Red Cross Secret Report: -"Highest Officials In US Goverment In Jeopardy Of Being Prosecuted' (NYT)

[kpete]

New Book Reveals Existence of Secret Red Cross Torture Report
By Kate Klonick - July 11, 2008, 8:45AM

In a secret report last year, the Red Cross found that the CIA's interrogation techniques were "categorically" torture, a new book reveals.

From the New York Times:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/11/washington/11detain.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

The book, "The Dark Side: The Inside Story of How the War on Terror Turned Into a War on American Ideals," by Jane Mayer, who writes about counterterrorism for The New Yorker, offers new details of the agency's secret detention program, as well as the bitter debates in the administration over interrogation methods and other tactics in the campaign against Al Qaeda.

. . .Citing unnamed "sources familiar with the report," Ms. Mayer wrote that the Red Cross document "warned that the abuse constituted war crimes, placing the highest officials in the U.S. government in jeopardy of being prosecuted."


Late Update: The book also reveals new specifics on Abu Zubaydah's waterboarding. Contrary to administration reports that the technique was used "on only three occasions," Abu Zubaydah told the Red Cross that he was waterboarded "at least 10 times in a single week and as many as three times a day."

And there's new info on Khalid Shaikh Mohammed as well. "KSM" says he was "kept naked for more than a month" and "kept alternately in suffocating heat and in a painfully cold room."

more at:
http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/07/book_reveals_existence_of_secr.php

[Bob Dobbs]

1. As I prophesied in '99

busholini is a criminal of historic proportions.

My support of Gore and outrage over the election fraud in Florida, where I was living, cost me my dream job and derailed my career, but at least I am now proven correct.

[leveymg]

19. The truly terrible thing is that I wrote in '83 that this was coming in 2002

It was part of a 10-part series in the Santa Cruz (CA) Express weekly paper, titled, "Santa Cruz in the Year 2002". I predicted that an oil war would start with the suicide bombing of American-made aircraft in 2001, and the end result by 2008 would be a total surveillance police state using torture tables. Oh yes, I also described a tech-sector crash and real estate bubble blowout.

I still have yellowed copies. Guess it's time to post these on-line and take "credit" for my foresight. Not clairvoyance, just scenario-building of the sort taught in universities and used by intelligence services and multinational corporations at the time.

All this is just a logical culmination of processes and events already in play during the Reagan-Bush Administration.

[LaStrega]

22. Wow!

Any foresight on the future?

[Raksha]

24. Please post your documents on DU when you get them transcribed.

I'd be very interested in seeing your 1983 predictions, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

[rucognizant]

36. WHY.......

Aren't YOU running for Pres?

[zeemike]

40. I too would love to see them

I have made predictions in the past (I have peen posting on boards for 15 years) that have come true also but never saved them. But they were mostly about global warming. And it was like you, not clairvoyance but simple deductions.
Can't wait to see it.

[Divine Discontent]

26. living good trumps 'good living'

these SOBs did all they could to get Lil Boots in office, because they knew it would usher in billions for all of them to divvy up with each other and finance their good living!

Well, in the end, living GOOD and wholesome, and fighting the good fight will always trump their filth, crimes, and deception.

I lost someone to the dark side around the start of the "war" and I never got him back. My life has been topsy-turvy since, and I blame the evil empire. They are corrupt as far as the galaxy is long.

Cheers to you for being on the right side of justice!

more at --- www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable

[The Backlash Cometh]

27. When this is over, if we truly come to understand how much they took from us,

we should stop at nothing until we get full restitution from the sons of bitches who took seven years from our lives. I mean, for all their posturing, they weren't right about nothing. And the fact that they'll never admit they were wrong, is evident by the way they're willing to pay 400 mil to the biggest fucking liar of them all: Rush Limbaugh.

[Dover]

2. They never mention just WHO will do the prosecuting, however.

And in what court?

[GreenPartyVoter]

5. ICC, I imagine. Sure ** doesn't recognize it, but he rarely recognizes any form of law other

than martial.

My big question is how will they (the prosecutors) catch them (the evil-doers?)

[Dover]

6. There doesn't appear to be ANYONE willing to enforce either our national laws

or international laws. One can be charged but WHO will enforce?

There is apparently no will in THIS country's government to enforce our laws and no stirring among the People either.

[NBachers]

35. Isn't there something like a "Department of Justice?"

If the rumors are true, then maybe the "Department of Justice" could do something.

[tanyev]

3. K and R.

[wryter2000]

4. I had a thought

If Bush is deemed a war criminal (as Kissinger has been), he won't be able to travel abroad. He won't give a s**t. However, I imagine that it'll be very unhelpful to Yoo's career as an academic because they routinely go overseas on sabbatical and for conferences. I wonder if there's any chance that he might attend a conference in Europe somewhere and get taken out of a talk in handcuffs.

[Dover]

7. Why do you suppose no one is enforcing OUR national laws on these matters?

We have our own laws in place and yet there is no enforcement or even the will among politicos to do a damn thing (with only a few exceptions). Bushco criminals have learned all they need to do is
"just say no", and there's no one to make them.

[tridim]

8. Because BushCo owns the enforcers.

At least they do for another 7 months.

[Dover]

10. So you think a new Dem White House team will sick the enforcers on Bushco?

If Bushco had any expectation that there would be mass prosecutions, do you think they'd just turn things over to the Dems? Will the Bush-owned enforcers do the bidding of a Dem White House?

What I've seen over the past several years (and even prior to Bush) is general movement to the right in a nonpartisan lockstep (with only artificial differences).

[Ichingcarpenter]

11. I think agreements with the international bodies are much

more likely to happen which can help circumvent our republican judicial system

[Dover]

13. I don't think Bushco has any concerns about being prosecuted at home or abroad.

I hope they get a big surprise, but I'm not counting on it. The day Cheney, Bush and a few others are locked up is the day I'll know that there has been some justice done and law restored.

[tridim]

14. Yes, and they will if we demand it. nt

[Dover]

17. Yeah, they've been SO responsive to our demands thus far......n/t

[tridim]

18. In 2009 we will have the Presidency, and big majorities in Congress.

And thus the ability to actually prosecute the criminals in the current regime.

[Raksha]

25. Interesting idea...it's the ONLY possible rationale

for our spineless do-nothing Congress that makes any kind of moral sense whatsoever.

Re If Bushco had any expectation that there would be mass prosecutions, do you think they'd just turn things over to the Dems? Will the Bush-owned enforcers do the bidding of a Dem White House?

What sense does it make for them to roll over again and again for a pResident with an appoval rating in the 20s, antagonizing their supporters to the point that Congress' own approval rating is in the single digits?

Maybe--just MAYBE--they are trying to get Bush to think he'll never be held accountable, so that he'll go peacefully. It's like, "Don't go away mad, or scared...Just. Go. Away." Then AFTER he's out of office and his goons have all been purged from the Justice Department, THEN the new Administration and Congress really put the screws to Bush and Cheney and the whole evil bunch.

Now this is admittedly a best-case scenario, and I am NOT saying I necessarily believe it. The Dems could very well be as spineless and complicit as they appear to be. But it's a nice thought anyway.

[Solly Mack]

9. K&R

[SpiralHawk]

12. "Stop the republicon torture machine." - JC

"It happened to me, and I say it is anti-Christian. As well as immoral, cruel, useless, and evil." - JC

[trusty elf]

37. That's quite a graphic SpiralHawk!

Your work? :thumbsup:

[lonestarnot]

15. Damn sickening bunch.

[Peace Patriot]

16. LBJ & Nixon slaughtered 2 million people in Southeast Asia with complete impunity

(although both were basically drummed out of office--in both cases related to their war crimes, LBJ more directly than Nixon). But they both lived out their lives in peace, not in jail, nor even threatened with it. Reagan was directly complicit in the slaughter of TWO HUNDRED THOUSAND Mayan villagers in Guatemala, and, of course, in perpetrating a war on Nicaragua that was expressly forbidden by Congress. He is a "saint" to this day, to our national political (i.e., corporate/fascist) establishment. The Democratic Congress hand-slapped a few of his underlings (who are back in power today).

So, the dysfunction of our legal system, as to presidential/executive branch war crimes, has been evident for a long while. Maybe it will be ultimately to the good that it is so blatant now.

A Democratic House leader saying "impeachment is off the table" is one of the most blatant violations of the U.S. Constitution that I know of. It is equivalent to Bush's "signing statements" and numerous, lawless executive orders. It is mind-boggling--the way Democratic Party leaders' promotion of 'TRADE SECRET' vote counting is mind-boggling. The betrayal is so...awful. And it's interesting how at least between elections opinion polls reflect what the American people think of all this: Our Democratic Congress has a worse approval rating than Bush (Bush at about 15% approval, Congress under 10%). As elections approach--by means of polling fraud, or because of the lack of choices--we always end up with close to a 50/50 split, between Dems/Repubs. And it's no wonder. People are just plain bewildered. They try to vote against unjust war, and for lawful and beneficial government--but who's to say what their vote will result in?

Anyway, "our system"--government/political--has become SO illegitimate, and SO completely lacks the "consent of the governed," and is SO completely unresponsive to the will of the people, and has been SO completely lacking in "course corrections" (i.e., the antiwar movement driving LBJ out of the presidential race in 1968, and the "Watergate" impeachment proceedings driving Nixon out of the White House in 1973)--that you get the feeling something's gonna give--crack, collapse. It can't go on like this. Maybe Diebold & brethren (s)electing Obama will let some steam out of the system. I don't think he was their first choice, but apparently he will do. That's what it looks like to me. Then we can all forget about the 'TRADE SECRET' vote counting machines, and play some progressive games for a while, until the Bush Reich comes back at us in 2012. Or, maybe they won't bother--the U.S.A. will be such a hulking ruin by then. Maybe THEN we will be able to restore vote counting that everyone can see and understand--when it doesn't really matter to the global corporate predators who rule over us.

As long as we had transparent vote counting, there was the possibility of a "course correction"--and even if we got bad rulers, this kept them somewhat in check. Now they are completely out of control, and the lawlessness is rampant and completely without consequences. The result will likely be the ultimate "course corrector"--economic ruin. It happened in South America, 1980s to 2000--U.S. supported fascist brutality followed by "free trade." And this--totally trashed economies--DID result in a leftist movement of truly awesome proportions that has swept the continent, and it includes bringing the fascist bastards to justice, who had initially brutally destroyed democracy. The key to this movement: more than a decade of work, by many people and groups, on TRANSPARENT elections.

[leveymg]

20. Yes, but America was the world's greatest superpower then. Now, we're a bankrupt shell.

When they come to make arrests, nobody will defend Bush-Cheney and the rest, except private Blackwater mercinaries. But, even the mercs will be fugitives on the run. Machiavelli warned about relying on them.

[defendandprotect]

31. ...and we were defeated by a small nation ....

and deservedly ---

and what great harm we did in Vietnam . . . !!!

[The Wizard]

39. Not a small nation, but

19 guys with box cutters. And they defeated us because poor leadership in Washington had the response bin Laden wanted. The only thing that will save our asses is turning over the entire Bush/Cheney/Rove cartel to the International Criminal Court for war crimes and crimes against humanity. We have to make reparations to Iraq and get other Middle Eastern countries involved in Iraq's reconstruction.

[defendandprotect]

41. I was talking about Vietnam and being defeated by this tiny Asian nation . . .

While I agree on the need to get rid of these criminals who control our government --

I don't agree that this was "19 guys with box cutters." Highly unlikely.

We will need the cooperation of ME countries and also the United Nations, which the

neo-cons continue to attack and co-opt.

[Jackpine Radical]

23. Nixon got off on a pardon.

That was a mistake.

We need to insist that such a mistake not be made again.

[spanone]

30. neither nixon LBJ or reagan had a torture program....you can kill millions in war if you play by

the rules...bu$h* did not play by the rules

[defendandprotect]

32. ...but there was a TORTURE program in Vietnam . . . . !!!!

The Phoenix Program --- Operation Phoenix ---

http://www.answers.com/topic/phoenix-program

Ed Landsdale -- General Y -- had a lot to do with this ---

He was a real sadist ---

Fletcher Prouty is good on him . . .

But, overall the CIA ran this program which killed more than 60,000 and more Vietnamese

civilians. They used to beat them severely, torture them, and then take them up in

helicopters, torture them some more, and throw them out of the helicopters alive.

[spanone]

21. k&r - what does it take for this congress/the rest of the world to act???

[defendandprotect]

33. I think we're getting closer, but I think it's Global Warming which is

moving it along -- which may be really why we've had all these really aggressive moves by

corrupt government now?

They, of course, can't be sure just when the real unrest will hit ---

but I think they know it's coming.

[leveymg]

34. All they have to do is realize that Bush-Cheney is a bluff - nobody's going to defend them

The military is damn good at carrying out missions for which they're trained -- they're not trained to prevent the arrest of war criminals.

After January, we Americans will arrest these criminals, lest the rest of the world has to. Better that we do it. Even the Secret Service understands that.

[frog92969]

28. K&R

We have to make sure that happens.

[mod mom]

29. Let's all buy this book to get it to the top of top selling book lists.

[NNN0LHI]

38. There was no need to torture KSM. Bush had his children. He would have admitted to anything

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/03/09/1047144871928.html

We have your sons: CIA

March 10 2003
By Olga Craig
Kuwait

Two young sons of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the suspected mastermind of the September 11 attacks, are being used by the CIA to force their father to talk.

Yousef al-Khalid, 9, and his brother, Abed al-Khalid, 7, were taken into custody in Pakistan in September when intelligence officers raided a flat in Karachi where their father had been hiding.

Mohammed fled just hours before the raid but his sons and another senior al-Qaeda member were found cowering behind a wardrobe in the apartment.

The boys have been held by the Pakistani authorities but this weekend they were flown to America where they will be questioned about their father. CIA interrogators confirmed that the boys were staying at a secret address where they were being encouraged to talk about their father's activities. "We are handling them with kid gloves," said one official. "After all, they are only little children, but we need to know as much about their father's recent activities as possible. We have child psychologists on hand at all times and they are given the best of care."


Why doesn't the NYT mention this?