If you chose not to have children... what was/is your reason?

[nadine_mn]

*** this is not a pro/anti children post nor is it for people who cannot have kids.



I always knew I did not want kids... and for 20 years (since I made the announcement at 16) I have been told I would change my mind. When I met the man who would be my husband, I told him him on our second date 12 years ago that if we wanted kids, move on because there is no point on continuing this relationship, I won't change my mind. Fortunately he feels the same way. We still have a talk every now then, has either of changed our minds (no) we would still consider foster care at some point.

I am so determined not to get pregnant, I am on the pill and insist hubby uses a condom anyway.

Its not that I don't like kids, I have worked as a child advocate and literally worked with hundreds of kids over the years and really love them. But I have never wanted one - ok thats a lie.... every now then I get the urge but it goes away within a day or two. It breaks my mom's heart because I am an only child and her only hope for being a grandma, she tried guilting me into for the first 5 yrs of marriage... finally she gave up.

I have several reasons - ranging from too poor right now, not wanting a child to grow up in today's world, but mainly I am too selfish and too scared to be a parent. I raised myself in a way and really don't want to raise a child. Because of the sexual abuse I suffered as a kid, I am terrified of having a daughter and not trusting my husband. Not that he would do anything, but because I have no idea what a normal, healthy father/daughter relationship is, I think I would be sick constantly, and that's not fair to my husband or my daughter. I finally found somone who loves me for me, unconditionally, and I don't want to risk it with my fears. We have 4 furry kids,and we both want more pets (they are all rescued).

He feels the same way about kids, and I am so lucky. Whats funny, is that I think we would be good parents - we have talked about how we feel about child raising - spanking or no, church or no, etc and we agree on the important stuff, we communicate and work out our problems (not at first...lol..many years of hard work to get to this point). We have a ton of love and I think we will eventually be foster parents. What surprises me is my friends who have children haven't had these conversations - and they end up having huge fights about should their child be raised Catholic or not, private school or public school, etc.


Anyway enough rambling, I am just curious what reasons others have for chosing to be childfree and like me are you sick of the idea that you must be a mother to be a woman? This idea permeates MSM (imo) and I am sick of it.

[gateley]

1. I never had that strong maternal instinct so many of my friends did.

And I was all about me, me, me until my mid 30's or so. (Insufferable.) Now, in my 50's, I adore children, but don't regret not having any.

[nadine_mn]

2. I feel ya... never had that urge

hmmm and does the me, me, me ever stop because I am right there too

[Lorien]

35. I never thought I had a maternal instinct until someone brought me a

tiny baby raccoon to care for. The poor thing was found in a tollbooth late one night in the middle of a six lane highway. No sign of mom. She didn't even have teeth yet. I gave her a bottle of KMR milk and BANG-she bonded to me. Looked at me like I was her mother, followed me everywhere, screamed like a human child when I locked her in a room or cat carried. She'd reach out of that carrier with her hands open, just desperate for contact and comfort. Every cry or coo pushed my maternal buttons and I'd be there for her instantly. The thought of anyone hurting her gave me murderous thoughts. I knew it was all simply because she BELIEVED that I was her mother and mimicked so many human sounds and behaviors that caused my reactions. There are many cases of this between all sorts of species. It was really surreal, because I had always been convinced that I lacked the maternal gene.

The logical part of me did finally take over. I knew that my home was no place for a highly intelligent, very curious wild animal with hands, so I reluctantly took her to a wildlife rehab center where she was placed with other raccoons her age. She screamed and cried when I left her there and it broke my heart, but I knew it was for the best.

I still can't bring myself to have kids of my own though, because I do care to much (further explanation down thread).

[beam me up scottie]

120. Likewise.

I have raised many orphans and cared for many foster kids, none of them human, and there is nothing wrong with my maternal "instinct".
I never advocate violence, but whenever I see someone being cruel to a kid or an animal I could easily tear them apart with my bare hands.

[zanne]

87. Same here. I knew when I was a kid that I didn't want to have any. nt

[ladywnch]

118. Same here. I knew I didn't want kids when I was in my early teens

I never felt that urge to be a mother. In fact when I was younger my parents bought me babydolls (like every girl in those days) and I took them apart. I wanted to know why their eyes rolled shut when you laid them down or how the baby bottle refilled when it was set upright and how the babydolls joints worked, etc. If they had special things like talking or such I REALLY wanted to know how it worked.

I wanted a career and freedom. Kids did (and still do) nothing for me. I just got married for the first time at 49 yo and picked up 2 kids in the bargin. The youngest one will graduate high school in 6 more years and be out of this house (not soon enough, but I'll survive).

I love and care for dogs. They are much more loving and logical than kids and they don't hold grudges. Hell, I'll take a dog over most humans any day!

My mom even told once, "face it, you're not the mothering type.".

And yeah, I am sick and tired of people who think I'm some kind of freak because I don't feel the need to breed.

[slackmaster]

95. Same here - It always looked like an unrewarding hassle fraught with risk

I've never had the temperament to deal with people who are highly needy. I don't care much for dogs either.

[ThatsMyBarack]

106. Same here.

Although I'm 37 and still very much a "Me Me" person (actually, me and my kittehs!). ;)

[Skip Intro]

3. 3 reasons.

I like myself to be my main priority. For one. Freedom.

Also, I have so few answers for myself, how could I ever begin to think I have the answers for a newbie to this planet?

Plus, I'm not big on diaper changes or spit-up clean-ups. Actually, babies gross me out.

[DesertFlower]

13. i know the feeling. nt

[Manifestor_of_Light]

4. I can give you the opposite position.

I wanted to have a child because I didn't want my family to die off. I was very career oriented and wanted some balance in my life. I wanted the experience of nurturing a new person.

I got married and then got pregnant and the hubby IMMEDIATELY wanted me to get an abortion. His supposed reason was my history of depression. He had no consideration for MY wants.

I told him if he didn't like it he could leave.

We divorced a few years later when the beautiful, healthy, happy child was a toddler, and he made me pay HIM child support for years just for spite. Yes, women DO have to pay child support some times. He had worked for the same company for ten years, still works there, nearly 30 years after he hired on there. Me, I had a career that died in the 1990s and after that the jobs were temporary and crummy and just as stressful as the career, although I have far more education than he did.

Some people just don't appreciate what they have. He was in a great position in life and decided to throw me, the house, and a stable family life away.

[Flabbergasted]

169. If you were raising the child, why we're you paying child support? nt

[Manifestor_of_Light]

180. We had joint custody. The child went back and forth between houses.

We had a Joint Managing Conservatorship. Texas.

If one parent is the primary parent and gets custody of the child more, they are the Managing Conservator and the other one (usually a visiting daddy) is the Possessory Conservator.

We had a JMC which was supposed to be equal. However, we had a truly bizarre visitation thing until the child was about 12. Instead of Friday at 6 pm to Sunday at 6 pm on alternate weekends, we had Thursday night at 6 pm until Tuesday night at 6 pm on alternate weekends.

[Pisces]

5. The pressure to procreate is unbelievable. Do what is right for you and screw everyone else.

[nadine_mn]

7. I always hate the"oh you'll change your mind"

Like I could say that to a mother...

but the pressure is amazing I think more so for women than men.. but my husband got it a lot from his folks. Thank god his brother and his wife popped out 3... now they are glad we don't have any.

[TlalocW]

28. Here's the reply

Ask the person who tells you, "You'll change your mind," if they have kids. When they answer yes, ask them if they love them. When they say yes, say, "Oh, you'll change your mind." :)

I forget where I read this, but a childfree woman was always goaded by an aunt of hers whenever there was a family reunion, and there was a new baby to show off. The aunt would poke her in the ribs and tell her, "You're next." So the woman started saying the same thing to her aunt at funerals.

I also have 3 siblings, all older than I, who have popped out at least one sprog each. My oldest sibling, a sister, used to get on my case all the time about finding someone and having kids, but I've replied in a smart-aleck way so many times, she's slacked off. My other sister has come to the opinion that not everyone should have kids or even marry (I've done neither), and I think my brother is a little bitter at me because of my freedom. All my siblings (who are all very intelligent people) either got pregnant or got someone else pregnant and then got married, which I don't have a problem with until the one time they ganged up on me over a holiday about having kids, and I switched it around on them and told them something like, "Instead of pressuring me to have kids, maybe you all need a lesson in birth control. If you want, I'll go buy some condoms and bananas, and I can give you the basics since it's apparent that your education in that area has been deficient." Especially funny since my oldest sister is a nurse.

Now it turns out that along with being an uncle, I've been a grand-uncle for the last 3 years (I'm 36) - my oldest niece is just five years younger than I am (I think she actually got pregnant AFTER she got married), and my second oldest niece, who's turning 25, is now pregnant as well. So I don't worry so much about family genes dying out - not that we're special or anything. :)

TlalocW

[nadine_mn]

33. "you're next"

:rofl:

oh man that's great...

you know I do think there is some jealousy towards us childfree people.

My mom's ultimate guilt trip - one day she bought a crapload of toys for infant to toddlers, put them in a big toybox in the living room. When we came to visit and saw them, we asked what were they there fore...(thinking a toy drive)

She lets out this melodramatic sigh... for my grandchildren.. if you ever give me any...

I said nope, and started playing with the Elmo train

[TlalocW]

36. I guess I'm lucky

My mom wants nothing more than for her kids to be happy and live their lives how they want so she's never given me crap about having kids. In fact, she refers to my ferrets as her grandkids because she knows how important they are to me, and she even got a little choked up when my first one passed away. Plus, she already has plenty of grandkids and now great-grandkids and doesn't need me adding to the brood.

I remember first getting this vibe from her in high school. I lived near Wichita, Kansas, when Operation Rescue came to town to protest at the abortion clinics there. I was in high school, and both my sisters, being 14 and 16 years older than I, were already out and had had at least one kid between them. The younger of my two sisters is very conservative and pro-life, and when she found out I was pro-choice, she actually told mom on me. Mom looked at her and said, "What do you want me to do about it? I raised you kids to think for yourselves!"

TlalocW

[Recursion]

216. I think Margaret Cho had a good one

She would answer her older female relatives' question of "are you two having a baby yet?" with "have you broken a hip yet?"

[MidwestTransplant]

17. The more you screw, the greater your chance of getting (or getting somebody) pregnant

:)

[Common Sense Party]

19. Screwing everyone else...can often LEAD to procreation.

:)

[tomreedtoon]

6. No woman would let me near her.

This was a post from the Only Other Honest Man in America (Obama pushed me out of the primary spot).

[Sen. Walter Sobchak]

8. I love children and on an emotional level I want them badly

but I don't even want to imagine what this country will look like when my hypothetical children would come of age. The inertia behind what has taken place over the last 30 years isn't going to skip a beat no matter what happens politically.

My GF's feelings are shaped a little differently, but mostly come out of her fucked up extended family.

[billyoc]

9. Just don't like 'em.

j/k, children would interfere with my guerrilla activities.

[lostnotforgotten]

10. Love Kids - Never Found A Woman That Would Have Me

eom

[elocs]

11. I never had children because I never got married (I'm a guy).

I realize that is not a requirement, but I'm old fashioned that way. I had an English teacher in high school who told us if we were not married by the time we were 30 that it would get harder because we would get set in our ways. We were 17 year olds and figured we had forever, but she was right. The older I got the more set in my ways and independent I became and so I wasn't interested in marriage or a family.

Much different than having to be a mother to be a woman is for a guy not to ever have been married and not to have any children. Without ever having been married or have children how can he be a real "man" (nudge, nudge, wink, wink, you know what I mean). So for guys there also is a lot of pressure to marry and/or to have children, like that is some kind of guarantee of your sexual preference. Tell that to my brother who was married for 10 years and had 2 kids when his wife announced that she was a lesbian and always had been one.

I'm really way, way past the point of caring anymore. I have had some experience with babies and little kids. I have a goddaughter who has been like a daughter to me since she was 8 months old, so I've gone through the diaper changing, feeding, bottles, giving baths, teaching her how to walk, how to tie her shoes, how to ride a bike. Since her own father walked out on her she always thought of me as her dad (I was always called by my first name, but last summer she sent me an email where she said her stepfather had always been a good stepfather, but she always thought of me as "dad"--I shed a few tears over that one). She will be 17 next month. Where did all the years go?

[raccoon]

81. I'm old-fashioned that way too. nt

[DesertFlower]

12. i had 1 child. did not want anymore.

husband #1 and i divorced after 6 years. i knew i would eventually re-marry, but hoped i would find a guy who had been married and had a child or children and didn't want anymore. i was lucky. i found him. we've been together 38 years. have never regretted not having another child.

some women are not meant to be mothers. i am one of them. i loved my son and i was a good mother (the best that i was capable of).

i don't know how to talk to children. i talk to animals, but children -- they make me nervous.


on edit: husband #1 is with wife #3. he is almost 68 and has a 15 year old. oy vey.

[zanne]

88. OMG! I don't know how to talk to them either!

I thought that was because I'd never had one. Honestly, I just don't know what to do with them. I have one great-niece who always lets me know what she wants to do and talks constantly. I'm crazy about her. But with most kids, it's a staring contest.

[FedUpWithIt All]

14. As a mom I know you weren't speaking to me but i just wanted to say thank you...

Thank you for your thoughtful post. It is difficult sometimes when people have different ideas about their individual life paths. Many people believe that their direction is the "only" correct way. You wrote a well spoken comment on a childless lifestyle and did not once criticize those of us that chose to have children. :bounce: I am grateful.

As one who feels that life's paths are extremely personal, I have always been bothered by the societal pressure on woman to have children. Nobody comes away unharmed from a situation where women have children because "it's what women are supposed to do". Women are SUPPOSED to live their lives as they see fit. It is good if they strive to be happy and healthy and loved. Hopefully they strive to make the world a better place than they found it and touch some lives along the way.

In my own experience some of the most loving and nurturing people i have ever met chose not to have children and some of the mothers i have known were cold and hard.

[Sherman A1]

43. Well Said!

I have two daughters (both in their 30's), one by adoption and one as a step daughter. The adopted one I have not seen for 16 years after a messy divorce with my charming ex wife. The step daughter calls everyday and we have a great relationship. I believe that everyone should be able to have children if they desire or not if they so choose without anyone living their lives for them. It's is your life and not another person's to decide how you live it.

[Number23]

62. I completely agree

I have always been bothered by the societal pressure on woman to have children.

Total damn strangers decide it's their right and prerogative to give you advice whether you asked for it or not. I was 34 years old when I had my first (and possibly only) child. I was only four months pregnant the first time someone asked me when I was going to have the next one!

I just looked at her like "can I get this one sorted out first before I start churning out the next ones??" So, it's not just the pressure to HAVE kids, people will then put pressure on you to have the correct number, and of course spaced out the CORRECT amount of time apart from each other.

You have to live your life for yourself. And if you're feeling pressure to have kids when you don't want any, STOP. And if you're putting pressure on someone to have kids based on YOUR specifications of what a "good" life is, you stop too!!

[Luminous Animal]

243. A few month after our one child was born (18 years ago)...

my brother kept bugging my husband and I about when we were going to have another one. My husband finally retorted,"I wouldn't be able to continue living my dirtbag lifestyle if we have two kids." That shut my brother up and he never bugged us since.

[EnviroBat]

134. HEY! You're back!

Nice to see you here again... :hi:

[FedUpWithIt All]

145. Good to see you too...

:hi:

[undergroundpanther]

15. I hate this world

I found out years ago in deep meditation that I was trapped here before I was born,and so remembering that,I do not want to force another being to be caught and born here in this horrible world.

Secondly some people are predatory twords kids,sensitive people women,and people who are different .I don't want to subject anyone to that kind of soul murdering shit, done by bad adults and peers by giving birth.

Third I don't want kids,I don't really enjoy being around kids much,I am not a kid type of person.I kinda think babies are rather gross.

Fourth, I don't think life is a "gift".To be forced to exist in a pay to exist world (you must BUY food,BUY water,BUY shelter..etc.) that is a very sick system,this system is made up and exploited by a few greedy people. I do not want to have any kids that will have to grow up in this abusive pay as you go bullshit existence everyone else for the most part thinks is normal..

Sometimes not being a parent is really being the best parent you can be.
I prefer the company of cats over human kids any day...

[vadawg]

27. kids

??? probuably best for you not to have kids if this is how you feel, personally i feel the complete opposite of you, i love kids, i love my kids, i think they are a gift, every day with them is a joy. But i would never force anyone else to have them, its a personal choice i guess.

[Leeny]

49. maternal bliss!!!

I have kids too, but because my husband and I wanted to. I have respect for those who make a conscious choice not too; especially now that I have two and I can better understand why! I love my kids too, very much so, and I do think they are a gift, but I would not go so far as to say that EVERY day with them is pure joy. I have had some days that were pure hell!! Pure hell, I tell ya! But I love them nonetheless.

The pressure to have kids IS intense, and the assumption that all women have this magical maternal instinct is crap. And the day I brought my first baby home I was scared absolutely shitless to think that I was responsible for this little person for a very long time. I thought "oh my god, I hope I don't fuck up".

It's been wonderful though, and I wouldn't have it any other way. But that's my choice. (Funny, eh, the notion that women should have some freedom of choice in this matter.) :sarcasm:

Eternal maternal bliss?; no. But I'm very satisfied.

Good luck and hang tough and don't let anyone pressure you into it.

[vadawg]

50. lolz

i guess for me every day is a joy, as im the dad and i dont have to spend every waking moment with the little spawn of lucifer (as my wife sometimes calls them) :)

[Leeny]

51. ha!

I could have sworn my daughter's head was spinning around the other night!

[beam me up scottie]

115. "To be forced to exist in a pay to exist world (you must BUY food,BUY water,BUY shelter..etc.)"

As usual, UP, you've pointed out an injustice that most of us need to ignore if we want to live the American dream. The pursuit of happiness, my ass. How can that be considered a "right" when you live in a country that lets poor people starve to death and die from preventable diseases?

"Sometimes not being a parent is really being the best parent you can be."

I never wanted kids either and I couldn't agree with you more, my friend. :hug:

Keep telling the truth, we need to hear it.

[Kitty Herder]

238. I second that.

Great post, UP.

[Missy Vixen]

16. I didn't get the mommy gene

I knew when I was in high school that I really didn't want children. (I joked with my friends that I would fertilize the "last available egg"). Like you, when I met my husband (and everyone else I dated before him,) I told them very quickly into the process that I wasn't interested in having children, and if they were, we shouldn't be together.

Besides the lack of the mommy gene, I grew up in a home that it was demonstrated to me on a daily basis how absolutely wrong it is when someone who really didn't want kids is forced to have them anyway. When people would say to me, "Oh, it's different when they're your own," they'd get a faceful. The people that pushed us the most over our decision to not have children are the most unhappy with their choice to have them.

I'll be 48 next Monday. Do I regret this decision? NO. Have I ever had second thoughts? Yeah, but they pass immediately. On the whole, it was the right decision for us, and I am happy to have found a man who also did not want to be a parent.

Julie

[flvegan]

18. Bring a child into this world, with me as a dad?

No thanks.

I'd be a shitty dad bringing a kiddo into this pathetic world in which we live. I'd have been a horrible example, raised him/her/them wrong.

Lots of great dads and parents out there that take care differently and well. I fear I'd not be one of them.

Which is why I run a dog rescue.

[nadine_mn]

34. we have a mini-rescue our home

kudos for you for running one
:applause:

When hubby and I plan the future... we want a big hobby farm so we can rescue as many as we can...

sigh... not in this economy

[Midlodemocrat]

61. I fear you'd be wrong.

Your compassion and sensitivity shine in every thing you do. Don't sell yourself short. :loveya:

[Karenina]

139. They shine quite brilliantly where currently directed.

Forgive my annoyance at your comment.

[Midlodemocrat]

141. Of, FFS.

:eyes:

He's a friend of mine. I was paying him a compliment. Untwist your knickers.

[flvegan]

218. Indeed.

Never toss an insult you can't back up, mark.

Have at it, bitch. Throw down or fuck off.

[Karenina]

225. I've read, with quite some admiration and interest,

the advice you unstintingly provide and of the capable work you do with canines. Not being privy to your connexion to the poster who exhorted you not to "sell yourself short," I posted my reaction to those particular words in the context of this thread. If that makes me a bitch, so be it! I can live with that! I assure you no insult was intended. I'll go fuck off now! :hi:

[cliffordu]

20. I never wanted them. Neither did my wife.

[Truth4Justice]

45. Amen to that! If only more people felt that way, we could make this world a nice place to be.

[cliffordu]

103. Yep - and I didn't want to subject any kids to my "parenting".

[mrreowwr_kittty]

21. Like Margaret Cho said, "I ovulate sand".

I personally believe that the so-called Maternal Instinct is possibly the stupidest canard ever devised in all of human thought. Countless women have been conned into procreating, when they probably wouldn't have if left to their own devices because "Motherhood is the highest spiritual experience you can have!" or "You're not a real woman until you've had a child!" My b/f's mom tried to pull that crap on me recently. She waxed rhapsodic about how having children elevated people and made them more connected to the world, or some blather like that. I asked her, point blank, what that meant about me, since I am not a parent. Is my political activism worthless? Are the many hours I've devoted to improving my community not as meaningful? Am I utterly unable to contemplate the world beyond my own experience, whereas those who have procreated are magically endowed with special powers to do that?

[fed_up_mother]

140. Really?

"I personally believe that the so-called Maternal Instinct is possibly the stupidest canard ever devised in all of human thought."

Just because every woman doesn't have a maternal instinct doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

And, yes, I do believe that having children made me connected to the world in ways that only children could do. Similarly, I'm sure other people feel connected to this world through other means that I haven't experienced.

Basically, I'm an optimist. Even with the scumbags in the White House, I believe my children have a good future ahead of them. Sure, times will be tough. Sure, they'll encounter problems that our parents didn't, but that's life. You jump over the hurdles as you get to them.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

142. Which women have it? Which don't?

And why don't we live in a society where each woman can decide for herself if motherhood is right for her? It's an expectation placed on practically all women, enforced through relentless pro-natalist propaganda. Think about it: If the number of mothers who don't possess the vaunted "maternal instinct" is only 5%, we are talking about MILLIONS of children with the misfortune of being born to women who don't want them.

[fed_up_mother]

173. First off, it's not my place to say who "has it."

And, frankly, I think that plenty of children can be reared by women who have no maternal instinct JUST FINE. Men obviously don't have a "maternal" instinct, and they can make fine parents. My husband is one such man.

However, all that said... just because we shouldn't compel people to have kids doesn't mean we can deny human biology. Most women have a maternal instinct of some kind, and I'm sure it has something to do with the survival of our species. That's not easy to overcome. If you long for a baby, telling yourself it's not real isn't going to make it go away.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

177. You're making the exact point of why it's bullshit.

Parenting is learned, not instinctive. Yet you have society telling women that once the squalling baby is placed in your arms this magical spiritual thing happens and your "instinct" will kick in. It doesn't happen like that.

[fed_up_mother]

178. If to some degree, it didn't happen like that we wouldn't be here today

Just like other mammals, if women didn't care for their babies, we wouldn't exist as a species.

Yeah, there's plenty of bad moms, but I don't believe the majority of women are bad parents.

Oh, by the way, I certainly did have that overwhelming feeling when my baby was placed in my arms the first time. Yeah, it happens that way for some of us.

[RandomKoolzip]

22. I'm too poor. It sucks. I really want to have kids, but it'd be cruel to raise them in

my current financial situation. I see couples with beautiful, sunny little toddlers and I ache; I feel like I'm missing out on something.

(sigh)

[nadine_mn]

37. I have mixed feelings on that reason

I gave it as one of mine - I feel like I will never have the financial stability to offer a good home.

On the other hand, I grew up dirt poor - so poor we didn't have a frig for awhile, welfare, homeless for a bit, etc and you know I don't remember feeling like I was missing something.

My grandma showed me a letter she got from me when I was 7, said something like we have only had peanut butter sandwiches for the last 2 weeks, but we are having fun.

The romantic in me says love is enough, I know plenty of poor parents who are a hell of a lot better parents than richer counterparts.

The best experience I have ever had was working at a domestic violence shelter as a child advocate - for 8 hours a day I gave kids 100% of my time and energy. They had my patience, my lap, my ear, my poor B-Ball skills, and my many crafts - all theirs. At home I didn't have to worry about my own kids, or not spending enough time with them. No guilt and an amazing amount of love.

[Truth4Justice]

46. You are not. Your freedom is at stake when children are involved in any DV call.

[Heidi]

52. I think you'd be a great parent, RK.

Just sayin'. :hug:

[RandomKoolzip]

89. Hey, thanks.

It'd be a bad time for me to have a kid right now. I'm in the process of getting divorced and my new girlfriend is significantly younger than me. She wants to have kids, too, though...someday (she's very much a homebody).

But I just remember what it was like for me and my family growing up, when we were damn poor. I don't want to raise a kid in those circumstances; If I have a kid or two, I want her/him to have the best things possible in life, and to feel as if the world is full of opportunity. That'd be impossible in the current world situation (this (y'know, the earth) is a SCARY FUCKING PLACE these days, and unless President Obama can get the economy back on track, I don't want to simply create another wage slave like myself).

Plus, since I make very little money and I'm holding down college and a job at the same time, my time and commitment would be divided. I don't want that. I would want my highest priority to be the kid, and without financial solvency I couldn't do it. It'd be just mean and cruel to dump a kid into the world without the necessary resources - and this busts my heart to no end.

Thanks, though. :hug:

[Number23]

64. How sad and beautiful

I see couples with beautiful, sunny little toddlers and I ache;

If you feel that way, you're probably more than able to be a fantastic parent. And it's the materialism of our culture that makes people feel that unless you make $340K a year, you won't be able to take care of a child.

Kids need good parents who are there for them more than they will need anything else in the entire world.

[shadowknows69]

70. ,,,,,

[fed_up_mother]

175. IF "you" want a child, you are missing out on something

I'm really sorry you feel like you couldn't have a child right now, but I hope you get your wish. Kids aren't as expensive as we're told they are.

[BlueIris]

23. At this point, it is because I know

I probably won't be able to provide the same quality of life/similar quality of opportunities that my parents provided for me, thanks to the destruction of the global economy. Other things that give me serious pause include the probability that any children I might choose to have would not inherit an environmentally sustainable planet. And I question where on earth I would even want to raise them at this point, considering how I feel about the sorry state of our dysfuctional societies.

Finally, there is the fact that my work and my plans for the future require an enormous amount of sacrifice already. Don't know how I could continue to do my work with the responsibilities of childcare in play.

[Lorien]

31. Pretty much the same here

I got attacked here recently for saying that I thought that bringing a child into the world as things stand today is cruel. I think that we'll soon see very serious environmental collapse which will have grave implications for our species (along with all the rest), probably within in the next decade or two. Knowing what I know about the health of the planet, peak oil, the stability of our society...I just feel like it would be a very irresponsible move to add another soul to this groaning planet. I would have liked to have had kids, but I can't do it in good conscience. I also have fibromyalgia and CFS, so supporting myself is extremely difficult as it is. If I were suddenly very wealthy I would probably adopt one or two older children. With a little help with salary and home care I'm sure I'd make a top notch parent.

[Lady Effingbroke]

55. I agree 100%. It is for the same reasons that I have no children.

My parents never pushed me to have any kids, and I have found that societal pressure has lessened as I age (I'm 38).
------
Please don't slap me too hard, but I first read CFS as Chicken Fried Steak.

I think I worked in the restaurant biz for too long.

:hide:

[LostInAnomie]

24. I know it sounds bad...

... but I really like just doing what I want to do, and not having any unnecessary responsibility.

[tpsbmam]

57. Doesn't sound bad....

I know way too many parents who "just like doing what I want to do" but they go ahead and have kids anyway. Your way is preferable IMO.

[Prophet 451]

25. I don't like kids

I need my home to be quiet and orderly (I suffer from severe depression) and kids are exactly the opposite. Plus, I know myself well enough to know I'd make a lousy father: No patience and bad tempered.

[TlalocW]

26. Pffft... Where to begin?

The weird thing is that I like kids for the most part. Hell, I have a side business where I perform magic and twist balloons for the little ankle-biters so I have to like them. Of course, being paid a stupid amount of money because I can twist a balloon into a dog (actually, into just about anything, really) helps me like them since they're my market, and I get to wind them up for an hour or so then leave and let the parents deal with them. :) I'm also the weird, fun uncle who is the big kid with the nieces and nephews.

I've just never seen myself as a dad. I went through all the different stages of life to get to where I am now - 36-years-old - and I don't really care to have to relive any part of it through someone else. And I'm not saying my life was hell growing up - on the contrary, looking back, I had it pretty good.

Not having kids also has freed me up to do other things I want - specifically, starting that side business and possibly taking it full time.

There's also the rebellious part of me that knows that the government and religion want me to pro-create, and thanks to the vasectomy I had several years ago, that just ain't gonna happen.

The thing is, once you start looking at it - being childfree is not as selfish as you think, and you can make the opposite case. Common reasons for having children are: I want to pass on my genes/family name, I want someone to look after me when I'm older (that's an iffy dream), a child will love me unconditionally, mom wants grandkids (selfishness one level removed), etc.

Plus, the cult of the child that is prevalent in society today is staggering. I've gone to midnight screenings of horror movies like, "Scream," and parents have brought their 8-year-olds to it. At the first (crappy) Hulk movie, some new parents brought in their baby in one of those car seats that convert to a way to carry the kid. The Hulk movie (actually all movies nowadays) are too loud for babies. I was probably the only one in the theater who realized that the kid's hearing was going to be permanently damaged once the Hulk started roaring and fighting jet planes. Later on in the movie, when the Hulk first appeared, a little girl's voice rang out in the theater exclaiming, "Shrek!" I wonder how she felt seeing "Shrek" rip apart tanks and killing giant mutant dogs. (Sorry if I'm spoiling the movie, but it sucked anyway. Go see the new one instead). Kids are taken to fancy restaurants, where they have no business being, and where they cry and ruin everyone else's meals.

And since starting my side business, I have been astonished at how extravagant some parties get. I've entertained at parties where the kid is two-years-old, and I'm there along with a face painter, a Jupiter Jump, and a pony. The kid got tons of gifts - mainly play kitchen sets that came in boxes big enough to hold actual appliances. She's not going to remember her 2nd birthday, but parents think that every birthday has to outdo the previous one so I might as well benefit from it. ;)

The only problem is finding someone else that's childfree. I come from a small farming community in Kansas. I can guarantee that probably all of my classmates that graduated with me have kids. I now live in Tulsa, where it seems all the single women either already have kids or want them. I had to sit down and educate a woman who runs a successful matchmaking business on what it means to be childfree and how it doesn't make people freaks. I've also been pro-active. My normal job is computer programming, specifically database-driven websites so after I taught myself a new language (PHP) that lets me create them, my first project was creating a free personal ads site for childfree people (unfortunately, it's now gone... didn't have the time to keep it up).

But as well as being childfree, I'm also one of those people who don't mind being alone... the generation labelers (Gen-X, Gen-Y, etc.) had come up with a name for us in a few articles I read, but I can't remember what it is now. Guess it didn't stick. :)

TlalocW

[nadine_mn]

39. DINKs or SINKs?

Dual Income No Kids or Single Income No Kids?

I remember those labels...

sheesh I hear ya about the parties... everything has to be an MTV style My Sweet 16 event.

best party ever, my mom organized a scavenger hunt for me and the kids in our neighborhood...ending at the park with a huge rainbow and rainbow cake (I was 9 - I am sure there was a unicorn somewhere too).

But it was all homemade and a crapload of fun - that I remember.

[Lady Effingbroke]

59. I was STINKY for a long while, now I'm just a SINK,

Neither of which are conducive (at least to me) for having kids! :D

I am happily childfree!

* STINKY = Single, Tiny Income, No Kids, Young; SINK = Single (with a single) Income, No Kids.

[Lorien]

40. Ah, my new favorite rationale for having kids

(which I heard once on TV after 9/11, and once from a friend) "Because I want to give back to the world/ do something to make the world better". I'm not sure just why having a child makes the world "better" if the planet can't comfortably sustain the nearly seven billion inhabiting it now, so that bit of reasoning really confounds me. How about strongly supporting a better educational system for the ones already here? Or providing food to the starving millions at home and in far away nations?

Wanting to pass along ones genes also doesn't make sense to me. I can't imagine being so conceited that a person could really believe that their genes were that superior to anyone else's. I have two friends who are just wonderful people, but their kids are the most ill tempered, abusive and obnoxious children I've ever met. Genes don't always seem to make a huge amount of difference from what I've seen.

[dysfunctional press]

72. i didn't have kids because i didn't want to pass on shitty genes.

i have a congenital arthritic condition that has no "cure".

[Blue Belle]

107. I went to a U2 Concert...

and somebody brought their baby. I couldn't believe it. The concert ws so loud that you could literally feel the sound waves crashing against your body. You could hear the concert from almost a mile away and I had to wear ear plugs just to tolerate the music. Why anyone would subject their little baby to this is beyond me and maybe that is why I choose not to have one. I don't think you should have babies just because you can - this innate biological ability doesn't automatically give you the judgement you need to be a parent and everyday I see more and more evidence of it. The earth is pushing maximum human population density anyway... I think we should work on becoming better people before we become parents.

[beam me up scottie]

119. I hear ya, my ex was a race car driver and parents would bring infants and toddlers into the pits.

This was dirt track racing, too, noisy and dirty and the cars didn't have brakes, so it was considered dangerous for adults to be there. Once the races started you couldn't leave for hours unless it was an emergency.

We couldn't believe it.

[TlalocW]

127. When you get down to it, it's the parents being selfish

They feel that they don't have to make any lifestyle changes once they have a kid - that everywhere is going to be or should be welcoming to having their baby in it, and they get upset if it's not, or if the place isn't somehow child friendly. I remember several years ago, a successful family counselor with a weekly online column wrote about how he wanted to go to the beach for a couple of hours, but his toddler daughter was fussy and overtired from not having a good nap, and he went anyway, dragging her along with him. She proceeded to fuss and shriek and make life miserable for everyone on the beach, and he wrote a column about it, calling everyone who gave him dirty looks child-haters. His comments for that article had to be turned off because so many people - childfree and not - wrote in calling him an idiot because the people giving dirty looks at him were doing it because he was being a selfish prick for bringing his daughter, in the state she was in, to the beach.

So many people just don't get it.

TlalocW

[mrreowwr_kittty]

147. I believe the word you're searching for is Quirkyalone

A writer coined the term when she noticed that many of her 20 and 30something counterparts were perfectly content to be alone, and while they were open to the possibility of love, they didn't feel it was imperative that they be in a relationship.

[lastliberalintexas]

209. I've never yet taken my child to a movie theater, and he is 4

Not even to the kiddie movies, for the very reason you mention- it's too loud for me, much less him.

However, I must quibble with you over the restaurant issue. My child has eaten at very upscale restaurants down to fast food joints, and has impeccable table manners. People are always complimenting him on his behavior and manners in eating establishments, and it's probably because we have taken him out to eat from the beginning. He also uses a fork or spoon, places his napkin in his lap and even (mostly) wipes his hands on his napkin. While I agree that parents should not take their children to certain venues, I disagree that any restaurant should be included in that list.

Obviously the real problem is not that children are at a public restaurant, it is that htey have never been taught how to eat properly. Manners and etiquette are dying concepts for adults, they certainly don't take the time to teach their children how to behave. Not all children are hooligans, but *most* hooligan children have bad/unattentive/disinterested parents. JMHO anyway.

[Bettie]

228. Um....not all parents are like that...

I am very careful where I take my kids.

I want them to be successful at behaving in a variety of social situations. Right now, since they are 6 and 7, that means that they only go to places where kids should be expected to be, "family" restaurants, kid's movies, the park, and other "kid" places.

As they've grown older the number of places we go has increased and the kinds of places have changed, because they are able to behave.

Oh, and I also think that the kind of parties kids have these days are just ridiculous...my kids get a homemade birthday cake with family and maybe a friend or two to play with. Any more is just silly.

That said, kids don't always behave and they sometimes cry. NO parent, no matter how diligent can completely guarantee that their child won't have a meltdown, but then, I see adults behaving badly fairly often too.

If you don't want kids, you shouldn't have them. They are a lifetime commitment and a huge amount of work. The work is rewarding at times, not so much at others, but for me, even in those bad days, I know that I made a CHOICE to do this and I'm going to do my best to turn my tiny barbarians into contributing members of society! (And 6 and 7 year old boys are indeed barbarians!)

I'd never wish parenthood on someone who didn't want it. Just as I would never want to deny it to someone who really did want it.

[pansypoo53219]

29. i'm not maternal. baby wise.

don't like babies. much prefer cats. always have. teletubies showed me that. that baby in the sun? no reaction. show me a kitten/cat? AWWWWWWWWWWWWWW.

best i not have any.

[dgibby]

30. Because

Because I believe that only adults should raise children and even 'tho I'm waaaaaay past childbearing age, I STILL don't know what I what to be when I grow up (if I ever decide to grow up, that is)!

[Mind_your_head]

32. I have a LOT of respect for people who consciously 'choose' not to be parents.....

although I sometimes wonder if some of you all would make the BEST parents of all......you're thoughtful, reflective. analytical....wonderful traits that you would pass along to your children, and the world.

Parenting is a tough, thankless, often lonely job. It's also rewarding in ways that one who has never 'done it' can't even begin to imagine.

Peace,
M_Y_H

[galledgoblin]

38. gay

to conceive would require bringing in a fertility doctor. not that I'm completely ruling out someday conceiving, depending on my partner's wishes, but I doubt it will happen.

I will likely adopt a few kids though. someday.

[Cheap_Trick]

41. I don't wanna have to share all my stuff....

[Greyhound]

42. A very different led me to the same place.

I've never wanted 'em. I announced to my mother that I was never having kids when I was about 10 and have never felt any desire to alter that stance. My sister feels the same way and she still hasn't changed her mind either.

Ms. Greyhound & I have 4 canine kids, also rescues, and have been places and done things we never could have with children for both financial and practical reasons.

[Cobalt-60]

44. I won't reproduce in poverty

I'm not going to reward my oppressors with a fresh generation of wage slaves.

[Truth4Justice]

47. Amen to that. The masters are counting on more human bodies to run THEIR machine.

[Heidi]

48. I like kids, but I don't feel I need one or two of each thing in the world that I like.

That's just one of the reasons. :hi:

[comtec]

53. All this talk about HAVING, MAKING kids... What about adoption?

My wife and I are putting on hold (till after our vacation) working on making a kids.
However, I have told her flat out, IF we have second one it'll be adopted.
I can barely justify to myself bringing a child INTO this world, but I have NO problems taking care of one that is ALREADY here!
I have no illusions, I'll be OK as a father, and as a role model.
But I have found that I do have the paternal gene.
I have enough love and concern to take care of my family, and that blood is not necessary for me to love.
I want to pass on my knowledge and perspective of the world.
I have some nieces and nephews i would like to get to know better, but families here in the Netherlands are not as close as elsewhere.
If I can successfully pass on my wisdom and sense of justice for otehrs, and love for all life to one more person, I'll be happy, and content that I did not exist for nothing.

But yeah we are unsure if we even can have kids, and adoption might be our only way.
After one I'm getting fixed no matter what (as it can be reversed if I loose my mind and want to make another)
But yeah... with the way the world works, I don't know if we should make a life only to have it snuffed out. The idea of adopting is tempting, but how old to adopt? gender and race don't matter. I'm selfish, because I want a child with a sound mind adn helthy body, beyond that, i don't have preferences, because all I can pass on in the end is my mind.

[nadine_mn]

66. this isn't about adopting or biological children

this is about a choice to remain child free - no pitter patter of any type of feet. Adoption is a great option - its why hubby and I talk about foster care... no pain, no diapers (if we go older) and not forever.

I am choosing to opt out of the parent game

[Heidi]

69. I'm adopted,

and I thank you for this post. (I was adopted at six; it made every difference in my life that two beautiful people were willing to adopt two little girls, six and five. Had it not been for our adoption, we probably would have been in foster care for a long time.)

:yourock:

[comtec]

96. We have a niece we might end up adopting

Her mother is... yeah. long story short the father (who is not our cousin, he was hubby one with 2 kids by her) is not really able to take care of the girl(s) , and if/when she's declared incapable we'll possibly sue for custody (however its quite possible the father will just give us custody as well). She may or may not know her half sisters as that, or just her cousins, but we want her to have as normal a life as possible.

Even though they are technically our cousins (daughters of my wife's cousin) we are considered their aunt and uncle :)
Just wish we had more contact with the lot of them. Family is important to me, but the ones here are so distant... :(

[Heidi]

99. My sister and I

were adopted by my (former) aunt and uncle. Best parents on earth. Please PM me if you want. :hug:

[old mark]

54. Neither my wife nor I want kids

We are both pretty perceptive and don't want to bring another person into this authoritarian, stupid world. There are enough miserable smart people without adding any.

FWIW, I have 2 brothers and 1 sister, and NONE have any of their own kids by choice. My middle brother and his wife addopted 2 girls several years ago, and they are our "decendants".

mark

[eShirl]

56. Frankly, I've never had a good enough reason to HAVE kids.

Besides, my years of direct care in a community group home for developmentally disabled adults *really* brought home to me what an incredible responsibility it is to have other lives dependent on me for most everything. A parent doesn't get to leave that responsibility at the end of a shift.

Our shelter rescue cat is like our son. My father-in-law even calls him his grandson! :D

[Hissyspit]

58. Two Reasons:

1) I'm spending all my money on me.
2) People suck. Cats are cool.

[Dissent Is Patriotic]

60. I just don't like children. Much like you, i found a loving

man who feels the same. He had a vasectomy three years ago and it's been fantastic. Not being on the pill is so liberating. We are 29 and 34 respectively. I never felt maternal, except towards pets, and never wanted to be a mom.

[distantearlywarning]

63. My reasons:

1) I never saw myself as a mother, I've never experienced the biological clock ticking, I don't have the urge

2) I don't really like young children. Teenagers are ok, but unfortunately you have to raise them for 12 years before you get to that point. Interestingly, I didn't like children even when I WAS a child, and nothing much has changed since then.

3) I enjoy my life the way it is now, without children

4) The thought of pregnancy and childbirth scares me

5) My husband is not interested in children either. In fact, he's neutered, thank God, which makes our sex life much less stressful.

6) Children are expensive and I have other things to spend money on

7) I like cats

8) The world doesn't need more people in it

9) I've always had the strong sense that my ultimate destiny doesn't involve parenthood - I have a different calling

10) If I suddenly came across a lot of money and free time, I would strongly consider entering the foster parent system, which I think would be a much less selfish act on a societal level than procreating myself.

[CatBO]

65. There are many, many reasons...

I'm a woman who has known since I was 5 that I didn't want children. I proclaimed this to my aunt one day, and have never reversed position once.

There are many, many reasons.

1. I was picked on a lot as a kid, and as a result I never liked being around kids. As a kid, I felt childhood was like a prison term and I was just waiting to be an adult. That's all I did as a child - fantasized about being an adult.

2. Kids are loud. I don't like loud.

3. If for some reason I changed my mind about 1 & 2, I still could not bring myself to create a new child to bring into this world. I think the world is overpopulated, as our recent food and energy shortages are beginning to highlight, and I would have a very hard time adding to that. Instead, I'd adopt, if I ever "changed my mind".

4. My mother made being a mother seem like the most awful job in the world. I never saw motherhood in a positive light, and instead the only people who seemed to genuinely love being around me and taking an interest in me as a child were my aunts or my godmother. They became my maternal role models.

I love being "Aunt Cat". It's what I do well. I love on my nieces and nephew, and then I send 'em home. I have their pictures posted on my desk at work. It's the perfect arrangement.

[madokie]

67. I'm from a big family, 13 of us kids, 5 girls and 8 of us boys

I remember all my life that I felt that instead of having children of my own I would like to help to raise one or some of the many children who have no father or who needs a father in their lives. I always felt there were enough of my brothers to carry on our name and I have always felt that the most important thing in life was in how a child was raised and not in who sired them so here I am at 60 with two young men who I call sons. Our youngest and his most wonderful wife gave us our first grand child about 16 months ago and let me tell you all this I am one happy okie, in spite of my user name. I am living a life long dream

I met my wife soon after I came home from 'Nam, we fell in love right off but I was bug nuts from the war and about as irresponsible and wild as they come and knew a long term relationship with her at that point in my life was out of the question so we remained friends and all as she ultimately had the failed marriages that produced my two step sons. A little over 18 years ago we bump into each other one day and start talking about what if and as is often said the rest is history. Thats how I became the dad that I am today. I could not love my Sons any more if they were my own flesh and blood. The young men now were 8 and 14 when we married. I never adopted because I always felt that they needed to carry on the names they were born with and to know their born into families. We have never received any child support nor have we ever felt the boys dads owed us anything, giving up the children for me to raise, nurture and to love was enough for me.

I type this as tears of joy flow down my cheeks

Peace and please everyone have a great day

[shadowknows69]

68. I hope my wife won't end up hating me for it, I fear she will

But I couldn't bring a child into this world knowing the state of it. I decided this around 8-10 years ago too and I'm still pretty sure I made the right decision given what's happened in that time, although it does haunt me occasionally.

[dysfunctional press]

71. when i was diagnosed with a congenital arthritic condition, i had a vasectomy.

there's no way that i would want to pass these genes on, and have someone else go through the hell i went through, and have the pain that i have.

but- i had actually decided long before that not to have kids- i had a shitty childhood, with shitty parents; and i think that people who have happier childhoods are more likely to want to have children.

[MichellesBFF]

74. We got rid of the kids, cause the cats are allergic!

No, not really. ;)

DH asked me one day if we HAD to have kids, and it was like a light bulb going off. No, we don't have to have kids. So I had my tubes tied, and that's that.

Now it's just us, and the 6 cats, and I wouldn't want it any other way.

(As for the allergy thing, we actually adopted 2 Ragdoll cats many years ago from a family whose son was becoming asthmatic from his cat allergies. They've since passed on, but we were so glad they trusted us with their precious kitties.)

[dysfunctional press]

93. we've got 3 cats, and one beautiful black labrador retriever...

although it will soon be 2 cats, and 2 dogs.
one of our cats has cancer, and we'd like to get a 'friend' for our lab- we'll see what's available at the shelters once our cat has passed...she's got a HUGH tumor and has become very thin, but doesn't seem to be in any real pain as of yet. when she does start showing signs of...great distress(?), we'll probably have her put down, rather than watch her suffer and deteriorate. she was a runt of a stray when we took her in 12 years ago when we lived in chicago, and now we're in a more rural setting in a far northwest suburb. she's already lived a lot longer and in much more comfort and health than she would have as a stray, so at least there's that.

sometimes i worry that my wife might have been disappointed at not having kids (her two sisters and her brother each have two), but i was very clear up front about my desire to remain childless(my arthritic condition had not yet manifested itself or been diagnosed, and i had not been vasectomized).i think that she might have thought that i would, or she could, change my mind. ultimately though- i probably changed her mind, in that the way we choose to live our lives would not be conducive to raising kids, let alone the financial burden it would entail for us(and if in fact we HAD chosen to reproduce, i'd probably be typing this from my room in my parent's basement, as i tried to figure out how to come up with this month's support payment...and i'm 47). since we met and married when i was 32 and she was 36, it made it easier to do 'without' -and once i got a vasectomy at 38, it became a non-issue.

[Mabel Dodge]

73. We made the decision back in the 80's

We made the decision when we were married 28 years ago and we still don’t regret it.

We thought the world was bad then with Reagan, we had no idea just how bad it could get.

[earth mom]

75. I have one child and I can NOT imagine life without knowing what it is like to be a mom.

I'm glad that I know what it was like for my parents to raise me and my brothers and how damn hard it was. I wish my parents were alive today so I can thank them for their many sacrifices and their love and support.

What bothers me about this thread is that I have a few friends who don't have children and I don't hold it against them. But I find it really odd that anyone can say not having a kid is the best thing ever when they don't have a clue about having a child of their own in the first place. :wtf:

[nadine_mn]

79. I don't think that is a fair statement

But I find it really odd that anyone can say not having a kid is the best thing ever when they don't have a clue about having a child of their own in the first place.

I think I know a lot about having a child without having one - I have changed diapers, been puked on, had to kiss skinned knees and comb through hair looking for lice. I have been through more time-outs than I ever want to be, held kids through horrible tantrums, dealt with ADHD, IED, and ODD, I have been up at 2 for bottle feedings, picked up hundreds of kids from school and daycare, helped with homework that is over my head. I have had the "sex-talk" with 12 yr olds, helped do mock interviews with 17 yr olds looking for their first job.
I have stacks of fine works of art, I have laughed so hard I cried, and cried so hard I thought I would die. I have pulled play-doh out of unimaginable places, been told I was hated, loved, hated again and loved all in the same day... I have held little newborn angels, discplined toddler devils, dealt with tween angst, and teen turmoil.

I love kids... but at the end of the day I don't want the responisibilty of having one.

What bothers me about your response is that as I stated in my OP, this isn't about whether or not one should have children. This is for those who made a deliberate decision not to have children and what reason they have for it.

[earth mom]

126. Saying you think kids are great from a far is NOT the same as actually having your own kid.

You know what? I wasn't in an all fire hurry to have kids. I wasn't one of those people who couldn't wait to have kids-NO. I knew I wanted to have a child-someday, whenever that was. Frankly, I used to get annoyed with bratty kids I'd see in stores or restaurants and I thought that lots of the people I knew were raising full-on brats. Oh sure, I thought kids were cute from afar, but didn't see the reason for having so many kids or having kids so young or spoiling the hell out of your kids when you did have them. Yep, I made HUGE judgments about something I knew diddly squat about. But it wasn't until I had my own child in my mid 30s, that I realized that I had known ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about being a parent and what it meant to be a parent. Being a parent helped me to truly understand life and what it's all about and it blew my mind! Having a child has been the BEST thing I've ever done! That said, I'm still NOT that crazy about other peoples kids; I don't always think they are cute or the smartest or the nicest as their parents do. But I am patient with them and I totally understand the love their parents feel for them because I am a parent too and feel the same love for my child.

Seeing this thread bothers me because NONE of you know what it's like to be a parent. So how in the world can you make a judgment about it one way or another? You just want people to post on this thread in support of your decision without anyone telling you that you don't have a CLUE about what you are talking about. Sorry, I'm not gonna do that. Instead, I'm here to tell you that you are missing out on something incredible and you don't even know it! Multiply your love for your pet by a thousand and even then you'll never understand the depth of meaning having a child gives to the lives of people who do have children.

IMO, Having a child is the key to understanding what life is all about. And you can't know that if you don't have a child.

[lukasahero]

129. "Being a parent helped me to truly understand life" "And you can't know that..."

"And you can't know that if you don't have a child."

Wow - what a pile of sanctimonious crap. Must be nice to know the meaning of everyone's life.

[earth mom]

152. Too bad if you can't handle the truth.

I'm sure others are too polite or don't want to hurt your feelings by telling you the truth.

And the sanctimonious one is those of you who think they know it all about being a parent when they know absolutely nothing! :eyes:

[lukasahero]

184. Are you sure you're in the right place?

I see very few people here who don't have children suggesting they know all (or anything) about being a parent - and you will kindly note I said no such fucking thing. However, you seem to know all about what is right for me and my life, so please, tell me again how I'm sanctimonious? Are you REALLY sure you're a Democrat?

[earth mom]

187. WTF-Are you sure you're a democrat???!!!

:wtf:

Excuse me but what do I have to do to prove it to you? I'm pro choice-is that good enough for ya? :eyes:

Maybe you are the one that's not a dem since you have a problem with allowing free speech! Just as the rethugs do!

I don't care one way or another if you have a kid or anyone on this thread has a kid.

But at least stop knocking it if you don't know diddly squat about it!

The bottom line is that I'm a parent and I'm free to say that parenthood has been an wonderful life changing experience for ME. ME-get it?!!!!

If you don't like me saying that on this thread, tough shit. Simple as that!

[mrreowwr_kittty]

181. You are not a fully actualized person until you've procreated.

Better get going on making a baby so you can be as wise and knowing as the poster you responded to. :sarcasm:

[lukasahero]

185. A reality, I'm sure, the poster reserves especially for women.

Am I really reading this right? Wow.

Where's that :shakes her head in wonder: icon when you really, truly need it?

[earth mom]

190. What TOTAL bullshit!

All I've said is that if you haven't had a kid you don't have a valid reason to diss parenthood. Period.

Oh and btw, you can be a parent without actually giving birth you know! :eyes:

[lukasahero]

198. No - that's NOT what you freakin' said!

You said those of us who don't have children can't understand the meaning of life: "Having a child is the key to understanding what life is all about. And you can't know that if you don't have a child." There's nothing about "dissing parenthood" here.

This is a deliberate first blood attack on people who made different choices than you did based on the possibility that some of them MIGHT diss parenthood. And now you're scrambling to change the game.

[earth mom]

188. Same back at ya! nt

[Scout]

132. IMO, Having a child is the key to understanding what life is all about.

well you know what they say about opinions....

:eyes:

gee, I don't know what it's like to be a parent, so I guess I have to have a kid before I can decide I don't want to be a parent ... is this really what you expect people to do/believe?

you need to get a grip on reality.

[earth mom]

151. No, the reality is don't knock something until you've tried it and understand it. nt

[nadine_mn]

160. Don't knock it until you try it?

Nice way to describe parenthood.. and what if after having a child I decide, you know I was right - this whole kid thing isn't for me.

Do I give the child up? Return it to the stork? Bringing another life into this world or adopting one into your life should not be taken lightly. If you think you don't want to - why risk damaging or hurting the child.


My mom told me she wished I was never born - true she said that out of anger, but I never forgot it. Nice idea to have a kid to "try it" ya, that won't hurt anyone.

[earth mom]

168. No one had a perfect childhood.

I had brothers who went so far off the rails it would scare anyone away from having kids. Which is one of the reasons I waited so long to have kids. But I wanted to experience life FULLY and so I had a child. It was a good choice for me. I choose not to live in fear of the unknown. And it has been a beautiful experience, but not one without ups and downs and highs and lows for reasons I won't go into here. But at the end of the day I am very glad that I became a parent.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

182. Can't you just say that you're very glad you became a parent and leave it at that?

Why the need to lay on all that sanctimonious bullcrap?

[dysfunctional press]

210. nobody can experience life "fully"...

have you ever experienced crushing poverty...? if you want to experience life "FULLY", that's a part of it. so- you should probably quit your job, and give away all your possessions, including home and vehicle(s) if you have them, and give that poverty thing a try for a year or so- see if it's for you.

how about divorce...? have you experienced that yet? being a single parent? how about prison..? have you had that life experience yet? have you lived in a leper colony? how many mountains have you climbed? how deep in the ocean have you dove?

have you experienced life a nomad? gone on a walkabout in the outback? done peyote and gone on a vision-quest?

have you experienced what it's like to sell your body to a total stranger for money?

any of those questions that you answered "no" to are life experiences you might want to get busy on- seeing as you want to live life "FULLY", and all...

and when you finish those, i've got more.

[Iris]

179. Well, then get off this thread. Because you can't know what it's like to have decided NOT to have

a child. So, frankly, YOU don't know what YOU'RE talking about here.

[earth mom]

192. I didn't decide to have a child until I was in my mid 30s! I know what I'm talking about! nt

[dysfunctional press]

212. if you don't know what it's like to be in your 40's and childless, you just wouldn't understand...

it's something that you really have to experience to truly appreciate.

[Kitty Herder]

236. My thoughts, exactly.

To quote GoldenRule: "What bothers me about this thread is that I have a few friends who don't have children and I don't hold it against them. But I find it really odd that anyone can say not having a kid is the best thing ever when they don't have a clue about having a child of their own in the first place."

WTF? You can't know that you don't want to have kids unless you've tried it? Well, it's a little too late then. You can't send 'em back if you find out you really aren't cut out for it.

[azmouse]

133. Having, or not having, children is much too personal a choice

for anyone to make for anyone else.

I'm happy that having children worked out for you.

Obviously for many others it would not have been the right choice.

And choice is really what it all about, isn't it?

[earth mom]

154. Look, if people don't want to have kids, fine. I think having 1 child is all anyone should have

anyway due to overpopulation.

But I've seen the attitudes of people who don't have kids before and who rant on about how horrible it is without knowing what the hell they are talking about. This thread could easily go that route and so I put my thoughts in about it.

But people don't want to hear that on this thread because it's all about them talking about something they don't know anything about.

It's like saying you hate Europe and never having been there. :eyes:

[azmouse]

158. You say that those of us without children don't understand your life.

Would you at least admit you don't understand ours?
I don't slam anyone for having children and I don't think most here were slamming parents. We were honestly stating why having children wasn't something we wanted.

You're right. I'll never understand what a parent goes through. I didn't want children in my 20s and when I tried in my 30s I found I was unable to have them. Those are some of the facts of my life. I'm not critical of people for whatever choice they make. We all have to do what is right for us.

I do feel that you are being much too sensitive about this.

[earth mom]

163. I've seen parenthood slammed before, so yes, I do have my back up here.

Look, I'm not saying that choosing to not have children is bad, what I'm saying here is that parenthood is a beautiful experience that I think we are all meant to have in order to truly understand life. But that said, if people choose not to become parents, that's their choice and I do understand the many reasons why. What gets in my craw is that a lot of the time people without kids have a sanctimonious attitude that I was accused of upthread and it really irritates me. Did it ever occur to them that maybe people who have become parents know something fabulous about parenthood that they don't?!

Again, I understand why people don't have children, and I'm sorry that you couldn't have children. To each his own really.

Just don't diss me for having a kid or for saying that FOR ME parenthood is worth the price and I wouldn't change a thing.

[lukasahero]

186. "that I think we are all meant to have in order to truly understand life"

And that's where the bullshit starts.

If you leave your opinion as as "FOR ME", then fine but you're not leaving it there - you're suggesting that those of us who have a different experience can't possibly be as fulfilled and knowing as you are. Sorry but that's the part that got your post called "sanctimonious". Are you really saying you don't understand that?

[earth mom]

193. I know from experience, you all know nothing yet sit there and say how great not having kids is.

You all are the clueless and holier than thou ones here.

Again, if you've never been to Europe how can you say you hate it?

[Alcibiades]

171. Everyone who has had a child

Was once childless. The reverse is not true.

And, no, cats are not the same as kids. Not by a long shot.

[nadine_mn]

161. You are the one steering this thread into a rant

I just asked a question for THOSE WHO DO NOT HAVE CHILDREN


I said in the beginning - THIS IS NOT PRO/ANTI CHILDREN


you are the one who decided to judge those who made a choice not to have kids.

[earth mom]

170. No, you are trying to dictate what people can and can not say on this thread!

FYI-I am judging NO ONE. I understand why people don't have kids.

I just don't want to see a thinly veiled sanctimonious thread about why you all think you are better than those who choose to have kids.

I am saying that none of you can REALLY know what it means to have a child if you have never had one!

Like I said upthread, it's like saying you hate Europe and have never been there. It doesn't make sense!

[fizzgig]

189. how is this a thinly-veiled sanctimonious thread?

i see nothing in the op or most of the responses that even imply that those of us without children thing we're better than those of us who do. yes, some people say they think it would be selfish to bring a child into the world at this time, but they aren't saying that those who have children are selfish. i feel it would be selfish of me to have a child right now because i have a hard enough time keeping my own stuff together that i couldn't give the child the life they deserve

as far as your assertion that you can't understand life if you don't have kids...i call bullshit. your understanding of life is different than mine which is different than anyone else's. that statement is judgmental because it says that i don't understand life because i don't have kids. do you know me? no, you don't, so how dare you presume to know what i do and do not understand.

and yes, i think some of us have an idea of what it means to be a parent even though we don't have kids. again, more judgment and presumptions on your part.

[earth mom]

195. See post #156. I'm getting tired of repeating myself here. nt

[fizzgig]

197. yeah, i saw it

and it says nothing to address my post. you are screaming sanctimony and judgment, but that is all you are spouting.

so i will ask you again: where do you get off telling me what i do and do not know or do and do not understand? and why is it that i have to have the same understanding you do?

[Scout]

204. why you all think you are better than those who choose to have kids

why do you care so much about what strangers on the internet think?

maybe deep down you resent the childfree, eh?! :rofl:

[raccoon]

227. Huh? Where'd you see that?

"I just don't want to see a thinly veiled sanctimonious thread about why you all think you are better than those who choose to have kids."

[Scout]

202. "talking about something they don't know anything about"

and that is where your argument is shit.

you said yourself you don't have to HAVE a child to be a parent.

many of us have parenting experience that informed our decision not to have children. you just assume you know better than we do about our own lives.

[Name removed]

144. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

150. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

159. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

164. Deleted message

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[nadine_mn]

167. You didn't even read this OP did you lol

Never did I say I was saving the world LMAO

never did I say having a cat was the same


take a deep breath a try to read it again... sllllooooowwwwly

[Deja Q]

196. Life isn't about making babies. It's about exploring, experiencing, seeing, tasting,

and computers rock too!

[Missy Vixen]

203. I may not know what it's like to be a parent

>Seeing this thread bothers me because NONE of you know what it's like to be a parent.<

However, I do know what it's like to be an unwanted child. I will NEVER do that to another human being.

Please don't force your mores and your values on me. This thread was supposed to be those who don't have children and why; this happens a lot. Instead of treating our choice with respect and courtesy (as we do yours), we are lectured yet again on how we will never understand "the meaning of life" because we did not procreate.

I prefer the happiness my life choices have brought me to pleasing those who believe they know better than I how I should live my life.

Julie

[Name removed]

208. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[earth mom]

215. Same back at ya!

:puke:

[quakerboy]

222. Ah, ignorant assumptions are fun

Ignorance is fun, huh? Unless we personaly know a poster here, not a one of us has a clue what background someone has. We have no idea who here raised a sibling, in the absence of able parents. Or who has spent years working in the child care field. As a nanny, or teacher, etc.

Have fun telling others what they know.

[Lorien]

224. So, we should all withhold our judgement about whether or not to become

parents until AFTER we all have kids? :wtf: I know some parents who actually regret having children, but they can't exactly return them now, can they?

Yes, I imagine that I would love a child much more than I've loved any pet-and that's why I can't have a child. Why would I bring something I would love so much into the world when the planet itself doesn't have a future? What, so I could enjoy them for a decade or two before the environment collapses and wipes most of us out? Nope. Can't do it.

[undeterred]

109. So childless people really can't make this decision

Yeah, we get that a lot- treated like we are incompetent adults.

[earth mom]

157. No, just don't spout off like an expert about something you don't know anything about. nt

[distantearlywarning]

148. I was a full-time nanny for 3 young boys for 2 years in my twenties

I think I know a little something about my decision not to have children.

And knock it off with the sanctimonious crap. If you like being a mom, good for you. That has nothing to do with me or my opinions or anybody else who's posted in this thread.

[Name removed]

156. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dysfunctional press]

207. i'm sorry for you that your imagination is so limited.

:shrug:

[Marrah_G]

76. I don't think anyone who doesn't REALLY want to be a parent, should be one.

I see some really great parents out there. Personally I think I am an adequate parent. To be honest, due to finances, if I had to do it all over again I probably would not have had mine (at least not when I had them). I love my children, but I struggle just to give them the raw basics.

I wish I had thought things out as much as you did. I have friends who have chosen to not have children and they live very happy and fulfilled lives.

[Vinca]

77. I never really liked kids all that much. When I was a teenage girl

I took babysitting jobs, but it was definitely only for the money. I get along fine with kids as long as their parents take them home. The closest thing I have to maternal instinct is my love for animals. That's just the way it is. My brother is pretty much the same, so I figure it has something to do with our unhappy childhoods and not wanting to repeat them.

[elocs]

85. My almost 17 year old goddaughter is like that, except she would never even babysit.

I have thought that if I were ever to be a "grandpa" it would be through her, but that doesn't look likely now (although the last thing we want now is for her to be pregnant). The choice is hers and she is still young so she may change her mind, but somehow I doubt it. The important thing is for her to be happy, whatever she chooses.

[IdaBriggs]

78. The reason people say 'you'll change your mind' is because of

the hormonal surge that seems to hit (or is it just the reality check?) kicking in because a woman's procreative life cycle is going to end which generally hits around 29'ish. After age 35, fertility rates drop for MOST (not all) women rather dramatically, unless they have had children prior, in which case they seem to get some 'overtime' points. I am told this is because of our life spans -- a woman who has children in her 80s (for example) usually won't live long enough to finish raising them, and since our bodies still haven't caught up to our longer life spans, women's eggs expire about 40 (generally). Men do the 'drop and run' so they stay fertile longer, while women, with 9 months worth of physical/mental/emotional investment, plus childbirth, etc. are usually more 'vested' in the results.

I had a challenging childhood, and for me, it was important to have children. This was my choice, and I respect yours, as only you know if you can overcome your own trauma and enjoy being a parent. I really enjoy my children, and cannot picture my world without them, but because I had infertility issues, I had the opposite experience you did, and had to EXPLAIN repeatedly why I wanted to have babies. (I told my last doctor it was because I wanted little slaves who would wait on me hand and foot, because that is what children are for right? Fortunately, he caught the exasperated sense of frustration / sarcasm, and started cracking up -- it wasn't the answer he was expecting! LOL!)

Please don't get too annoyed when people with children feel sorry for you, as it is one of the most amazing experiences in the world for those of us who go through it who love our babies. If you have ever fallen in love, and you remember that feeling, picture it hitting you a dozen times a day, every day, for years! -- then picture never getting to experience those moments, EVER. Yes, you miss out on the diapers, the spit, the lack of sleep, the utter frustration of not being able to FIX teething pain, etc. and maybe the trade-off is a good one for you, but my twins let me see the world as a brand new place every single day, and for me, the world is a happier place because they are in it.

Best to you, Ida (Mom to 17 month old twins, Cameron & Brianna -- smartest, best babies in the world!)

[raccoon]

80. I always knew I didn't want kids.

My father died when I was a little kid, and my mother raised me and my sibs alone.

She never said so, but the covert message me and my sibs got was "don't have children." Another covert message we always got was that my mother just wanted us to grow up and get out of the house. I can understand her feeling burdened and she didn't have much emotional/practical support.

My sibs got the same message as me--we've discussed it--and only one of us sibs has one kid, and that was an accident. Accidentally on purpose, I think. This was the youngest sib, who, as often happens, received more attention than the rest of us.

My mother was very emotionally shut down. My father, when he was alive, was a raving, out of control alcoholic. The picture I got of marriage and family life was, needless to say, not a positive one. I looked at my family of origin, and thought why the HELL would anybody want to go through something like that.

I know, it doesn't have to be that way, but everybody speaks from their experience. I also felt that I didn't know jack about being a parent, just as my parents didn't.

I like children in small doses. As I'm in my mid-50's now, I won't be having one of my own. And I'm OK with that.

[marmar]

82. I just don't think I have the mental makeup to be a parent.....

..... I enjoy spending time with my younger cousins, and I like working with kids in a summer writing program and really enjoyed it, but I couldn't deal with it 24/7. I'm someone who needs a great deal of "alone" time, and it's one of the reasons I'm still single.

[iamthebandfanman]

83. waiting to see if mother nature

makes us feel the wrath of her revenge.

if humans stop being parasites, maybe ill have some children :)
i know ive always wanted the opportunity to be a good dad since i didnt get the chance to have one of my own.
i just cant do it right now with all the uncertainty though.
it wouldnt be right to bring a new life into this world knowing the extreme possibility of a horrible death and a short life.

[yellerpup]

84. I didn't have children because I wasn't sure I would be a good mother.

I was unwanted and was never allowed to forget it, and I didn't want to bring a child into the world unless and until I was double-dog sure I could do better than my parents did at providing for a child's future. (I got the basic legal minimum-food, shelter, and sometimes warmth-no perks, no extras like college, for instance) Also, I was committed to Zero Population Growth that was on everyone's mind when I came of age. Reproducing oneself is so easily achieved for most people that it is accidental as often as not. I am 59 and am often asked if I regret not having children. My reply is, "Not yet." My husband and I have over 60 nieces and nephews, we mentor teenagers, and give time and money to our local residential facilities for kids whose parents are so ineffective that the kids are essentially 'jailed' until they reach adulthood (unprepared to take care of themselves, I might add). We also adopt shelter animals when we have room. I find satisfaction in nurturing senior citizens who are or have been neglected by their families as well. There are plenty of opportunities to nurture if you open yourself up. Personally, I think that there should be established an "Anti-Mother's Day" for those of us who have not produced additional competition for other's children to battle over the planet's ever scarcer and rarer natural resources.

[Autumn Colors]

86. No desire to be a parent

Not fond of kids and have no patience for babies. I learned that as a babysitter in my teens. I also was told I would "change my mind". Funny thing is that it was always either non-family or distant family who would state this. No one in my immediate family ever said this to me because they knew me well enough to know that I wouldn't change my mind.

I didn't get married until in my mid-30s and my (now ex) husband was 10 years older. He didn't care one way or the other and said it was up to me if I wanted kids or not.

I have absolutely no regrets and hopefully, I'm close to the point where I won't have to worry about birth control too much longer.

[GreenEyedLefty]

90. I never wanted kids at 16, but now I have 3

The first one was not planned... if not for her, I might not have had kids at all.

I've long believed that anyone who chooses not to have children for any reason should be commended for their honesty with themselves, and for their courage, because the pressure on couples (especially women) to have children is egregious.

And besides, parenting isn't all it's cracked up to be. Those cute little babies grow up - and they're not so cute when they become sneering teenagers.

[shrike]

97. I've actually met people who've said if they had it to do over again, they wouldn't have kids

And these were all people that I, and probably everyone else, would have considered good parents.

One is the most hardworking, creative mother I know, but if she had it to do over again, she probably wouldn't have them because "there are so many other things I'd like to be doing." She also said that she realized that early on, but that since her kids were already here, she owed it to them to give them the best start possible -- how's that for maturity.

Another one was the father of six children. He told me, almost offhandedly, that if he wouldn't have any kids if he had the chance to live his life over again. Although he loved his children, the hard work of raising them and supporting them (and he believed it would have been the same even if he'd limited family size) took up so much of his time and energy. Now that they were out of the house he and his wife were discovering a whole new world out there.

[GreenEyedLefty]

101. I admit that I sometimes think that way...

but keep those thoughts to myself. I'd hate to make my kids feel guilty for holding me back for whatever reason.

Unfortunately for thinking adults, this society is incredibly child-centered. Parents feel guilty for daring to have interests outside of the family.

I try to balance doing a lot for my kids with benignly neglecting them. Kids need space, just like we do.

[MonteLukast]

123. I do sometimes wonder about...

... the experiences I'll miss out on.

What if, personally, the best way for me to learn patience, leadership, and diplomacy is through being a mother? Each person learns personal skills in different ways, and I thought my way would be through career... but so far, that hasn't worked out that way.

I'm always thinking about the paths I don't take. What would really bring out the best in my personality and character?

[philosophie_en_rose]

91. I don't think I'm ready yet.

I'll be thirty in a few years, but I don't think I'm emotionally or financially prepared to choose to have a kid. I like them, but I also like the idea of returning them to their parents after taking the nephews to the park.

[mikeytherat]

92. Married almost 20 years, childless by choice.

Mainly because we've never felt the urge to have children.

A friend with two lovely daughters once described the birth of his first child this way:
"You know that feeling you got on christmas morning when you first got to open your presents, and everyone was sitting around in their PJs, and you had that moment that something you had wanted so much, and waited for so long, was finally here? I get that feeling every time I see my daughter's face."

That is the type of desire we would want before having children, and we've never gotten anything remotely like that.

mikey_the_rat

[supernova]

94. 46 and child free

It's not that I didn't want children, because I do like them. But truthfully, I never could see me having them as a realistic dream/goal. edit: I have congenital heart defects and when I was growing up, talking about the time when you would grow up and have kids of your own jus wasn't done in the 60s and 70s. So I grew up not knowing whether or not I could have them safely. I didn't get myself invested in a "mommy" identity just in case it turned out not to be true.

When I was in my 20s, I was married to an emotional abuser and I wasn't about to bring a child into that situation. I was having a hard enough time dealing with it myself. The thought of having to protect a child from him absolutely horrified me. But I did learn that it would be alright for me to have children, at least from a cardiac standpoint.

While I got free of the relationship, it took me years to recover, the same years that many people spend having and building families. I was quite fearful of men and of choosing someone just like him so I stayed away from the whole relationship arena for years for my own mental health.

Also, my career path has been very up and down, I've never had a job I could rely on. There's been minimal financial and physical stability in my life. Again, it consumed most of my energy.

It's only been within the past 3 or 4 years (I've been divorced for 11) that I've begun to think seriously that I might, Might, be able to have a rewarding relationship. But, I'm 46 now and that new relationship, whoever he might be, will either have to have kids of his own or not want them himself. I'm simply too old. Yes, adoption might be good, but that's way down the road. I know, I'll probably be in my 50s.

So, I like kids but it just never worked out that way. And I try to be happy with what I do have and keep looking toward the future.

[LWolf]

98. I've enjoyed reading this thread.

I DID choose, sort of, to have kids. For the wrong reasons.

"Sort of" because none of the pregnancies were planned.

Yet, I craved babies. I think my "accidents" were deliberate, although not consciously.

Why? Why do teenage girls crave babies? I've seen it repeatedly in the decades since, and I have some theories. For me? I think it's because I was the only child of a single parent who cut herself off from all family when I was young. We not only had NO family connections, we moved every year, so had no community connections, and while I was allowed to contact friends made in previous "lives," we couldn't afford to travel to see them, so those connections didn't often survive.

My mom suffered from depression off and on, and would often send me to "stay" with her friends for a few months. For me, I think it was a craving for roots, for stability. For family that wouldn't disappear.

That's no reason to have babies at 17 and 19, but that's what I did. I discovered that marrying someone from a big family didn't guarantee stability, and that large families could be more dysfunctional than my family of 2. When that marriage ended, I raised my boys by myself. I also got my tubes tied, and had the "you'll change your mind" argument with the doctor. Having kids was no picnic. While I adored them from the moment they were conceived, and I love them even more fiercely today when they are grown men, I'm not really cut out for motherhood.

I don't like babies, except for my own. I have never wanted to pick up another person's infant and admire it. I do like kids, as along as I don't have to take care of them. Actually, I do take care of other people's kids as a profession; I enjoy interacting with them, I build relationships with them, I really like the people they are, and I like best sending them home to their parents when the school day ends.

I don't want to feed, clothe, or manage their lives.

My 2 sons, who are fine men that I love with a fierceness that surprises me, love me back. They say they've forgiven me for the hard parts of their childhood; and yes, there were many. Teenagers having babies are not likely to have everything go smoothly. My oldest has no desire for children, ever, and I fully support him. It's cost him the most significant relationship of his life, and I think he was correct to let the relationship go. My younger son has one son, is a single custodial dad, and will have no more kids. He has taken responsibility for his unplanned child, and loves him, but without that "accident," he never would have had kids, either.

I know that the social and cultural pressure to reproduce is overwhelming. I wish that more people could resist. Spending my life in the classroom with everyone else's kids allows me to see a huge range of families. I am humbly grateful for parents who provide their kids with stability and good parenting. The number of parents who do not is staggering.

In my perfect world, those that truly want to spend their lives loving, nurturing, and raising children, and who have the stability to do so, would. Those who don't, wouldn't.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

100. We chose cats. They're easier to herd and a lot cheaper.

My wife and her ex-husband adopted. It was a disaster. A controlling and domineering man managed to produce a narcissist child (woman now) who is incapable of caring for anyone but herself.

I was briefly married to a woman who had two kids that she neglected by giving them a lot of money and letting them fend for themselves.

When we (my present wife) got together we decided that we didn't want kids. That was 28 years ago and we have no regrets about that decision.

[Irishonly]

102. Not Every Woman or Man Should Be a Parent

I taught for over twenty years, several of them working with SED boys. I had nightmares about the abuse many of the kids suffered at the hands of their parents. For some a complete recovery was a wish because the damage both physically and mentally was so severe.

I have great respect for those who know they do not want to be parents. One of my best friends had a tubal ligation at the age of 27. She's great with kids and loves them but never wanted one of her own. She was a terrific step mom when she married a man with a 14 year old and my daughter thought the sun rose and set with her.

IMHO children are gifts and when you have a child it's a life long commitment. I wanted a child and just couldn't get pregnant. I was thrilled after five years of marriage when I learned I was going to be a mom and I have loved every day. I consider myself lucky to have such a great daughter. She doesn't know if she wants to have kids and says she may want to adopt instead of giving birth. I tell her to do what is right for her. She has the right of choice.

[intheflow]

104. My gynecologist wouldnt' tie my tubes because of the

"you'll change your mind later" mentality. Mind you, I have one child, a really great son who's grown up to be a fine liberal young man. But I had him when I was a teenager--I never wanted kids before I got pregnant and I never wanted another after I went through childbirth once. But when I was in my early 30's and asked my gynecologist to tie my tubes, she wouldn't because I might someday want to have another child. I have gotten the urge to have another child only once in the 15 years since then--and it left as quickly as it came.

Why not another child?

1) I gave up my young adulthood to raise my son, I didn't want to give up my 40's, 50's and/or 60's to raise another child--18 years is a loooong time commitment.

2) My son was such a great child from the start, I didn't think it would be fair to any other child if they turned out to be more challenging than my first son: "Why can't you be more like your brother?"

3) I'm not really that maternal. I liked my own baby, but am not fond of other people's kids, generally speaking.

4) Right now I'm at zero population growth--very ecological.

[MonteLukast]

124. Zero population growth. I alluded to this in another thread last week...

The "is it unethical to have a child?" thread. You may have stayed away from that one because it could get pretty intense at times. I basically said that I think there should be a moratorium on bearing new children until all unwanted ones already here found loving homes, our elderly were properly engaged and integrated back into our lives, and our middle class was strong again.

Of course, that will never happen; but we see economic and social consequences of too many people long before we see the ecological ones-- and I keep thinking about these poor high school kids fighting each other like banshees to get into colleges that were safe for them just five years ago-- having to prepare in ways unthinkable to me when I was in high school, everybody having to start earlier and earlier just to keep up socioeconomically-- and then I remembered that one of the effects of ZPG was a relatively even distribution of wealth.

If this mad college fight is the first sign we've got an overpopulated country, I say we heed it. Because we have to think of every child as never JUST a child, but a potential 80-90 year old adult who will have emotional and spiritual needs, who will have to compete, who will have to fight all their lives just to make a living and get some love. And the more relief from this shock, the better.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

183. It's more than an 18 year commitment

My b/f is supporting his adult children. The daughter is a junior in college. She works part-time, but Dad foots most of her bills. The son is a 19 yo loafer who is content to sit in front of the computer and raid the fridge. Obviously, there's some choice involved in these situations but I notice that more and more young adults are dependent on their folks.

[intheflow]

226. I know it's more than an 18 year commitment.

I myself have boomeranged back to my folk's home in my early 20's with a 6-year-old child as I completed college. But 18 years is the minimum--I mean, there are people who kick their kids out at 15 or 16, but at 18 people attain legal adulthood. That's really all I meant by that.

[RB TexLa]

105. I enjoy my life the way it is, don't want to give up time or money to raise them. Children

add complication to life.

[trashcanistanista]

108. I'm poor and I'm a slacker by nature. I won't work full-time, life is too short.

I live cheaply and the reality is, kids are expensive. I have too many other interests that would interfere with raising a kid. I feel that I was meant to persue other things and it doesn't bother me at all. I do sense jealousy, especially now, when friends in my age group are going broke paying for college and apartments and cars for their unemployed older children. I have multiple days off in between shifts and others work 6-7 days a week to pay for this stuff. They always want to know what I do on my days off. I never tell them.

[Blue Belle]

110. I haven't met the right person...

to have kids with. I've been pregnant before but chose not to have it because the person I was with was an alcoholic and abusive to me. Since then, I have met some wonderful men, not the right man. I want to have a stable, loving, relationship first before I bring a child into this world. I don't want to have a child because I can, I want to raise a child in a home that can model a solid partnership to that child. I know you don't have to have two people to raise a kid, and I know that you can't always guarantee that your significant other will always be there (death happens), but despite the pressure placed on women to have children, I don't want to have any until I can give it the home it deserves to be raised in. Maybe I'm selfish, maybe I'm hanging on to an unobtainable dream, but that's just how I feel. Until then, I'll continue to pay my taxes, fight for better health care/education/child welfare programs, and try to approach bringing up the next generation as a whole instead of on an individual basis.

[Deja Q]

111. While my mind is allowing me to work and prosper...

...and even then it's difficult because my personality is so introverted and intimidated, let's just say I would make a bad parent. Not out of conscious hate, but of - for once the term makes sense - pre-existing conditions.

And while I wholly appreciate the innocence of childhood, I lack the discipline to raise them - much less other factors such as ADD, as those problems stem back to just about my very beginning. But I digress. With ADD and PTSD, I would not make a good parent and I sure as hell wouldn't want to screw up a child's life because of any ineptitude on my part. (other people who know me enjoy my sense of humor and know I am a decent person, but have either alluded to or made direct statements about me as a parent.)

A victim of molestation, various forms of abuse, and peer-based violence as a child, or at least being wise enough to know I'd be foolish, I make up for my "personal demons" by supporting pro-child causes, and helping others who do raise children. It's all I can do, and I do not want - by any means - to even harm any child. If you knew me personally, it would make far more sense.

At any point did I just sound arrogant, whiny, pompous, or vain? That was not my intent to do.

[badgerpup]

112. Thought I was going to do the wife, mother, white picket fence thang...

...but it didn't turn out that way.

Got caught by Women's Lib at a crucial time, and it turned out that I've got really lousy judgement when it comes to men. Guy I loved (and still do, in a way) was gay, but he still wanted a son...
I was OK with that, even though a marriage license wasn't part of the picture.

Figured OK, I could probably raise a child by myself, but I'd better have a damn good-paying job first. Decided I'd shoot for LPN (LVN in some states), then work up to RN before we started anything.
Couldn't afford to stay in school...

(edit...whole bunch of Life Happens)

Then I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder after a really spectacular manic episode. Was informed there was a genetic component here, and gave a long serious think to how many members of my family exhibited symptoms of mental illness.
Did I want to pass this on (along with some of the other familial genetic pre-dispositions, e.g., heart, diabetes, cancer, etc.,)?
No.
And...this was purely selfish, but utterly cold, pragmatic, practical and honest...did I think I could be a good parent to any child?
Ummm...well...no.


Doesn't mean I won't do my best if I get involved with someone who already has kids.
I just won't be adding to the mix.

[MonteLukast]

125. It's amazing how thoroughly children can pick up subtle messages...

... and turn them into referenda on their personal worth. Even if you weren't intending to do anything but give them the best love possible. They can still misinterpret and make themselves miserable.

Some people would say, "That's the child's problem, not mine", but the bottom line is that each of us has a different definition of what love feels like, and conflicts between two people's definitions of loving actions causes more misery than we think. Of course, communication is the key.

[alarimer]

113. I never felt the need to have children.

Which is good because I am currently seeing a man who has had a vasectomy. LOL so that works out well.

[LanternWaste]

114. So far I've chosen not to have kids because....

So far I've chosen not to have kids because because I'm not married. I imagine that should I get married, I'll re-examine my position.

[Withywindle]

116. Just not interested.

Whatever broody feelings or biological-clock ticking or feelings of love and tenderness when looking at a baby that women are "supposed" to have - just aren't there for me. I've never experienced a strong desire to have a child (and at 39, I kind of think if it was ever going to happen, it would have by now) and I don't think having a child is something that should be done by someone like me. You have to REALLY want it, I think. And I just don't.

[Iris]

117. So far, I've chosen not to have children. But that doesn't mean I'm not maternal.

I find myself being maternal in ways that women with children do not have time or energy for.

[Iggo]

121. I would've been the very best Daddy.

I never found a woman I wanted to have kids with. But I helped my brother raise his daughter (Grandpa, Uncle, Father and Daughter was our non-traditional family unit) and not only was it fulfilling, I'm totally fulfull!!!!

[MonteLukast]

122. I'm at the age when my friends are starting to raise families.

And from what I can gather, once you do you're sucked into a black hole where you have no time or energy for anytbody but your own family and immediate social circle. Work and commutes are the main time robbers, and combined with the work of raising children you're just thrust into this routine-- you have to prioritize your time, and that means focusing on the people who really matter to you. Nice... except if you do NOT happen to be one of the people who "really matters" to your friends!

And that's only a consequence of the normal wear and tear of life... I'm not even talking about deliberate cocooning, escaping into the church and the playdate groups, consciously deciding you have no time for people who don't share your lifestyle.

Those unfortunate realities aside, I still want to be the link between my familied friends and the outside world. My life has been nowhere near as adventurous as I would've liked, :( but still I'm a link to something different, a change of pace.

Obviously, I get along best with parents who stay involved in their communities and local politics even if they have very young children. Some have stay-at-home dads, some rely on friends and extended family, some grin and bear it with weird schedules. But all show they have the imagination to make room in their lives for both family and community.

[mrreowwr_kittty]

143. Is it any wonder so many middle class families become Republican?

You have perfectly described the suburban/exurban existence, and how limiting and isolating it can be. These people are ripe for megachurches to swoop in and indoctrinate them into the Gospel Of Republican Prosperity.

[azmouse]

128. I am childfree first by choice and then by chance.

My mother was very young when she married (only 16) and had 3 children by the time she was 22. She wasn't a good mom... I never remember being hugged. I never remember her saying she loved me.
I hated being a child and couldn't wait to grow up and move out on my own.
Because of that and so much more, I decided when I was young that I wasn't having children. I wanted to do what I wanted to do without being picked on or made fun of.
I never stopped enjoying my life and getting to see the world and meet people. I had an isolated childhood. I couldn't see myself wanting children when I was still too busy growing up myself.

It wasn't until I was 32 that I gave any thought at all to having children. I did try to get pregnant but had no success. I tried many fertility drugs and still had no luck. I was incredible infertile. We gave up only to unexpectedly get pregnant about 2 yrs later.... and I miscarried at just 8 weeks. I still cry about it to this day and find myself tearing up as I type this. It was my only chance at motherhood.

I have no regrets about chosing to be childfree in my 20's; I know that was the right decision for my at that time.
I have no regrets about trying to be a parent in my 30's; I know I gave it all I had and it wasn't meant to be.

My husband and I have a great marriage. We've known each other almost 30 yrs at this point and still laugh and enjoy each others company like we we're still kids ourselves.

[SidneyCarton]

130. Those who do not want children, should not have them.

I salute your clarity of thought on this matter.

[alfredo]

131. UofK medical center took away our ability to have children. They

botched the removal of a pituitary tumor. They left the tumor, and took out the pituitary gland, then lost all record of the surgery, except for the billing.
Botched surgery, missing evidence of the botched surgery, but they expected us to pay them $60,000. No fuckin way.

[Terry in Austin]

135. Never was interested

That was the basic reason. Over time, I added others:

1. Having kids: twenty years, half a million bucks, and then they break your heart. Wanna sign up for that?
   
   
2. Enough already! Too many, even.
   
   
3. Well, it is the most important job in the world. So it should be restricted to people who are A) qualified, and B) highly motivated.
   
   
4. Those little suckers are expensive! (see #1)

I might be interested in having some grandchildren, but you know, there was that middle step...

[usualblacksheep]

136. Reasons

Reasons:
1) The State of the world and America as of now
2) Giving up my independence
3)Lack of maternal instinct

Everyone tells me I'll change my mind, get married and have babies. I think not.

[EnviroBat]

137. My best friend has two children. One is Autistic and he requires

a lot of attention. He is a stay-at-home dad, and the kids are his career now. Recently his wife insisted that another child was necessary because she had seen three children in a "dream" she had. My friend protested. His wife threatened divorce if the seed was not planted. He gave in. He is miserable staying home with the two kids all day, and now there's going to be a third. I've never understood this "need to populate the planet" mentality that some people foster. Is it necessary to have a huge family these days? Really? I just don't get it I guess, and I think it's sort of dumb. It's dumb because the world population is maxing out. The planet won't sustain this rate of growth. Why add to the problem?

[FreepFryer]

138. I Love Kids, But I Love My Independence and Freedom More. (n/t)

[Indenturedebtor]

172. The wife and I are doing everything we can to get minimally financially stable

So we can break away from the states and have kids. We plan on travelling around, teaching english etc and home schooling our kids when we're on the move.

Don't think that's appropriate for kids? I think you're wrong. I think Go-Gurt and Disney movies are innapropriate for kids.

[enigmatic]

146. Zero desire to have kids. None.

Never had it, never will. My wife is the same way; if anything, she feels more strongly about it then I do.

We're happy w/ our lives; we have the love of our friends and our animals, and they have every bit of ours. That's all we need.

[treestar]

149. I would have had to have been a single mother and the desire

to have children was not strong enough for that - not only regarding the financial issues, but the family ones (strict Catholic family which would have been greatly disappointed - still is that I could not manage get married).

I love the nieces and nephews, though. It's nice to be able to help out there more than I could if I had my own kids.

[Ilsa]

153. Good for you. I decided I wanted to be a mom when I was in my twenties.

I had no idea before then if I could handle just the pregnancy/childbirth part. Being a parent is hard work, and my oldest is disabled. Our lives have been turned upside down over his disability.

But not wanting kids doesn't make you any less of a woman or compassionate person.

[JFN1]

155. Too many humans already

I've got around 20 nieces and nephews, ranging in age from 19 to 3. Before I got married 11 years ago, I knew I did not want kids, as I have believed for a long time the human race is caught up in j-curve population growth. I've been a parent - vicariously, mind you - to my nieces and nephews, have been there for the good times and the bad times, and feel like I am making a contribution to the next generation by being there (and being accessible) for them. And while I'm not passing on my genes, I am passing on what little I know, every chance I get.

[Starry Messenger]

162. I can't afford them

It really sucks because I am 37 and my parents started putting the screws to me a few years ago after years of imploring me not to have kids...now my cousins are having babies and my parents want to be grandparents now. Sorry. No mun no fun. I make under 30,000 a year and have $0 health insurance.

I had to have an abortion in 2002...I was only making $15,000 a year. I did have Kaiser then. I got tested and had a pro-life ob-gyn totally hate all over me for asking how to end my pregnancy. I'm never putting myself in those kinds of hands ever again.

If I ever get to a good financial place, I would love to adopt. I love children and would love to have my own. My boyfriend had a kid when he was really young, so I got to be a sort of stepmom during weekend visits and I loved it.

Children are a luxury item.

MPK

[bigwillq]

165. I don't have any sort of paternal instinct.

I don't want kids. I never have. I like kids but not enough to have any of my own.

[NashVegas]

166. I Was Messed Up

Now that I've finally pulled my head out of my ass, I wish things could have been different, but I'm thankful I didn't pass my problems onto anyone else.

[NeedleCast]

174. Don't Want the Responsibility / Enjoy my Lifestyle

It took me until about age 30 to figure out that there was nothing wrong with the fact that I didn't want kids. At age 34, many of my friends are married with children (although I'd say I have a higher number of bachelor/bachelorette friends than most people my age). The idea of settling down, having kids and devolving into some routine lifestyle has just never appealed to me. In fact, most of my married friends are a continual reinforcement of why I have no desire for children or to really even get married. Many of my peers are now divorced, often divorced with children, some even working on or going through their 2nd divorce. Their lives pretty much revolve around their children...school functions, little league, dance class, et. al. If that's your cup of tea, super, but it's never been mine.

I've always been a generous person financially, but I can be selfish about my time. I like to spend it doing the things I like to do. I like to stay out at bars until 2:00 AM, I like to go on vacation and travel when I want and where I want and I'm self aware enough to realize that my lifestyle is not conducive to having children.

Being a parent is a huge obligation and one I just don't want. I wish more people who had kids realized what they were getting into. I know way to many miserable parents.

[Yavin4]

176. Never Been Remotely Financially Secure Enough To Have Kids

I've worked for dog shit money after dog shit money, sometimes barely able to get by on my own. I cannot imagine having to carry kids on my paychecks.

[fizzgig]

191. i don't think it would be fair of me to have a child, at least right now

i don't have a job, i have no savings and i've got a pile of debt. my life is very much up in the air right now and that would not be fair to the kid.

i've pretty much decided against having kids anyway, but if i changed my mind, now would certainly not be the right time to have them.

[Hippo_Tron]

194. If you've ever watched The West Wing, that's the kind of career I want

And unless you get to that point when your kids are already grown (in your 60's) or are fortunate enough to get there in your early 30's like Sam Seaborn (George Stephanopolous) it's not really condusive to family life. I know that the show is fiction, but the difficulty of having that kind of job and having a family is one thing that it does portray accurately.

I'm way too young to have definitively decided that I'm not having kids, but right now it's not in the master plan.

[csziggy]

199. Another non-maternal woman here

I never felt that urge. Plus, I had an aunt who from the time I was about 4 years old was pregnant almost continuously for nearly 15 years. She had six living children and a number of miscarriages. And she was not one who had easy pregnancies - either physically or psychologically. So watching her just reinforced my desire to not have children.

My DH of 31 years knew from when he first met me that I never wanted kids. While he is a wonderful guy, he makes an excellent uncle but would be a horribly indulgent father. He can't even discipline our pets - he would spoil children rotten. He is just as happy to not have the responsibility of being a father.

And there is another reason I did not want children that I realized after I was an adult. May parents both drink. While they are functional, they are alcoholics that would never admit it. In addition, my father is an undiagnosed manic-depressive. I am to some extent and at least one of my nieces has been disgnosed. I made the decision to not pass along those traits, though two of my sisters have perpetuated these problems. Another sister also chose not to be a mother.

I did not want to have kids so much that I had my tubes tied when I was 25 - I had tried birth control and had medical problems while on two different kinds. I wanted a hysterectomy but could not find a doctor that would do it on a young woman who had no children. Six years ago I did finally get one at 50 after 35 years of migraines, severe cramps and increasingly severe monthly bleeding that debilitated me.

My life would have been infinitely better if I could have gotten that hysterectomy when I first wanted it. I have resented the medical profession for all those years for making me live with what for me really was a monthly curse. The migraines were directly tied to my hormone levels since the only times since I have had any was when my hormone replacement treatment is messed up. But for all those years, the doctors (including a female OB-GYN) blew off my records of my symptoms and the correlation between them and my monthly cycles.

That is only one reason I will fight for women's rights to chose and to get treatment for their real needs, not those that society decides for them. Women today are not ignorant idiots - most educated young women know what they want. But I do worry about the limitations the far right has imposed on educating our young women about their own bodies and how to protect themselves. That imposed ignorance is doing terrible things to the ability of young women to make good decisions about their lives.

[AZBlue]

200. Money and a preference for 4-legged children.

I've never really been in a situation where I could afford a child - but then again, if it had been a priority for me, I could have made it happen, so it was obviously never really a priority for me. I used to think for a long time that "I'll have children someday, when the desire kicks in" - then I realized that desire was never going to kick in for me. At this age (42) I'm a little too old to start, plus I don't really want to - I have a cat-child and am looking to add a second one this year - that's enough for me. If at some point I do want to have a human-child, I'll adopt - there are already SO many children here already who need a home, I'd rather reach out to one of them.

[Luna_C_06]

201. Ok, first some background info...

My mom started a home based daycare center when I was 11. I've helped her with children on and off since then, but I really started working with her when I turned 18, when I was able to officially become a helper (we get inspected by the state so any helpers have to be 18, with CPR training, no felonies, etc.). Also, my doctors and I have agreed that a pregnancy could possibly endanger my health and my life (type 1 diabetic).

I've known since I was 11 that I did not want any biological children. Hell, after watching my mom go though her next to last pregnancy with my little sister 17 years ago, I prayed that I would never get pregnant and I was 5 then!

I might adopt, but not for another 10 years at least.

[Paladin]

205. I Have The Utmost Respect For Those Who Opt For No Kids

God knows, there are way too many people having children who shouldn't.

Our two daughters are absolute treasures, and we're overjoyed with how things have worked out. But it took a huge amount of effort, and managing to overcome a considerable amount of worry, frustration and anger over the years, for things to turn out as well as they ultimately did. I can certainly see why people choose to forego the experience.....

[DFW]

206. I let my wife decide. She wanted 2, so we had 2

The sleepless nights went on for a while, and the financial burden is still
ongoing, but we're happy with how it turned out, and I'm happy to pay the price.
Not all would or can, and I respect all decisions made in this regard that were
rationally thought out. No one's situation is identical to another's, and so
no two ideas on the subject can be identical.

Even so, I'm happy with our results, and I know a couple of 20-something guys
that are glad we bothered:

[InvisibleTouch]

211. Very simple: I don't like them.

I know I would never have the patience to be a good mother (though I have a houseful of pets and am a perfectly good mother to them, or so I hope!), and it wouldn't be fair to the kids or to me. I know I would massively resent wasting vast years of my life raising kids with all their problems and demands. Call it selfish; that's okay. Better to be straight-up honest about that, rather than allowing myself to be pressured by society's expectations and creating misery for everyone involved.

Big secondary reason: there are too many humans in the world as it is. I wouldn't want to contribute to the overpopulation. If by some bizarre quirk of fate I find myself 50 years old and suddenly feel that I've "missed out" on something, that I'm suddenly desperate to have kids (yeah, and Dubya could become a Democrat tomorrow and start advocating to save the planet, too!), then I would adopt. There are plenty of kids out there needing good homes, from all over the world. No need to make more.

[Joanne98]

213. MONEY! People don't have children because they can't AFFORD TOO!

[Blue_Tires]

214. a lot of my own reasons mirror yours

but for brevity's sake i'll say i just didn't want them

[windoe]

217. I knew I would not have them when i was very young.

In the core of my being I did not want to be a parent. Luckily my parents did not push traditional roles, so I was free to do what I wanted. I have the highest respect for parenthood, and love to see people really happy to have children. However I am sad when I see people who seem to have been trapped into parenthood, and their unhappiness is felt by the kids too.
It is the most important job, to care for young people, so I think that it is important to be true to oneself and not to what others think when making this decision.
Most of the time I do not admit this because I have gotten some really negative reactions from people. I just say I can't or not yet who knows kind of thing and move to another subject.

[roody]

219. I have always adored freedom, so I didn't have kids.

Now I have freedom and some disposable income.

[quakerboy]

220. hmmm....

1) We don't wanna
2) You can't make us
3) We like each other
4) Why subject more people to the vaugeries of this world?
5) We don't wanna
6) Genetics. We would either have the perfect child or a true daemon.
7) Every one else is, so why should we?
8) Medical reasons.
9) We don't Wanna.
10) They don't come with soft fir, nor do they purr. Nor Chuckle and scamper. They do however wake early.
11) And they take years to toilet train.
11) Money
12) No health insurance
13) Teen girls make the urge to kill rise. Teen Boys have a rising urge to kill themselves with stupidity. And children turn into teens
14) Why should we?

[NuttyFluffers]

221. because they are non-refundable and i'd get in trouble if i break 'the new toy.'

:freak: :silly:

somedays though i think about the fun i can have casting children into the various molds i dream up. yet i hear this would likely be illegal and i'd get in trouble discarding defective or uninspired creations, or some such technical nonsense people have informed me...

:evilfrown:

[nadine_mn]

231. similar fears of the non-refundable part

what if I break it? or worse what if they don't leave at 18 like they are supposed to?

[kevinbgoode]

223. I grew up in a very large family. . .and was second oldest

As soon as I was able, I was changing diapers and playing with babies. As a child, I was taking the younger ones out to play, bandaging their skinned knees, rocking them to sleep. . .
I was 20 years old when my mother had her last child - and I used to take her and the dog to the park all of the time - just like all of the others. When I was 14, I was pulled out of school for a week while my mother had one of my brothers - to stay home and take care of the younger siblings.

I've talked about this experience with my parents before - interestingly, none of my siblings have many children - 1 or 2 at the most. . .one has three. There were nine in my family. My parents tell me today that they would usually choose me to take care of the others because I was empathetic and would look after them - so they aren't surprised that I chose not to have any children as an adult. Now I might be a gay man, but - I could have still adopted. There was a short time in my 20's that I wondered about doing just that - but I honestly don't miss the experience.

My parents today joke that I already raised children growing up - and they are partially right. Now I know it isn't the same as having one of your own, but I was so glad to grow up and out of the house and become my own person. Now that I'm middle-aged, I love kids. . .I'll talk with them in public with their parents. . .heck, recently I was at a big community Fourth of July celebration and found myself just as attracted to the lighted up Star Wars-like sabers as many of the children - so I bought one for myself and the friend I was with. . .we played with them for awhile, to the amusement of other adults. . and then looked at each other and realized that if we took the toys home, they would just gather dust in a closet. So. . .just before the fireworks, as dusk made things start to get dark, we each decided to walk around the crowd and choose a child (with a parent, of course) to give our light saber away. I choose a kid with his grandparents and she found a kid who was only with his mom. . .and after the adults gave permission, we presented our toy to the kids, begging them to give them a good home. They were thrilled. It's the same way with this stupid little red, white and blue lighted big necklace I bought for the celebration...it was pretty when it lighted up, but I had no reason to take it home. As we were leaving the park, there was a young couple next to us pushing baby in a stroller - the mother was carrying another infant in her arms. They were trying to negotiate their way through a very crowded floodgate entrance that was bottlenecking with people trying to leave. I leaned over to the Dad, pushing the stroller, and handed him the lighted necklace thang...mentioning that the baby (and stroller) could probably use some headlights in the crowd. He didn't hesitate...he took it and both parents thanked me...tossed the thing over the baby's neck like a ring toss...hahaha. . .and the baby's eyes grew wide staring down at the lights. But the purpose was to make sure all of those tall people crowding in the exit gate could better see a stroller. . .

I know it sounds silly, but I rather enjoy being more of that kind of support for children now. It's like being a bit of a friend for them and their parents - especially in public settings. . .and while it isn't so much, it's just a nice way of being a little part of the whole community.

[MillieJo]

229. I do want kids but haven't fond anyone to have them with yet...

nt.

[jeffrey_X]

230. time, money, freedom...

We got married in our early 30's and we have focused on our careers, traveling and enjoy spending time with one another. That is what we like to do. Having children would completely change the dynamics of our life and our relationship. We both just turned 40 and my wife is finishing up her doctorates. Once she is finished, we want to do a lot of traveling. The life we chose to live just doesn't involve kids.

:shrug:

[Evoman]

232. I'm almost 30 and I don't have any kids.

My gf and I have discussed the kids issue, and haven't made any decisions. Honestly, I could give or take them...I think I could be happy either way. The only restrictions I put on it is this

1 kid - fine
2 kids - you're pushing it.
3 kids - no fucking way, marry someone else.

Personally, I'm not really a kid person. It's not that I don't like them, it's just that I don't like too much responsabilities. I like taking care of myself, having a good time, and living a quiet and peaceful life. One kid might shatter that peace, but I could handle it. More than that, and I think it would be hell on earth.

And really...when I talk to people with kids, sometimes I get the feeling that they envy my life. I don't have a good job, I make shit money, and I don't have a house....but by the gods, my life is peaceful. I go to work, come home...my gf and I make supper. Then we read, or watch movies, or play video games, or go out for a coffee. I do all the things my friends wish they were doing. I don't have to clean diapers, or go to some shitty kids event.

[La Coliniere]

233. How do I count the ways?

There are so many reasons why I never became a parent, here are some:
-too many people in the world
-very self centered
-didn't want the tremendous responsibility
-met and married a woman who felt likewise
-didn't want to bring another person into the world who might some day have to face nuclear oblivion
-didn't want to risk damaging another person psychologically like my father did to me (I overcame that many years ago thanks to counseling)
-have always loved the freedom to travel and do my thing
-somewhat dysfunctional childhood myself
-fear for the future of our already dysfunctional society
What's really ironic is that I enjoy kids. Hell, I'm a 5th grade teacher whose life has been incredibly child centered for the past 20 years! However, I prefer other people to produce and do the parenting. I enjoy, yes even love, teaching and playing with children, but I especially like the fact that once the dismissal bell rings, my responsibility ends for the day.
One more thing. In my mid 20s. I read a book of short stories, "The Dubliners" by James Joyce. One story, "A Little Cloud" had a very profound effect on me. The story is about a young married man who appears to be happy with his wife and their newborn child. One day the man is visited unexpectedly by an old college chum who remained unmarried and was living a very exciting life full of travel and professional opportunity. After the visitor leaves, the young married man takes stock of his life and realizes that he made a mistake in his life choice. The man then looks at his baby and senses that his bundle of joy now represents for him a little cloud. Man, I never forgot that short story and I knew that I would only become a father if I was 100% sure, without a doubt, that a child is what I wanted. I could never again look at myself in the mirror
knowing that the child I helped produce had now become an object of resentment. I could NEVER do that to a child, my wife, or myself. I believe that one must be 100% certain that being a parent is the correct choice. I've never felt that way, and I have no regrets.
Peace

[MikeH]

234. My not having children is due to both choice and circumstance

First of all, I am a heterosexual male, 57 years old, and due to various reasons and circumstances, including especially some problems I had when I was young, I have so far in my life not had any serious relationship with a woman. Even though my not having had a relationship has been also due to some choices that I have made as an adult, it is still one of the biggest disappointments of my life that I have not had a relationship with a woman.

However I would say that I am not disappointed that I have not had any children.

I do remember when I was a kid I had the normal fantasies about being a daddy and having children. However as I was in college and approaching adulthood I came to be disenchanted with the idea of having children.

In particular I came to learn, in 1970, about the threat that overpopulation poses to our world and to our world’s resources, and that people in America consume more than their fair share of the world’s resources. So I had a little bit of a bad feeling about bringing a child or children into the world if this were true.

I definitely had problems and was not mature when I was in my 20’s, and not ready for the responsibilities of raising children or even of being married. It would take a number of years for me to work on my issues and develop some maturity.

I had a very unhappy childhood, and as an adolescent and as a young adult I struggled with unhappiness, and trying to be happy.

Actually one of my main problems as a young man was my relationship with my father. He was a very dominating person, and while he did do many very good things, he was often very judgmental, and very poor at understanding my issues from my point of view.

He was a very hard worker, and an excellent provider for his family. I myself could never measure up to his standards of working hard. If something I was supposed to do did not quite measure up to the standards he expected, or if I honestly forgot something, or if I made an honest mistake, he would sometimes treat it as if it was a crime, or an affront to him. My dad often seemed to regard and treat his children as if they were his personal property.

I came to fully realize, about a year after my dad died when I was in my mid-30’s, how angry I still was at my dad, and how much of his behavior had actually sometimes bordered on being abusive. I.e. it was not just something wrong with me that I had problems with him. I have been in much therapy to deal with my issues with my dad.

So feeling the way I do about my dad, I have had and still have a strong distaste about being a father myself.

If I were to be a dad myself, I would want to be as good a provider in a material sense as my dad was, and I don’t think I would be able to. For one thing I could never work as hard as he did, and I have had some problems at some of my jobs (even though I did have a very good job during the late 80’s and most of the 90’s). Also the time when I was growing up was during the Golden Age of the middle class, as Thom Hartman describes it. A single wage earner could support a family of several children (I was one of five children).

I would also want to be much more sensitive than my dad was. However I was not able to get across the hurdle of dealing with the problems I had when I was young until my late 30’s and early 40’s.

Given what we know now about global warming and the threat to our planet’s sustainability, as well as what the shrub administration has done to ruin our country and to pile on debt to the next generation, I am now glad that I do not have children who are going to have to deal with all this. And being 57, it is past the time anyway when I or most people would want to have children. I don’t like the idea of being in my 70’s when my children would be teenagers.

If people really want children and are able to raise them, there is no reason they should not have them (though not arbitrarily many). However nobody who does not want children should be made to feel that they are obligated to have them.

I really don’t think that anybody should feel that they ought to have children for any reason other than that they really love children and want to bring their own children into the world, and want to and are able to pass on joy to their children.

In particular nobody should feel that they have to have children to please anybody else, such as relatives, or out of any sense of duty or obligation, religious or otherwise.

I myself have not had pressure from family to either get married or to have children. However sometimes I have been a little offended when somebody I am conversing with in casual conversation asks how many children I have. And one time at a buffet restaurant, the day after Halloween one year, the woman behind the counter asked if I went trick-or-treating with my children. I reminded her that there are people who don’t have children. She said she thought that I had looked like a daddy. I did find her question to be offensive, with the assumption that a man like me “should” have children.

[Firespirit]

235. Misanthropic

Hey, I'm not ashamed of it. I don't really like dealing with people face to face, including my own family and friends. Much more of a "virtual" person. It's not a shyness thing, or something I secretly crave; it is an actual rooted dislike. I don't think I ever bonded as a kid, because I have always been like this. I get annoyed quickly if I am forced to socialize and cannot get away as soon as I'd like. In general, I think people are stupid, unthinking, and small-minded, and that would include any that I spawned. If my kids couldn't be exactly as intelligent as I wanted, I'd get tired of them too.

[Kitty Herder]

237. To be honest, I don't think I'd make a very good mother.

I'm the kind of person who requires plenty of alone time to be able to function. When you have kids, you don't get that. I'm afraid parenting would drive me insane and that would not be good for the children. Plus, I have bouts of depression that render me pretty useless. And I'm pretty damned selfish.

Hell. At least I'm honest.

Sometimes I think I want a kid. Spending time with my adorable, precocious nephew triggers my maternal instinct, something I didn't think I even had. But as much as I love him, if I baby-sit him for too long, I start to get twitchy, feeling the need to sit down in a quiet room by myself with a book.

I dunno. I'm always progressing, so maybe there will come a time when I've matured beyond my selfishness enough to raise a child--if I have plenty of support from the kid's father. But so far I haven't met the right man. I've dated plenty of wrong men, but no right ones yet. And I'm thirty-one, so that biological clock is ticking.

Edited to add: Another reason I'm not real gung-ho about having kids is that I was raised Mormon and always, always resented the Mormon attitude that a woman's entire purpose is to pop out babies and raise them. Before I left the LDS church, as an angry, resentful teenager and young adult, I really, really did not want kids at all. After getting out the church and no longer being told that I HAD to have kids, and that as a woman, that's the only thing I was good for, I started to soften up on the issue a bit.

[Dogtown]

239. At 36

it's probably time to consider a tubal ligation or vasectomy. Both myself and my SO are sterile-by-knife.

[ellie]

240. I have so many reasons

-I grew up in a huge family and like my peace and quiet.
-I have no maternal instincts.
-I realize that parenting is very difficult and it is not like me to do something half-assed like many parents out there. I don't have the time or the inclination to give it all of my attention.
-It took forever for me to find a good job. Consequently, I feel I am about five years behind and now I am too old. I think having children is for younger people, if you do it right, and time has passed me by.
-I don't have supportive husband. He is 36, not finished with school, and is still in the process of finding himself.
-I have a problem with commitment and am very restless.
-I always assumed I would have children because everyone else has. It is refreshing to take a different course. I am very happy with my choice.

Good luck to you!

[Minervah]

241. Reason

I am a child free-by-choice person who never wanted children for many reasons.

For those of you who say that people who do not want kids will change their minds and love the kids when they are their own please think how much damage that statement can do. My mom never wanted kids but was talked into it by my dad. The result was she didn't find an enlightening maternal instinct after having three kids and she expressed her feelings through extreme abuse toward my sisters and me both mental and physical.

Here's the thing: if you try it but don't like it (parenthood) you can't take it back. There are no refunds, no returns. To the people who used to tell me "It would be different when it's your own," I would tell them that if I found having one of my own did not make me change my mind I would give it to them. I'd also point out that I love cats and I never knew what it was to love cats until I had one so they should get a cat. Sounds silly? Well no more silly that the absurdity of someone assuming all I have to do is have a kid and I will instantly become uber-mom.

This is just me. My sisters went on to have kids and loved them and were far better mothers to them than our mother was to us. But I never wanted kids and I saw how giving in to pressure made my mom an abusive mom so I knew that sticking to my guns was the best thing I could do.

Many people who have kids do it because of Society's pressures. You see these so-called parents taking their infants to rock concerts and toddlers to theme parks that are way to advanced for them to enjoy. Then there are those who drag the kids along to bars and other smoke-filled noisy venues or make them sit through inappropriate movies at a late hour. These people have the obligatory kid to satisfy the people around them but don't want to make the sacrifices one has to make when becoming a parent.
There are many parents out there who should be child-free but are not.

I wish more people would be honest and admit parenting is not for them. Misery loves company and I suspect a good number of parents who have bugged me through the years for my being child-free wanted me to be as miserable as they were. I do believe there are good parents out there but I don't believe they are the ones who campaign to make everyone else reproduce.

[Missy Vixen]

242. Welcome to DU, Minervah

>I wish more people would be honest and admit parenting is not for them.<

I wish they would, too.

Thanks for the great post!
Julie

[pitohui]

244. genetic illness, i never saw a reason to pass on bad genes

the world does not suffer from shortage of people, why not let those who have quality genes have the kids?

i don't understand why people who have known genetic illnesses want to pass them on, don't they remember what it was like?

my childhood was so horrible i could never do that to another person