Katie Couric on sexism in the media

[pnwmom]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/06/11/katie-couric-sexist-media_n_106595.html

[Cleita]

1. She oughta know as someone who is rumored to have

gotten where she did via the casting couch.

[pnwmom]

3. Surely you don't believe all the sexist gossip that you hear? n/t

[Cleita]

5. I view my insider gossip with skepticism until it's proved to be true and

usually it is in the end. I guess we will have to wait for her to write a tell all memoir ala Barbara Walters before we know the facts.

[gaspee]

7. Because she

said something you don't want to hear, she's a whore? Nice, real nice.

Nah, no such thing as sexism.

[Cleita]

11. Did I say it was something she said?

No it wasn't, it is something that is rumored about her and I have so stated that. So until she wants to clear the record and apparently she hasn't denied it, the rumor is there. btw it's not sexist to state that someone acquired their position through other routes other than hard work. I did not call her a whore. You did. I merely stated she ought to know about sexism in the industry better than others if that rumor is true.

[gaspee]

13. Right

So, do men have whisper smear campaigns about how they "slept" their way into their jobs?

Can you, seriously, not see the sexism here?

Seriously?

She wrote a piece you didn't like, so you accuse her of being a whore through your "sources."

Like I said, real nice.

So she has to deny rumors that are put out there to de-legitimize her professionally and to smear her personally.

Oh, Katie Couric wouldn't have gotten anywhere if she didn't put out -- don't you see how spreading crap like that is completely sexist?

I don't even know why I'm wasting my time on you. I think you're beyond being educated.

Next time someone tells you how Brian Williams or Anderson Cooper slept their way to the top, make sure you spread that around.

[Cleita]

15. How little you know about what I think.

There are several "journalists" who got where they are through connections let's say both male and female and not because they were good at what they do or even had the training for it. My first lady in California is one of them and no she didn't do it via the casting couch but she didn't do it the old fashioned way like Amy Goodman through hard work either. She got inside because of being a Kennedy. If she had been Maria Nobody, we never would have heard about her because without a producer she is plain awful at what she does. I hold these journalists in contempt because many a career journalist didn't get a job they deserved through education and hard work because they didn't have connections or were unwilling to jump on the casting couch. You were the one who brought up sexism. I was referring to whoring in general in both a literal and metaphorical way. I doubt if Brian Williams slept his way to the top but now that you bring it up, there are rumors about Anderson Cooper. Wolf Blitzer definitely whored his way to the top, not with sex but on his knees nonetheless. Also never try to educate me about something you know nothing about and don't be smearing the sexism label on anything that has anything to do with a woman because you can't stand the truth.

[Breeze54]

20. "I doubt if Brian Williams slept his way to the top"... LMFAO!!!!

Who'd "do him" anyways?!? They'd be asleep before he could get it up!! :P

"Brian? Hey, Brian?!" ..... Zzzzzzzzz..... Boooooring!!! :rofl:

[gaspee]

42. Boy,

Are you a piece of work.

The Anderson Cooper thing was a test and you fail.

Miserably.

[Breeze54]

19. The 'rumor' is only there because YOU chose to keep spreading it.

:eyes:

[Cleita]

23. Get real!

That rumor has been spread and respread. I'm not entering any new territory.

[pnwmom]

25. Where? In the National Enquirer? I've never once heard it until today,

from you.

[Cleita]

28. Oh this is the type of stuff that doesn't make it into the supermarket tabloids.

However, I think you will find a lot of information on google. I live in California and there are many well known secrets about celebrities that are known among people who know people in the industry. This is not new territory. Let me put it this way. Back in the sixties, it was well known on both coasts that Rock Hudson was gay. This was at a time when he was a romantic hero doing movies with Doris Day. It was only when he got AIDS that it went to the tabloids and that was a decade or two later. It's well known like how Katie Couric got where she did but as I said it's only rumor. Also, I don't care about who she had sex with. My gripe is that she used it to get to a position that she probably wouldn't have earned as the mediocre journalist that she is. She actually is not that much to blame either but the powerful execs who took advantage of her.

[Cleita]

29. Keith Olbermann just named her worst person in the world not about

this but some other outrageous criticism she made against another reporter who is covering Obama. Sorry the name slipped my mind. He said she didn't bother to read up on the guy to get the correct information about him.

[pnwmom]

30. Keith Olbermann is one of the worst offenders, as far as sexism goes.

I lost a lot of respect for him during this primary season. I think he's been hanging out too much with Tweety.

[Cleita]

31. He needs training, but he's not too bad with women he respects like

Rachel Maddow. Now Tweety is another thing altogether.

[pnwmom]

32. Sexism isn't acceptable, even when the target is a woman for whom

you lack respect -- anymore than it is acceptable to use racism against someone for whom you lack respect.

[Cleita]

34. Okay, I really don't find him more sexist than the average man.

Should we all go become Amazons and eschew the company of men altogether? I have also held him at a distance in the past because my view of him was as a sport's jock, but he has proved himself to be not so much a sexist as someone who has a hard time tolerating stupid people of either sex. I really had a hard time warming up to him.

[pnwmom]

35. In my family, I'm surrounded by men, and they're not sexist.

Neither are the husbands of my friends.

I guess it depends on who you know. Like I said, I think he's been spending too much time with Matthews.

[Cleita]

36. Maybe I'm buying into your idea of what is sexist

and it's not my idea. Could you explain so we are on the same page?

[pnwmom]

37. Here's a recent example.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/25/keith-olbermanns-idea-for_n_98557.html

Olbermann was discussing the election with Newsweek's Howard Fineman, a frequent guest. They topic was, how can a winner finally be determined in this never-ending Democratic race for the nomination? Of course, the assumption was that it was Clinton that should be shown the door (despite clearly still earning her spot in the race thanks to, um, voters). Fineman said that, all the delegate math aside, ultimately it was going to take "some adults somewhere in the Democratic party to step in and stop this thing, like a referee in a fight that could go on for thirty rounds. Those are the super, super, super delegates who are going to have to decide this."

Said Olbermann: "Right. Somebody who can take her into a room and only he comes out."

What does that mean? Really, it can only mean one thing: Beating the crap out of Hillary Clinton, to the point where she is physically incapable of of getting up and walking out. At minimum. We know this. We know this because we have all seen movies where people are invited into private places to have "discussions" and the unruly party is, um, dealt with accordingly. It's an unmistakably violent image.
Do I really think Olbermann thinks Hillary Clinton should really be violently beaten to the point of physical incapacitation, or worse? No, though some have taken that statement to its logical conclusion. But it is an unmistakably violent image — and that point seems to be undisputed by those who have written about it so far (Google "Olbermann" and "take her into a room" and you'll see results like "Keith Olbermann Advocates Violence Against Hillary" "Olbermann: Misogyny 101" "Calls To End Race Turn Violent""Olbermann: How To Snuff Out Hillary Clinton"). Even Fineman seemed taken aback by the statement - there is a distinct pause after, and it's an eternity in TV time. He's not facing the camera but you can tell that the statement was jarring. (Even so he agreed, saying, "Yes, yes exactly.")

There really seems to be only one interpretation here, and the only point of debate is on whether it's okay or not. I'm going to cut that one short: It's not. To the fellow (male) journo I wrote to about this yesterday, who waved it off as just some colorful film-noir imagery, I say: can you IMAGINE if someone had said that about Obama? That he should be taken somewhere and dealt with, so that he wouldn't come back? Can you imagine if some right-winger had talked about getting Obama out of the race "the old-fashioned way?" If that last one makes you cringe, it should, because it evokes a history of violence against black people in this country that is raw and real. Well, frankly, the same goes for women — many of whom have been taken somewhere private, and never returned.

SNIP

[Cleita]

38. Yes, but I can see the sport's jock references there.

I will say I am not a fan of his for his sports/man thing. I used to be a bartender and watched more games I never wanted to watch including many that Olbermann hosted and to tell the truth women had no place in these discussions other than "bring us another round here". I think the fact that she wasn't put on a pedestal and was talked about in those terms means they do respect her on their terms. No they don't want to beat her to a pulp. We have a long way to go yet in bridging the understanding that being people has nothing to do with gender.

[pnwmom]

39. And if they also joked about violence to a black man?

Would that be acceptable?

[Cleita]

40. According to you nothing is acceptable if you don't approve. n/t

[pnwmom]

41. You avoided answering the question

which tells me the answer. Thanks.

[Cleita]

43. Answering the question. Violence to anyone is not acceptable.

Why does it have to be a black man in your mind? I think the metaphor, because that is what it is, would be offensive to anyone who is looking for offense.

[pnwmom]

44. Because that was the comparison in the article I quoted.

"There really seems to be only one interpretation here, and the only point of debate is on whether it's okay or not. I'm going to cut that one short: It's not. To the fellow (male) journo I wrote to about this yesterday, who waved it off as just some colorful film-noir imagery, I say: can you IMAGINE if someone had said that about Obama? That he should be taken somewhere and dealt with, so that he wouldn't come back? Can you imagine if some right-winger had talked about getting Obama out of the race "the old-fashioned way?" If that last one makes you cringe, it should, because it evokes a history of violence against black people in this country that is raw and real. Well, frankly, the same goes for women — many of whom have been taken somewhere private, and never returned."

___________________

In other words, there has been in this country a long history of violence against people due to race and to gender.

Jokes about violence toward women are both vile and sexist.
Jokes about violence toward black people are both vile and racist.

[TheWraith]

45. Name something sexist that Keith did.

You can't, because Keith's only offense was calling out truth when he saw it.

[pnwmom]

21. She can't clear the record. It's like the old question

when did you stop beating your wife.

I think the vast majority of Americans have not heard that gossip about her. So trying to clear the record would just make a significant number of people think it who wouldn't have otherwise.

And gaspee is right. Your comment really had nothing to do with the sexism in the news media, which has to do with the types of comments Chris Matthews, for example, made all through the election. Katie Couric is right to comment on that. How she got her job is not relevant.

[REP]

47. I thought you were talking about the rumour that she's a journalist

Turns out it's completely untrue. Katie is a lot of things, but she's no journalist.

[Breeze54]

18. Like that isn't a SOP "rumor" in TV or Hollywood?!?

:silly:

Yeah, I believe all the rumors I hear daily!! :sarcasm:

What a load..... :eyes:

[MrCoffee]

2. Is it sexist to say that Katie Couric is an incompetent "newscaster"?

I don't want to offend anyone. She's awful at her job.

[pnwmom]

4. I think there are plenty of men who are worse. n/t

[Breeze54]

16. She's the only talking head that admitted on live TV that the M$M didn't do their job in '02 +

Williams and ? on ABC/NBC protested loudly!

She admitted that the M$M failed.

That was the day McClellan's (sp?) book came out.

[malaise]

33. And that is the bottom line n/t

[gaiilonfong]

6. Couric is an IDIOT NeoCon and LOSER

She is a known NeoCon IDIOT

[Breeze54]

17. What did she do that pissed everyone off? I never got an answer when this started against her.

:shrug:

I mean, when she moved to the CBS Nightly News, the attacks against her started and I joined on
a few occasions about the non-reporting of the war but I never knew why some were MORE pissed
off at her, when the blow hards like Williams and the guy on ABC were just as bad, if not worse!!!

[pnwmom]

22. Ironically, or maybe not, I think that sexism is at the root of a lot of

the Katie-hate around here.

She spoke out strongly recently about the poor coverage going into Iraq -- she apologized for it, while Brian Williams and a third newscaster (I forget who) pretended that it was fine. Yet the attacks on her here on DU always seem more vicious than they do against the real culprits in the news media.

[TheWraith]

46. No, people hate her because she's an airhead and a lightweight, not qualified for the job.

To attribute dislike of Couric to sexism shows that you have no perspective on the subject at all, because you ignore her real and numerous failings, as well as the many female journalists who are well respected like Christiane Amanpour.

[gaspee]

8. The comments

Are typical for HUffpo - a supposedly bastion of liberalness - read the comments and come back and whine to me how there's no sexism and the lyin' bitches are making it all up.

I'm so sick of this shit.

[pnwmom]

9. You're not talking to me, are you?

I agree with her about this. I've been particularly disappointed with Olbermann this year. Tweety's sexism never surprises me, but Olbermann's did.

[gaspee]

10. Nah,

Just throwing it out there. Not to you - we're typically on the same page when it comes to sexism in the media.

[pnwmom]

12. That's what I thought.

:hi:

[ErinBerin84]

14. Is this the first time she has talked about it?

If so, how come she is always "sounding the alarm" on these issues when it is too late, like when she criticized the media's coverage leading up to Iraq? I mean, if this is the first time that she has talked about this, isn't she kind of like "the men and women who let them get away with it", as in the piece? Just look at the question that Katie Couric posed to Barack the other day "So, would you be able to work with her, or is it too much like, UEEWWW".


edit: Ok, seriously, is this the first time she's spoken about this? No one knows?

[pnwmom]

24. Her criticism of the network coverage leading to Iraq means that she will

be less likely to fall for something like this the next time around -- unlike her male counterparts, who are still certain they did everything right.

And no, this isn't the first time she has talked about sexism in the media.

[ErinBerin84]

26. I know, but in reference to presidential politics? If so, good. What has she said/where has she said

it? I appreciate her admitting that the media failed in their coverage of Iraq, but I would appreciate it even more if she said it someplace else other than the Today show or said it more than once (which it's quite possible she has and I'm just not aware of it). The last time I watched a My Notebook segment with Katie Couric, she was saying "Is America ready to elect a president who grew up praying in a mosque?" (this was last year, and I haven't watched her since then so I don't know what her approach is now. Is she harder on McCain than most other the other media outlets that always seem to give him a pass for everything?) I've always liked Katie in general, but I'm not sure she will translate her Iraq epiphany into her coverage. Though I'm always hopeful. I'll always love her for raising colon cancer awareness though, and I have enjoyed her reporting in the past, though I do not watch CBS often. Katie has experienced sexism as well, and I would love for her to write a book on it in reference to CBS, if she experienced it there behind the scenes as well (though maybe legal obligations would prevent her from that).

[mitchum]

27. Sexism in the media rocks!