Eisenhower was a far left extremist

[eridani]

At least by today's standards.

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower

"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children."

"A preventive war, to my mind, is an impossibility today. How could you have one if one of its features would be several cities lying in ruins, several cities where many, many thousands of people would be dead and injured and mangled, the transportation systems destroyed, sanitation implements and systems all gone? That isn't preventive war; that is war."

"Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes you can do these things. Among them are H. L. Hunt (you possibly know his background), a few other Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or business man from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid."

"It is my personal conviction that almost any one of the newborn states of the world would far rather embrace Communism or any other form of dictatorship than acknowledge the political domination of another government, even though that brought to each citizen a far higher standard of living."

[wryter2000]

1. Lord, I miss him

He was President when I was a little kid, and he's always been my President. I don't imagine I'd agree with him on everything, but I'd so love to have him back now.

[Hissyspit]

16. He would think Bush was a coward.

And Cheney was a war-profiteer.

[annabanana]

33. And he would be right on both counts.. . . n/t

[Redstone]

2. He knew what war is REALLY like. Unlike the keyboard commandos of today, who

only experience it via video, and never see or smell the blood and fear and death.

Redstone

[grantcart]

3. and his progeny are for Obama

I left the United States in 1978 and returned to live in 1994 and was stunned at how conservative it had turned.

[eridani]

5. So, when do we stop letting Repukes and pundits

--define what is "left" or "center"? The mythology is that Reagan was everybody's favorite president; the reality is that he wasn't all that popular.

[FarLeftRage]

4. Maybe he should have been a Democrat...

Rather than a repuKKKe.

Nahh, he chose nixon as his veep, he'd never be a Democrat.

[eridani]

6. Nixon signed the Environmental Protection Agency into existence

It's entirely possible that both might be considered centrist Democrats by today's standards.

[FarLeftRage]

8. It's possible...

by what passes for what, these days.

In my youth, I was a Liberal Democrat in the line of FDR and JFK.
Today, I am considered to be a Socialist.

[osperto]

14. Nixon

is actually a very strange character. If one ignores the nixon IMAGE (especially the sweaty debate one - that arguably lost him the presidency), policywise, he was actually relatively liberal - EPA, Affirmative Action, etc. Otoh, he took us off the gold standard... sigh... (iirc)

Nixon the PERSON was just eminently unlikeable, but politically he was not a rightwing ideologue. Otoh, he was very controlling, and a poor leader.

He was a crappy president, and corrupt, though. That's his legacy

Well, that and a a lot of f-bombs on the whitehouse tapes.

[galaxy21]

19. I wouldn't call Nixon a crappy president

or maybe Bush has been so bad, we now realize how good every president before him was.

[ReadTomPaine]

21. I don't feel the same way about Nixon..

However his bi-partisan accomplishments dwarf both the Bush presidencies combined. The creation of the EPA, the SSI program, OSHA and his support of affirmative action and price controls all put him to the left of Reagan. His handling of China and the Soviet Union were more adept than GWB can even imagine.

It was under his watch, however, that the rot began in earnest. Donald Segretti found his legs in Nixon's administration and such colorful characters as Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney & Paul Wolfowitz got their first executive branch jobs with him. Moreover, it was Nixon's close ties to Prescott Bush that lead to Herbert's first associations with the White House and eventually to his job as head of the RNC around '72.

Bush used that position to continue the war his father started against Nelson Rockefeller and thanks largely to Nixon's assistance, he became a rising star in the GOP and remained there until his win in 1988. Needless to say, much of what's happening now is directly traceable to Herbert's presidency and thus to Nixon's tenure previous to that.

Of all his many character flaws (paranoia, anti-semitism, vindictiveness etc) who would have thought Nixon's most dangerous fault was his utter inability to judge the character of his appointments? That legacy has outlasted Vietnam, Watergate and everything else which occurred during that period. The way things are looking politically these days, it may outlast American democracy as well.

[EFerrari]

53. Nixon used to get drunk and call generals in the middle of the night to bomb

whoever he was pissed at. That's pretty crappy!

[hootinholler]

34. An odd duck indeed

Brought along in his first Congressional campaign by none other than W's grand pappy. He rose to the VP selection certainly after the robust recommendation of a certain influential senator, from which he helped H.W.'s real career along during his years as head of Zapata Oil and other enterprises.

At the time the EPA was a no brainer. Pittsburgh was literally a black city from mill soot, and the three rivers ran a murky brownish yellow from sulphurous mine tailings.

He was also very influential to Cheney and Rumsfeld, especially in their ideas of the unitary executive.

Those parts of his legacy seem to evaporate.

-Hoot

[underpants]

18. Froze prices and wages, Clean Air and Clean Water acts, ...

engaged foreign policy


Nixon, in today's standards, was a liberal

[alarimer]

37. I feel dirty admiring Nixon for some of the things he did.

But he was better on the environment at least than almost any Democrat currently serving. I'd rather have Eisenhower than ANY of the Democratic candidates for President (except Kucinich or, maybe, Edwards).

[Thothmes]

23. Actually Ike was courted by both parties

to run on their ticket. He remained apolitical during his army career. He was not particularly hard overone way or another for Republicans or Democrats.

[whistle]

7. Those words pretty much made Ike a commie in the eyes of the far right wing

[Selatius]

9. By today's standards, FDR would be a member of the Socialist Party if we listened to the Repubs.

He wasn't. In the universal political discourse, FDR would probably more likely fall into the ranks of the Social Democratic Parties seen in Europe. Folks like Tony Benn were even further left.

[scarletwoman]

10. Heck, he even sounds like Gandhi!

Eisenhower: "It is my personal conviction that almost any one of the newborn states of the world would far rather embrace Communism or any other form of dictatorship than acknowledge the political domination of another government..."

Gandhi: "I beg you to accept that there is no people on Earth who would not prefer their own bad government to the good government of an alien power."

I grew up during the Ike years, things have certainly gone downhill ever since...

sw

[Uncle Joe]

11. In some respects he was a bleeding heart liberal because he actually cared about the people and

you could see it in his eyes that he cared about his troops as well, in the film footage of him inspecting his paratroopers just before they were to fly off for the D-Day invasion, he knew many of them weren't coming back.

[tiptoe]

12. Bush, McCain are of that "tiny splinter group" Ike mentioned in 1954:

Labor Laws: Was the saving of lives the first priority of BushCo in NOLA? Nope. Rescue ship offers from England and Canada were spurned and one of the first things Bush did was attempt to repeal the 1931 Davis-Bacon Act, which mandates government contractors pay prevailing wages of the locales their contracts address.

Bush -- beneficiary of Election Fraud against democracy -- is one of the "neglible and stupid" Eisenhower describes.
McCain, too, reiterated recently his intent to privatize Social Security and supports BushCO's criminal war in Iraq.

What would General Eisenhower have done with treasonous members of the Bush admin and saboteurs of democracy?

[bunkerbuster1]

13. I love that speech.

It's kind of sad that Americans re-discover it, and scratch their heads and say "A Republican President said this? And wasn't burnt at the stake?"

[unblock]

15. heck, NIXON was a far left extremist by today's standards

at least if you believe the country (not just the powers that be) has moved as far to the right as the msm would have you believe.

coming from texas, i said before shrub was elected in 2000 that this guy was to the right of pat buchanan and no one believed me. that this administration has managed to make pat buchanan the occassional voice of reason is certainly telling....

[Hydra]

22. That I hate more than anything

The fact that things have gotten so insane that Pat Buchanan occasionally sounds sane and reasonable scares me more than anything else. That is the ultimate sign of what troubled waters we've drifted into.

[Gman]

17. Damn communist bastard...

:evilgrin:

[kiva]

20. Oh, THAT Eisenhower.

For a minute there I though you meant the President Eisenhower who:

Used the CIA to overturn a democratically elected leader in Nicaragua, virtually guaranteeing political chaos.

Used the CIA to overturn a democratically elected leader in Iran, which has continued to plague the U.S. today.

Planned the CIA adventure in the Bay of Pigs.

Allowed Joseph McCarthy to continue his filthy redbaiting rhetoric unmolested until the senator involved DDE's precious army.

Said nothing in support of civil rights until his presidential power was challenged.

Articulated the Eisenhower Doctrine which said the U.S. would "prepared to use armed force... aggression from any country controlled by international communism."

Yup, a real liberal, that Ike--thank God Wikipedia is there to set us straight.

[Hydra]

24. The death doesn't stop there

But the OP's point is still valid- somehow the monsters currently in the WH make the previous monsters look like pansies. Like "Bleeding heart Liberals" on some of their better days.

It's all an illusion, of course. We didn't end up where we are with the actions of one Administration.

It's still amazing how far they've pushed the discourse into their court though. As many have stated so far, most of us "extreme lefties" really aren't that left by any rational measure. By the current yardstick, though, you are off the chart lefty if you so much as disapprove of the Iraq war or think that "The War on Terror" is not a charge card with no limit.

[kiva]

25. I know what you mean, Hydra *sigh*

New improved monsters, bigger and badder and they do more damage. You're right, but I couldn't let this pass--Eisenhower was a key player in expanding the Cold War, and rates as one of the worst presidents of the 20th century, IMO.

[Hydra]

28. And you shouldn't have let it pass

I'm not going to bring up some of the dirtier things he did on his way to the Presidency.

As others have pointed out, Bushco 2.0 makes Nixon look like a boy scout(And they had to take the nuclear football away from him).

I'm all for both sides. What did they do, good AND bad, without the historic varnish?

[kiva]

30. Are you a history teacher too?

That's one of the biggest hurdles (for me) in teaching--my students are 18+, many of them have bought the St. Ronny story and don't want to be disillusioned. But they also don't want to hear negatives about Washington, Lincoln, FDR, Kennedy, or any of the figures we've chosen to idolize--it's a lot easier to put our leaders into slots, good or bad, than to think the shades of gray. Here's to removing that historic varnish :toast:

[Hydra]

32. Hehehe

No, I'm a WWII buff, and the cracks from what happened back then are still there today.

After studying the deeper history and following the threads to other things(MK-Ultra, for instance), it's hard to look at your country the same way. It's also hard to relate to the people who think we are some sort of shining example in the world.

As Bush continues his bulldozing, though, it's getting easier to tell people how it really is. The price of truth really is substantial.

[bobbolink]

48. There are no white hats and black hats. Roosevelt kept many from starving to death

and gave us a badly needed safety net.

He also put US citizens of Japanese descent in concentration camps.

[Thothmes]

52. He also authorized the assinations of foreign officials.

[eridani]

26. In this country, you can't distinguish left and right by referring to support of imperialism

That has been a straight across the board bipartisan thing since Truman established the National Security State. Obama is foursquare in favor of continued US military domination of the rest of the world as well.

[hootinholler]

31. The one who chose Nixon for VP...

I thought that Prescot Bush was running those operations through Nixon. Certainly Tricky Dick was wrapped seriously into the 'Cuban thing' as evidence on the tapes indicate.

Liberal? No, Ike wasn't liberal, but he did at least respect the law.

-Hoot

[LanternWaste]

57. I'm sure you have at your disposal

I'm sure you have at your disposal the names of all the Presidents who were sinless, perfect and possessed the benefit of the hindsight we take for granted.

Or (and I find this more likely), the OP was making a *relative* rather than an absolute statement.


“Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world, can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.” - Michael Scott in 'The Office' :eyes:

[eridani]

27. The OP was a response to all those folks who think Obama should disown the "far left"

Naturally they never say one single word about some specific POLICY they think is "far left." Just ask them for an example and it's instant <crickets>. Notice not a one has chimed in on this thread.

[Hydra]

29. Most keyboard warriors like words that end arguments

Basically, they like trump cards.

"Far Left" is a trump card. Fuck knows why "Right" isn't an instant killjoy, let alone "far right" considering what damage those ideas do in reality.

As plenty of people pointed out during the Primary, Obama and HRC weren't far off each other policy wise.

No one sane would call HRC a lefty, so why do so many people get mileage out of accusing Obama of such?

[Art_from_Ark]

36. The problems with the word "right"

is that it also has meanings of "correct", "fair", "just". So the "right" automatically has this advantage in perception. "Left", on the other hand, has no other meanings that would "enhance its image", so to speak. In fact, "left" has had a serious image problem for hundreds if not thousands of years.

[PerpetuallyDazed]

38. So true!

Do you know anything of their origins? I wonder if Lakoff has spoken to this?

[Solon]

47. The terms date back to pre-revolutionary France(1789)...

The French National assembly consisted of people from the First Estate(Nobles) who sat on the right wing of the building, and the Third Estate(Revolutionaries) sat on the left wing.

[Radical Activist]

41. People who cliam Obama is conservative don't often give many specifics either.

I see the guilt by association game about who his advisers are played a lot.

What Ike says here is consistent with Obama's public statements and platform of reinvesting in America instead of the war machine. Some people will always find a way to ignore 99% of what he stands for to spin the 1% they don't like as corporatism.

[eridani]

42. There is nothing BUT specifics posted on his conservatism

That isn't to say that things won't be much better for us under his presidency, but we are going to have to fight for progressive policies.

[Radical Activist]

44. Like what?

That he supports telecom immunity, even though he doesn't?
That he supports NAFTA, even though he doesn't?
Those are the two I read here most and both accusations involve a lot of spin.

[eridani]

45. That he publicly calls out Venezuela and Ecuador

--but supports the union organizer murderers in Columbia. That he does not support single payer health care. That he has stated we are in danger because Muslim jihadists want to establish a caliphate. That he wants to raise overall troop levels in the armed forces, as if we can even continue to afford the military establishment that we have now.

[Radical Activist]

46. Those aren't specific statements.

"Calls out" Venezuela and Ecuador? Somehow I suspect that's going to be another quote that someone will spin into something worse than it is, which is what people have been doing to Obama since he announced. What specific policy does he suggest regarding those countries that you object to?
In what way does he "support" those who killed the union organizes, and are you talking about the Drummond company or the government of Columbia?
You're kind of proving my point. Its always these vague statements and spin on something he said, just like in the primary where if Obama sneezed it was proof that he's a conservative sell-out. Deja Vu.

Universal Single-Payer would be nice. In the past he said that's a goal. I'm not willing to deny him entry into the progressive club based on that one issue since it isn't politically viable yet.

The big expense in the military establishment is the defense contractors, not the meager pay we give to troops. In fact, if he increases the numbers of troops while eliminating contracts to mercenaries like Blackwater (something he says he'll do), then I would consider that a progressive improvement.

So you've got one specific statement of a single issue where he has a merely liberal stand instead of a socialist one. You're making my point for me.

[eridani]

51. The big expense in the military establishment is maintaining 700+ military bases all over the world

There are more than a few conservatives who realize that continuing an American military empire is unaffordable in the long run--it ain't just a "socialist" thing.

Pardon me, Mr Obama, but the government of Columbia is the main supporter of the RW paramilitaries.

http://progressivesforobama.blogspot.com/2008/05/obama-can-do-better-on-latin-america.html

We will fully support Colombia's fight against the FARC. We'll work with the government to end the reign of terror from right wing paramilitaries. We will support Colombia's right to strike terrorists who seek safe-haven across its borders. And we will shine a light on any support for the FARC that comes from neighboring governments. This behavior must be exposed to international condemnation, regional isolation, and - if need be - strong sanctions. It must not stand.

Also, it is extremely disappointing to get this "caliphate" horseshit from someone who is way past smart enough to know better. Maybe he could at least tell us how they plan to decide whether it should be a Sunni caliphate or a Shi'ite caliphate. As long as that question remains unanswered, the whole notion is just idiotic.

http://www.barackobama.com/2007/08/01/the_war_we_need_to_win.php

Just because the President misrepresents our enemies does not mean we do not have them. The terrorists are at war with us. The threat is from violent extremists who are a small minority of the world's 1.3 billion Muslims, but the threat is real. They distort Islam. They kill man, woman and child; Christian and Hindu, Jew and Muslim. They seek to create a repressive caliphate. To defeat this enemy, we must understand who we are fighting against, and what we are fighting for.

[mdmc]

35. You can never say that IKE didn't warn us

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower
He knew fascism when he saw it.

[cobalt1999]

39. As a history buff, I have a lot of respect for Ike.

People remember Kennedy for civil rights, but Ike sent the 101st to Arkansas to force school integration.

Ike fought against the "military-industrial" complex and warned of their growing influence on our budget.

Ike actually CUT defense spending during the Red Scare and "bomber gap" fears in order to maintain a budget surplus.

Ike's memoirs show the immense thought and concern he had to do the "right thing".

If he were running now, I'd vote for him in an instant.

[Recursion]

40. Ike was a moderate Republican in a much more liberal time

It's one of those quirks of history, like how Nixon was, policy-wise, more liberal than most Democrats are today.

[anonymous171]

43. Before the neocons, republicans used to be quite anti-war, bordering on isolationism.

[tabasco]

49. Ike was a good man who cared about his country.

Modern-day republicans and their brainwashed lackeys only care about money.

[NorthCarolina]

50. That's because the media has been allowed to redefine what a "Liberal" is

with little to no rebuttal or opposition from our leaders in Washington.

[JHB]

54. I've started describing myself as an "Eisenhower Leftist"...

...just to remind people that "liberal" and "far left" doesn't mean what decades of conservative PR work (propaganda)have gotten people to conjure up when they hear those words.

[mdmc]

55. nice

:toast:

[JHB]

56. Thanks, mdmc

BTW, That doesn't mean I'm unaware of the bad things happened under Ike (as noted by kiva and Hydra above).

I just figure if the wingnuts can use JFK to push their agenda (e.g. "I was a Democrat in the John Kennedy mold, but the party moved away from me"), then I'll use Ike to push aganist the Holy Church of Freemarketology.

[bobbolink]

58. Sadly, I think we use what we can to get people to think, and move beyond

the ugly stereotypes.

Including right here at DU.

It's all very sad.

Thank you for sharing your ideas!

[mdmc]

59. kick