Is the United States of America an empire?

[arcadian]

[mix]

1. you had to ask?

eom

[arcadian]

4. Just curious as to where folks stood on this issue.

n/t

[raccoon]

2. And the pope is Catholic. nt

[arcadian]

3. wrong spot

n/t

[sinkingfeeling]

5. Absolutely and one of the cruelest ever to exist.

[Captain Hilts]

7. Wow, what a stupid remark.

King Leopold thanks you!

[sinkingfeeling]

8. You're entitled to your opinion as I'm entitled to mine. You should read about the US's

foreign policy exploits of the last 100 years. Try "Freeing the World to Death: Essays on the American Empire" by William Blum. Our use of starvation, "sanctions", cluster bombs, land mines, blockades, depleted uranium bombs, chemical and biological 'weapons', and the nuke, has probably resulted in the deaths of over 65 million people.

[IDemo]

9. Arthur Silber's "Dominion Over the World" series is illuminating as well

http://powerofnarrative.blogspot.com/2007/01/dominion-over-world-i-iraq-is.html

[On the Road]

6. You Could Describe it as a Virtual Empire

held in place by treaties and a combination of political, economic, financial, clandestine, and military coercion of various kinds. Great for the colonial power, since comparatively little money has to be spent on government, infrastructure, etc.

[mmonk]

10. Here is my answer:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/7/6/123449/0822/844/547337

[paparush]

11. Does the Pope sh* t in the woods? (Jeff "The Dude" Lebowski)

[Indenturedebtor]

12. Yes. And we're not members we're the conquered. n/t

[Solon]

13. Manifest Destiny ring a bell? The United States was ALWAYS an empire. n/t

[SidneyCarton]

14. You say empire like its a bad thing...

[sinkingfeeling]

15. Empire is the antithesis of democracy.

[Solon]

16. Considering the abuses needed to maintain an empire, hell yes its a bad thing....

and has been recognized as such, worldwide, for over 50 years.

[SidneyCarton]

18. First off, I should have used the "sarcasm" thingy

Our asperations toward empire have been the strongest force that has caused us to stray from our core democratic ideals. That said, we have a problem, for all territory west of the Mississippi, and the State of Florida are all essentially territory taken through imperial expansion. Furthermore, the entire settlement of the pre-1803 United States was done through imperialist expansion and genocide. I have no illusions about our bloodstained past, but in order for us to properly "atone" for our sins against humanity, we would have to vote ourselves into virtual nonexistence, somehow I don't find that a likely, nor a wise option.

That said, I firmly believe we must put down the sword. We are no longer the sole great power on the globe, and cannot act as one, whether we like it or not we are diminishing, and need to retrench to a level we can sustain, lest we implode.

[Solon]

22. Actually, I already mentioned Manifest Destiny...

recognizing that the United States was founded to be an Empire, and continued to expand, territorially, up until the 20th century is just an establishment of the facts. This doesn't mean that we must vote ourselves into virtual non-existence, that simply isn't practical, if it was, I'd be for it. However, as you said, we could put down the sword, that would be a good first step.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

17. The United States is the tool of the Corporate Empire.

[robcon]

19. Not even close to an empire.

I think those who call the U.S. an empire need to take history courses. A lot of them.

[Solon]

23. So Manifest Destiny wasn't imperialistic?

How about the "taking" of Hawaii, the Philippines, Cuba, Puerto Rico, etc.

[robcon]

24. Certainly these actions were imperialistic.

Does that make the U.S. an empire, today?

Look up history - maybe Ireland or India or Rhodesia under Britain.

Maybe the Belgian Congo, Peru under Spain, Korea under Japan, Hawaii under the U.S. (19th century), Czechoslovakia under the USSR, etc.

Then tell me whether the U.S. is an empire.

[Solon]

27. It could be argued that Iraq and Afghanistan are U.S. colonial possessions now...

That would make the U.S. an Empire today, just like it was in the past, the fact that the United States allowed these two countries to establish what are essentially rump states is irrelevant. This is, of course, in the classical sense, since after we freed the Philippines, after WWII, we became a hegemony rather than a classical empire, they are too expensive to maintain, after all. Basically it was a defense again the USSR, but was used, in the past, and today, to try to economically dominate other nations, rather than doing it militarily, though sometimes "freedom fighters" are used.

[robcon]

31. No it can't.

Both have elected leaders, not appointees from the alleged "empire." Both have legislators, and are not ruled from abroad. When those leaders or legislators criticize the U.S., as they have done numerous times, they are not thrown out, or executed, as empires would do.

Both countries are not limited as to where they can ship their exports, as colonies would be.

You seem to want to somehow stretch the meaning of empire to include those states under a U.S. empire. Why is that? Is it ignorance or attempted spin?

[sinkingfeeling]

30. I disagree. "737 U.S. Military Bases = Global Empire", says Chalmers Johnson.

With more than 2,500,000 U.S. personnel serving across the planet and military bases spread across each continent, it's time to face up to the fact that our American democracy has spawned a global empire.

The total of America's military bases in other people's countries in 2005, according to official sources, was 737. Reflecting massive deployments to Iraq and the pursuit of President Bush's strategy of preemptive war, the trend line for numbers of overseas bases continues to go up.

Interestingly enough, the thirty-eight large and medium-sized American facilities spread around the globe in 2005 -- mostly air and naval bases for our bombers and fleets -- almost exactly equals Britain's thirty-six naval bases and army garrisons at its imperial zenith in 1898. The Roman Empire at its height in 117 AD required thirty-seven major bases to police its realm from Britannia to Egypt, from Hispania to Armenia. Perhaps the optimum number of major citadels and fortresses for an imperialist aspiring to dominate the world is somewhere between thirty-five and forty.

The total of America's military bases in other people's countries in 2005, according to official sources, was 737. Reflecting massive deployments to Iraq and the pursuit of President Bush's strategy of preemptive war, the trend line for numbers of overseas bases continues to go up.

Interestingly enough, the thirty-eight large and medium-sized American facilities spread around the globe in 2005 -- mostly air and naval bases for our bombers and fleets -- almost exactly equals Britain's thirty-six naval bases and army garrisons at its imperial zenith in 1898. The Roman Empire at its height in 117 AD required thirty-seven major bases to police its realm from Britannia to Egypt, from Hispania to Armenia. Perhaps the optimum number of major citadels and fortresses for an imperialist aspiring to dominate the world is somewhere between thirty-five and forty.

The worldwide total of U.S. military personnel in 2005, including those based domestically, was 1,840,062 supported by an additional 473,306 Defense Department civil service employees and 203,328 local hires. Its overseas bases, according to the Pentagon, contained 32,327 barracks, hangars, hospitals, and other buildings, which it owns, and 16,527 more that it leased. The size of these holdings was recorded in the inventory as covering 687,347 acres overseas and 29,819,492 acres worldwide, making the Pentagon easily one of the world's largest landlords.

http://www.alternet.org/story/47998/?page=1

[kpominville]

20. America is a Hedgemony

We project the appearance of empire so we get the benefits of cowing the local populace without the responsibilities of governing that used to go along with it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

21. Well, we slaughtered some ten million natives in order to expand.

A couple million Iraqis to take their natural resources. Our military's all over the earth.

Hard to say it's not an empire, IMO.

[zorahopkins]

25. An EVIL Empire

The United States is not only an empire, but an EVIL empire.

If the US had a death star, it would not hesitate for one minute to destroy another planet.

The United States illegal invaded another country, and continues to occupy it.

The United States is responsible for the deaths of MILLIONS of people.

USA = Evil Empire

[bdamomma]

26. a crumbling one.

[Nye Bevan]

28. NO- If we were an EMPIRE we would be ruled by an EMPEROR;

If we were a KINGDOM we would be ruled by a KING;

but we are actually a COUNTRY so we are ruled by George W Bush. ;-)

[KansDem]

29. LOL!!! A DUzy if ever there was one!

I had to read it a couple of times before I "got it." But those are the best kind of DUzies!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: