Any astronomy/telescope experts out there?

[Aviation Pro]

I'm looking to go beyond the Wallymart special and get into something a little more sophisticated. I've been to the Meade site (http://www.meade.com), but I don't know my arse from a hole in the ground when it comes to these types of optics.

Any help appreciated.

[tridim]

1. I get the telescope itch every few years.

Then I start looking at them and get depressed because I can't afford a good one. :(

I think the general rule of thumb is to get the widest diameter you can afford.

[Aviation Pro]

2. Thanks, I'm looking for a good starter one....

...which isn't going to break the bank. I looked at the big 16" LX and gasped at the price.

[tridim]

4. Can't help you there..

I just pretend the Hubble is mine. :)

[Aviation Pro]

7. It is yours....

...it's every taxpayer's scope. And the investment has been well worth it.

[Mind_your_head]

3. Why are you even ASKING?

If you want specialized knowledge/info/technology you don't go looking at WALMART?!

Geez.....

[LeftyMom]

5. Do you have a local astronomy enthusiasts group?

If you go out to a star party you can try out other people's telescopes and get some idea of what would work for your needs. They might also offer a used equipment swap meet or something.

[Aviation Pro]

6. Good idea....

...thanks.

[LeftyMom]

13. No problem.

I know the people at ours http://www.svas.org/ are enormously helpful, and do a lot of volunteer work bringing their telescopes to events for kids to get them interested in science.

[bananas]

30. Some useful websites

These aren't about telescopes, but they are useful astronomy sites.

clouds http://www.cleardarksky.com/csk/
satellites http://www.heavens-above.com/
meteors http://leonid.arc.nasa.gov/estimator.html
auroras http://www.spacew.com/

The Clear Dark Sky site can also help you find local astronomy groups.
For example, here are observing sites within 60 miles of Denver:
http://www.cleardarksky.com/cgi-bin/find_chart.py?Mn=telescope%20accessory&type=wmap&radius=60&unit=1&disp=text&title=Charts+within+60mi+of+Denver&olat=39.739&olong=-104.984
Look down the last column, "Comments/Links", you'll see several astronomy groups mentioned.

[TahitiNut]

8. Do you live where the light pollution isn't so bad?

It's getting so bad that there's not many places remaining. A low humidity, low population area is best ... like the deserts of Arizona or the high deserts of eastern Washington. When I lived in eastern Washington, we'd go up to the local observatory which had times available to the public by arrangement. The folks that were really into it belonged to astronomy clubs and had regular access.

I'll never forget sailing back the the U.S. from the Canary Islands in the summer of 1962 (training cruise on the USCG Eagle) under blackout conditions (no exposed lights except running lights) and discovering WHY the Milky Way is so-named. Out in mid-ocean, there's no light pollution and the air was crystal clear. It was AWESOME. I've never been able to describe this thick swath of stars that looked like a stream of Milk across the sky. I never realized how many stars could be seen. I'd been in the country on clear nights and thought it was great. Nothing compared to mid-ocean. Some of us had permission to sleep on deck ... a couple dozen of us lying on our backs just staring at the night sky. Incredible.

I didn't think Hawaii (Oahu) was free enough of light pollution for good viewing, but the island of Moorea in French Polynesia ('Tahiti') is about the best I've seen on land. Truly beautiful ... and it's neat to see the Southern Cross.

[Aviation Pro]

10. As a matter of fact yes....

...about a mile to the northeast is the departure end of Buckley AFB south runway. There's a buffer zone around the airbase and a parking lot that's an almost pristine dark area. The rolling hills obscure the lights to the southwest.

[tburnsten]

16. That sounds incredible

The closest I have come to that was out in the desert in southern utah when I was 15, it was bright enough to see very clearly at night, and I thought the sky was beautiful then. Apparently I've got a new mission to accomplish.

[cherokeeprogressive]

23. Moonless nights on the ocean are something every human should experience at least once.

We used to lay on the top of aircraft at night in the Indian Ocean. Lots of nights during "darken ship" conditions. There is nothing to use as an analogy for how many stars you can see out there.

Once we had a contest to see how many falling stars we could see in an hour. If memory serves me correctly, the number was somewhere over a hundred.

I live at the 7000 foot level outside of LA. With binoculars, the Milky Way looks like a million points of light.

[TahitiNut]

28. I remember thinking it must've been how most of humanity saw the stars until relatively recently.

It's something I'd never considered until then, but the enormity of the skies and the incredible number is something human beings almost never see any more. And that's only in the last hundred years or so ... as we've lit up the surface of the earth and smudged the skies with smog. It makes it far easier to understand the prominence that stars have in our literature and religions ... in all human cultures for as long as history is known.

At the same time, as a Coast Guard cadet, we'd learned to use a sextant and charts to navigate and had plenty of practice on the cruise ... and some of us were conscious of how that connected us to our ancestors. It's hard to think one's self a 'big deal' on nights like that. It's big stuff.

[Ganja Ninja]

38. I was on a sub in the navy.

I remember one night being on the surface as we were coming in to the shipping lanes at the end of a patrol. The sky was so brilliant and phosphorescent plankton were flashing as the water rode up over the hull. Then I turned around and behind us and they were going off like flash bulbs in our wake. The whole scene was beautiful and surreal.

[spag68]

9. I guess no one noticed

They are still asking Canadians to pay a 20% premium, even though the money situation has changed. At those numbers, it's no wonder they don't get many buys from anywhere. CVS had one for 14.95, how about that?

[tkmorris]

11. A couple of years ago I did a ton of research on scopes

I wanted to do pretty much what you are doing. I'll pass along a few of the more informative links I collected.

http://www.excelsis.com/1.0/section.php?sectionid=12&lastsort=&findtext=&cond=&range=&archive=-1&page=3 Telescope reviews. Name the scope and it can be found here.

http://www.rocketroberts.com/astro/first.htm This site offers advice for buying a "first" telescope, past the department store scopes. It is a bit dated, but most of it remains useful in terms of what to look for, and what to expect.

I had a third link that discusses the types of telescopes, and which one is right for you depending upon what you want to see with it, but it doesn't seem to be working.

Do NOT buy anything from a department chain store. You will likely hate the thing, and it may turn you off to astronomy forever.

[Aviation Pro]

14. Thanks, I'll take a look....

...

[Speck Tater]

12. A good starter is around 100-150mm netwonian reflector

Fairly inexpensive, but very good quality for the money.

I've had a couple of these and I was very happy with them, and bought one for my grandkids.
From moon craters, to Jupiter's moon, to Saturn's rings, this is good inexpensive starter.

Here are some examples:

http://www.target.com/Galileo-1000mm-Newtonian-Reflector-Telescope/dp/B00013Q3SY/qid=1216700560/ref=br_1_2/602-1230811-2519836?ie=UTF8&node=111470011&frombrowse=1&pricerange=&index=target&field-browse=111470011&rank=pmrank&rh=p%5F3%3A%24100-%24199&page=1
http://www.target.com/Meade-EQ-ASTR-Equatorial-Refractor-Telescope/dp/B000F6WEAS/qid=1216700488/ref=br_1_11/602-1230811-2519836?ie=UTF8&node=111470011&frombrowse=1&pricerange=&index=target&field-browse=111470011&rank=pmrank&rh=&page=2
http://www.1stopcamera.com/i28376-galileo-fs120dx.html

[Aviation Pro]

15. Thanks, I'll take a look....

....the Dobsonian's look like they need an observatory.

[hfojvt]

18. the one for $249 doesn't look too bad

it's about 5.4 inches. Mine is six inches and you can see some cool stuff with that. One guy I went stargazing with had a neat system. With arrows in his finder scope and a book that showed various objects you could see when you put an arrow on a certain star. Otherwise I spent hours fruitlessly trying to find the ring nebula. I never did find very many Messiers except Andromeda and a globular cluster in Hercules. I spent most of my time on Jupiter and Saturn.

[Up2Late]

17. How much are you looking to spend? Not saying that price is the most important factor...

...but it's the first thing you need to figure out.

Next is what are you hoping to see, because even with the best scope available, you are not going to see the bright colorful nebula or star cluster like you see in the pictures on the web. What you see live in a scope is very different from what you see in a good photo.

Why? Because a good nebula photo is a time exposure photo, live looks different.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

19. I've seen good telescopes on Craigslist.

After you figure out what you want, go there.

Consult with the local astronomy club first--excellent advice.

[Fumesucker]

20. With telescopes it's almost more about the mounting than the optics..

You can't see doodly through even the best optics without a decent mount to hold everything steady.

A decent 6" (150mm) Newtonian reflector is a good starting point if you want to go with a German equatorial mount.

Something like a 10" Newtonian on a Dobsonian mount will show you considerably more deep sky stuff but finding that deep sky stuff can be quite a challenge. Deep sky sights are nothing if not subtle, be prepared to spend considerable time learning to properly see. A good challenge for beginning observers is the Andromeda galaxy without optical aid, until you can do that with some degree of ease a scope isn't going to do you much good.

You're going to want some decent eyepieces and be prepared for sticker shock on those too when you get to the high end, I've seen people with high quality refractors wherein the eyepiece is actually bigger than the objective lens. My own personal cost/performance ratio choice is high quality Plossl eyepieces but your mileage may vary considerably.

Astromart classifieds are a great place to pick up deals on telescopes, eyepieces, binoculars and ancillary equipment. I bought all but one of the scopes I have and all of my eyepieces there at significantly below retail.

http://www.astromart.com/classifieds/

[TreasonousBastard]

21. I ain't an authority, but I have owned and used scopes and am...

a member of our local observatory.

First, DON'T go out spending a bunch of money on a beautiful scope like a 16" Meade Cassegrain until you know you really like hanging out all night on a freezing mountaintop to get yet another picture of the Horse Nebula.

For the first toe in the water, you probably want to get a decent Newtonian scope-- they're the cheapest and they work well. A Newtonian reflector is the one with the eyepeice at the top of the tube, and is the easiest to design. the other type, the Cassegrain, is the one with the eyepiece at the bottom of the tube, and is more convenient to use. (Cassegrains are often optically better than Newtonians, but not by much.)

There's also something called a Dobsonian which is the way to get the bigget mirror you can possibly afford-- it doesn't have a tube or a real mount and is kind of an open frame holding the mirrors with a big box on the bottom you move around to aim the thing. Forget about that for a while.

BTW, telescope makers don't like to tell you that the bigger mirrors, over a foot or so, aren't just hanging around waiting to be plopped into scopes, and tend to be custom made when an order comes in. It could take years to get that 18" or 20" scope, so go to a good star party and you'll find lots of people who prefer to grind their own mirrors. Our observatory has a couple of guys doing that for the new scope.

The diameter of the main mirror determines light collection, with a bigger mirror able to "see" darker stuff deeper in space while the depth of the grind of the mirror and the eyepiece determine magnification-- most astronomical scopes are designed more for light collection than magnification.

So, I'd suggest something like a 6" Newtonian with an equatorial mount to get started.

B&H is a reliable vendor I've dealt with, and here's what they have for Newtonian scopes--

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/shop/3390/Telescope_Optical_Tube_Assemblies_Reflector_Newtonian_Dobsonian_.html

I see good deals on Celestrons in the 6-10" range and that funny looking 3 1/2" inch one looks like the Astroscan Edmund Scientific was selling for years-- at that price I'd grab one just for the hell of it.

Get a few books, find "Sky & Telescope" and "Astronomy" magazines and have a great time out there.

[Aviation Pro]

22. Good advice....

..especially on B&H, they've been servicing my optical needs for years. Since I'm approximately at 5500' MSL in some very dry air a 6" scope seems to be the way to go. Likewise, I'm going to find a club first and ask thousands of questions.

[TreasonousBastard]

26. Ever been to B&H? For some reason...

most of the good photo/optical stores around NYC are owned by orthodox Jews, so you end up talking to some guy with a beard and prayer shawl and very thick accent, about contrast levels in Zeiss lenses. That's OK, but here the store itself is insane.

First thing you notice is the place is crowded like a subway platform at rush hour.

You wander around from department to department ordering stuff and end up with a list you pay for at the checkout. Then, there's this intricate system of baskets on pulleys that magically manages to get all your stuff to the pickup counter. Somehow, you manage to get what you want in all this controlled chaos and make it to the street.

It's an interesting shopping experience.

[Aviation Pro]

34. Yes, I grew up in NYC....

...and now I use their web site. I suppose a lot of people get ticked off that you can't order anything during Shabbos, High Holy Days or Passover, but that's what delayed gratification is all about.

[Frank Cannon]

31. Edmund still sells the Astroscan

http://scientificsonline.com/product.asp?pn=3002001&bhcd2=1216724543



It was my first scope, and I loved it. But I'm not sure what the OP's aims/goals/budget are.

[TreasonousBastard]

33. So they do. I thought Edmund was out of business, but..

it seems they have risen from the grave.

Neat stuff there.

[Frank Cannon]

36. They don't have the big mail-order catalog anymore...

but they still do an online business.

Remember getting those catalogs in the mail as a kid? Like Christmas in July.

[Nevernose]

24. Be careful of the eBay Scope

I don't mean just any scope from ebay, I mean that 6" newtonian that's usually priced too good to be true. There are some good deals out there (my 6" newtonian is from eBay, for instance), but there are a lot of cheaply priced and cheaply made Chinese crapola scopes. There are some good astronomy forums out there with genuinely helpful people -- i used to get advice from people at Bad Astronomy.

Also, invest in a laser calibrator. A properly callibrated telescope is the difference between night and day, if you'll pardon the pun.

My Sister-in-Law's cousin brought a solar scope one weekend when we were all camping at Arches National Park. The ability to look at the sun, track sunspots and flares, really make out details, was astounding. What was even neater was that after a few minutes of sun-gazing, a horde of people began congregating in our campsite. There were well over a dozen total strangers lined up in front of our tents waiting to take a look. We keep meaning to buy one of our own, but finances are never quite right (and his wife thinks it's a giant waste of money, which it is, and that when we go out at night we're really going to the boobie bars, which we're not, but that's really a whole 'nother post).

Meade has great introductory level stuff. I like the prices on their dobsonians, but have never used a Meade personally. If I do purchase a new one, though, it'll probably be a Meade. The level of detail you can make out on deep sky objects is truly beautiful.

[1]

25. my advice. (and i am a complete moron)...

i was interested in looking upon the stars. and i am a tech geek. so when i saw the meade explanations about how their telescopes tracked the stars and whatnot i was so totally "geeked" i bought one.


again, just my experience, but that meade was a monster. it took like a million batteries and light years to set up. and that "tracking" software did nothing for my star watching experience.

if i (and again this is just my experience) if i could do it all over again, i would buy a simple telescope, no fancy electronics, just the biggest lens/aperture you can afford. BIG GLASS!

that is star gazing. not electronics.

you want to point your scope where you want to point your scope. its personal. it not a decision to be made by computers.

[girl gone mad]

27. Does it need to be portable?

What are you primarily hoping to observe, planets or deep sky objects? Do you think you would ever want to get into astrophotography or view with your laptop or will you be strictly visual?

[Lasher]

29. I've got a Meade ETX-90EC

I use it for both astro and terrestrial viewing. It is just what you described you are looking for. Get ready to caugh up $600 just for the basic scope. I've got a Deluxe Field Tripod, Autostar Computer Controller, 2x Barlow Lens, 45° Erecting Prism, Hard Carrying Case, and 2 or three eyepieces. Cost of these extras really mounts up.

http://www.weasner.com/etx/90ec_comments.html

http://www.meade.com/manuals/etx90ec/ch05.html

I bought this ETX a long time ago and I guess Meade has come up with some newer ETX versions. But I know you can still buy the 90EC.

[bpcmxr]

32. You may also want to consider binoculars

I don't know if you've ever looked at the night sky through a good pair of binoculars, but I would definitely suggest doing so before you make your final decision. I've owned reflecting and refracting telescopes as well as a pair of 11x80 Meade binocs. The telescopes were eventually sold, but I'm keeping the binocs. Huge field of vision, and very bright - it's like pointing two 80mm refractors at the sky simultaneously. Observing with both eyes is also very comfortable, especially over long viewing sessions. They're also very portable - I just mount them on a sturdy photo tripod and I'm good to go. For casual amateurs, good binoculars are an excellent alternative worth considering.

And the people here advising you to seek out your local astronomy club are absolutely right. There's nothing like getting even a little time in the field with more experienced folks and some different makes & models of scopes (and binocs too, hopefully) to help you figure out what your needs & tastes are.

Good luck!

bpcmxr

[arcadian]

35. Don't get a telescope, get some really big binoculars.

You won't be able to see anything with a telescope anyway. The cool near Earth stuff(craters on the moon, comets, Mars, Venus) you will be able to see with a really good pair of binoculars, plus you can mount them on a tri-pod or use them manually. Unless you spend a lot of money you won't be able to see the stuff like, distant galaxies with a telescope. They always come out like a fuzzy blur. Plus with binoculars you can check out stuff like high flying aircraft, etc.

[KharmaTrain]

37. You Don't Happen To Live In A High Rise By Chance?

I had a friend who was had several telescopes set up on his balcony about 40 stories up...and most the time he was looking down into the nearby buildings. :rofl: