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Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) |
UndertheOcean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:13 PM Original message |
So . if the Earth can't sustain 6 billion of us without cheap energy |
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Rosa Luxemburg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:16 PM Response to Original message |
1. we can start by using less energy and stopping waste |
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UndertheOcean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:18 PM Response to Reply #1 |
2. How ? |
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Rosa Luxemburg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:27 PM Response to Reply #2 |
4. we are going to have to |
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izquierdista (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:35 PM Response to Reply #2 |
21. How about rocks from China? |
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RaleighNCDUer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:35 PM Response to Reply #21 |
33. But as long as the government gives tax breaks to companies that |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 01:23 AM Response to Reply #33 |
51. It's not, in terms of real inputs. Only in terms of labor cost. Which |
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muriel_volestrangler (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 06:59 AM Response to Reply #21 |
58. This winter, I saw an extension to a Scottish mansion being built with Chinese granite |
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RaleighNCDUer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:53 AM Response to Reply #58 |
67. Shipping granite to Scotland is right up there with coal to Newcastle. nt |
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screembloodymurder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:14 PM Response to Reply #2 |
28. You don't understand. |
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AndyTiedye (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:38 PM Response to Reply #2 |
34. The Internet Saves More Energy Than it Consumes |
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NYC_SKP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:24 PM Response to Original message |
3. if we don't take care of nature, nature will "take care of" us... |
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UndertheOcean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:27 PM Response to Reply #3 |
5. Ha , its like we have power over our destiny! |
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angrycarpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:27 PM Response to Original message |
6. The 70's would have been a good time to start. |
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Hardrada (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:32 PM Response to Reply #6 |
8. I was convinced about saving the environment and ZPG etc. |
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angrycarpenter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:10 PM Response to Reply #8 |
17. I was only 7 in 1971 |
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Hardrada (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 12:39 AM Response to Reply #17 |
48. I was 27. I was a student radical rather than a hippy though |
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Truth4Justice (806 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 04:54 AM Response to Reply #8 |
54. ZPG died a quick death after 1974. I saw the numbers so no kids for me. |
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Bozita (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:39 PM Response to Reply #6 |
22. I read a book back in '70 by Paul Ehrlich. Scared the shit out of me. |
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Extend a Hand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:29 PM Response to Original message |
7. Sharon Astyk did a really thoughtful post on population |
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pitohui (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:26 PM Response to Reply #7 |
29. i don't understand what's "thoughtful" about that |
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Extend a Hand (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:43 PM Response to Reply #29 |
36. wow, I think |
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chapel hill dem (212 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:32 PM Response to Original message |
9. About a year ago, I heard an agricultural economist on a local radio program say that about 1-1.5 B |
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hendo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:30 PM Response to Reply #9 |
19. Damn those people |
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Heywood J (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 09:26 PM Response to Reply #19 |
82. Exactly. Selfish bastards! They should all die! |
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Truth4Justice (806 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 05:02 AM Response to Reply #9 |
55. I think the numbers are even higher then that. The more humans the more energy needed expotentionaly |
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dysfunctional press (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:34 PM Response to Original message |
10. like ask for volunteers to leave, maybe...? |
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NYC_SKP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:43 PM Response to Reply #10 |
13. The mother nature will take care of the "culling", it's already begun. nt |
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BigDaddy44 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:53 PM Response to Reply #13 |
38. Really? |
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NYC_SKP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:18 PM Response to Reply #38 |
41. You betcha...not a mass die-out just yet, |
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robinlynne (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:34 PM Response to Original message |
11. works for me. |
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NYC_SKP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:42 PM Response to Original message |
12. We CAN do this! Please visit this really cute but informative site, pretty please! |
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SmileyRose (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:48 PM Response to Original message |
14. Get rid of the seatbelt law - that will do it in a decade |
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LWolf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:57 PM Response to Original message |
15. Better late than never. |
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pitohui (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:34 PM Response to Reply #15 |
32. if we do it voluntarily the intelligent will breed the least and we're outbred by idiots |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 01:32 AM Response to Reply #32 |
53. reversion to the mean. |
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The Stranger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:15 AM Response to Reply #53 |
65. Reproducing at "the replacement rate" is prolonging and compounding the problem. |
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joshcryer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:09 AM Response to Reply #65 |
71. Where do you get that stat from? It's alarmist and unsurported by the math. |
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The Stranger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jul-13-08 01:06 PM Response to Reply #71 |
83. Where do I get the "stat" that there are currently too many people on the planet? |
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LWolf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 04:07 PM Response to Reply #32 |
81. I understand what you are saying. |
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Mr_Jefferson_24 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 08:57 PM Response to Original message |
16. Relax, the Ruling Class has taken the liberty of working out all those... |
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WheelWalker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:28 PM Response to Original message |
18. the Great Path is not difficult for one who has no preferences. |
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frog92969 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:34 PM Response to Original message |
20. There's one simple solution |
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UndertheOcean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:52 PM Response to Reply #20 |
24. You've got something there .... |
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WheelWalker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:56 PM Response to Reply #20 |
26. Water Brother |
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frog92969 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:29 PM Response to Reply #26 |
44. "Thou art God" |
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WheelWalker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 12:23 AM Response to Reply #44 |
46. All that groks is god. Never thirst. |
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End Of The Road (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 08:21 AM Response to Reply #20 |
60. Looks like I'll be eating myself in no time! nt |
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Tesha (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 03:47 PM Response to Reply #20 |
79. Be a little careful of things like Kuru, nvCJD, and the like, though. |
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frog92969 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 04:05 PM Response to Reply #79 |
80. I'm already trembling with pathologic bursts of laughter. |
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csziggy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:41 PM Response to Original message |
23. I've done my part by not having children |
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UndertheOcean (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 09:53 PM Response to Reply #23 |
25. Me too, although I love those cute little buggers |
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screembloodymurder (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:13 PM Response to Original message |
27. The ultimate question. |
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galledgoblin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:27 PM Response to Original message |
30. encourage sex education, birth control, and improve the health/living conditions |
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galledgoblin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:28 PM Response to Reply #30 |
31. wait, forgot the easiest one: educate women! |
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pitohui (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:39 PM Response to Reply #31 |
35. do you think mormon women, baptist women, etc. can't read and write? |
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galledgoblin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:57 PM Response to Reply #35 |
39. oh, I didn't say that it would eliminate kooks |
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Enthusiast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 05:35 AM Response to Reply #30 |
57. God doesn't want birth control. |
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joshcryer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 02:59 PM Response to Reply #30 |
76. Gapminder shows that this is happening already, and will stem population growth... |
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BigDaddy44 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 10:52 PM Response to Original message |
37. You first. |
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WheelWalker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 12:36 AM Response to Reply #37 |
47. Exactly. Join the Coalition of the Willing..... |
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aint_no_life_nowhere (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:04 PM Response to Original message |
40. I think it will take international leadership |
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Lorien (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:26 PM Response to Original message |
42. I've done my part; I haven't reproduced |
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WheelWalker (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 12:42 AM Response to Reply #42 |
49. I believe there's a more efficacious approach. Combine DNA. Reproduce. As early and as often |
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NYC_SKP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:26 PM Response to Original message |
43. Overconsumption, Energy, and countries emulating the US (like China). |
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DCKit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Jul-11-08 11:36 PM Response to Original message |
45. Spoilsport,,,n/t |
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scheming daemons (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 01:21 AM Response to Original message |
50. The problem is not in the West... we've achieved population balance |
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morningglory (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:00 AM Response to Reply #50 |
63. In desparate conditions, the poor have as many children as possible to |
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Deja Q (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:35 AM Response to Reply #63 |
74. More reasons for support real globalization (expansion), not mere 'offhsoring' (migration) |
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joshcryer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 03:04 PM Response to Reply #74 |
78. Check out www.gapminder.org, that's basically the answer (unfortunately). |
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Hannah Bell (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 01:27 AM Response to Original message |
52. If the earth can sustain us with cheap energy, it can also sustain |
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Enthusiast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 05:35 AM Response to Original message |
56. But but, who will make money on the weapons? |
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Mendocino (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 08:08 AM Response to Original message |
59. We should start in the US by |
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eShirl (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 09:01 AM Response to Original message |
61. someone posted this a while back -- Voluntary Human Extinction Movement |
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Wcross (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 09:59 AM Response to Original message |
62. I am doing my part. No children, ever. |
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The Stranger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:12 AM Response to Original message |
64. Support ZERO POPULATION GROWTH! |
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rucky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:59 AM Response to Reply #64 |
69. We stopped at one kid. That's -1 replacing us. |
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El Pinko (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:37 AM Response to Original message |
66. There's no way to reduce our numbers short-term without it being catastrophic. |
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rucky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 10:57 AM Response to Original message |
68. I think that's what turned a few liberals into neocons. |
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Deja Q (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:37 AM Response to Reply #68 |
75. Wasn't it once said that neoliberalism = neoconservatism? |
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joshcryer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:03 AM Response to Original message |
70. Algae use more energy than us. Energy is *not* the problem. |
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Stuart G (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:15 AM Response to Original message |
72. As the emperor said to Luke ...........(in Star Wars 6) |
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Kazak (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 11:26 AM Response to Original message |
73. Gee, maybe insurance cos might want to reconsider that birth control policy? |
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joshcryer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sat Jul-12-08 03:01 PM Response to Original message |
77. So where do you get your "The Earth can't sustain 6 billion of us without cheap energy..." |
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paparush (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Sun Jul-13-08 01:21 PM Response to Original message |
84. In terms of consumption of resources - The American child will consume much more - |
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