MYTHS THAT MUST DIE: Only liberals want big government.

[ColbertWatcher]

The way liberals look at government is to take on more responsibilities. The way the GOP looks at government is to take on more responsibilities, but they "frame" it as though the GOP can better control the government by keeping it "small". The GOP lie is that the government should do less, but in reality the GOP wants the government to be big enough to cover for their countless mistakes and misadventures.

The GOP have been pushing the word "big" as a bad thing, while being deceitful about their own desire for "big" government.

Please kill this myth. Thank you.

[BrklynLiberal]

1. besides which, the governmet has grown more under prez shit-for-brains than any of his predecessors

[ColbertWatcher]

2. So very true.

But the GOP-controlled media has that fact under an "executive privilege" order preventing it from speaking out.

[JBoris]

3. I've been pondering this for a while, I can't come up with a good sound-bite counter argument. nt

[tridim]

4. How about "Look at the last 8 years and tell me again the Repukes are for small government"?

[JBoris]

6. I've tried that on the brainwashed. All I got back was "its all the Dem controlled Congress". nt

[tridim]

9. Well in that case I hope you just called them an idiot.

You can't debate with people who have no facts.

[JBoris]

12. LOL. I did. Actually the closest I got was when I talked about smaller government vs consolidation..

of power, and how bush gave huge amounts of power to unqualified asshats.

[livvy]

5. Another way to frame it....

Liberals and Progressives want government to take on more responsibilities that benefit their constituents. The GOP wants government to have more control over their constituents,(by denying them services) which does not make it smaller, just more powerful. They still want the money. They just don't want to spend it on the people who provide it.

[ColbertWatcher]

10. Liberals want a government for more of the people...

...the GOP wants the government to control the people.

Something like that?

Still needs work, but I think I understand where you're going with this.

Thank you for posting.

[livvy]

14. Yeah, that's pretty much what I was thinking.

Liberals want government for the benefit of the people, and the GOP wants government for the benefit of the few. Size has nothing to do with it, as both require personnel/departments to implement and maintain the policies. However, one attempts to create equality, whereas the other encourages inequality.

[ColbertWatcher]

15. That's beautiful! "Liberals create equality; the GOP encourages inequality."

Although, "equality" may seem too "communist". Maybe using the word "fairness" or "justice".

Nice going, nonetheless.

[livvy]

17. I like the word promote better, I think...

Liberals promote (parity, fairness, equality)...


It doesn't really get to the idea of "big" government. Still thinking on that....

James Wilson (Penn. delegate to the Continental Congress, one of a few who signed both the D of I, and the Constitution, and the author of a piece written in 1774 that argued that Parliament had no right to legislate for the Colonies), was a legal philosopher (member of the 1st Supreme Court appointed by Washington). Anyway he pondered the purpose of government and his thought was "the purpose of government is to secure the rights of its members and that the purpose of the Constitution was to create such a government."

Some good quotes from his writings...

"Government … should be formed to secure and enlarge the exercise of the natural rights of its members; and every government which has not this in view as its principal object is not a government of the legitimate kind."

"The citizens of the United States… best pleased with that system of government which would best promote their freedom and happiness."

"I view the states as made for the People, as well as by them, and not the People as made for the states … "

"The enemies of liberty are artful and insidious … liberty herself is treated as a traitor and an usurper … Against these enemies of liberty, who act in concert … the patriot citizen will keep a watchful guard."

http://blog.mises.org/archives/006546.asp

So the size of the government should be determined only by what is necessary to assure "the rights of its members", so that they are equal and free. The GOP interpretation of government does not do that.

From a treatise he was working on...died before he finished it.

"The important conclusion to be drawn from the premises, which we have established, is, that, in government, the perfection of the whole depends on the balance of the parts, and the balance of the parts consists in the independent exercise of their separate powers, and, when their powers are separately exercised, then in their mutual influence and operation on one another. Each part acts and is acted upon, supports and is supported, regulates and is regulated by the rest."

"The influence of a good or bad constitution is not less powerful on the citizens, considered as individuals, than on the community, considered as a body politick. It is only under a good constitution that liberty ― the precious gift of heaven ― can be enjoyed and be secure. This exalting quality comprehends, among other things, the manly and generous exercise of our powers; and includes, as its most delicious ingredient, the happy consciousness of being free. What energetick, what delightful sensations must this enlivening principle diffuse over the whole man! His mind is roused and elevated his heart is rectified and enlarged: dignity appears in his countenance, and animation in his every gesture and word. He knows that if he is innocent and upright, the laws and constitution of his country will ensure him protection. He trusts, that, if to innocence and integrity he adds faithful and meritorious services, his country, in addition to protection, will confer upon him honourable testimonies of her esteem. Hence he derives a cheerful and habitual confidence, this pervades and invigorates his conduct, and spreads a noble air over every part of his character. Hence, too, he is inspired with ardent affection for the publick: this stimulates and refines his strongest patriotick exertions. His heart, his head, his hands, his tongue, his pen, his fortune; all he is, and all he has, are devoted to his country's cause, and to his country's call.




A person of a very different description appears in view ― pale, trembling, emaciated, faltering in his steps, not daring to look upwards, but, with marked anxiety, rolling his eager eyes on every side. Who is he? He is the slave of a bad constitution and a tyrannical government. He is afraid to act, or speak, or look. He knows that his actions and his words, however guarded, may be construed to be criminal: he knows that even his looks and countenance may be considered as the signs and evidences of treacherous thoughts and treasonable conspiracies; and he knows that the suspicion of his masters, upon any of these points, may be fatal: for he knows, that he is at the mercy of those, who, upon the slightest suspicion, may seize or hang him ― who may do whatever they please with him, and with all those who are dear to him. What effects must this man's situation produce upon his mind and temper? Can his views be great or exalted? No. Such views, instead of being encouraged, would give offence; and he is well aware what would follow. Can openness and candour beam from his soul? No. Such light would be hateful to his masters; it must be extinguished. Can he feel affection for his country, its constitution, or its government? No. His country is his prison; its constitution is his curse; and its government is a rod of oppression, held continually over his head. What must this man be? He must be abject, fawning, dastardly, selfish, disingenuous, deceitful, cunning, base ― but why proceed in the disgusting detail? He must receive the stamp of servility fully impressed on his person, on his mind, and on his manners."


http://www.constitution.org/jwilson/jwilson1.htm (Volume 1 Chapter X)


I guess my point here (if there is one), is that Liberals support a government that attempts to provide what is promised in the Constitution. They are doing their patriotic duty as citizens of the country.

In contrast, many members of the GOP do not have the common welfare as their motive, but instead put the balance of our government off kilter, enlarging some areas of the government (defense, corporate interest) while lessening social programs, civil rights, etc. They make it sound as if they are limiting government, but in reality they are simply rearranging the structure in a manner that was not intended by the founders of our government because it's not in the community interest.

I love reading the original writings of the Founders (can you tell?). I find that it helps me to clarify what our government should be. It is also interesting and alarming to see how far our Republic has strayed from its intended form. It also is a good reminder for me that it is our charge to keep.

[ColbertWatcher]

18. You really sound like a student of the founders, actually...

...and that is meant as a compliment, in case there is some bizarre internets sincerity filter that makes it sound like I'm being sarcastic.

I agree that promote is the better word.

It's just so hard to turn the works of these great thinkers into bumper stickers.

Liberals promote fairness; the GOP limits opportunity.

Gonna have to think a bit more...

[livvy]

19. I like that.

"Liberals promote fairness; the GOP limits opportunity." It's short and to the point.

[The Straight Story]

7. I think they want big government but in different areas than we do

They like to expand military, we social programs.

So they really are for bigger government, they just don't like to admit it :)

[YOY]

8. Big contracting for government is a GOP government

n/t

[Clear Blue Sky]

11. Government grows regardless of who is in charge.

It has grown under Democratic and Republican administrations and Congresses.

Regardless of party affiliation, politicians crave power. Bigger government gives them more power.

This is the one area where there is no shortage of "bipartisanship"...

[DailyGrind51]

13. According to the Brookings Institute,

Government is bigger under Bush than since the end of the Cold War in 1990!

http://www.brookings.edu/gs/cps/light20030905.pdf

[checks-n-balances]

16. GOP has recently enjoyed looting the U.S. Treasury

And that's part of the government, isn't it? As far as their concerned, the bigger the gov't, the better job they can do destroying it and awarding it to themselves & their cronies.

That's about the only thing they've done well, besides effectively destroying the Constitution, the American Dream, the Middle & Lower Income Classes, the education & justice systems, responsible energy policy, national & international security, etc.