Can we tolerate just one more thread about the family that got kicked off the plane?

[hedgehog]

Have you ever encountered people who self-diagnose their child with something, then use that diagnosis as an excuse for the child rather than as a reason to get help for the child? What I'm suggesting is the possibility that there is nothing wrong with any of the children involved in the Southwest Airlines incident. Calling a child autistic rather than poorly raised is both an opportunity for self drama and an excuse not to correct a problem.

[skooooo]

1. ..

:popcorn:

[Maddy McCall]

2. No. I've met more people who are in denial about their child's...

disability than who self-diagnose.

[mdmc]

6. me too

I've met many autistic kids that have a family in denial. I've never met a family that claimed to have an autistic kid that was actually healthy.

[EFerrari]

16. Yep. It usually goes much the other way. n/t

[proud2BlibKansan]

38. Not really

Lots of parents want their child labeled so they have an excuse for whatever they are in denial about - poor parenting, wild kid, etc.

It really happens and probably more than you realize.

But yes the opposite is true as well.

[Ilsa]

7. I was in denial for a year. nt

[PA Democrat]

33. My experience as well.

I've known that several acquaintances' children had autism long before the family would even seek professional help.

There were people who suspected MY child had autism months before we sought help, and her case was NOT subtle. She had all of the full-blown symptoms.

[mdmc]

3. I don't know anything about the incident you are talking

But autism is real and it causes behaviors.

I think that it would be acceptable to remove an autistic kid / family from a plane due to behaviors.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. Yeah, she's exploiting the kid.

In fact, I think that was an episode of Squidbillies.

[Ilsa]

5. No, but I've seen people ignore real diagnoses of autism because

they were ignorant about it. That gave them the opportunity to butt in and tell the parents they weren't raising their child "God's Way". Seriously.

I've never seen a family call their non-autistic child autistic. But I'm not in the transportation industry.

[SteelPenguin]

11. People are liars

They'll do anything to gain sympathy. The more I live on this planet the more anecdotal evidence I see to remove any lingering traces of faith in general humanity. Recently I saw a family of 5 at an airport with a child (10 or 11) in an airport wheelchair. They bypassed the longish security line by going through the handicapped lane on the side. Later I saw them at the terminal and the wheelchair was gone and the kid was running around with his siblings. At first I assumed that he must have some sort of issue that isn't constant, but then I overheard them talking about how they always do that to skip the security lines.

More and more I start from a position of 'people are scum and liars...prove me wrong'. Especially recently it seems to have gotten worse.

Or I'm just getting old and crusty.

[Ilsa]

21. You are very much like the genius Dr. House on FOX tv. The series

is exceelent. House always tells the residents working with about patients, "Everyone lies."

What a disgusting thing that family did, feigning hardship and disability. They should be careful; that sort of thing has a way of catching up kharma-wise sometimes.

[LostinVA]

26. I sometimes feel that way, too

Working with the public made me realize many people will lie about anything and everything. It's quite discouraging.

[hedgehog]

13. It doesn't always involve autism. For some dysfunctional families,

the presence of a chronic condition, whether real or imagined, is a source of unending drama and enjoyment. For example, there is the mother who is martyred by her child's asthma and who carries the rescue inhaler but who won't put the child on the medical regimen to control inflammation and prevent attacks. There is the adult diabetic who has an "attack" whenever someone else is getting too much attention. A trip to the ER is an opportunity for a family outing, with cousins, uncles, aunts and grandparents all sitting in the waiting room comparing symptoms and diagnoses! The worst part is that this behavior makes people skeptical of families with real issues that can't always be controlled. Just mention peanut allergies if you want a sample of that skepticism.

[Ilsa]

19. Sort of a munchausen syndrome by proxy or something, I guess. I is odd that the

mother would be "stimming" off the excitement.

No, I've never seen it, but is certainly possible.

[dddem]

31. OMG

you know my mother? I've stopped inviting her to the kids performances and ballgames because we always have to focus attention on her ailments, instead of on the kids. I've tried many times to get her to prepare so that she doesn't end up needing to be rescued, but to no avail. It's sad, but that's how life is for a lot of people.

[Horse with no Name]

32. I've seen that before too

In one...the woman made her child sick in order to forge a relationship with the child's pediatrician...whom she felt would ultimately fall deeply and madly in love with her when he realized how smart she was to take care of such a sick child.
Another one, the child is ALWAYS sick during the Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays and ALWAYS insists the child be admitted during that time period. Funny thing though...the child is ALWAYS asymptomatic the week before each and the family celebrates the holiday early "fearing" that they will be in the hospital on the actual holiday...since they always are.:eyes:
Doting family members, church members, and friends always feel obligated to troop up to the hospital on THEIR holiday to show support for the "poor family with the sick kid" bearing gifts and food.
It is absolutely nuts what people will do.:(

[BigDaddy44]

8. ADHD

I see it all the time. "My child has ADHD". Which basically means "I can't control him, so i let him do whatever he wants."

[La Lioness Priyanka]

22. autism unlike ADHD has no cure and no easy meds that make your kid mellow

so really the incentive to falsely label your own child autistic is vastly reduced

[LostinVA]

27. My teacher friends would agree with you -- they say that alot!

[SteelPenguin]

9. I have

I've met people before who listed off the various problems their wonderful little maniac child had. I asked them what kind of treatment they were pursuing, etc, and after a series of questions it became obvious that there had never been an actual diagnosis by a doctor.

I don't think this incident shows that though. I think it's some scumbaggy people who are too lazy to parent. Whether the kids actually have problems, or they're just lying to gain sympathy because they're scumbaggy is irrelevant. Whether the child was autistic or not, the parents should at least be able to keep them in their seats, particularly when instsructed more than once to do so by the flight attendants.

[yardwork]

10. Link? Somehow I missed the whole thing.

Dish!

[hedgehog]

14. Here you go

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3385049

[fasttense]

12. Yes,

I knew a woman who went around saying her son had ADD. When my son got diagnoses with it, I asked her how the doctor diagnosed it. Turns out a teacher told her her son might have ADD and she never took him to a psychiatrist or doctor to get a real diagnosis. But every time her son acted out, she would wave the flag of ADD and learning disabled. She would proudly say she refused to give him drugs for it.

She also had a daughter she claimed was dyslexic. I never pressed her about her daughter's diagnosis but I suspected it was the same kind of thing.

[KitchenWitch]

15. ...

:popcorn: :beer:

[LeftishBrit]

17. There's a possibility of anything; but neither any of us here nor the airline are qualified to tell

I have encountered people who probably self-diagnosed *themselves* with something and then used it as an excuse; but virtually never with their children. On the other hand, I've seen plenty of cases of people whose real disabilities were not addressed until very late because either the parents were in denial, or the parents *did* recognize something wrong but the medical profession did not diagnose it. I myself experienced years of delay in being diagnosed as having Crohn's disease, and my parents, who did notice a problem, were simply regarded as neurotic, because at that time it wasn't thought that children could have it. I also know several people who had depression from childhood or adolescence, and it wasn't recognized or treated for years, because either their parents or the doctors that they consulted were in denial or thought children couldn't have it. I know someone who has a mild mental handicap and for years her parents simply refused to admit it. Etc.

So while parents COULD invent a diagnosis for their child ('Munchausen's by proxy' being an extreme example of such a situation), I just think it's so rare compared either with parental denial or denial by society, that one should not risk making things more difficult for parents whose children have genuine problems, by assuming this to be the case. Frankly, it reminds me a little of the RW attitude that anyone in financial need is just trying to cheat the system.

[hedgehog]

18. Which brings us back around to whether or not people that can't

sit in their seats and follow instructions for the duration of the flight should be allowed on the plane. This includes children, the mentally ill, people who are drunk or high, people who are just plain obnoxious as well as anyone who is afflicted with autism.

[PA Democrat]

35. Thank you.

I am appalled at the need by many here to rush to judge this woman and all of us struggling to raise a child with autism. My husband and I had a horrible time dealing with our own child's diagnosis despite the fact that she clearly met all of the criteria for diagnosis. It was the darkest period of my life. I would have sold my soul to remove that label from my child.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

20. actually thats highly unlikely since most people dont want to give their children

negative labels. also unlike ADD, autism doesnt have medication that mellows your child, so it really takes any incentive to give a child this label away


i think this is more BS attack on families that has become part of corporate america

[jeff30997]

23. Oops!

I thought that you were talking about a family that got kicked off the planet!

[A-Schwarzenegger]

28. Laughed.

[LeftishBrit]

29. If it was the Bush family, that might not be a bad idea!

[jeff30997]

36. Nah!

They would come back and live in Paraguay as planned..

[screembloodymurder]

24. Tolerance and LUV to you too.

Have you ever worked with these children? Do you know what medications they are on?

[LostinVA]

25. Yes, I have -- and I wondered that about this family, too

My mom is a pediatric nurse, and it's very common to have a parent bring in a child and say,"They have ADD/hyperactivity/Asperger's/etc." Friends who are teachers also have that problem.

People are forgegting that ALL FOUR kids were out of control and NOT being disiplined. Not only was this unfair to other passengers, but it was unsafe for everyone on board.

I'm not saying this is what's the case in this incident, but I REALLY wonder about it, especially having watched the video and having heard the mother herself say the kids were "out of control." She was aware of it.

And, I have both a relative and a very good friend with CP, and I have friends who have autistic children. I am not some mean person who doesn't want special needs kids around them, or even kids who are experiencing normal high spirits... unless I'm in a nice restaurant or a movie theater, but those are other threads!

The airline should have helped make alternate arrangements, but taking them off the next leg was NOT an evil thing to do.

[LostInAnomie]

30. I've worked in Special Education long enough to know that kind of crap goes on.

There are always people looking to get by with something. It happens a ton with mental disorders. They are incredibly hard to disprove, and once you are labeled with them you can get away with murder. All the unscrupulous parent needs is a basic knowledge of the symptoms of a disorder and a doctor that is either willing to please or doesn't care enough to call them on their bullshit.

I had a student last year who's mother swore he had Asperger's. He had never been tested, didn't show any of the symptoms, and gave no signs whatsoever of having Asperger's. Out of a 45 pt. check sheet for Asperger's I had, the kid only scored a 3 (and those 3 were a stretch). But, every time an IEP meeting or a parent/teacher conference came up she would throw Asperger's out there as an excuse for his poor performance in class and his disruptive behavior.

You see it with ADHD so much anymore that it's almost funny. The teacher in the general ed. class next to mine had a total of 19 students last year. Of those 19 students, 14 had been diagnosed as ADHD. Anymore when I hear ADHD, unless I see the symptoms myself, I automatically think "lazy parents looking for an excuse" or "this kid's parents must not want to deal with them". It sounds bad, but once you've seen it a few hundred times you know it's true.

[proud2BlibKansan]

39. So many parents of disabled kids are in denial

It's sad. But I do think there are a certain number of parents who make up a handicap too.

I had a kid once who was retarded and had a sight problem that was corrected with glasses. And every time he had problems at school Mom would say well he couldn't see. If he acted out she would say well he can't see so he acts up to get attention. We had his eyes tested over and over and the glasses he wore worked fine plus he never came to school without them. But Mom was in complete denial about his cognitive functioning; she was convinced he struggled because of his vision problems. It was one of the more frustrating families I have ever worked with.

[Marrah_G]

34. My best friend has two young autistic girls.

Identical twins. We had quite an adventure bringing them to their first movie a few weeks ago. I can't imagine her trying to bring them on a plane at least while they are still children. It wouldn't be fair the the other passengers and more importantly it would not be fair to her daughters. I have to wonder what was so important that they needed to go on a plane.

[proud2BlibKansan]

37. Happens to me all the time

I teach disabled kids :)

But in this situation, just like at school, I am choosing to take the mother's word for it until we know differently.