct?

But a new report by Media Matters for America and the Campaign for America Future—The Progressive Majority: Why Conservative America is a Myth, shows that most of us in the United States are far more tolerant, open and progressive in our views than we are characterized as by pundits and commentators.

And those pundits and commentators declaring the nation’s rightward spin are not just the Rush Limbaughs or the talking heads on Fox News. The report finds the nation’s mainstream media is repeating the same mantra.

It should come as no surprise that conservative media figures repeat the myth that most Americans share their views. Even when Democrats win, conservatives claim that their ideology is still dominant.

But it was not just conservatives; in fact, they were simply repeating what they had heard mainstream journalists say for some time. “This is basically not a liberal country,” said John Harris, then of The Washington Post and now of The Politico, in May 2005. “It’s a conservative country. Previewing the Democrats’ prospects for victory three weeks before the 2006 election, CNN senior political correspondent Candy Crowley asserted that Democrats have been “on the losing side of the values debate, the defense debate and, oh yes, the guns debate. (Crowley presented no evidence that Democrats had been “on the losing side” of any of these debates.)

Starting with what became post-election conventional wisdom that Democrats won such a sweeping victory and control of Congress last November because their candidates had moved to the right to appeal to voters, the report begins to dismantle the America-is-firmly-conservative myth.

In truth, however, the Democratic class of 2006 was remarkably progressive. According to a survey conducted by Media Matters, all 30 newly elected House Democrats who took Republican seats advocated raising the minimum wage, supported changing course in Iraq, and opposed any effort to privatize Social Security. All but two supported embryonic stem cell research and only five described themselves as “pro-life” on the issue of abortion. Thirty-seven House and Senate candidates who promoted “fair trade” rather than “free trade” won; none of them lost.

The journalists straining to interpret 2006 as a validation of conservatism were following a pattern they had established long before: Democratic victories are understood as the product of the Democrats moving to the right, while Republican victories are the product of a conservative electorate.

(For a different view from November, click here.)

For example, in the 1994 midterm elections after Gingrich and company scored big, The New York Times declared (and this was not an editorial) “the country has unmistakably moved to the right.” Ten years later on President Bush’s re-election, the paper proclaimed it was “the clearest confirmation yet” of the nation’s rightward swing.

Just how conservative are Americans? The report took independent, nonpartisan polling data—gathered over the course of 20 years by sources such as American National Election Studies, the General Social Survey and Gallup Polls to see just how accurate these grand proclamations of continental drift to the right are. Not very. Here are some of the key findings:

The role of government—69 percent of Americans believe the government “should care for those who can’t care for themselves;” twice as many people (43 percent vs. 20 percent) want “government to provide many more services even if it means an increase in spending” as wanted government to provide fewer services “in order to reduce spending.”
The economy—77 percent of Americans think Congress should increase the minimum wage; 66 percent believe “upper-income people” pay too little in taxes; 53 percent feel the Bush tax cuts have failed because they have increased the deficit and caused cuts in government programs.
Unions—59 percent of Americans have a favorable view unions—more than twice as many (29 percent) who hold unfavorable views and more people want unions to have greater influence in the country as opposed to less (38 percent to 30 percent)
Trade—48 of percent Americans says “free trade” has cost U.S. jobs while just 12 percent believe such trade policies have created U.S. jobs.
Health care—69 percent of Americans think it is the responsibility of the federal government to make sure all Americans have access to health coverage; 76 percent find access to health care more important than maintaining the Bush tax cuts; three in five would be willing to have their own taxes increased to achieve universal coverage.
Security—4 percent of Americans say we are spending too much on our military; 60 percent feel the federal government should do more about restricting the kinds of guns that people can purchase.
The environment—75 percent of Americans would be wiling to pay more for electricity if it were generated by renewable sources to help reduce global warming; 79 percent want higher emissions standards for automobiles.
Social issues—61 percent of Americans support embryonic stem cell research; 62 percent want to protect Roe v. Wade; only 3 percent of Americans rank gay marriage as the “most important” social issue.
The 31-page report (click here to download a PDF version) makes fascinating reading and gives folks some good ammunition the next time some talking head or political commentators looks out of your TV or writes in your newspaper that progressive movement is doomed because we’re a deeply conservative nation.

It’s a myth.

http://www.democratictalkradio.com/wordpress/?p=441

[Lydia Leftcoast]

41. In my observation, a lot of would-be Democrats have been led to believe

(with plenty of help from DLC types) that "liberal" means liberal on personal behavior issues only and conservative otherwise.

They're hurting economically, but the Dems appear to be complicit with the "free" trade crowd, and no matter who is in charge, life just seems to get harder and harder.

The Republicans of course do nothing for people struggling with the economy, but they're masters at playing to racism ("Tax and spend Democrats want to take the tax dollars of hardworking Americans and give them to welfare queens"--and everyone understands what color those alleged "welfare queens" are) and future shock ("That kind of thing would never have been allowed when I was a kid"). This leads to the misconception that the Republicans "understand ordinary Americans."

In one sense, they do. They understand them as a target population in marketing terms.

[earth mom]

55. Excellent Post!

:thumbsup:

[DemocracyInaction]

42. Olberman last night

He had on Jonathan Turley (sp?) the Constitutional Law Prof from Georgetown. Turley remarked how important it is for Dennis to have this read into the record. He slammed our Dems for their compliance and capitualtion over the years of this administration, saying they had to trip over constitutional violations every day from their walk from the House floor to their offices. The landscape is littered with horrible violations of the US Constitution and they made not one peep. He and Wexler are the only two people in that whole damn Congress who are not guilty of criminality or criminal neglect. We have NO "of the people" any more...that died long ago.

[Cleita]

45. If you watched Jon Stewart last night he did a montage of various

anchors on various cable shows but mostly Faux labeling liberals as "latte liberals" etc. When all put together this way, it really made them look stupid. I think this is what the left needs to do is amplify the stupidity and ignorance every time they attack us with their lapses of logic and straw men. If we let them get away with it, then it's easy for them to project those images on Kucinich and other Democrats as looney.

[cui bono]

49. up. He's one of the few who routinely fight to save our country.

And holds its ideals close to his heart.

Now that's loony!

:silly:

[Generator]

50. Yep I suppose if he was better looking

he'd already be dead. Good looking truth tellers with power? OH NO. Can't have that. He is marginalized because he isn't pretty. Also because he's anti-war. Must have war to give profits to corporations. Which reminds me:

I noticed the biggest lobbyist group in the country is the American Chamber of Commerce. It sounds so quaint and well yes, American. But they probably ended John Edwards campaign, because he was cute and a truth teller. They like money mostly. I was thinking some think it's sexism or racism that's the big factor-oh no it's CLASS-who has the money and who doesn't. Those that have it intend to keep it and not spread it to those that don't.

[Canuckistanian]

51. I agree totally from a Canadian perspective

Kucinich would probably be in the same political range as our New Democratic Party (NDP).

And although it's never had the majority here in Canada, the NDP is certainly in the mainstream, with a candidate in every riding (district).

We've even had many NDP provincial governments, including one here in very conservative Ontario.

I think the US is REALLY a lot more progressive IF you ask the majority of the people specific questions about how they feel about healthcare, fair wages, the environment and government regulation.

[tblue37]

53. I don't think the nation really is that conservative.

The corporations and the media that they own create that narrative and drum it into people's heads, while suppressing real information about him. If people could actually get honest information about him (or about anything) from the MSM, they would probably agree with him on most things and admire him for his positions and his willingness to stand on principle.

[Old Hickory Fan]

56. Relative Link for Possible Explanation?

http://americanconscience.org/poly_5_corporate_fascism.html