Prison officials may free Manson family's Susan Atkins due to illness - No please don't

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/la-me-atkins13-2008jun13,0,7824240.story

From the Los Angeles Times

Prison officials may free Manson family's Susan Atkins due to illness

Woman convicted in the 1969 murder of actress Sharon Tate reportedly has less than six months to live. Sources say she has brain cancer and one of her legs has been amputated.

By Andrew Blankstein and Hector Becerra | Los Angeles Times Staff Writers
June 13, 2008

State corrections officials are considering a request by former Charles Manson follower and convicted murderer Susan Atkins to be released from prison because of an undisclosed terminal illness.

[Warpy]

1. She's unlikely to be a threat to society at this point

and justice untempered by mercy is not justice, at all.

[FredScuttle]

43. You know who else isn't a threat to society

or a part of society at all? Paul Richard Polanski.

You know....Sharon and Roman Polanski's unborn son who was brutally killed along with his mother almost 40 years ago.

Let Susan Atkins rot and die in prison.

[bluestateguy]

2. I don't know. Is she in any way remorseful for what she has done?

On the other hand, maybe the reason they want to cut her loose is because by keeping a very sick woman locked up, that imposes major medical costs on the state of California.

[ikojo]

5. BINGO!!! She'll get better care under Medicare

and Medicaid than she would in jail. Look up Corrections (or correctional) Medical Service, a major health insurance carrier for the prison system.

[Clovis Sangrail]

3. why not?

if she really does have 6 mos to live it would be the compassionate thing to do.

If people are worried about it being a 'trick' to get out, give her a 6 mos furlough and renew monthly if needed.

Maybe she's swearing she'll kill everybody she meets, but I doubt it. The authorities that deal with her should make the decision based on a)her being terminal and b)her still being a threat to society

:shrug:

[slackmaster]

16. There is always a chance her cancer could go into remission

Let her die in prison. That was her sentence, and it is a just one.

[Clovis Sangrail]

23. it might go into remission...

which is why I said give her a 6 month furlough.

That it was a just sentence isn't really the issue.
The measure of compassion is how you treat people you don't like.

[slackmaster]

25. Liking or not liking her is not the issue

The issue is trusting her.

[Clovis Sangrail]

29. fair enough

if she's a threat then I don't think she should be let out either.

If, however, she's not a threat and she is going to die of cancer in the next 6 mos or so then refusing to entertain the idea of a furlough is vindictive.

I try not to be like that.
(though I'm far from universally successful)

:shrug:

[LibDemAlways]

4. Even prosecutor Bugliosi says that under the

circumstances (terminal illness, recent leg amputation) plus his belief that she's sincerely renounced Manson, he feels it would be ok to release her. I'll trust his judgment.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

6. For what she did,

she's getting what she deserves. One of the most heinous crimes in American history. I was in Los Angeles when it happened. Let's not forget the LaBianca murders that took place the next day. The city was paralyzed with fear.

She's dying clean, unlike her victims. Let her out, but only if she's absolutely terminal. Then, good riddance.

[kestrel91316]

9. She doesn't deserve a death by conscious medical neglect, which is what

she's headed for if she stays in prison.

Manson himself, OTOH, was the force behind the murders and pointed those drugged-out kids in a direction they probably would not have gone if he weren't in the picture..............so he should be REQUIRED to suffer long and hard. He's still pure evil IMHO.

[dana_b]

12. he's criminally insane

and has been for a loooong time.

My daughter dated a kid and she found out later that his mom was one of Manson's girls. Not one of the famous girls, but she was there on the ranch, has a scar from the "X" on her forehead, etc. She won't talk about it anymore. It's a part of her life that she'd like to forget. Evidently she did tell her kid that he (Manson) was "nice" and seemed sane at the time to her. I'll bet she was pretty much out of her mind on drugs too. Wow.

[NNN0LHI]

14. She has been in prison just short of 40 years

Seems like conscious medical neglect if that has occurred would have killed her a lot sooner.

Don

[eShirl]

28. not necessarily

for one thing, she probably didn't require this much or this high a level of medical attention for most of that 40 years, and will probably need even more in the coming weeks and/or months

[yardwork]

38. Actually, a lot of people get pretty good medical care in prison.

It's not clear to me how she would receive better care outside. Where would she live outside prison? Who would provide her care? Who would transport her to and from treatments?

[Warpy]

17. Shouldn't this be about who we are?

We know what she used to be, but what are we if we let her die of neglect in prison, far from any possibility of mending relationships in her family before she dies?

I know who I am, and I'm not as vicious as she once was.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

20. This should be about what she did

Nothing more, nothing less. She committed horrible atrocities. She's lived a lot longer, say, than Sharon Tate's unborn son.

I didn't read anything about neglect in the OP. Perhaps I missed something. I trust she's getting standard medical care, and wouldn't it be ironic if it's better than our 42,000,000 uninsured Americans might get?

[Warpy]

21. I can't be a rigidly punitive person

especially when I know the person she was once no longer exists.

I hope she is let out to tie up the loose ends of her life because of who I am, not who she is.

I say this as a survivor of a murder of a family member.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

27. How do you know that person no longer exists?

If you have special and personal information about Atkins, then I can understand that your perception of her current problems is quite different from mine.

As the survivor of a murder victim as well, I think her life sentence should be carried out.

[Iggo]

34. I was not paralyzed with fear...

...but I get your point.

[underseasurveyor]

7. giving her a taste of what she has missed

for the majority of her life with only 6 months left? She won't be able to handle it anyway. what did they call it in the movie the shawshank redemtion... she's institutionalized.

hell and even if they do let her out the state will still being paying her med bills i mean it's not like she has any health insurance.

[dsc]

11. actually the feds will be paying if she is out

and the state if she is in. That is why they want to let her out. NC is investigating doing the same thing with some ill, longtime prisoners.

[loyalsister]

32. Don't worry it's just cost shifting

I am sure there are ankle alarms and drug tests and other forms of oversight.
She will die in an outside prison.
They are getting easier to build with technology.
She's imprisoned by her body and limited time anyway.

[dsc]

42. I have no problem with either the cost shifting

nor freeing her to die except the fear it will increase support for the death penalty which would be bad public policy.

[underseasurveyor]

45. yea i have no problems with the cost shifting

but you do raise an excellent point about the increase of the death penalty. I hadn't thought of that and that's the last thing we need. the death penalty itself needs to die.

[LeftinOH]

8. "Look bitch, you're gonna die ..and I don't feel a thing about it..."

The final words -spoken by Ms Atkins- that were ever heard by a pregnant (8 months along) woman. She's in prison for a reason, and she can finish her life sentence there.

[GreenPartyVoter]

18. It was an awful, awful thing that she did

[dana_b]

10. I wonder if she'll have to wear one of those monitors

or have a PO checkin on her frequently?

I wouldn't wish a terminal brain tumor on anyone, even Susan Atkins. Seizures, intense pain, she may not have all her faculties. I really don't think she's a threat to anyone but for piece of mind, she definitely should have to be monitored.

[Mike Daniels]

13. Actually, anything that makes her experience a fraction of the pain she inflicted on others

is more than fine for me.

Most people don't deserve to be subject to endless pain. I have no such qualms about anyone involved with the Manson family.

That said, if she has any family still around who want to have anything to do with her then by all means, let her out to live her final days with them.

[slackmaster]

15. If she's going to die soon, that means her sentence is almost over

Let her finish her sentence. She's a monster.

[Sheets of Easter]

19. I have little/no pity for "Sexy Sadie."

As far as I am concerned, she can finish out her sentence.

[Lance_Boyle]

33. "Sexy Sadie" was the Maharishi, not Susan Atkins. n/t

[Sheets of Easter]

36. I know that, but Charlie used to call her Sadie Mae Glutz.

He thought the song "Sexy Sadie" was about her. You know, that whole Beatles communicating to him via the White Album thing.

[tkmorris]

22. In this thread, I hear the voices of mercy....

And I hear the outraged cries of the vindictive.

I know which one of these I wish to be. Let her go.

[Sheets of Easter]

24. If I were a family member, I would have forgiven her by now.

That doesn't mean that I think she deserves to be free. She is not finished paying her debt for what she did to those people.

[tkmorris]

30. That makes no sense

"Paying her debt" for what she did to those people. What does that even mean? What debt? Owed to whom? In what coin is it paid? Suffering?

Nothing is served by continuing to incarcerate her. It is just self-righteous anger substituting as law. There is no place for it in a civilized society.

[Sheets of Easter]

31. She is serving a life sentence for murder. That is her debt.

For that matter, she was to be sentenced to death, until CA abolished the death penalty in the 70's (don't worry, I am anti-death penalty).

It's not "self-righteous anger." It is a sentence for a crime committed.

[MedleyMisty]

47. I found this blog post very interesting

http://dangerousintersection.org/2008/03/23/its-time-for-the-annual-non-sequitur-of-easter-but-is-god%e2%80%99s-easter-%e2%80%9cgift%e2%80%9d-based-on-a-contorted-application-of-the-moral-accounting-metaphor/#more-2334

It talks about the idea of debts like that. And could have used some more proofreading, but hey.

[NYC Liberal]

48. So how long should anyone be incarcerated?

Until they "say" that they're sorry?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

26. Yes, she'll suffer terribly no matter where she is

Those six months will be no picnic.

What is to be gained by keeping her in prison?

It won't bring a single one of the victims back.

[rox63]

35. If they release her, it should be with electronic monitoring n/t

[AlCzervik]

37. By the time this thing works it's way through the system she may gone already.

I've seen someone die from brain cancer and pretty soon she won't realize where she is.

[Stinky The Clown]

39. I'm a bleeding heart

I'm okay with letting her go, assuming she's, indeed, imminently terminal and that she is, indeed, no threat to society. Her life has been hopeless and miserable at best. Yes, she committed a horrible crime. No, she has not served her sentence until she dies in prison.

But maybe this isn't about her at all. Maybe it is about us. Show her the compassion she never showed her victims.

[orleans]

40. well, if this is true

"Atkins told the grand jury that she stabbed Frykowski in the legs and that she held Tate down while Watson stabbed her. She also testified that Tate had pleaded for her life and that of her unborn child, to which Atkins replied, "Woman, I have no mercy for you."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Atkins

if this is true, if she was actually there helping to kill someone, i say fuck her. why the hell should anyone feel sorry for her just because she's sick. if she wasn't sick would she be considered for release?

fuck that. my "compassionate" inner liberal doesn't give a rats ass that she is sick. it shouldn't make any difference. if she was there/involved/helping/killing--fuck her. she should stay in jail.

[LeftyMom]

41. What's she going to do, hop after somebody with a knife?

Vindictive bullshit aside, she's got terminal brain cancer. She's gonna die soon, and it's going to be ugly as fuck. If they let her go, it'll probably be straight to a hospital room or some hospice someplace. Slap a monitor on her remaining ankle if you want, but she's no longer capable or hurting anybody, and there's no punishment prison can offer that exceeds what she'll feel over her last few months, even with the gentlest of care.

[FredScuttle]

44. She should have thought of that before butchering a pregnant women

and four others that night.

I have absolutely no problem with her dying in prison. She should serve her sentence out and not feel fresh air until her corpse is rolled out.

[lonestarnot]

49. EEeek.

I hate to say it but I think I agree mentally, but my heart tells me to let her out.

[Pavulon]

46. Let her finish her prison sentence

she earned it. She should have been gassed but this is a pretty fitting end for a person who murdered a pregnant woman.

No mercy for the merciless.