HUGE fight with my father tonight - and I feel awful

[phylny]

My father is a Republican, but mostly it was from pragmatic necessity, as he lives on Long Island where years ago, you needed to be a registered Republican to get anything done for yourself with the powers that be. He voted for Kerry in the last election, but the last time he visited, and on the phone tonight, he said he's voting for McCain, even though he was/is a Hillary supporter.

The reasons are straight out of a Republican wet dream:

1) "I don't know where all his (Obama's) money is coming from." I explained that it's from small donations, he doesn't believe it.
2) "Those news people crucified Hillary." How is this Obama's fault? He ranted on and on. Dad, Obama and Hillary are practically identical in their views and voting record. How could you go from that to McCain? See point 3.
3) "I don't trust him." I know this is not an issue of race, because we weren't raised that way.
4) "That poor girl (Bristol) is being smeared on TV." Dad, that's not Obama's doing, he said to leave family and children out of it. "He said what he's supposed to say." But Dad, don't you see that they advocate no sex education, so if a teen has sex outside of marriage, they don't know how to prevent pregnancy and the grandparents or the state has to support the child? No answer to that one.
5) "That lovely woman is a mother! She's raising her baby with that disability. She didn't get an abortion!" Oy vey. I'm a mother, too, but I'm certainly not qualified to be president.
6) "I don't hear him (Obama) telling me anything about what he's going to do." Dad, it's on his website, I'll print it and send it to you.
7) Dad, it'll be 4 more years of Bush. "I don't believe that! McCain's different." Dad, he voted with Bush 90% of the time! "Yeah, and Obama probably voted with Bush 85% of the time."

Okay, I made a few errors in this conversation, because I couldn't believe what was coming out of his mouth. Yeah, I called Palin a bimbo, that wasn't right, and I don't easily use that word. Yeah, I told him that the Republicans were praying for rain, and they got a hurricane, but in the wrong week. I was irrational and inflammatory, too, once I realized that he was serious.

I'm sick, partially that he's sucked into the Republican's hateful web, but more so that I lost it, too.

[Arugula Latte]

1. Just tell him his vote is going to get swamped in New York anyway.

He can vote for McCain if he wants, but he'll be pissing into the wind and the pee is going to blow back on him.

[emilyg]

2. Go kiss your Dad

nothing is worth fighting with a parent. Wish mine were still alive.

[Diane R]

4. I absolutely agree with this. Go hug your dad...family is more important than politics.

[madaboutharry]

3. You know, I can't help but think there

is another reason your dad won't vote for Obama. I think we both know what it is.

Let it go. He's family.

[phylny]

7. No, It's not "that"

He knows Obama is not a Muslim, and there was never, ever a hint of racism in our home. Not one bit. Both my parents reared us to be kind, open-minded, and fair to all.

Thanks for your suggestion of letting it go. I'm not angry at him, I'm more angry at myself for engaging in the conversation.

[gateley]

11. Don't be angry with yourself -- this is something that you care a lot about

and it stirs your passions. It's understandable that you would engage in a discussion. But now you know.

[madaboutharry]

15. That's good to hear.

n/t

[gateley]

5. My friendly advice, is to let it go.

Your relationship with your dad is more important than who he votes for. I understand your frustration and horror that your father seems unable to listen to reason, but in the big picture, it's not worth it.

Call him up and apologize if you said anything that insulted him.

I'm saying this from the perspective of someone who has lost her dad and wish I would have been more kind and forgiving when he was still alive.

I'm sorry this happened. :hug:

[phylny]

9. Thanks to you, and all for the kind words.

I wish I could hug him - I'm 9 hours away :)

I'll call him tomorrow. We never, ever argue, and my heart hurts. I'll apologize and let it go.

And, yes, New York will be overwhelmingly for Obama.

[panader0]

6. Let the dust settle

You probably gave him a lot to think about. It'll be OK.

[cobalt1999]

8. My dad was a conservative republican too.

He's dead now. IMHO, don't waste time arguing politics with him, it's not worth it.

[femmedem]

10. Be big and apologize

for the stuff you can honestly apologize for. Say you feel sick because you don't want to fight with him over politics, and because you said things you wish you hadn't said. Look for common ground: you both hate Bush, you both feel passionately about moving the country in a different direction. You can probably share his abhorrence of sexism in the media and acknowledge that there has been sexism against both Sen. Clinton and Gov. Palin. You can empathize with Bristol. If you want to go further, you might ask why he doesn't trust Obama (don't argue when he spouts RW talking points--this is about listening.) After he feels listened to, he might be more receptive to hearing specifics about McCain's economic policies vs. Obama's economic policies, or about why the possibility of a McCain presidency scares you.

But then again, maybe it would escalate again and the apology is the only thing that matters.

I wish you well straightening it out. Everyone says hurtful crap sometimes to the people they love. Your Dad probably feels as sick about it as you do.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

12. Don't feel bad

This is a terrifically emotional issue for everyone.

And, as much as you might not want to believe it, my guess is that your father will not vote for a black man. Otherwise, why his irrational, and false, defenses against Obama?

Sure you lost it. And Palin IS a bimbo. But you're never going to change his mind, and, for what it's worth, your vote will cancel out his.

[Narkos]

13. Been there, know how you feel.

It drives me insane too, but I just don't go there with my folks anymore. Totally agree with all of the above suggestions.

[NeedleCast]

14. Deal With Republican Family Members - A Guide, By NeedleCast

I have a very good relationship with my mom and dad despite the fact that they're conservatives and I'm not...and we are able to openly talk politics.

My dad is a fairly moderate conservative. He can't stand Bush, but here's the deal...at age 62, trying to get him to support a democrat for President makes him have to re-think pretty much 40 years of politics. That's a hard admission to make. He doesn't dislike Obama and I think he's voting for McCain because he's been voting for Republicans for 40 years and change.

First thing is to stay calm and not let it turn into a shouting match, or even an argument. Go in armed with facts, don't try blind-siding or surprising him. I'm still convinced I can get my dad to vote for Obama. I talk to him on the phone about it from time to time, send him articles from sources he can trust (i.e. not blogs, which he doesn't really get).

Example...he goes on about Obama's inexperience and I point out that McCain, who is not a spring chicken, just picked someone with far, far less experience than Obama. It's not something he can really argue. It's a fact. I tell him "Dad, you hate Bush, why would you vote for McCain?" He says the same thing your dad did "He's going to be different!" I point out that McCain voted with Bush 95% of the time. He can't argue that.

Two years ago he changed his registration from Republican to Indy. Slowly but surely he's started to realize that the Republicans from his past are not the Republicans of today.

So go make up with your dad and don't bring up politics for awhile. When you do, be calm, and make your arguments in small bits. Your dad, like most people, is probably a reasonable person and most reasonable people, when presented with facts, will come to accept them, even if it takes awhile.

[Fumesucker]

16. Let it go and make up with your dad..

I got gut punched by a family member that way the other day, I knew better than to argue with them because they define stubborn so I just bit my tongue other than telling them about McGigolo's affair, divorce and remarriage to a very wealthy younger woman and mentioning that he graduated almost at the bottom of his Annapolis class, all verifiable facts.

It's not worth tearing your family apart over politics, in the end their vote is just a drop in the bucket.

I wish you and your dad well, no matter who he votes for.

[orleans]

17. HE'S BEEN WATCHING FAUX NOISE!

break his tv!

then he'll be fine.

[KoKo]

18. Sometimes some of us in these Bush Years...can't believe the families we come from...

Just leave it. If he doesn't have an open mind on your first few points...it's not worth beating your Dad or any realitive into some belief they don't want to accept. We wouldn't like it if they did it to us "agressively" and, in the end, is it worth losing your family over.

So many of us have had your experience going way back. And, we've learned that it's very hard to convince those who have a "closed belief system." Give him a hug...and talk about something else. It's not worth trying to convert people at this point. They all had their choice in 2000, '02, '04 and '06.
If they don't know by now what the issues are and how bad things are...they just aren't gonna learn in time for '08. :-( It is what it is....