The draconian measures make sense now, Homeland Security, Blackwater, Patriot Act etc.

[arcadian]

They fear a revolt when the system completely collapses. A collapse that by and far is looking more and more manufactured everyday. Concentrate all the wealth, smash the system, rebuild it in some kind of dystopian anti-New Deal fashion. We've been had folks. The corporatists are waging war against the American system and they are traitors. They destroyed the manufacturing base, which is a destruction of the unions and the labor movement, a key component of the left. They have destroyed any industry regulation which translates as wholesale warfare against the environment and the consumer. They have destroyed our education system and taken over the media and the airwaves which makes it easier to govern a populace whose only concerns are Britney Spears and NASCAR. They have created a war against an undefined enemy in a far off land and use terrorism as a trump card to do anything they want, something straight out of George Orwell's '1984'. They have bought all of our elected officials. They own Congress, the Supreme Court and the Whitehouse. If you think you are living in a "free" country, you are sorely mistaken. We've been duped folks. We are all slaves. Bought sold and paid for by Wal-Mart, Starbucks, Coke-Cola, Disney, Genral Electric, Phillip Morris, Halliburton etc.

[grannie4peace]

1. you are correct!

[lapfog_1]

2. DING! k&r Shock Doctrine - n/t

[shanti]

10. exactly

we DU'ers have known this from the get-go. they didn't set up the camps and all the other "measures" for nothing! my pensioned retirement is planned for 2011, but i fear i will never see it...

who ever thought that our once proud and mighty country would be brought to its knees by its own?

[bdamomma]

18. the enemy is within

totally true.

[OneGrassRoot]

99. I agree, but please give me hope as to how Obama and Biden...

can shift this?

It seems so much bigger than elections. As though the elections are just for our entertainment.

Had this collapse remained on the brink, I believe Obama could have averted it...somehow. With it here, I'm lost as to how the tide can be turned?

A general feeling of goodwill with an Obama Presidency, around the world, will go a long way, but can it turn things around?

Or, is our only hope that he will eventually correct the course for the sake of our children, and we are doomed?

[bdamomma]

17. we have to rise to the occasion.

[Fridays Child]

3. Even freepturds and FoxNoise viewers (but I repeat myself) need income.

They're no better off than the rest of us. It just makes me marvel at the depth of their group psychosis that they would still cling to the belief that any repuke could, or would, save them from this mess.

[libertypirate]

4. Continuity of Government /nt

[Beam Me Up]

31. Yep. COG -- it isn't just for mechanics any more.

http://tinyurl.com/cogextension

[old mark]

5. Wait till Palin becomes President.

You ain't seen nothin' yet.

mark

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

57. I'd be targeting local conservative sympathisers!

If a president Palin started pushing a fundieocracy agenda I'd be torching the offices of organizations like the Heritage Foundation, the Reactionary ("Traditional") Values Coalition and the American Fascist ("Family") Association.

[NBachers]

77. So, uh, where's the Hate Radio station

in your community?



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1n03a7cLf0M

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

81. Any place that broadcasts "Savage Nation" I guess. N.T.

[Uncle Joe]

6. I believe you have nailed the situation, arcadian,

along with prisons for profit, medical care for profit, it all spells corporate supremacy and a new age of indentured servitude at best for the American People.

Thanks for the thread.

[knitter4democracy]

7. Worse. The Handmaid's Tale.

That book gave me nightmares for weeks, it was so close to the truth of what's happening today.

You've nailed it. That's exactly what they're planning.

[nichomachus]

8. This was the plan all along -- Greg Palast warned us

in "The Best Democracy Money Can Buy." This whole economic meltdown was planned. They have a playbook. And one chapter in the playbook is how to deal with the civil uprising that will inevitably occur.

[StClone]

66. And it was a planned demolition

There is no way that all this crap wars, debt, economic meltdown could have occurred without the end timers mentality of destroying all so the Liberals couldn't have some social programs.

[Marsala]

96. Well, if that's true, you would think they would have timed it a little better

Instead, they've just turned a terrifyingly close election into a golden opportunity for Obama to become the second FDR with an Even Newer Deal.

[Nihil]

104. No, I don't think so.

Your suggestion would have been valid if America had an objective, reliable
and trustworthy mass media to report the events to the general public.
Instead, it has a fully-owned subsidiary to broadcast the "official truth"
to one & all.

Your suggestion would have been valid if America had a transparent electoral
system (complete with truly independent monitors) so that every valid citizen
had a vote.
Instead, you have Diebold (et al), electoral roll manipulation and a supreme
court to provide the facade of "democracy" that Robert Mugabe can only dream
about.

Your suggestion would have been valid if America was a democracy rather
than an oligarchy with two front organisations.
Instead, the best that an Obama/Biden win will get is that people will sigh
with relief at having dodged the bullet of overt theocratic fascism without
noticing that that dodge put them back in the cage with the same people in
charge as before (just different spokespersons).

And all of these skip innocently over the grab-bag of dirty tricks that the
powers that be have used over the years to ensure that the boat doesn't get
rocked too much.

So no, I don't think they could have timed it better at all.

[femrap]

121. I tend to agree with you,

Nihil. The Elections are now nothing but entertainment/distractions/circuses. However, there might be good news resulting from this financial collapse we are seeing....maybe Marx was right and Capitalism contains the seeds of its own destruction.

The Greed has reached its ultimate end. The Empire is collapsing...this could be a good thing in the long run...but it certainly will be very ugly in the short run.

Where will it be safe to ride out the 'short run?' Costa Rica? Any ideas?

[Nihil]

142. Your guess is as good as mine ..

> Where will it be safe to ride out the 'short run'?

:shrug:

I have no suggestions other than "somewhere with people that
you care about" and "reduce the amount you rely on the outside
world". (On the other hand, if one is not careful this can
devolve into some kind of survivalist militia fantasy rather
than a practical plan for 'ordinary people' ...)

> it certainly will be very ugly in the short run

Unfortunately, I think you may be right.

[femrap]

145. I'm just hoping we can

get thru October w/o a bad 'surprise.'

I've downsized, no debt....but I am still dependent on the grid.

Take care.

[MuseRider]

9. It has been coming

for a long time, these guys have finished us.

Not that I don't hope for a solution but I certainly am not hanging my life on that hope.

Been watching it happen, many of us have, but once it started there was really no way for us to stop it. Still we try we will always try.

[bdamomma]

19. in another country these thugs would have been long gone.

sometimes the tree of liberty lives on the blood of tyrants and patriots.

[MuseRider]

23. Do you think

anyone kept a cutting of that tree? We could sure use another one since the old one has apparently died. Do you know anyone who needs to be bled? lol all I can think of is "FEED ME SEYMOUR!"

Talking to walls of busy, that is what I have been calling it for years. Of course there is apathy but that can change when one is hurt bad enough but every little hurt is making people who don't want to hear it just more busy and less likely to even try.

My solution, although it is probably not going to hold up much longer, has been to focus hard on something you feel is very important and be happy with each little advance. Sadly those advances are going to be reversed if people do not wake up and soon.

I am really afraid of the future, mostly for the young people.

[bdamomma]

24. the young people deserve better than this.

you know it took one person to start the Civl Rights movement one person who did not give up her seat, all it takes is for one person to get the ball rolling, or will that ball and whatever else roll over us.

it really depends how much a person wants their country back, be it peacefully or confrontation. But confrontation has its drawbacks but it will be just.

[Hannah Bell]

97. no, rosa parks didn't just spontaneously refuse to move. she had well-organised

(and funded, incidentally) support behind her, and years of activism under her belt. the civil rights movement began long before rosa, too.

one person does nothing. that individualistic myth is the reason we're in the pickle we are.

[90-percent]

11. Slaves?

I think this term is stressful to my beautiful mind. I find it much more acceptable to use the word "serf". when describing the non-rich 99% of American citizens.

We are in the midst of a new feudal system, after all, and the term fits and doesn't make me weep openly as much.

-90% Jimmy

PS - I'm more preoccupied with NHRA than NASCAR, and Obama actually met Big Daddy Don Garlits last week in Virginia. Garlits is officially the number one drag racer of all time and deserves the title. In spite of John Force, who came in second. Snake and Shirley were also up there, as one would expect.

[bobthedrummer]

12. Political mind control with extreme sanctions against dissenters-that's the BFEE's HOMELAND (tm).

[janet118]

13. Mission Accomplished!!! n/t

[Atman]

14. "A collapse that by and far is looking more and more manufactured everyday."

Bing-fucking-O. All one has to do is check back to statements coming out of BushCo from the very beginning. The "drown it in bathtub" comment by Norquist, and the interviews in which they were saying that sometimes it takes catastrophic pain to bring about real societal changes. When you go back before the war distraction, before terra-terra-terra, before there was anything but an oft-vacation Crawford pinhead keeping the seat warm, this is what the talked about. This is the vision they were laying out for the country. They weren't hiding it. We just weren't listening.

Once again, Bush and Company get what they want and no one does anything to stop them, or punish them after the fact.

.

[TornadoTN]

22. It makes sense - but this close to the election?

Obama is a threat to these people - he promises market reform. Not just a slogan either, I believe he means it.

Why risk a total economic disaster that could hand the election to your single biggest threat? Are they that confident that they can steal the election or that wedge and distraction issues will rule the day?

That's the only thing that doesn't add up for me - otherwise you are spot on.

[Raksha]

44. Because they didn't plan for the big meltdown to happen NOW.

Re Why risk a total economic disaster that could hand the election to your single biggest threat? Are they that confident that they can steal the election or that wedge and distraction issues will rule the day?

I agree with all the other points expressed in the OP, with this one exception. And even that isn't my own opinion, but an observation someone made on DU yesterday. I wish I could remember who it was, so I could give that person credit for his or her astuteness.

The big meltdown wasn't supposed to happen now, but a few years down the line. They believed they could keep the ILLUSION of a viable economy going for another few years, or until after the election anyway. That was their ONE big miscalculation. They were hoping the major perps would have time to relocate to Dubai or Paraguay or wherever, and that they could figure out yet another way of blaming the Democrats for their systematic destruction of the economy.

Looks like it didn't work out that way.

[bbgrunt]

70. well, I don't think they care about the election anyway--

you know they have plans. I get the feeling that since their plans may involve something where no election is held, they don't really care about the timing of the financial meltdown

[Dangerously Amused]

79. Agreed. They got their in 8 years of screwing the treasury and lining their pockets,

...what do they care now? They and their families will retire someplace warm and sunny far, far away from here where their beautiful minds don't have to contend with the everyday atrocities they have inflicted upon the rest of us. They will have warm sunny skies, plenty of food, clean water, toys to keep them entertained and all the expert healthcare they need for the rest of their comfortable days. Oh, and armed guards in case one of us tries to burst their happy bubble. It's good to be king.

[CrispyQ]

114. There is a poll out there, sorry no link, but it was within the past couple of weeks,

that states that a significant majority of Americans fear some kind of attack on American soil in the next several weeks.

I vacillate. On the one hand I think that Cheney didn't amass all this power in the executive to simply hand it over to someone else, especially a dem. On the other hand, the Treasury is looted, the country is bankrupt. ???

Have Americans reached a point of complacency that they would accept canceled elections "for the sake of national security?" Since a minority of Americans even vote, it makes you wonder.

[femrap]

126. Don't forget about the

'October Surprise.' This might give them what they really want...martial law.

[frogcycle]

61. what election?

[trthnd4jstc]

67. I think that there desire to destroy the system has had the unintended consequence of happening

Sooner than they had planned. Grover Norquist is a TRAITOR. Many of the NeoCons are Traitors. I hate to say this, everyone that has bought into the idea that it was necessary to outsource all of the middle class paying jobs, Traitors. Why is there still a tax loophole giving a tax break for outsourcing a business. Now that the Democrats are in control of the House, why have they not removed this tax break? It seems they wish to destroy the economy also, otherwise they would have gotten rid of it, or at least fought against it. I do not understand why Nancy Pelosi refuses to start impeachment against the Traitors. What is going on that the Constitution, the Economy, the Future, is not something that the Democrats are fighting night and day in the House and Senate about right now? Where is the fight? Where is the continual outrage against the Treason that the Republicans have commited against the rest of us?

[Atman]

76. "What election?" is right. And what do you think FISA and all the signing statements were about?

BushCo, the administration (as opposed to George W. Bush, the puppet president), never intended for another for or eight years. They didn't need them. They've done exceedingly well for themselves. Part of our problem is US, being mere peons who don't make a brazillion dollars.

The uber rich running the joint -- hell, running everything, -- have absolutely no concept of what is going on the world of "real people" and the very heartland they claim to embrace. It's pure bullshit.

Why do you think BushCo has been so resistant to raise taxes during wartime, while their cronies have received insane no-bid contracts and their war profits go through the roof? They can afford not to care. They feathered their nests with OUR money, they raided the treasury and bled off every last cent they could get their slimy mitts on because they were planning ahead. You gotta give 'em credit, Republicans tend to be patient. Evil and patient. It's a bad combination.

They figured out that they had to get the courts in line (Gonzalez has never even answered a subpoena), get the media in line (they simply bought 'em all), pay off everyone possible and silence the rest. From there, it was easy. Everyone important is bought and paid for. Bush used his unitary powers, unfettered and unchallenged even under a Democratic legislative branch, to make sure that he and his, will never suffer, no matter how long this economic meltdown lasts.

That's why he's been so opposed to taxing the wealthy. The dividends they've earned, the villages they've pillaged, it's all been to build their buffer when the "underclass" revolts. They'll be safe behind they're compound walls, with their wholly owned media subsidiaries tell us that everything is all right.

.

[bbgrunt]

68. and yet so many refuse to even consider MIHOP or LIHOP

I sure hope they are beginning to see it now.

[SammyWinstonJack]

119. Not so incompetent after all, are they?

:evilgrin:

[rndmprsn]

15. we've never really been free since the corporatists took over, until now we've liked our cage...

[adigal]

16. I don't think this was planned - the corporatists are

feeling the pain now, too. That was never in the plan. I think it got away from them.

[TornadoTN]

21. They just kept getting greedier and greedier

Eventually, their greed was their own undoing - that is if we can get someone in office that will hold the feet to the fire and take an honest approach to the marketplace voodoo that this country is functioning under.

[bbgrunt]

72. well, the corporations are just another tool to achieve their end.......and I

doubt too many of them will end up suffering to the same extent as the common working man and woman.

[Hannah Bell]

82. some are, some aren't.

[Greyhound]

88. The Gatekeepers, those who thought they were in the club because they have (had?) money, are feeling

the pain. The true parasitic rulers are long gone, they've been shifting to real assets and commodities for 3 - 4 years now and have been raking in so much they have to hire assistant rakers to keep up. Don't worry though, they'll be back in the next few years to buy up the remnants for pennies on the dollar.

Welcome to the New World Order, global serfdom.

[dhpgetsit]

118. Pain?? Let me feel some!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/sep/17/merrilllynch.executivesalaries

[Indenturedebtor]

130. Not true at all. If you run a company, or have a lot of money to spread around

And you know what the market is going to do - devaluing the assets of this country will help you. Wouldn't it be great if you could go shopping and when you saw something you wanted you could simply declare that it is now on sale!?!?

That's what they've done.

[leftofthedial]

20. there is no war but the class war

[arcadian]

28. All warfare is class warfare.

Truer words have never been spoken.

[conspirator]

90. Wow. Those words are like a sharp knife that cuts straight to the core of ALL ISSUES nt

[Orsino]

25. And now they have a trained force of torturers. n/t

[peacetalksforall]

26. "Creative Destruction" I remember this from 2006 Please read.

"According to Professor Mark Levine the "neo-liberal globalizers and neo-conservatives, and ultimately the Bush Administration, would latch on to CREATIVE DESTRUCTION as a way of describing the process by which they hope to create their new world orders," and that "CREATIVE DESTRUCTION (in) the United States was, in the word of neo=conservative philosopher and Bush adviser Michael Ledeen, 'an awesome revolutionary force' for (...) CREATIVE DESTRUCTION...; "

(The caps are mine). (seventh paragraph)

This is from an article about the C Rice announcement of The New Middle East - and the leak or release of a new map that the military was using for training = a plan by the U.S., U.K., and Israel for realigning the ME and a NEW WORLD ORDER. The article was written around the time of the Israeli (and U.S/UK) attack on Lebanon.

Michael Ledeen - of the Niger forgeries and many other acts.

The source for this quote is in (footnotes) - Professor Mark LeVine, The New Creative Destruction, Asia Times, August 22, 2006.

The article (long, worthhwhile) - that connects many more paragraphs like this is by Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya of Global Research and the title and date is Plans for Redrawing the Middle East: Repeat: "... CREATIVE DESTRUCTION IN THE UNITED STATES was, in the words of neo-conservative and Bush adviser Michael Ledeen, 'AN AWESOME REVOLUTIONARY FORCE' FOR CREATIVE DESTRUCTION'.

(caps are mine)

I don't know why we haven't made these two words and the name of their project household words.

This is the first sentence in the second paragraph:

"This shift in foreign policy phraseology coinincided with the inauguration of the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan (BTC) Oil Terminal in the Eastern Mediterranean." From the article.

The quotes are all by the usual players, with emphasis on Rice and a military honcho. So, we have CREATIVE CHAOS for the ME and CREATIVE DESTRUCTION for the U.S. There is their new name for the region - THE NEW MIDDLE EAST. The author says that our leaders are quoted as UNLEASHING creative chaos in the ME. Central Asia is the Souther Tier.



You will understand what's happening in Georgia and Pakistan.

For we common citizens - CREATIVE DESTRUCTION really describes what op has summarized.

Creative Destruction
Creative Chaos
The Project for a "New Middle East"

[bertman]

133. higher class, the reason we haven't "made these two words and the name of their project household

words" is because the NEO-LIBERALS, insert here DCCC and DLC, are part of the Reich. Did you read where the Baroness Princess Duchess whatever deRothschild who was formerly a Hillary backer has now decided to invest her dollars in the McCanus-Palin bid for the Decider-In-Chief.

The fact that a deRothschild would be backing a Democrat for anything other than the ability to have control over them is ludicrous. We're talking serious aristocracy here.

Once we make the connection with the Democratic leadership being an integral part of the Reich, everything else falls into place: no 911 investigation, no impeachment, no slapdown of the FISA internal spy system, no election/balloting reforms. These DCCC/DLC folks have the same agenda as the Republicans, they just pretty it up to entice us to buy their brand by dangling healthcare reform and Change in front of us.

I believe in my heart that Barack Obama is a leader with a vision who, along with a progressive Democratic majority in the house and 60 non-blue dog Senators, could start to roll back some of these abominable abuses. BUT, the leadership doesn't even want to support Dems against hardcore Republicans like the Florida delegation, for one. Why else would they be so cozy with the people who are the primary enablers of this fascist takeover?

I'm working for Obama and voting for Obama, but I'm sending my money to the other ActBlue Dems whom we need to elect to help him. And I'm going to try to be realistic about my expectations.

On the other hand, I am VERY WORRIED now that we are sending bunker-busters to Israel. Doesn't look good.

[peacetalksforall]

140. I think you're right on every point. Makes me cry. 30-40 years ago, a

friend scorned my belief that one Party was rotten and the other was more idealistic and represented the people in an superior way. I started to suspect the person was right. And it was proved with all the center and right of center of the DLC. The hallways in the Houses of our Government are all named Charade Lane.

I can't believe the arrogance of this deRothschild, except it all starts making more and more sense. She must hae been holding her nose in dealing with all the other Dems involved (but, I admit, I have no right to say that based on my ignorance of her whole belief system).

She proves that the Clintons are DLC and probably the key leaders of the DLC.

[earth mom]

27. Yep, how many of us around here having been saying this for years?! Wake up America! nt

[Greyhound]

29. Not slaves, serfs. Slaves are valuable assets, serfs are imminently and inevitably disposable. n/t

[Canuckistanian]

38. The only thing that will reverse it is a major plague, like in the Middle Ages

After the Plague, labor became scarce and the aristocracy had to start bargaining to attract and keep workers for their vast land holdings.

It's not like I'm advocating for a genocide, but the financial circumstances improved dramatically for workers after that event.

Some say that it was the beginning of our modern labor movement.

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

43. Reuters - May 6, 2008: Risk of bird flu pandemic probably growing

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSPAR65178020080506

GENEVA (Reuters) - The risk of a human influenza pandemic remains real and is probably growing as the bird flu virus becomes entrenched in poultry in more countries, health officials warned on Tuesday.

Some 150 experts are attending a meeting hosted by the World Health Organization (WHO) to update its guidance to countries on how to boost their defences against a deadly global epidemic.

The H5N1 avian flu virus has infected flocks in much of Asia, Africa and parts of Europe. Experts fear it could mutate into a form that passes easily from person to person, sparking an influenza pandemic that could kill millions.

"The risk of a pandemic remains and is probably expanding," said Dr. Supamit Chunsuttiwat, a disease control expert at Thailand's health ministry who is chairing the four-day meeting.

[Canuckistanian]

46. Uh, thanks

Not something I'm looking forward to.

[Greyhound]

89. Well the serfs could, and on rare occasion have, band together and take what is theirs anyway.

But I'm not holding my breath.

It's not hard to understand why they hold us in such contempt.

[Beam Me Up]

30. And those of us proudly wearing tin foil hats have been saying this for years

The real history of our country has been that of a ruling oligarchy that has stacked the deck in their favor against us. They've been at it for a long, long time both openly and covertly. Their ultimate aim is the complete overthrow of the Republic. It isn't a "conspiracy" so much as a confluence of interests -- theirs against ours. Their primary means of controlling us has been by framing politics through their increasing control of the media (and education, too) as a right/left issue. That isn't it. That has never been it. It is US vs Them®. They truly do hate us for our freedoms because our freedoms are a threat to their control, their hegemony, their centralized power and ability to create wealth.

Yes, the 2000 election was stolen. It was a palace coup d'état. 9/11 WAS an inside job -- and everyone is still afraid to look at it. Everything that has followed in its wake, including the open theft of the 2004 election, has been to the point of weakening the balance of powers and the constitution while implementing imperial policies abroad.

HOWEVER, the rest of the world isn't going to sit back and just let the US Imperialists roll over them any more. As far as I can tell, we are now at war. It isn't 'hot' yet, except in some spots, but that is going to change and by the time this is all over, we may look like Germany after WW II.

[southerncrone]

47. Yes, we have!

:tinfoilhat:

I wear it proudly.

[bbgrunt]

73. well said Beam, give me a jim.

[Truth2Tell]

83. can I get an

AMEN!

[Greyhound]

91. Sometimes it sucks being right.

:kick:

[robertpaulsen]

32. You probably know this, here's exactly how they prepare for revolt when system collapses.

American Prison Camps Are on the Way

By Marjorie Cohn, AlterNet. Posted October 9, 2006.

Kellogg Brown & Root, a Halliburton subsidiary, is constructing a huge facility at an undisclosed location to hold tens of thousands of Bush's "unlawful enemy combatants." Americans are certain to be among them.

The Military Commissions Act of 2006 governing the treatment of detainees is the culmination of relentless fear-mongering by the Bush administration since the September 11 terrorist attacks.

Because the bill was adopted with lightning speed, barely anyone noticed that it empowers Bush to declare not just aliens, but also U.S. citizens, "unlawful enemy combatants."

Bush & Co. has portrayed the bill as a tough way to deal with aliens to protect us against terrorism. Frightened they might lose their majority in Congress in the November elections, the Republicans rammed the bill through Congress with little substantive debate.

Anyone who donates money to a charity that turns up on Bush's list of "terrorist" organizations, or who speaks out against the government's policies could be declared an "unlawful enemy combatant" and imprisoned indefinitely. That includes American citizens.

http://www.alternet.org/rights/42458/

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

33. I didn't think I'd see a stupider post on here than that shit this morning...

...rejoicing over the supposed 900 deaths from Ike, but I was wrong. This is stupider.

[arcadian]

34. You have proven yourself to be a staunch supporter of neo-colonialism

I wouldn't expect you venture far off that path. :hi:

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

35. Actually, I'm an opponent of neo-colonialism.

But I'm also an opponent of ridiculous conspiracy theories propogated by people with no apparent understanding of history or politics. kthxbye.

[arcadian]

36. What in my post is a conspiracy theory?

You need to watch the movie The Corporation or read Shock Doctrine.

[Jim Sagle]

59. Another coincidence theorist heard from. Thank you for your concern.

[liberalhistorian]

45. There was actually such a thread here

this morning? Are you freaking kidding me? That is beyond sick and disgusting.

[Th1onein]

135. There was no such thread, lieralhistorian.

Nope. Didn't happen.

What he is talking about is a post of mine where I said that a friend had told me that there are over 900 dead in Galveston and the morgue is overflowing. In fact, I think I said that there were 900 floating bodies out there and the morgue was overflowing.

Some jerks on the thread took it upon themselves to interpret that as DUers gleefully hoping for the death of the people in Galveston. Don't ask me why they would make such an interpretation, but you know how some people are.

Now, it looks like they want their OWN words to be taken as an example of what DU is, by repeating this claptrap in yet another thread.

That kind of tactic remind you of anything? Say.....Karl Rove, perhaps?

[Th1onein]

69. Give us all a break here. No one was rejoicing and you know it.

And we've all seen this coming--the camps, the laws allowing them to name Americans as enemy combatants, the signing statements. It's fascism, pure and simple.

[Name removed]

108. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

111. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

115. It was a restriction on flights below 2000 feet over Galveston.

Nobody was prevented from flying over Galveston:

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_8_8191.html

Altitude: From the surface up to and including 2000 feet MSL

[Th1onein]

136. And your point?

How is that a lie? You even provided the link, yourself, verifying it!

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

139. You said people were being prevented from flying over Galveston...

...in order to prevent taking photos of...

You know what? Fuck it. It's not worth the effort. Adios, kiddo.

[Th1onein]

143. Did you watch Wayne Dolcefino asking these questions of Gov. Perry?

Where have you been?

[Th1onein]

144. Did you watch Wayne Dolcefino asking these questions of Gov. Perry?

Where have you been?

[Vincardog]

37. I agree with everything until you try to make me a slave. I will not relent.

[KakistocracyHater]

39. yes, but it can be stopped at governors' level

& barring that at the mayoral level by outlawing/overturning those nightmare laws using the American Constitution as overriding precedent.

[NoSheep]

40. Exactly! Thank you for playing!

Great post. Yes. I'm afraid it made sense to many of us all along.

[MsLeopard]

41. Absolutely correct

The plan all along has been to rob the Treasury blind and leave the nation trillions of dollars in debt. If there were any justice in the world, they would be held accountable. K&R:kick:

[Golden Raisin]

86. As with everything else in Iraq

in particular it wasn't even subtle, nor was there any attempt to hide it. Remember the infamous (disappearing) pallets of cash?

[MissMarple]

42. Guns. They will want them...no private ownership.

Only the GOP could do that.

[sop]

51. Break out the torches and pitchforks....

In another country, where people actually believed in the "land of the free, home of the brave" crap, these guys would already be swinging from lamposts.

[mirrera]

48. DING DING DING!

[Dystopian]

49. KandR. When they came for me...

there was no one left to speak out.


peace~

[sarcasmo]

50. When middle America wakes up and realizes their 401k's have been swiped by these

Greedy bastards, I fear your revolt may happen.

[Usrename]

52. Is it fascism yet?

They will not go quietly.

[1Hippiechick]

53. AWEsome post!!! K&R n/t

[Ilsa]

54. "National Security" isn't about terrorists. It is about maintaining

law, order, and control when our owners (the Chinese, etc) openly take control of the US.

[Hannah Bell]

84. Who do you think "owns" the Chinese? Where did the capital for China's boom come from?

US auto companies have been investing in China since the 80's. Many of the Bushes have played key roles in facilitating the move of capital to China, e.g.:


Prescott Sheldon Bush, Jr.: brother to George Herbert Walker Bush

Phillips Academy, Andover and Yale.
Founder, Prescott Bush Resources, Ltd. 1985.
9 years with Pan Am.
33 years with Johnson & Higgins, international insurance brokers.

"Mr. Bush has been engaged in business projects with China since
1983 and has advised such companies as Anheuser-Busch and ADM
concerning their business development in China."

"He worked closely with Chinese conglomerates such as Cereal Oil Food
Import/Export Corporation (gov't-owned conglomerate, COFCO) and
Norinco (vehicles, machinery, electric/optical, explosives, defense
mfg). He is also a consultant for Wanxiang America (automotive
parts)."

Founding member & Chair of Board of Directors, U.S.-China Chamber of
Commerce.

Shanghai International Golf and Country Club in Shanghai developer &
Vice Chairman.

Chairman of the Advisory Board of Global Access, Incorporated.

International Advisory Board of the Culture and Civilization of
China.

1989-1992, U.S. delegation on the U.S.-Hong Kong Economic
Cooperation Committee.



It's not "countries" competing, it's groups of capital. They move things around just as they'd move plant from New England to the South, & they arbitrage the spreads.

The rest is a cover story to keep ordinary people working for them, busy "climbing the ladder" & out of their faces.

[conspirator]

93. The truth is the owners of the world don't have nationality. They are multinational oligarchies

Families who own businesses and property in multiple countries. Who control international commerce, banks, oil and military industries.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

55. What happens upon collapse is anyone's guess

I honestly don't think our security forces are powerful enough to maintain any kind of order, even with martial law, if economic chaos ensues. Who knows what that kind of calamity would bring?

[NJCher]

56. this is news?

Cher

[GoddessOfGuinness]

58. Except...

They're horrifically inept, and ill-equipped to handle any revolt.

[OnyxCollie]

60. Don't forget the Active Denial System.

I expect there will be a couple of these things parked outside the White House.

[Waiting For Everyman]

62. And we're hopelessly in hock to the Chinese.

I agree with you. Hard to keep hope, isn't it?

But you know what, in the dark days of the Revolution and the Civil War, and even WW2 it was this bad too... it just depends on which way the pivot goes at this point... up or down.

[tismyself]

75. yes

and it's about to get worse. Check out the news on Morgan Stanley.

[Hannah Bell]

85. That's what they want folks to believe, but in fact, we're not "hopelessly" in hock to anyone.

Most of the US debt is owed to its people, & the US doesn't have to be borrowing from China - it's just that some folks want it that way, because it suits their interests.


Where did the capital for China's boom come from?

US companies have been investing in China since the 80's. Many of the Bushes have played key roles in facilitating the move of capital to China, e.g.:


Prescott Sheldon Bush, Jr.: brother to George Herbert Walker Bush

Phillips Academy, Andover and Yale.
Founder, Prescott Bush Resources, Ltd. 1985.
9 years with Pan Am.
33 years with Johnson & Higgins, international insurance brokers.

"Mr. Bush has been engaged in business projects with China since
1983 and has advised such companies as Anheuser-Busch and ADM
concerning their business development in China."

"He worked closely with Chinese conglomerates such as Cereal Oil Food
Import/Export Corporation (gov't-owned conglomerate, COFCO) and
Norinco (vehicles, machinery, electric/optical, explosives, defense
mfg). He is also a consultant for Wanxiang America (automotive
parts)."

Founding member & Chair of Board of Directors, U.S.-China Chamber of
Commerce.

Shanghai International Golf and Country Club in Shanghai developer &
Vice Chairman.

Chairman of the Advisory Board of Global Access, Incorporated.

International Advisory Board of the Culture and Civilization of
China.

1989-1992, U.S. delegation on the U.S.-Hong Kong Economic
Cooperation Committee.



It's not "countries" competing, it's groups of capital. They move things around just as they'd move plant from New England to the South, & they arbitrage the spreads.

The rest is a cover story to keep ordinary people working for them, busy "climbing the ladder" & out of their faces.

[tuckessee]

63. You left "the military" out of your title.

Why did you do that?

The US military will be the primary force used against the American civilian population in case of emergency.

Their experiences in Iraq and to a lesser extent Afghanistan have made them a perfectly well-heeled martial law machine, experts at cracking down and controlling disgruntled civilian masses.

Whether it be cordoning off a neighborhood for searching, randomly detaining individuals, forcibly issuing biometric national ID's, confiscating private weapons, conducting heavily armed patrols among civilian crowds, setting up unexpected checkpoints, or punishing recalcitrant cities like Fallujah the American military has shown great eagerness and skill.

Now the US Army is sending these same units on Homeland Tours. On your streets. http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090708w/

[Beam Me Up]

80. Saw that. Stunning. All puns intended.

[Greyhound]

94. And has failed for 7 years to subdue the equivalent of a third world California.

Not even counting the psychological effects of doing it in their own country.

Small isolated incidents can be controlled/eliminated very effectively, but a general uprising? No way.

[RagAss]

64. Fuck 'em... it's too late....

[Sonicmedusa]

65. Welcome to Costco. I love you. NT

[Mark D.]

71. I'd Posted This Elsewhere

But it is very much related to this thread, so I'm going to post it here.
This is the tip of the iceberg, we need to go viral with a few things.

1) Phil Gramm, as we know, put into legislation deregulations, when he
was a senator, that opened the door for much of this major crash now.
He's an economic advisor to McCain who will be part of his D.C. team.

2) That's not the end of it!

McCain's chief adviser, Charlie Black, is one of 72 lobbyists, that
have worked for/with/or bundled money for John McCain.

3) That's not it either!

The top of the list of those he lobbied for? JP MORGAN! Yes, that is
the company of the globalist banking family. JP Morgan's grandfather
founded AETNA, the first and now largest health insurer. Leader in a
fight we are well aware of, to not allow true universal health care.

JP Morgan himself helped steer the monetary supply to allow a major
Wall Street collapse that ushered in the Great Depression, with the
help of the Federal Reserve he helped get passed (due to a 'scare'
he helped orchestrate on Wall Street). That is the same family...

4) Here is the zinger. Who did Gramm open that door for? MORGAN!

The leading beneficiaries of the massive deregulation Gramm was a
big part of and McCain was fully supportive of was SPECULATIONS.

Energy Speculation is believed to be about $2 of the increase in
our gas prices, raising our food prices, and so much more and it
has put serious breaks on the economy as we all are so aware...

Speculation in Real Estate. The sub-prime debacle. Allow many
sick banker children of the mega banks and the big brother in
the Federal Reserve to run amok, giving out those bad loans.

Then sell them bundled to foreign investors. The biggest of all
of these, by far and away, were HEDGE FUNDS. What is the
biggest hedge fund of them all? MORGAN. I repeat, MORGAN!

Many who believe the monetary policy is the true root of all of
this mess we are in, and the corporate control of govt. by the
lobbyists. And war for corporate and banker profit, and know
of Morgan's major role, with the other two pillars in this
great NWO disaster (Rockefeller/Rothschild) can clearly at
this time, I hope, see that McCain IS their boy.

THE FINAL NAIL in the coffin? The former fundraiser for Hillary who
helped the DNC write the convention platform is now supporting,
and actually out campaigning for John McCain. She's also head
of the Rothschild investment arm of the Rothschild banking and
globalist Euro empire. The elites have their candidates now...

Funny how he may only be in power long enough to put Gramm
in a position economically in his administration to cut loose all
the rest of the chains on that beast so it can maul us into a
Great Depression version two by sometimes in his first year.
Something recently brought up on Olberman's broadcast...

Then he can break his hip, and be unable to continue and let a
Dominionist, Theocratic, anti-feminist cave woman take the job.
GOD HELP US. They hack this fucking election and they then rule.

We will at that point be nothing more than Feudalist & Fascist.
Disguised as unregulated "Capitalist". As THE military division
of the Nazi ultimate victory, as when we fall, the world shall
be next. Complete w/Knights of Malta Blackwater military rule.

[tismyself]

74. I'd like to buy a vowel now

:nuke:

[Chulanowa]

78. The first step in rehabilitarion is recognizing the problem

Then you seek realistic solutions to fix this problem.

So I ask... What do any of us plan to do? No course is irreversable. But action must be taken. For nearly trhirty years we've been coasting in the passenger seat, occasionally demanding that the driver stop and ask for directions. We need to grab that wheel.

[Twist_U_Up]

87. 911 was an inside job. We have been screaming this for 7 years.

Wake the fuck up peeps.

[conspirator]

92. I used to think "911 inside job" theorists were attention craving nuts

The current manufactured economic "crisis" puts things in a different perspective.
It's now a strong possibility.

[OakCliffDem]

95. Bush's mercenaries, Blackwater, stand ready to do his bidding

[nradisic]

98. I think you may be right...

Corporations are not citizens....

[JohnnyBoots]

109. Butyet, they some how qualify for "Personhood" That seems fair.

[Wizard777]

100. Research Gen. Smedley Butler, war is a racket, and the business plot.

Then whats going on right now will REALLY make sense. A group of businessmen got together and planed to overthrow the Presidency of FDR with a military coup. Gen. Butler proved that to Congress. Guess what they did about it? Nothing. So why not try it again? Add in Diebold for a Bloodless Coup. Voila! Welcome to today.

[malaise]

101. The Democrats are going to wipe them out come

November 4th unless the election is canceled. Thankfully they stood up and defended Social Security or these fuggers would have had public money to keep up the facade. If they cancel the elections the rest of the planet will bail out on them and the American people will rise up. Bushco is not invincible - they have long shot their last atom of credibility. Bushco is history.

If you'd all calm down you'd see the Bushco and Conservative infighting. Calm down folks.

[MarkP]

102. The Revolution will not be televised...

Maybe we need a good old fashioned revolution...it's been awhile.

[billyoc]

103. Fearing it doesn't mean they could stop it.

A few pampered mercenaries would be swept away like blades of grass in a real revolt.

[Johnnyheadstone]

105. We Are Going To Be Sold To China, Here is How It Works...

You are right, it is a scam...here is the way it works.....
I've spent the last 6+ years working in the wholesale banking industry as an underwriter. I have been involved in both the wholesale and secondary markets. For those not familiiar with the difference "wholesale banking" allows banks to offer lower mortgage interest rates to approved clients (mortgage brokers) who then "sell" those rates to homeowners at a slightly lower (or higher) interest rate then the bank would offer a "retail" cllient (someone who walks into a branch and wants a mortgage)

Typically a client would be going to a mortgage broker because they do not meet the lending guidelines the bank has set forward in regards to thier retail lending policies, which are more strict then the wholesale guidelines the bank would have to adhere to, this is because these (retail) guidelines were set by Fannie Mae so the loan would meet basic criteria to be considered an investment grade debt (If the loan met the guidelines and went bad or was not repaid, Fannie Mae wouild insulate the loss for the investor by purchasing the loan and if need be selling the foreclosed property, needless to say this became a huge problem for them when the guidelines were lossened and loans starting going bad). The purpose of this guarantee is so the loan could then be sold on the secondary market as an investment, basically investors (and investment houses and firms such as Merril Lynch, Goldman Sachs etc would purchase these mortgages as large packages (300 or more loans at one time) from the wholesale lending divisions of banks. Large and small banks, savings and loans and correspondent lenders, and once the investment houses stopped buying these mortgages as investment grade debt (because people were not paying thier mortgages) the large and small banks savings and loans and correspondent lenders all went bankrupt because the investment grade debt was not being repaid. (There are various reasons as to WHY these debts were not paid, not the least of which is the gutting of lending laws and regulations that took place under the current admin.) The portfolios that the investment houses had built continued to lose value as the market collapsed, they were trying to collect debt + interest (and in the case of a lot of "subprime" loans. which are ALL wholesale loans sold to investors who set the guidelines, possibly predatory interest)
on an asset with a rapidly declining market value, not only in terms of the "paper" value of the property (based on sales of comparable homes in the area) but in terms of the "real" value of the asset because it is a debt that is not being paid.

Take this little bonfire and thow in two wars, huge tax cuts, billions and billions in deficeit spending and a worldwide rise in fuel prices which drive up the cost of all other goods......and when all of that happens while the nation itself depends upon a global economy in which we are the largest debtor, (largely because we do not provide an equal if any share of labor) and you have the perfect confluence of events for the firestorm that hit wall street yesterday.

It could get worse.


Consider again the Fed's response to this crisis:

"In order to try and calm the markets, the Federal Reserve announced plans late Sunday to loosen its lending restrictions to the banking industry. (More)
The Fed said it would expand its short-term lending to banks by starting to take all investment-grade debt as collateral - instead of just Treasurys and other high-grade securities."

This statement froze my blood.

We have arrived at this financial crisis because we have been forgotten the most fundemental law of finance, and no it is not supply and demand, rather it is as Abraham Lincoln noted the following:

"Labor must precede capital"

In other words, you can't push debt and paper around as the basis of a healthy economy, the labor must create the capital, currently we find ourselves in an economic situation where we do not provide the labor, OR the capital. This is the worst place to be as we are totally economically beholden to our debtors. (Think of it this way, your really cool Uncle gives you a VISA card, it's drawn on the Bank of the Really Cool Uncle, you have a limitless credit limit because your Uncle knows you are good for it (and besides, you have a great room, it has a large amount of valuable natural resources and plenty of interesting and possibly expensive things to see and do) now, you don't want to work so you cook up a little Zach Morris scheme, and what you do is you agree to allow your friends to purchase things from you at a slightly higher rate of interest because you know that the bank won't allow them to do so, because they have a poor history of repaying debts, and since you have the VISA from the Bank of the Reallly Cool Uncle, you can keep running up the debt and keep this going for as long as it takes.

Unless of course your friends fail to pay you back, which based on thier history of not paying anyone at all should not be a surprise to you when it occurs, which means you have to start taking the collateral back from your friends, of course that lowers the value on the items that you are taking in (repossessing), and also lowers the value of the collaterall you are still holding for your friends who are paying you back for it (because the resale market dissapears, why buy for top dollar when I can get almost the exact same thing for 30% less?) Your other friends catch on and refuse to pay the full amount of the debt they have agreed to (short sale) so they force YOU to take the loss, either in the form of refusing to pay the loan and forcing you to reposses another piece of collateral (which further degrades the prices) or to simply eat the difference and absorb the loss.
Either way as the value of the collateral you are holding decreases several things happen, the first is that people stop borrowing money from you, they simply can not afford your new terms, and besides the collateral they posses has now been rendered worthless, you no longer can support yourself with the VISA card from the Bank Of the Really Cool Uncle, you have no capital to lend because every bit you have left has to go just to pay the interest you already owe on the capital you have borrowed to lend back out, never mind the money you owe your uncle for the worthless collateral that you had to take back, because it is worthless you can't even resell it to pay back the debt, as you would normally. Once your Uncle has had enough of this he simply refuses to extend the credit on your limitless VISA, and he demands full repayment because of the turbulence in the market.......So, rather then attempting to come up with a realistic solution (or perhaps because you are UNABLE to do so because you simply do not understand capital markets) you instead attempt to go to your KIDS and have them buy all the investment grade debt that you are holding, because even though you have not been paid back on those debts, the collateral they are based on is worthless and they will most likely never be re-paid.....you are just SURE that once things turn around everything will be fine and people will suddenly start paying all of thier bills on time....except that your kids don't have the ability to earn any capital to pay back these markets, because they have no jobs, they have all been exported to your Uncle's house to allow you more favorable pricing terms on the items you purchased from him with the VISA card he gave you. Now you realize that the only way to repay him is to sell off the only things you have left of any value, sadly these are the items in your own room, your natural resources and interesting things are gone, they are now owned by your Uncle, but don't worry, he will provide you with a job with just enough income to be able to afford to pay back all that capital you misused and lent to the wrong people and to purchase all the goods you did not produce and again borrwered money to buy. And don't worry when you can't pay the debts (because you will never be able to, because your Uncle controls both the Capital (The Money) and the Labor (The goods and services being produced) you can just pass the bill down to your kids, and thier kids, and so on and so on.......

Replace the word "Uncle" in the above with the word "China"

Consider that China is the largest holder of US Debt, and that a majority of the items we purchase and use on a daily basis are produced in China. If major steps are not taken very quickly we are to going to find ourselves in a no win siituation, as it is we do not control our own Capital becuase we do not have any, we decided instead of using labor to produce the Capital for the last 40-50 years, we have simply borrowed it.

When we stop and think about what this will really cost us, it is shocking and frightening.

Now answer me this, how is it that someone who simply worked in this industry for only 6 years can come to understand these global markets and how the actions of the Fed are going to have an impact on them, and our economic future, and a major party Presidential Nominee and his Runnning Mate have no clue and are not being asked.

It's a sad day, and the worst part is no matter how many people read this (or don't) no matter how many K & R's I might get on this board, no matter who wins this election or if someone has "been" to Ireland, or what someone else said about lipstick or shooting wolves from helicopters, or how many houses Presidential Canidates own, at the end of the day I am just another sad, angry, unemployed American, who I am ashamed to say is very very afraid.

And I don't see that changing anytime soon.

[onlyadream]

141. Wow, amazing...

and sooooo very sad :(

[CaptJasHook]

106. Congratulations! You got it.

[aasleka]

107. Free your mind, your ass will follow

[lynnertic]

110. I'm not a slave and I don't think 'they' did this in some grand plan. Never attribute to malice

what can so easily be chalked up to greed and stupidity.

[Beam Me Up]

122. Greed is malicious, and "stupidity" is relative.

You know, when you or I make "stupid" mistakes, we pay for it, big time. Does that rule apply, for example, to the Bush administration? What I've seen over and over again is that what many of us would take as "stupidity" or a "mistake" or "failure" only looks that way IF you assume that the stated aims of a policy are, in fact, its actual aims.

Take the war on drugs, for example. The stated policy is to reduce if not eliminate drug abuse. However, despite billions and billions of dollars, despite the arming and near militarization of most, particularly urban, policing forces, despite draconian search and seizure laws, illicit drug consumption and drug abuse remains a serious problem in this country. The WoD has never 'worked' to produce the stated result. If you look at what a policy actually DOES instead of what it is "intended" to do what you often find is that it 1) increases centralized control and authority, 2) enhances certain investment groups while 3) is used to reduce the economic and civil liberties of an 'underclass'.

Are such policies "stupid" or simply "accidental"? Perhaps if one or two such policies existed we might say that but when one begins to see a pattern and the model of that pattern gets extended into more and more policy decisions, then you can't hang on to that "stupidity" excuse. Note how the War on Terror is supposed to make us safer -- but what does it actually do? Everything from the implementation of illegal civilian surveillance to the Bush doctrine -- and all along the way more and more money is allocated to "security" companies and an increasingly "privatized" (read "corporate/mercenary") military and an "intelligence" infrastructure that has the ability to spy on you without warrant, detain you without access to counsel, hold you indefinitely without charge and even try you outside the judicial system. You and I may think that is "stupid" but it IS precisely what they want.

ALL of this predicated, by the way, on the myth that what happened on 9/11 was precisely what we've been told -- an unforeseen and catastrophic failure of our domestic and foreign intelligence and national security and defense infrastructure. Never mind that not ONE person in a key position of authority that day has been held to account. Never mind that they've lied to us repeatedly about events and persons involved and kept real, substantiative questions about these events out of the media and, thus, polite social discourse. Never mind that they've successfully conflated the pejorative "conspiracy theory" with legitimate and persistent unanswered questions. I mean even the FBI can't find any "hard evidence" tying bin Laden to 9/11 -- but yet we've invaded two countries based on the BELIEF that the official conspiracy theory -- which is what it is -- is backed up by solid proof.

That isn't "stupidity," that is policy and it is devious and malicious. The problem is, most people don't want to accept that they (whoever 'they' are, and it obviously isn't just the bush cabal alone) have the ability to pull something like this off and the ability to keep it covered up. And yet when someone likes me points to obvious problems (and there are hundreds of such problems) what I see over and over again is the people I'm trying to point something out to say to me, "Oh, they couldn't keep something like that covered up." !! But that's just it, they don't have to cover anything up aside from making you and everyone else believe there is nothing to see there or if there was anything to see, the corporate owned media would have told you by now. As someone on the opposite side of the looking glass now, I find this attitude astounding. How can anyone still believe that the function of the media is to keep us factually informed about our government and what it is actually doing?

Sorry if I seem a bit irritated. Nothing personal -- it is just an attitude I see over and over again in otherwise intelligent people and it absolutely astounds me.

[Raksha]

138. Excellent observations,,,I agree with you

that when you stop believing that the stated aims of a policy like the "War on Drugs" or the "War on Terror" are the real aims, and just look at the EFFECTS, everything falls into place.

Re Take the war on drugs, for example. The stated policy is to reduce if not eliminate drug abuse. However, despite billions and billions of dollars, despite the arming and near militarization of most, particularly urban, policing forces, despite draconian search and seizure laws, illicit drug consumption and drug abuse remains a serious problem in this country. The WoD has never 'worked' to produce the stated result. If you look at what a policy actually DOES instead of what it is "intended" to do what you often find is that it 1) increases centralized control and authority, 2) enhances certain investment groups while 3) is used to reduce the economic and civil liberties of an 'underclass'.

I stopped believing the spin a long time ago, and don't go along with the "stupidity" and "incompetence" copouts either.

[Pete2069]

112. Everyone Knows this!

That is except the republican sheep.   So what are we going to
do about it.   It is far past the time for talk.   

[lisainmilo]

113. Your'e right!

Absolute Power, Absolute Corruption!

[dhpgetsit]

116. I love that Pogo frame!

And totally agree with your essay.

Beware of the Military Industrial Complex.

How clear it is to me now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8y06NSBBRtY

[Enthusiast]

117. But why was there support for

the Gramm-Leach-Bliley act? Why did Bill Clinton sign this into law? Didn't Congressional Democrats recognize this act as a threat? I'm serious. I want to know. Can this act be overturned so we won't have the fox guarding the chicken coop? I can certainly understand the abuses by the Republicans but why have Democrats been complicit?

[Johnnyheadstone]

120. Who controls the majority of worldwide labor and capital?

CHINA

Who used to hold the majority of worldwide labor and capital?

THE USA

It is very simple, China controls both the majority of the Capital and the Labor in this World (let alone our country) because of this, they essentially control us, the only real portion of the US infrastructure they don't totally own and control is the energy industry (which is also owned and controlled by a group of people who hate us) once they decide to stop lending us money due to our financial collapse, things will get even worse, or if they want immediate repayment of all that debt, then even worse then that.

I wonder if after the Chinese take us over we are going to order "American Food" as take out....

No sir, one from column A (Chicken Wings, Fingers or a Mad Cow Burger) and one from column B (Fries, Cole Slaw, or Soylent Green)

[Indenturedebtor]

131. China doesn't give a damn about taking us over

They'll just suck the money out of your pockets. New boss same as the old boss. The real people behind the curtain have no country. Their flag is the color of money... whichever money is in fashion that day.

[EnviroBat]

123. 100% Dead on.

Just as Mussolini did to Italy back in the 30's and 40's, Until the people hunted him down and killed his fascist ass. History may need a repeat. The fucking Neocons are destroying us for their own gain. They are traitors, and I can't wait until the day we collectively grow a pair and rise up against their shit.

[cartach]

124. Very vague about

rebuilding the system,i.e., "some kind of dysopian anti-New Deal fashion". While I agree with your claims they destroyed the existing system etc.,etc.,what makes you think they did'nt just get too greedy and the system is imploding as a result? And we won't be slaves of Wal-Mart et al for very much longer as we won't be able to afford what those companies have for sale even at the low prices resulting from near slave, overseas wages. The corporatists will be shit out of luck with a near zero customer base. Because the American public have been and still are a bunch of misguided sheep there will be close to nothing left for the corporatists to exploit. So why would they engineer a collapse when they were already sucking the maximum out of the system? They just went a little to far with all their changes because of greed. They did'nt have to do that given the gullible public and an opposition party that's cut from the same cloth. Collapsing the existing system and rebuilding it was'nt necessary.

[Liberalynn]

125. I am with the crowd still fearing that Bush is up to something

that he, Cheney, and Rove, are working to discredit even McSame, so they can call off the elections, and try to stay in office.

Why else is the carefully tightened muzzle suddenly off the press? Why is Turd Blossom admitting McSame lies? Why did Carly F admit that neither McSame or Caribou Barbie are qualified to run a corporation?

I am probably just paranoid, please tell me I am just paranoid, but that's what I am afraid of.

And in essence aren't we "federalizing" the economy right now?

I don't think its in response to Puke's own fears, I think it has been their actual plan all along.

Am I just nuts? Please tell me yes, so I can sleep at night, and quit obsessing?

I am just a :tinfoilhat: right?

[Enthusiast]

128. You are right to fear this crowd.

They are dangerous enemies of our country. I'm dead serious.

[Liberalynn]

134. I have my RR homepage up in another window

There is a headline: "Rove calls Choice of Palin Political: Describes How Obama can Prevail!"

If he's not up to something, I'm Paris Hilton's twin.

ETA: Okay the article is not so shocking as the headline:

In it Turd Blossom says Palin "isn't the most qualified candidate but neither is Obama."

Does state that the addition of Biden does add foreign policy strength to the Dem ticket.

Says Caribou Barbie is "still capable of leading"

Also goes onto say that McSame is over his anger/grudge issues.

"That Obama could win by showing the American people who he is."

So its not like hell froze over, but still some subtle diggs at McSame that I just don't get why Turd Blossom is making? I guess it could be that Turd Blossom just doesn't personally like McSame even though he is pretending to, to fake party unity, but I still think he's got an ulterior motive that runs deeper than that.

[MadrasT]

129. I'd love to tell you you're nuts... but I've been thinking the same thing.

:tinfoilhat: :hug:

[Liberalynn]

132. Thanks I needed that

:hug:

[Vattel]

127. I don't agree

with all of your premises, but I agree with your basic arithmetic and I share your worries about the future given the extent to which our rights have eroded even in relatively secure, prosperous times. When I do the arithmetic, I just add up all of the following: eroision of rights (done), seizure of unconstitutional powers and immunities by the executive branch (done), the blamk check of the "war on terror" (done), economic crisis (happening now), plenty of excuses for war (Iran, North Korea, etc.) and restoring the cold war with Russia (we seem to be moving in that horrifying direction). That adds up to disaster. McCain is a corrupt militaristic fool. He's fuel on the fire. Obama could move us back in the right direction. This election must be won.

[SweetieD]

137. The New Deal has been a target since its inception. nt