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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 09:30 PM
Original message
The march to war by Democratic strategists. Two months after 9/11 they said "New World, New War"
I watched Al Gore tonight as he endorsed Barack Obama. He spoke passionately against that war, just as he had done in 2003. He was one of the few who spoke out then against it.

I thought of the push to war and the organized way it happened.

The leaders and writers at the DLC came together quickly to get on board with the war on terrorism. I think about this horribly tragic war, and I realize that this think tank had controlled Democratic party policy for a decade. It was pretty obvious that Democrats would have gone along with the policy advice.

Nonetheless, it is scary stuff. Reading these pages about this issue that came out in November 2001 gives me chills. It was only two months, and it was like they had a whole issue planned...with articles by major Democrats basically going along with bringing down Saddam.

Here are the editors of the Blueprint Magazine giving their opinions on the road to war with Iraq.



Our first priority today is to fight and win the war against terrorism and to make America safe again

As former President Bill Clinton warns in his Blueprint article, we are engaged not only in the first war of the new millennium, but in the first battle for the "soul" of the 21st century -- one that will determine its ultimate direction for good or for ill.

Winning the war against terrorism abroad involves more than destroying the al-Qaida network and the Taliban regime that has protected it. It also means, as Sen. Joe Lieberman argues, that the war will not be over until we have neutralized other terrorist threats with global reach, including the mother of all state-sponsored terrorism, Saddam Hussein's Iraq.


More from the November 11, 2001 magazine. Here are links to articles by major Democrats speaking out. Some articles are cautionary and sensible, but behind all is that constant drumbeat for war.

New World, New War

It seems that they were prepared to wage war the day the towers fell.

This is an article from that month's Blueprint which describes what a "just war" looks like.

How to Fight a Just War

The origins of the just war tradition are usually traced back to the fourth century and St. Augustine's masterwork, City of God. St. Augustine grapples with the undeniable anti-violent thrust of the Christian tradition, especially the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth. He comes to the conclusion that wars of aggression and self-aggrandizement -- like Rome's imperial wars -- are never acceptable. But there are occasions when violence may be necessary. Violence is never a normative good. It is better for an individual who professes Christianity to suffer harm than to commit it. But public officials are charged with protecting the safety of a people: The shepherd must tend the flock. For St. Augustine, the most potent casus belliis protecting the innocent from certain harm -- the innocent being those who are unable to defend themselves.


Parts of another article listed in the table of contents caught my eye. I realized this was what our Democrats in congress had to deal with...those who since the 80s had pretty much gone along with the advice by this group of strategists.

This article presents The Case against Saddam.

As Americans adjust to the new reality of bioterrorism, it is gratifying to see more and more fingers pointing to Iraq as a possible source of germ warfare. For too long, we have allowed the menace of Saddam Hussein's biowarfare program to continue unabated and unmolested. Now is the time to take drastic action against one of the most serious threats to world peace and stability.

Everything we know about Saddam tells us that he could be the culprit behind the first wave of anthrax attacks or that he could soon start a new one. Long before Osama bin Laden got to No. 1 on the FBI's most wanted list, the Iraqi leader was hard at work, employing top scientists and developing not only his much-talked-about nuclear program, but biological and chemical weapons as well.

..."Whether Saddam was involved in providing the spores and powder that hit the U.S. Congress, the U.S. Postal Service, and other institutions all over the country is irrelevant; it's his clear capability to do it that should concern us. Experts believe Saddam, who has the most biological know-how in the region, has been actively building up his bioterror supplies. Very few parties with a grudge against the United States have the ability and the means of producing the microbe in highly refined form. Of these, Iraq is the only one with a deep enmity toward the United States.


That was the beginning of the long reign of invoking fear and terror and pushing the talking point that we must be stronger than the Republicans on national security.

Since George W. Bush invaded a country that was no danger to us, I would say that overall he was pretty weak in national security. We could have played up that aspect, but unfortunately we did not.

There has been a lot of talk here lately about how Democrats in red states should act. The discussions came up when a Democrat in FL distanced himself from the party..saying he owed the party nothing.

It came up again when two Democrats from TN said Obama might have terrorist ties. The Democratic congressman and governor from that state have yet to defend Obama on those statements.

I disagree with those who say that Democrats in more conservative states have to go along to get along and re-elected. If you subscribe to such a theory, you end up in places like Iraq with no end in sight.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. The same trio of groups tells Democrats not to stop funding the war.
The DLC/PPI/Third Way have made their views clear that Democrats should not stop funding.

Groups tell Congress not to use their constitutional power of the purse

Third Way supports the idea for a nonbinding congressional resolution condemning the escalation. But going further, with legislation barring the troop increase, would be a mistake, for both substantive and political reasons. First, we do not believe that Congress should use the imprecise mechanism of appropriations to dictate the management of an ongoing military conflict. There is simply no way of ensuring that funding restrictions would not compromise the safety of the troops already in the field, and it is generally a bad idea for Congress to be dictating the details of military strategy.

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annabanana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 10:01 AM
Response to Reply #1
19. These "three" groups are just the hydra-heads
of the same beast.
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lxlxlxl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
2. Disgusting...
This is shocking.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 11:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Yes, I agree it is shocking.
:hi:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:09 PM
Response to Original message
3. Thank you
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:36 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Most welcome.
Just two months after 9/11 they had this issue ready to go.
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Wiley50 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
5. Gore was instrumental in creating the DLC
He obviously knows better now

But it would really be effective if he were to speak out against it
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. He has distanced himself for quite a while.
I doubt he will speak against them.
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Lugnut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
7. K&R n/t
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Truth2Tell Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-16-08 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
8. K&R nt
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crickets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 01:27 AM
Response to Original message
10. K&R
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snot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
11. K&R'd.
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snappyturtle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:11 AM
Response to Original message
12. K&R and bookmarked! Excellent. Thank you! nt
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:46 AM
Response to Original message
13. November 11, 2001
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #13
21. It almost looks like warmongering, doesn't it?
Thanks for the screenshot.
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ikojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:54 AM
Response to Original message
14. Bill Clinton was also very instrumental in
creating the DLC. The goals of the DLC are to distance the Democratic party from its base of union members, environmentalists and minorities. They have moved the Democrats further and further to the right and should be ostracized.
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mdmc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #14
23. correct
awful, but correct.
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:02 AM
Response to Original message
15. Glen Greenwald on the Democratic Party as Bush enablers
British debate highlights the cravenness and complicity of congressional Democratic "leaders"

by Glen Greenwald
Salon, June 15

snip

When the history of the post 9/11-era in America is written, it will record that our country was ruled by an administration as radical as it was contemptuous of our laws and basic liberties, but was also aided and abetted every step of the way by a putative "opposition party" too craven and/or supportive even to attempt to impede any of it, let alone succeed in doing so. The very few times when certain of its members tried to take principled stances of the type Britain is now witnessing -- such as Feingold's vigorous opposition to Bush's illegal spying program, the Military Commissions Act, and excesses of the Patriot Act -- the Democratic Party leadership itself intervened to quash them and ensure they failed.

The lawlessness, excesses and civil liberties abuses of the last seven years began as secret Republican initiatives but are ending up as fully bipartisan policies, with the Republican and Democratic Party establishments sharing roughly equal responsibility for all of it. It may be unpleasant to have to accept that but it is nonetheless true.

The Democratic Party's embrace of the most radical and lawless aspects of the Bush administration will, by most accounts, be complete this week. The putative "compromise" that Congressional Democrats have agreed to with regard to spying powers and telecom amnesty is no such thing. The White House has signed off on the "compromise" precisely because it gives the President everything he and Dick Cheney have been demanding, simply dressed up in the most transparent wrapping to enable Democratic House leaders to lie to their supporters by claiming that they won important concessions.

snip

Put another way, Congressional Democrats -- not the Federalist Society, but Congressional Democrats -- are embracing the proposition that the President has the power to instruct private citizens to break the law. As the ACLU puts it:

This will set an incredibly dangerous precedent.

Why have privacy laws if the president can write you a note to disobey them? When the government asks companies to break the law in the future, they will have precedent that Congress will cover their tracks.


Democrats are about to institutionalize a proposition that has been rejected since the Nuremberg Trials -- namely, that individuals (or, more accurately, lobbyist-protected corporations) are free to break the law as long as they can claim afterwards that they were told by the Leader to do so. That's the principle which the Democratic Party -- following their standard pattern of having enough of their members join a virtually unanimous GOP while the Democratic leadership enables it all -- is about to write into our laws.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/06/15/britain/index.html
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #15
18. Greenwald has been right on top of this issue.
Heading there to read it now.
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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:31 AM
Response to Original message
16. Just wanted to highlight an important quote of yours:
"I disagree with those who say that Democrats in more conservative states have to go along to get along and re-elected. If you subscribe to such a theory, you end up in places like Iraq with no end in sight."
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #16
20. Thanks, it is how I feel very strongly.
In the end you must stand for something.

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KharmaTrain Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:47 AM
Response to Original message
17. Great Insight...Also Explains What Happened To Joementum
The 16 tons of 9/11 seemed to bring out the bloodlust in many in the Democratic party as much as it did in the GOOP. The 2002 elections became a "ball-puffing" session as each party tried to show who was "tougher" and booosh pulled the ultimate trump card that year with the IWR. It pushed Democrats to put up or shut up...and divided the party along lines that, IMHO, destroyed it in the '04 elections. You had those who saw the polls and the media pressure and caved...a few intrepid ones held firm, but it was at a price...they were "appeasers". Lieberman, who was always a hawk in regards to Iraq and Iran (like a good Likudnik should) was right at home as there were those in the party who played weathervane. By '04 the winds had begun to shift...the war had started to sour, the "appeasers" began to be proven right and the party began to soul search. Kerry's candidacy of "I voted for it before I voted against it" described the conflict within the party structure on how to deal with participating in a big blunder and now trying to find a way out of it. Lieberman tried to run that year as the "tough on terror" candidate and he thought he stood a good chance of winning (so did the corporate media)...only to see his message didn't hit on a party stuck in this funk. He further got rebuked in '06 when the netroots and anti-war side began to emerge and the pendulum finally had swung away from Joe...yep, the party left him...and thank goodness.

The corporate media still is trying to play this election as if it's 2000 and 2004. It isn't. The issues have changed, the candidates are different and the mood of the country has turned on both conservatives and the GOOP.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 01:33 PM
Response to Reply #17
26. Joe said he doesn't want investigations pre Iraq war.
He said he doesn't want "digging around anymore for who did what in 2003"

Right, Joe. It might show you guys up.
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vinylsolution Donating Member (807 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 11:46 AM
Response to Original message
22. We need a real Progressive in The White House....
.... Not another corporate, AIPAC-puppet Democrat.

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ikojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. It appears Mr Obama will take his marching orders
from the same people that brought us Clinton Inc.
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DCKit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-18-08 09:32 AM
Response to Reply #24
43. I am unaware of Mr. Obamas ties to the DLC. Please enlighten me.
The DLC needs Obama far more than Obama needs the DLC.

While many Democrats have benefited greatly from jumping into bed with the corporations and PACs the DLC was created to benefit, many others are seeing - or sensing - that the DLC is anathema to Democratic principles. When enough of the electorate becomes aware of the structure and goals of the DLC, the DLC will dissolve. No sane candidate for elected office will be able to afford to be linked to them.

The Clinton's deep ties to the DLC is what put me off to the idea of an HRC Presidency and, I believe, influenced a lot of others as well - if only subconsciously.

Politicians who appear to be owned and managed by corporations give me the willies. Thankfully, I no longer seem to hold the minority opinion.
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wildbilln864 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 12:44 PM
Response to Original message
25. yep!
k&r! :hi:
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George II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
27. Why do you repeatedly post anti-Democratic messages on a Democratic website?
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:09 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. If you think that, refer me to the moderators.
:shrug:

SO...you are okay with the tragedy we call Iraq?

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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Hi Mad! Thanks for another great post. The key to preventing such horrors
in the future is understanding how they happened in the past and are still happening today.

Keep up the great work! I and my children thank you. :hi:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:16 PM
Response to Reply #29
30. I fear what is happening about Iran.
I don't think they will stand up against Bush. I did not realize she had removed that about Iran from the bill.

Now they are about to let Rove off the hook. :shrug:

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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #30
41. I didn't either until I read that thread today. It made me literally sick
I'm so afraid for our country. If we go down that road, we're finished.
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George II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #28
34. No, I'm not happy with it, but the "information" provided is rife with opinion and speculation
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. My friend, I used their very own words...It is from their website.
So go and argue with them. It is that group who did the speculation and gave their opinion.

As I said, contact the mods if you think I am wrong.

Go for it.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #36
38. You don't like my linking to my own posts? You think I always attack Democrats?
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 06:27 PM by madfloridian
Then I say you are being remiss if you don't report me to the mods.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. George II...I just did a search of posts by you.
You seem to think everyone here attacks Democrats, so it is not just your opinion of me.

Interesting......
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. How is this anti- Democratic
It is interesting to see the positions of everyone at a point in time. The fact was that this was so soon after 911, that it likely is the high point in accepting militant solutions. This was a major part of teh Democratic party.
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:17 PM
Response to Original message
31. Check out the Kerry article which is 100% on target - and sane
It dealt with the real way to fight the terrorist - even making the point that stopping the money was FAR more effective than the military solutions used. I had not read before that the replacement to BCCI was in the Balkans.

Imagine if Clinton had pursued the money as Kerry wanted in the 1990s OR if Kerry had influenced the Democrats or Republicans to work against terrorist this way instead of the approaches others suggested
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:28 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. I read that Kerry article. It was very good.
Do a search at the DLC site for many other of his articles. Very sensible and reasonable.

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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 05:58 PM
Response to Reply #33
37. Thank you for posting this link - it is fascinating to see where
people were at different times. the fact is that many of the DLC people did become pretty war like. I assume that hearing Leiberman and Clinton - who both were very respected at that point moved many Senators, in and out of the DLC. People forget that the DLC at the beginning was not really left vs right - Gary Hart and Tim Wirth were there - as well as a conservative Gore.

In Kerry's case, his voting record was always way to the left of the others. But, there were issues where he looked for pragmatic solutions. Kennedy did not endorse him just because he was from MA.

This article was exactly his position on the WoT in 2004 and was declared "right" by George Will only in 2006 - he really was way ahead of the curve here.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #37
40. But the premise of their founding was to not need their traditional base.
To get money from corporations or wherever so as not to be dependent on minorities or unions, etc.

From that premise, it is easy to see how quickly they started viewing "the left" as "fringe"

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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-17-08 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. I also think they shifted when Clinton ran
Edited on Tue Jun-17-08 08:39 PM by karynnj
It always had a healthy portion of conservative Southern Dems, but with many like Hart and Wirth leaving the Senate - it moved to the right. The image I had at the very beginning was more Gary Hart then Sam Nunn. The idea was the need to encourage technologies.

I don't think it was so much to get money from corporations - though no one complained, but that they saw that their base was shrinking and that they would forever be out of power otherwise. (The shrinking of the unions paralleled the shrinking of the industrial component of the labor force.

As to minorities, at least the ones I know anything about had excellent records on civil rights. (Kerry had 100%, as did Leiberman - Bill Clinton was famous for that.)

One odd thought is that Gore, Kerry, Wirth and Heinz are the four Senators who were the best on global warming - all the Democrats were DLC . (they were the ones Gore thanked in Earth in the Balance - though that is from memory)
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