Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

An Affair To Remember: She Was 82, He Was 95.... And They Had Dementia

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 12:54 AM
Original message
An Affair To Remember: She Was 82, He Was 95.... And They Had Dementia
An Affair To Remember
She was 82. He was 95. They had dementia. They fell in love. And then they started having sex.

Slate
By Melinda Henneberger
Posted Tuesday, June 10, 2008, at 1:14 PM ET




Bob's family was horrified at the idea that his relationship with Dorothy might have become sexual. At his age, they wouldn't have thought it possible. But when Bob's son walked in and saw his 95-year-old father in bed with his 82-year-old girlfriend last December, incredulity turned into full-blown panic. "I didn't know where this was going to end," said the manager of the assisted-living facility where Bob and Dorothy lived. "It was pretty volatile."

Because both Bob and Dorothy suffer from dementia, the son assumed that his father didn't fully understand what was going on. And his sputtering cell phone call reporting the scene he'd happened upon would have been funny, the manager said, if the consequences hadn't been so serious. "He was going, 'She had her mouth on my dad's penis! And it's not even clean!' " Bob's son became determined to keep the two apart and asked the facility's staff to ensure that they were never left alone together.

After that, Dorothy stopped eating. She lost 21 pounds, was treated for depression, and was hospitalized for dehydration. When Bob was finally moved out of the facility in January, she sat in the window for weeks waiting for him. She doesn't do that anymore, though: "Her Alzheimer's is protecting her at this point," says her doctor, who thinks the loss might have killed her if its memory hadn't faded so mercifully fast. But should someone have protected the couple's right to privacy—their right to have a sex life?

"We were in uncharted territory," the facility manager said—and there's a reason for that. Even the More magazine-reading demographic that thinks midlife is forever (and is deeply sorry to see James Naughton doing Cialis ads) seems to believe that while sex isn't only for the young, exceptions are only for the exfoliated. We're squeamish about the sex lives of the elderly—and even more so when those elderly are senile and are our parents. But as the baby boom generation ages, there are going to be many more Dorothys and Bobs—who may no longer quite recall the Summer of Love but are unlikely to accept parietal rules in the nursing home. Gerontologists highly recommend sex for the elderly because it improves mood and even overall physical function, but the legal issues are enormously complicated, as Daniel Engber explored in his 2007 article "Naughty Nursing Homes": Can someone with dementia give informed consent? How do caregivers balance safety and privacy concerns? When families object to a demented person being sexually active, are nursing homes responsible for chaperoning? This one botched love affair shows the incredible intensity and human cost of an issue that, as Dorothy's doctor says, we can't afford to go on ignoring.

http://www.slate.com/id/2192178/">MORE

- While I miss my parents terribly sometimes, I've come to accept their passing lo these many years. But I sure am glad I didn't have to deal with this one.

And at 56, its my kids who should now be worrying.....

========================================================================
DeSwiss


http://atheisttoolbox.com/">The Atheist Toolbox
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:00 AM
Response to Original message
1. Shit, if you're 90, what's your source of fun in life?
Playing bridge? Getting Christmas cards from the grandkids? Meatloaf night in the cafeteria? :shrug:

If OLD (like, not just old, but OLD) people are still able to have sexual fun, God bless 'em! ;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:11 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. I agree with your sentiments....
...but I can also imagine too, the scene where right after the act:

HE: Ahhh, that was great!!!

SHE: What was great???

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:03 AM
Response to Original message
2. Sounds like the son was the one with the problem
...not his father and the girlfriend.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:13 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. Well he sure got one thing wrong....
...because generally speaking, the human mouth has many, many more germs and bacteria in it, than most people's genitals.


- Or so I've been told....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:32 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. This is generally true, depending on hygiene
On top of that, urine is sterile!

Google just introduced me to a whole mess of information I didn't need to know on this topic, including that a dog's mouth is cleaner than a human's.

Unless your dog is a garbage or poop eater. Then all bets are off. :P
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:37 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. Yeah well....
...that may be true about the dog's mouth versus a human's. But my dog's farts are the absolute worst!!!!

He can single-handedly(?) clear out the whole house!!!!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:43 AM
Response to Reply #16
17. He probably just does this
...so he can have access to the beer and chips while watching Animal Planet. ;)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Maine-ah Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 07:08 AM
Response to Reply #16
24. if your dog is really that bad, you should probably try changing
his food. It took care of our dog's stink. Switched to California Natural Lamb and Rice. Did the trick. :hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
CaliforniaPeggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
3. This is a dynamite story...
And I am outraged that those two people who loved one another, dementia be damned, were forcibly separated...

To have such love come into their lives is nothing short of a miracle.

My heart goes out especially to the lady, since she suffered so much from the separation.

Other peoples' morals were being imposed on these two, and that is just plain wrong.

Thanks for posting...

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:17 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. You're welcome, I thought so too....
...and its an issue that will become increasingly relevant as the Boomer Bulge grows larger.

And considering the Boomer's are also the founders of the Free Love movement, all hell gonna break loose. Mark my words.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
saracat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
4. What a wonderful story . A real life "Since you went away".
Edited on Sat Jun-14-08 01:12 AM by saracat
When are we going to realize that OLd age is still human?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #4
10. In case your question....
....wasn't rhetorical, then the answer is: "on the day that the last mirror gets broken and commercials are banned from teevee."


- And not until then....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mind_your_head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:12 AM
Response to Original message
5. The 'kids' only worry REALLY when their parents marry someone outside of the 'family'
and see their inheritance 'in danger' .... and THAT's the truth!!!

Ya'll know it!

(and 'kids' ~ and I mean mentally immature people, who are still "grossed out" that their parents had *gasp* SEX!!!! (and still like it/think it's an important part of life! ..... "how retarded is that? Oh course your parents had SEX.....you wouldn't be here if they didn't. *sheesh*)

Oh wait.... "sex is evil".....now I remember :sarcasm:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:26 AM
Response to Reply #5
11. Good.
I see you corrected yourself. Sex is evil. That's why we do it so much.

And you make a valid point about the money. Although in this case, I don't think the son had much to worry about, seeing how "Dorothy" has Alzheimer's and probably couldn't even remember what his name was later that day.

But to me, if the son is so worried about his father's penile hygiene, then maybe he should monitor that situation more closely. I can't write the words that my own father would have told me, had I suggested his nether parts were dirty.

- And he was a preacher!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Mind_your_head Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
13. Sometimes one has to wonder that if SEX didn't have such a
taboo on it, how much degeneracy would be eliminated from the 'big picture'.

Just musing,
M_Y_H
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #13
15. Muse away.....
I agree completely. What is worse, all those taboos were designed mainly to control women and to keep what was viewed as a man's property from being "pre-handled."

- And we know where all that came from, now don't we????

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
JVS Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 01:57 AM
Response to Original message
6. Grandmother, what strange breath you have!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 02:26 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. ROFL!!!!!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ismnotwasm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 03:03 AM
Response to Original message
18. I could tell a few stories
About my days as a nurse in long term care. Hoo boy. Never, ever think that old folks don't get horny.

Just as important, some of the greatest love stories I know came from people in their 70's on up, often they know the value of time, and living in the moment.

I want to state this carefully, I don't want to offend, but younger, developmentally disabled adults often are "allowed" relationships, even marriage and children. Why would we deny our elders with declining cognitive function? We need to protect the vulnerable among us of course, but that doesn't mean shutting them away from life.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 03:34 AM
Response to Original message
19. It's nothing new that people with Alzheimer's sometimes fall in love with
other people with Alzheimer's (and others).

Patients/Residents (in facilities) that can't remember their family or their old life, fall in love and DO remember the person they fall in love with in the facility. ..and relationships are formed...bonds are created.

Yeah - it hurts. It hurts the spouse that isn't remembered and it hurts the children...but it happens.

Some spouses are grateful that the person they love so much has found someone they can remember and someone they can feel love for...some are not. Some children are...some are not.

I think it's wonderful myself.

Decline is painful to watch...mostly for those who can remember what once was...who long to be remembered by their parent/spouse one last time....but developing/progressing Alzheimer's doesn't just end the very human need for reaching out in love, for contact.... and yes...people are going to have to come to terms with it.


We have to stop looking at old age as something horrible for starters. Then we're going to have to realize there are different degrees of human reality that are healthy - not harmful - with conditions such as Alzheimer's.

I'm not insensitive - I've seen the death that comes with Alzheimer's. I've seen the suffering coupled with other health problems and I've seen the devastation within the family....but I've also seen perfectly happy Alzheimer patients whose only moments of hurt and anger came from others demanding they be someone they no longer were or could even remember.








Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 04:29 AM
Response to Original message
20. The lesson is, if you're gonna do it, be more discreet. Sure, why shouldn't the
seniors have sex? They are adults. I can understand a facility not being able to condone it by providing access to beds and such. It's a facility. Like a hospital won't let a husband and wife have sex.

So if they're gonna do it, they have to be sneaky about it. And the facility will probably turn their heads, as long as they claim they had no reason to know about it.

Why is the son walking in on his dad w/o knocking, in the first place?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 05:19 AM
Response to Original message
21. Bob's son sure is an asshole, isn't he?
What right did he have to force their separation? Who were they hurting? Mr. Big Stuff takes away one of the few things that make them feel happy, because he's squicked out by his dad having sex?

Asshole. :grr:

What goes around comes around, sonny.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Bunny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 07:29 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. And furthermore, if sonny was so concerned about the cleanliness of his father's penis,
perhaps he should take that up with the nursing home staff. Maybe they could be more helpful with maintaining his father's personal hygiene?

Asshole.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
PeaceNikki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 06:53 AM
Response to Original message
22. Are you familiar with Sandra Day O'Conner's story?
Her husband has Alzheimer's disease and fell in love with another women in the nursing home. It's a touching story.

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/1114OConnor1114.html

O'Connors' story sends message on Alzheimer's

John Faherty, Mary Beth Faller and Connie Cone Sexton
The Arizona Republic
Nov. 14, 2007 12:00 AM

A public family's private story is now the center of a discussion about Alzheimer's disease.

Over the past week the world has begun to learn about the marriage of former Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor and her husband of 54 years.

John O'Connor, 77, was diagnosed with Alzheimer's 17 years ago and now lives in a Phoenix nursing facility.

That fairly common story took a turn when the couple's son, Scott O'Connor, revealed that his father had fallen in love with another woman who also lives at the Huger Mercy Living Center.

Sandra, also 77, left the Supreme Court in 2006 in part to care for John.

She is said to be happy that her husband has found joy in his life.

"Mom was thrilled that Dad was relaxed and happy and comfortable living here and wasn't complaining," Scott told Channel 12 (KPNX).

O'Connor's decision to recognize that her husband's actions reflect who he is now is exactly what she should do, according to people who work with Alzheimer's patients and their families.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Buzz Clik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 07:05 AM
Response to Original message
23. I had to check the URL to be certain I was still at DU. Why do I want to know this?
Isn't there a more appropriate outlet for this?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 07:48 AM
Response to Original message
26. I have dealt with this issue with my father (87) who now lives in an Alzheimer's facility.
My father has fairly advanced Alzheimer's, but is otherwise very healthy. I took care of him and my mother at home for a couple of years until my mother died. At that point I decided he needed specialized care (besides, I was exhausted).

Unlike most of the men in the unit, my father still stands up very tall and has a dramatic-looking shock of white hair. From his first day in the facility, he was the subject of a lot of attention by several of the women. As time went on, he developed a close connection with one of them. Mostly they just sat together all the time in the common rooms, or sometimes napped together fully clothed on the single bed in his room.

But then I heard from the staff that they had been found without their clothes on in the room. They wanted to know what I thought, which was that if there was something that would make them happy, and they both seemed to want it (no signs of coercion), I thought it was a blessing. But the family of the woman were absolutely against it.

This romance was not as intense as the one in the story. The staff just gently encouraged them to NOT be in the same place at the same time, and they both seemed to forget about it. Neither one of them seems to be sad.

Alzheimer's brings unbelievably complex issues about autonomy and about our myths and expectations of old age.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-14-08 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #26
27. Not just Alzheimer's, per se
but the whole issue of care facilities for the elderly. If you're in a care facility, it's probably because you need help in some area of your life. But allowing people to have lives within that setting instead of just seeing the old folks home as a warehouse for the elderly should be encouraged.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Wed Apr 24th 2024, 11:24 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC