NO Corporate Welfare, please let wall street collapse

[MeDeMax]

Tax payers cannot afford 5 new Haliburtons on wall street that suck tax payer funds dry to feed the greedy corporate pigs and their politician friends.

NO MORE Corporate Welfare !

NO bailouts, let them collapse !

Let the lying thieves drown in their own puke !

NO MORE Corporate Welfare !

-

[AllieB]

1. There are lots of average folks working on Wall Street.

If Wall Street collapses, the fat cats will still get away with millions. It's the workers who will get screwed. So I hope for them that Wall Street DOESN'T collapse.

[Romulox]

12. Do you think Wall Street workers spend much time fretting about job losses in Ohio or Michigan?

hmmmm....:shrug:

But don't worry...I'm crying on the inside! :rofl:

[ProdigalJunkMail]

19. do you think impacts on wall street don't affect workers

in Ohio and Michigan? are you really just that ignorant?

sP

[Romulox]

40. Workers in Mi. and Oh. can lose jobs by the thousands while Wall Street enjoys record profits.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

54. and when companies get trashed they cut jobs

you really don't see how all this is intertwined? if not, i feel for you and you myopic view...

sP

[Romulox]

55. The relationship is of the "heads I win, tails you lose" variety.

The prosperity of the American worker has been decoupled from the prosperity of the corporations they work for.

[cliffordu]

58. yep.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

60. this is very true... n/t

[PVnRT]

35. I guess people who don't work factory jobs in Ohio & Michigan are just scum, then.

After all, only they matter.

[Romulox]

38. LOL. Talk about Straw Men! Try arguing that what goes around shouldn't come around to someone else

[JVS]

67. This is dedicated to Wall Street

:nopity:

[PVnRT]

100. Right, the rich will finally get what's coming to them

:eyes:

[JVS]

101. If we're ever in prison, I want you to be my cellmate.

It will be nice to have someone who is willing to submit so easily. Eating your lunch will be fun.

Of course the rich won't suffer much if we don't bail them out, but that's no reason to run to their aid. Quite the contrary in fact.

[PVnRT]

107. So, I support bailouts because I'm not dancing for joy?

I forget how stupid DU can be at times.

[LanternWaste]

44. Well, as part and parcel of the job of many Wall Street workers

"Do you think Wall Street workers spend much time fretting about job losses in Ohio or Michigan?"

Well, as part and parcel of the job of many Wall Street workers is to analyze a present and future local, national and international markets, and as a better financial market is a de facto equivalent of better financial self-interest for the Wall Street worker, I would imagine that yes-- the WS workers do concern themselves with the markets in OH and/or MI.

However, I can see understand why many people would target the WS worker with a lack of concern or empathy, as it better allows us to find a very obvious and very convenient mark of derision to reduce our frustrations.

[Romulox]

56. The same market that has deemed American factory workers superfluous has spoken as to Lehman et al.

"as a better financial market is a de facto equivalent of better financial self-interest for the Wall Street worker"

You run into a brick wall when you ignore the fact that the generic "Wall Street worker" is not immune from the same sorts of calculated analyses. Again, you write a paen to capitalistic efficiency then complain about the workings of the very market you praise? A bit of a disconnect here. :hi:

[leeroysphitz]

112. Then why does Wall Street ALWAYS reward companies that downsize their workforces

with higher valuations?

[LanternWaste]

46. as part and parcel of the job of many Wall Street workers...

"Do you think Wall Street workers spend much time fretting about job losses in Ohio or Michigan?"

Well, as part and parcel of the job of many Wall Street workers is to analyze a present and future local, national and international markets, and as a better financial market is a de facto equivalent of better financial self-interest for the Wall Street worker, I would imagine that yes-- the WS workers do concern themselves with the markets in OH and/or MI.

However, I can see understand why many people would target the WS worker with a lack of concern or empathy, as it better allows us to find a very obvious and very convenient mark of derision to reduce our frustrations.

[AllieB]

47. There are tons of low-wage workers on Wall Street just like in MI and OH.

Clerical, janitors, etc. Your empathy is touching. :eyes:

[Romulox]

57. Solidarity! LOL nt

[1monster]

30. Not just the workers, the small investors and the folks who have scaped every month to make their

life insurance payments.

If AIG goes down the tubes, I am out $14,000 at the minimum. I've been making payments on that policy since I was 29 (with a few years out after I became a stay at home mom for the most part). I'm now 52. I was counting on that money for retirment and/or part of a death benefit for my family.

[Romulox]

59. Capitalism is ALWAYS about winners and losers.

Insurance companies make money by denying claims, for example. I sincerely hope your insurance policy is secure.

[1monster]

94. My insurance agent came around today and I asked him about it. He claims that my

policy is secure even if AIG goes because the insurance group is a separately operated subsiderary of AIG...

I guess we will find out one way or the other eventually.

[Marrah_G]

119. You would not lose your policy

If an insurance company goes under the policies are sold to another company and the contracted terms stay the same.

[Marrah_G]

118. Your insurance policy would not be affected

The Policy would be sold, as is, to another company. The terms of the policy would not change.

[Greyhound]

81. Whatever happens, the workers will get fucked while the perpetrators walk

away with even more $$$, so what else is new?

However, a complete collapse of the financial sector just might open the possibility to an equitable, sane, currency system. Look at what's going on today, the whole market is being propped up so more can get out while there's still time, of course, the sheeple who's $$ is captive to the large MM funds can't get out, they are locked in by law to cover the looters.

But DON'T PANIC, everything is under control, "the adults" are in charge and would never do anything to hurt you.

[Clovis Sangrail]

2. while I agree in sentiment it's not a very wise position

reform... YES.
Collapse, however, is going to affect you, me, and everybody else in a very negative way.
think great depression

If the economy goes to hell in a handbasket the super wealthy from Wall Street are going to be doing just fine while paying the rest of us starvation wages to clean their toilets.

[cali]

3. Ignorant6 and heartless

Wall Street collapses entirely so does Main Street. duh.

[Romulox]

13. LOL. I love how all the steely eyed capitalists have turned into sentimentalists!

"Ignorant6 and heartless"

What are you talking about? Laissez-faire capitalism is the secular religion on the USA. A lot of people on Wall Street are going to have to lose their jobs and retirement for the sake of efficiency (the market is always right!)

How are people who gleefully sacrificed the industrial sector of the US on the altar of the "free market" going to turn around that we need to start weeping for day traders? The market has spoken! :nopity: :silly:

Senator Obama: "I believe in the Free Market. I believe in Capitalism. I believe in Free Trade. I am not worried about us being able to compete anywhere on earth with American workers"

[ProdigalJunkMail]

22. this isn't only about traders

it is about the people that will lose their retirement/savings over this...but hey, you keep telling yourself this is only about 'rich' wall-street types...

sP

[SammyWinstonJack]

24. Obama said that?

:wow: I am not worried about us being able to compete anywhere on earth with the American workers

Really? :silly: Who is us? :shrug: Because the American worker can't compete with slave wages paid by greedy corps in third world countries, just to increase their bottom line.


He was kidding right? Right?

[Romulox]

41. Yep. Here's the Youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTfJmz3GWeE

[MeDeMax]

109. thanks for the link, he was trying to say Americans don't need protectionism to suceed - n/t

[PVnRT]

34. Yes, the collapse of Wall Street will have no effect whatsoever

All of those millionaires will lose their fortunes, and jobs will suddenly flock to Ohio and Michigan. Huzzah!

[Romulox]

42. Record profits for the financials did not bring jobs to Mich and Ohio, either, so...meh. nt

[Donald Ian Rankin]

116. If Wall St collapses, it takes the whole world with it.

Without it, companies who provide employment go bust.

[bdamomma]

27. and also what happens on Wall Street affects other countries too.

it has a ripple affect.

[Lasher]

4. Be careful what you wish for.

Laissez faire policy didn't work too well for Hoover, and it's basically what got us to this point. The invisible hand has been loosed and we are being strangled by it.

[dkf]

5. Well I hope you need no mortgage loans, car loans or credit cards then.

[Egalitariat]

32. And don't hope to retire with a union pension****

nm

[aquart]

6. Ah. Genuine ignorance. Practically a nature study.

Well, how very free market of you. Free markets regulate by death.

[rucky]

7. It's going to suck for us, either way.

But I'd rather it suck without a bailout.

[iamahaingttta]

8. We should nationalize any companies we bailout.

Seriously, I don't want my tax dollars bailing out failed companies any more.
I'm done with "socializing the risk and privatizing the profits."
If we want to save those jobs, we should own the company.
I can walk from my apartment to Wall Street, so many of those workers are my neighbors.
I would rather put them all out of work than hand my tax dollars over to one more greedy, incompetent CEO.
If we nationalize, and hold the criminals accountable, fine, use my tax dollars.
Otherwise, I say let it all collapse, and we have a do-over.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

9. Right on!

I'm tired of the government bailing out failed companies. They should be nationalized. And the financial industry should be strictly regulated so that the gambling that has been going on since Reagan stops.

[Odin2005]

11. I agree. n/t.

[MeDeMax]

25. great quote, I agree with you 100%

iamahaingttta wrote :

"socializing the risk and privatizing the profits"

That perfectly summarizes my position, the tax payers refund all the risks but the Corps keep all the profits.

There is no reason for the government to bailout failing wall street companies. Peoples retirement investments in stocks are covered under "Federal Investment Insurance Corp".

If your nest egg is in the bank locker, the government will make sure that your nest egg is returned to you via FIIC, but that is NO REASON to bailout the bank that housed the locker.

In my humble opinion.

[Orsino]

31. Yep. If it's vital to our economy, nationalize it.

But that would mean Congress' having to work for a living. Are the ones who failed to regulate willing to take on the big job?

[driver8]

49. I agree -- great post. n/t

[redqueen]

51. Heheh... well we are buying a large share of ownership at least.

Why not?

[crickets]

70. Agreed! -nt

[tbyg52]

74. Really. We bail 'em out, we own 'em. Sounds fair to me. nt

[katty]

90. yup, should nationalize-the elephant in the room, and the

free marketeers (free to 'steal' market gang)will scream: Socialism! No!

[racaulk]

96. Hell yes!

I am 100% behind you on this! You should post this as a new OP so I can have the pleasure of recommending your post. :hi:

[Generic Other]

120. If my taxes are to spent this way, I think should now own the company

and the CEO's can take a major pay cut. Otherwise let the vultures within bail out their own companies by refunding all the money they skimmed off the top.

My tax dollars being invested in these irresponsible high rick ventures. I want a return on my investment!

Otherwise call it what it is--WELFARE for the OWNER class. Another screw you to the rest of us.

[Chisox08]

121. I agree 100%

The CEO's can work for minimum wage because if its good enough for us its good enough for them.

[MeDeMax]

123. I agree 110%

[LeftishBrit]

10. But won't that bring everyone else down too?

When Wall Street collapsed in 1929, it started the Great Depression, which destroyed the lives of rich and poor alike.

I believe in greatly increased government regulation of the banks as a condition for bailout; but not in just letting them collapse.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

14. yes, but there are people,

as evidenced by the OP, on this board who wish for nothing short of complete economic collapse in this country, despite the fact that it would lead to untold misery for millions here and potentially billions around the world...

it's that 'fuck everybody' mentality...

sP

[cali]

15. it's just secular end-timers. Just as fucking sick as their religious

counterparts. I despise them all.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

17. it is sad that people that are supposed to be FOR people

are so willing to let everyone drown to punish a few...

sP

[Dr. Strange]

87. Secular end-timers

What a perfect description!

:thumbsup:

[LeftishBrit]

113. Good term - hadn't thought of it like that...

but there is definitely something in common between the religious end-timers, and those who believe on a more secular level that we must so-to-speak kill the patients to save them!

[bdamomma]

28. and they believe in that mentality

fuck everyone else, it is that religious fundi mentality these people are sick bastards!!!

[ColoradoMagician]

16. Wouldn't that destroy all of the 401Ks that normal people have?

We have to think about the 'little guy'.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

18. yep...

fuck 'em all according to the OP

sP

[yellowdogintexas]

62. yes, like me. not to mention minor stockholders, people who just did

a little investing.

Three years ago, I inherited 75 shares of AIG from an aunt who was an employee. This was her employee stock option she was allowed to purchase in increments. She had 525 shares when she died, split 7 ways. When she died it was $75 a share. When the estate was settled it was sitting around $35-40 range. It stayed in that neighborhood for a long time, and I really thought it had stabilized. Now I didn't sell it because I didn't want to take the tax hit, and I am a long term kind of investor and know that these things cycle up and down.

But if you look at the value when I acquired it, I lost around $3K yesterday, on this one item; But since I don't have a crystal ball, I couldn't know this. The consolation here is I did not shell out my own money to buy this stock.

I have two 401K accounts; one I have had for 19 years (worked at this company for nearly 8 years, and it had enough in it that I could just leave it there instead of rolling it to another one). They have done well enough and my original contributions are still doubled by the combination of employer add in and earnings, even after recent events. However, it is a very scary situation. I looked at it today on my Yahoo portfolio profiler (a fun tool) as a reference tool. I probably will not look at it again for another month; it is too scary to look at it every day, and I can't cash it in because of the tax hit I would have to take.

So there are lots of small folks out there who are having to sit tight and hope this thing corrects itself and stabilizes before I am totally retired.

[uncle ray]

68. you gambled.

you lost. because you didn't want to pay taxes on free money.

"people" talk about their 401k like it's one big fund that everybody's money goes into, and are guaranteed a return. when you signed up for your particular investments, you chose what risk you would expose yourself to. you apparantly chose fairly high risk investments. my free money(i don't contribute to my 401k, i only have invested my employers profit sharing)is in a low yield guaranteed interest account. i'm supposed to feel sorry for the people who were enticed by the double digit returns in the good years, the people who laughed at us suckers who settled for a guaranteed 3.5%? what is stopping you from choosing less risky investments?

i'm no economic genius, but i learned early on not to trust my "friend" who says he can take my money to Vegas and promise he can double it for me.

[yellowdogintexas]

73. my 401 K portfolios are actually balanced fairly well with low medium and high risk

items. Everything is decreasing right now, which is not surprising.

The other thing was a gift. I did not buy that stock.

I have not had the good fortune to work for a company that offers a choice between the company's profit sharing vs 401K, or even has a profit sharing reward annually. I always take the 401K because of the employer contributions, and the reduction in taxable income, and I put back enough from each check to get the absolute maximum the employer will contribute; I say take them for all they will give me.

As I said, the drop in mine has not even gotten close to the actual money I put in it. I am not sure it has even gotten to the employer contributions yet, just chipped away at the ups and downs of the interest earned on both sets of contributions over a very long time frame

Besides you don't know what I have done with other money. There are other funds, inheritances, etc. that are not in the 401K or stocks or anything else. This is just one part, one should always have a nice piece of liquid asset that is readily available which despite the low annual yield is steady.

[Thothmes]

125. Not to mention most union pension funds.

[RollWithIt]

20. Ya, lets bankrupt America... you do realize you're talking about peoples retirements??

Dumbest post of the day.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

21. it's only 0930 on the east coast

let's give it a while...but this one certainly has the markings of 'Dumbass-Post-O-The-Day'

sP

[redqueen]

52. ...

:thumbsup:

[AllieB]

53. It also has the markings of 'flamefest of the day'.

I can't believe the ignorance of the OP. This is the typical 'ends justifying the means' BS that fundies and fascists ascribe to. Does he realize if you take down Wall Street, Main Street will fall even farther down? The fat cats will have their million-dollar Golden parachutes. The little guy will have no retirement left.

[Chan790]

23. Um...no.

Such goes the market, so goes people's 401K, investments, pensions, savings, and the economy. I'm as economically-liberal as one can get but there is a difference between letting the bourgeois fatcats wallow in the shit of their own making and fucking the rest of us to wallow along side of them.

No...the answer is no more corporate welfare that isn't attached to criminal investigations and potentially criminal charges. The answer is the re-establishment of regulations to keep the bastards in line and to allow the government to go after the personal assets of the people responsible.

[Dorian Gray]

26. So you are hoping for the

destruction of many middle class worker's retirement, then?

Wow. That's just unspeakable.

[Wednesdays]

29. Instead of expending energy hoping for the market to collapse

We should be figuring out what to do if it does collapse. That's the rational, sensible thing to do.

Merely hoping for a collapse is an irresponsible attitude, IMO.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

33. Begging For Innocent People To Suffer Is Not Very Becoming Of A Democrat.

In fact, it is quite disgusting, ignorant, selfish and moronic.

[bvar22]

64. OTOH, facing REALITY may be the kindest approach.

The money is ALREADY gone.
There is NOTHING LEFT with which to "Bail Out" anyone.
The US Is $10 Trillion in debt.

Are you willing to tax your children and their children to bail out our broken system,

OR

Let it fail NOW. Bite the bullet, and build a better system.

I personally don't feel that it is moral to pass on the costs of OUR "Bailout" to our children.
They will need their money.

[Greyhound]

85. Another hit and run, how typical.

I'm rather surprised that there have not been more people pointing this out.

The kool-aid drinkers seem to missed the fact that it has already collapsed and delaying the inevitable just hurts worse the longer you put it off. Our private monetary system is insane, the idea that turning over the issuance of currency to profit motivated men ensures that they will extract as much of our wealth as they can and that is somehow good for the rest of us.
:crazy:

[fla nocount]

36. Your grandchildren, my grandchildren would applaud this.

The unborn are saddled with enough of this generations debt as it is.

[DumptyHumpty]

37. It is collapsing by itself.

McCain now goes ape over "greed." Who supports that greed, Senator?

Now if only the democrats will get some cajones and go after Palin. They have no choice.

[OnionPatch]

39. In theory, it sounds good, but

a lot of average, middle-class people have their retirement invested in Wall Street.

[DumptyHumpty]

43. If that has to happen, so be it.

We have to wake Americans with shock and awe, so be it.

This is war.

[BulletproofLandshark]

77. Are you on the right site?

This post has "agent provocateur" written all over it.

[fla nocount]

97. Yeh, the Freeps wouldn't have him...too far left.

Young and not afraid to start all over and anti-corporate/globalist to boot.

[Odin2005]

124. Go away you anarchist distruptor.

Typical wannabe "rebel" that thinks everyone will follow him once "the system" crashes and burns. :eyes:

[redqueen]

45. You do know that people work for those corporations, right?

No more executive pigs sucking up far more than they earn... but let's let people keep their jobs, eh?

[DumptyHumpty]

48. People shouldn't work for corporations.

If they can help it.

[redqueen]

50. Are you willing to support them while they find other employment? (nt)

[AllieB]

72. So where should they work?

There are only so many public sector jobs. You're not thinking rationally.

[Wednesdays]

78. I'm with DumptyHumpty on that point

I would rather go hungry than serve the corporate masters. There are a lot of jobs outside the public sector that don't involve corporations. "Mom & Pop businesses" and entrepreneurship are just a couple of ways, just off the top of my head.

Having said that, DumptyHumpty's assertion that "this is war" is suspicious.

[AllieB]

102. I worked for a start up that was acquired by a large corporation.

Since the corporation is European, they are considered good corporate citizens (I even have a pension plan, in addition to my 401K, which is unheard of in the US).

I think that people who critize others for their career path are either young and naive, or judgemental. Corporations, big and small, are going to exist period and are vital to the health of the economy.

[MindMatter]

61. When a bunch of bankers have secret meeting on Sunday with Bush officials, have the Vaseline ready

Nothing good comes from that. They will insist that there is no bailout, but you can bet about 4 months from now, that the Bush people found a way to send billions of dollars to their friends.

It is the Shock Doctrine at work every day. It never stops.

[Nihil]

65. I'd like to know why that isn't insider trading?

Or is this only a crime when the little kids do it?
:shrug:

[Wednesdays]

79. It's also a crime when Martha Stewart does it, too

However, IOKIYAR. :eyes:

[lumberjack_jeff]

76. Your instincts serve you well.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/16/54230/2116/741/600308

It turns out that the banks who are buying the investment companies (such as BoA's purchase of Merril-Lynch) are getting a little something to sweeten the pot. Prior to yesterday, it was illegal for banks (being fdic insured) to use depositors money to operate their investment divisions. The fed has now waived that law. Between now and January 20th, Banks can use your deposits to prop up bad investments. On January 20th, many of those banks will fail, and taxpayers will bail out the depositors.

It's Bush's inaugural gift to Obama.

[MindMatter]

80. ARE YOU SERIOUS? Janu-freaking-ary 20?

That is inauguration day. Talking about dumping the problem on the next guy. This is about as cynical as it can get.

[Naturyl]

63. Welfare for the poor FIRST

If corporations want a handout, the poor and homeless need to be helped first.

"Welfare" is not a bad word. But people IN NEED should be helped before people (corporations) who aren't even people.

[bvar22]

66. A question for those here supporting a "BailOut":

Where do you propose we get the money?

The US is $10 Trillion in debt.

The ONLY place to get money for a BailOut is from our children.

Should our children be forced to pay for our bailout of a broken system?

[SweetieD]

69. I wish it was that simple. Unfortunately, its not. nt

[brazos121200]

71. I support letting the economy implode for this reason:

A general collapse will only help Obama and the Democrats in November. In all likelyhood, if this should happen, Obama will be elected by a large margin and the Democrats will win vastly increased majorities in both houses of Congress. Then REAL reforn and restructuring can occur in the economic sector. Contrast this with no economic collapse and a possible McCain victory and probable continuation of marginal Democratic control of Congress with the same small majorities they have now. I would prefer to bite the bullet for several months, until January, and have real solutions to our problems, rather than provide taxpayer funded temporary relief now and maintain the status quo.

[Dreamer Tatum]

82. Great, then bite the bullet yourself

Your first sentence is absolute despicable horseshit.

People losing their shirts will score political points. Sick.

[yodoobo]

75. pretty much everyones retirement is tied up on Wallstreet

Either directly or indirectly.

If you have a pension, its invested for you in wallstreet.

If you have a 401k, then you invest it directly in wallstreet.

Government pensions and SSN aren't of course, however if Wallstreet collapses, the resulting hyper inflation will render that pension and ss worthless, not to mention your weekly paycheck.

Unfortunately, a collapse in Wallstreet will mean that we are at poverty level.

Fortunately, though, cheerleading its demise, or ir rise, is just idle web forum banter that has no effect other than giving us something to talk and occupy a little bit of bandwidth.

What will happen, will happen.

[nadinbrzezinski]

83. Yeah lets do that, and watch your local economy also go down the proverbial drain

people cannot connect dots it seems

Though what we truly need is a MIXED economy

Go to wiki to read on that and buy a clue while you are at it

[MeDeMax]

122. the local economy is going down the drain

or haven't you noticed ?

With the bailouts, they will let the "BIG" investors cash out at favorable terms and leave the rotting carcass for the little guys.


-

[Sheets of Easter]

84. Yeah! Watch it burn! There's no way it could affect us!!!

:eyes:

[Mesteryo]

86. yeah great idea, let the economy fall apart...

If Wall Street falls apart and businesses shut down we'll have massive unemployment and a huge depression. It'd set us back 40-50 years and create total misery. You have a pretty cynical approach to this mess.

We need change and rational collective thinking. Exactly what Obama offers.

[riverdeep]

88. So the question is, should we prop up what is basically

an unsustainable system because people at the bottom will be hurt more, or do we let it collapse and let a new, healthier system take its eventual place?

Bad things are going to happen both ways. It depends really on whether the long term is more important to you or the short term. In principle, what we are doing is out and out corporate welfare. No one is bailing out the family that now lives in their car. Those people are considered moral failures by people like Glen Beck.

[Mesteryo]

93. what alternative system do you offer?

Don't let our economic system collapse without having a system to fall back on. If it falls into anarchy after Bush's power centralization we'll likely become a fascist dictatorship like Germany after their pre-WW2 Depression

[riverdeep]

105. I'm for limited, sensible regulation of the market.

What I'm saying is that the constant buoying of financial institutions actually can just prolong the agony. The problems that have developed, homes being overinflated in value for example have to work themselves out. There is an equilibrium that the market seeks, and interfering with that can make things worse. The problems that need addressing never get addressed. I have no idea how people got from that to thinking I'm advocating for communism.

The essential component linking all of the economic problems whether it be the sub prime mess or credit debt or predatory lending or this, is the total lack of oversight. Obama addressed Wall Street a while back telling them that while some people will make out like bandits in the deregulated environment, Wall Street as a whole would be hurt. He was right. To much regulation chokes and stifles, too little leads to a breakdown in trust and accountability. We've had too much of the latter and need the some of the former.

[Mari3333]

89. I lost a LOT in my retirement funds because of this

a lot of retirees are losing their incomes. My financial advisor called me today and said hold on tight. Its going to be a rough ride for a while. I lost a lot. I was hoping to leave much of it for my kids, but thanks to Bush I guess I wont be able to.

[AllieB]

103. Me too, Mari.

Thankfully, I have 20+ years until retirement. People close to retirement age must be jonesing! :scared:

[Missy Vixen]

91. You know, I've been lurking for three weeks now

I can't remain silent any longer.

Do you KNOW how many millions of working people will lose their retirement in this? I suppose that's not a big deal. After all, you'll have brought about the utopia you all believe would be SO much more effective than the capitalist system. At the same time, those who keep posting the above bullshit are only taking food out of the mouths of family and friends who worked hard for it.

It's not those at the top of the pile that suffer when this kind of crap goes down. It's the working people. It always has been, and it always will be. Those people keep the economy moving, sluggish as it might be.

There is nowhere to hide.

>Let the lying thieves drown in their own puke !<

I suppose you'll be happy to see your friends and neighbors suffering the same fate, too, won't you?
Julie

[harun]

95. Millions?

If more than 10 people had ALL their retirement in the few companies that have folded I would be surprised.

If people had enough money to put in to retirement funds I don't see how they could be suffering. What about the MILLIONS of people living in the United States who have never been able to afford saving even a dollar in to a retirement account and never will be able to afford that. Those are the real people who are suffering.

[Mesteryo]

98. that's an exaggeration too...

There are alot of "regular" people out there with retirement funds dependent on the financial markets. Secondly, insurance rates and healthcare are another thing dependent on financial investment. If the system collapses millions would lose insurance.

[nadinbrzezinski]

99. And you'd be wrong...

On never mind... I am amazed at how clueless people are

What do you think happens to the accounts YOU TWEET?

[harun]

114. Tweet?

What accounts are you even talking about? Lehman Brothers accounts with other institutions? Peoples 401k's in general? Peoples accounts with Lehman Brothers? All investment accounts in general?

(Note: It is a rhetorical question, I don't expect someone who has resorted to name calling to actually be able to figure this one out)

[harun]

92. I am for Corporate Responsibility. They made this bed and they shall sleep in it (n/t)

[Missy Vixen]

104. Oh, yeah. "Corporate responsibility".

Just as long as the little people get screwed and you get your unsustainable utopia, everything's great, isn't it? You should know by now that those with the gold are not going to suffer. It's those who worked their asses off for the money sitting in banks and brokerages around the country.

Does it occur to you that this will be worse than any of us can possibly imagine? "They made this bed and they shall sleep in it"? Jesus. In other words, those who managed to eke out some retirement savings are as responsible as the sons of bitches who've looted our financial system? Where do you get your reasoning?

It's amazing to me the sheer numbers of those who post on this site who seem to have either never left their parents' basement, or have no frickin' clue about what's going to happen next. You might want to read up on the Great Depression if you have any additional questions.

Julie

[JVS]

106. People advocating bailouts probably shouldn't go finger-pointing about unsustainable utopias

This whole situation demonstrates unsustainability, and not on the part of the utopias.

If we're going to be stuck propping up a bunch of BS, we should at least have good BS.

[tannybogus]

108. If the stock market collapses the banks will collapse.

People will cause runs on everything. It sounds good in theory, but I remember picture of lots of average people out on the streets during the depression. It would also start a possible global collapse. If you can selectively bring down what you what and there were no connections, then it would be easier. However, you are in the building you are trying to bring the roof down on. It's like the Pentagon's claims for smart bombs. They really don't just take out the one thing.They take out the wrong thing or too much.

[Greyhound]

110. True.

A reasonable response might be to recognize the root cause and take control, but that will never happen.

How about this? No bailout, but we will buy the paper at a very healthy discount (just enough to let the bank stay open) and keep as many people in the homes as possible now, and control the influx and price of the foreclosed houses? The Government ends up holding the excess supply of houses, that can be used in any number ways to alleviate some of our more pressing societal issues, homelessness being among the top.
:shrug:

[codjh9]

111. Yeah? What about the millions of us whose retirements/IRAs/life savings (or at

least a fair portion of) are in the f-ing stock market? To hell with all of us too? Sure, I have no sympathy for the greedy assholes who are at fault here, but the rest of us were just trying to make more than 3% on savings accts. - how many times did I read that I 'had' to do that or I'd never have enough to retire? Well, turns out they were full of shit if anything significant happened.

[Duer 157099]

115. I say take the money the govt would use for bailout

and put that into Social Security, Medicare (and other health plans) etc, so that when everyone loses their pensions and health insurance, AT LEAST there will be some social safety nets that still work!!

But instead that $$ will be thrown away, propping up the failing companies just long enough for the big cats to escape with little harm.

End result will be pensions will be lost AND no social safety nets for John Q. Public who footed the whole bill.

[MeDeMax]

117. people won't lose their pensions

just because a few investment banks went under.

Your stock portfolio is insured under FIIC (similar to FDIC for investments) from your brokerage going under.


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