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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:29 PM
Original message
It's Reagan's fault all of it
If he hadn't been elected President, these fucking Reich wingers would NOT have destroyed our economy, our military, our country. Some of you here blame Clinton, bullshit. It's ALL Reagan's fault, every last bit of it.


(here come the Freepers to disagree)
.
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ananda Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
1. It started with Reagan.
Every admin since has done its part...

... though the Bush admin took it to such
extremes that we're in one hell of a mess
with not much hope for the future.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:31 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. If NOT for Ronnie Raygun, there would NOT be a BUSH in the White House
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uppityperson Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 04:23 PM
Response to Reply #2
15. If not for papabush, Raygun would not have been on the W.H.
Raygun was a papabush tool.
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Naturyl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
3. Yep, you're right.
Saint Gipper is ultimately behind all of this.

People drank the Kool-Aid in 1980 and the poison is just now kicking in full strength.
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alsame Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. Yep, the Reagan years were the beginning of the end. It was
during the 80s that I began to have trouble recognizing my own country.
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NOLALady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
5. Raygun, yes.
But the blame should be shared with the voters who elected the actor.

He could not have done it without support.
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ramapo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
6. Yup...we'd also have had energy independance
Reagan stopped progress in its tracks except for the rich getting richer.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Single biggest roadblock the Reich wing threw up
Carter had it right, and we'd be driving electric or hydrogen powered cars now, and e would NOT be in the position we are in with regards to the mortgage market since jobs would be plentiful and we would be the technology supplier to the world.

I wish I could invent the time machine and take us all back for a second chance.
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ddeclue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:36 PM
Original message
They're too big to fail... we're too small to matter..
Edited on Mon Sep-22-08 03:46 PM by ddeclue
For decades now, ever since the days of Ronald Reagan we’ve heard the conservative Republican mantra repeated over and over:

Privatize, deregulate, and downsize government.

There’s never been a merger they’ve been against – banks, airlines, oil companies, credit card companies, insurance companies, energy utilities and phone companies.

We were told there was only an upside to these mergers, never mind that they increased corporate power at the expense of consumer, labor, citizen, and government power. Never mind that these mergers made it harder to find a job, harder to bargain for a fair wage, harder to bargain for a fair price and harder to enforce rules to protect people, the environment and even national security.

Now we are being told that these merged institutions are simply “too large to fail”. Where was that important piece of information when they were asking us for permission to merge?

There’s never been an industry that’s had too little regulation for them – Savings and loans, airlines, telecoms, energy companies, real estate, stock brokerages, and banks. Their claim was “just get the government out of our way and we’ll make all of you rich”.

Well somebody got rich, but it wasn’t most of us.

They’ve effectively privatized health care already and turned it into a commodity that the poor and middle class increasingly can not afford – over 45 million Americans are without health insurance today because a family of 4 has to pay $1200 a month for basic coverage a figure that is rising 10 to 20% a year and those who have it are still likely to be bankrupted by the first major medical problem they face.

When the people have cried out for affordable healthcare, they haven’t been told that they were “too large to fail” but rather that they were “too small to matter”. So what if you go bankrupt because your spouse had a heart attack or cancer? That’s a problem for the marketplace to resolve.

Now they want every American to bail out insurance giant AIG but they won’t provide those same Americans with affordable health care coverage because they’re too big to fail and we’re too small to matter.

They’ve privatized a college education too.

Beginning with the GI Bill after World War II and reaching its peak in the 1960’s and 1970’s, the government treated a higher education as a national investment in our most important asset – “We the People”.

Loans and grants like the Pell Grant made it possible for anyone who studied hard and worked hard to go to college and have a better life for themselves and their children.

Since the 1980’s however, they have increasingly decided that college is for them and their children – not you and yours. If you can’t afford $60,000 up front for your college education, they’ll loan it to you at expensive rates – if you qualify for the loan that is.

And they aren’t satisfied with privatizing college, they want to privatize primary and secondary education too through school vouchers which are not enough to pay for private school but are enough to defund public schools and bankrupt them.

They don’t believe in public schools because:

Your dreams are too small to matter –theirs aren’t.

Owning your own home used to be an American dream too.

Wages have been nearly stagnant for a decade now because our good jobs have been shipped overseas where these companies that are too big to fail can find workers who they can pay a few cents an hour, workers without representative democratic government to protect them and workers without a right to collectively bargain for their labor – rights we have taken for granted in this country for a century or more now.

Meanwhile the price of a home has climbed 10 to 20% a year in many places and to force housing prices upwards in spite of these flat wages, the banks have created risky loan packages to artificially inflate demand that were ultimately doomed to fail and then resold them to institutional investors on Wall Street to make a quick buck and avoid the inevitable consequences of these doomed loans.

Had they not been allowed to play these financial games, had an agenda of common sense regulation ruled rather than corporate greed pushed through by corporate lobbyists, housing prices would have tracked the flat wages because the law of supply and demand would have forced the issue.

Now they tell us that these Wall Street investors are “too big to fail” – Well what about the rest of us?

When it was Bourbon Street, they dragged their feet to help those trying to recover from Hurricane Katrina and it was too little and too late. Apparently the Lower Ninth Ward and Coastal Mississippi were too small to matter.

When it was Main Street with hundreds of thousands of homeowners being foreclosed upon, that “wasn’t the government’s problem – we should let the market work” we were told. We were too small to matter too.

They’ve also largely privatized our company pensions by turning them from a guaranteed payment by our employer for a lifetime of hard work into a risky 401K or IRA investment in a stock market where it is becoming increasingly clear that there are two levels of transparency available – one for the ultra-rich who are given the real story and one for the rest of us who have to fend for ourselves amongst all the marketing hype that passes for financial news on TV and in the newspapers.

We’ve seen these investments go up in smoke at places like Enron and now it appears that we are at the edge of a disaster that will make Enron and the 1980’s S&L crisis look “bush league” If you’ll pardon that pun – they’re too big to fail and they are going to take us down with them if we don’t help.

For decades they’ve been about privatization – they were all about privatizing their profits and not sharing the wealth - now that they’ve gotten into trouble they have all become socialists overnight who want us to help them socialize their debts. Why?

Because they’re too big to fail – we’re too small to matter.

They’ve tried to privatize our social security safety net, arguing that that money would be better off invested in the stock market and trying to claim that Social Security was going to be insolvent in a few decades if we did nothing.

Thank God we did exactly that when George W. Bush pushed this plan a few years ago – nothing .

Had we let them invest our Social Security money in the stock market, Social Security would be insolvent right now not in 20 years.

They’re too big to fail – but hey - your grandma’s too small to matter.

The conservative Republican economic dogma has failed spectacularly this week and now they want the rest of –the ones who are too small to matter – to bail them out without any strings attached. They don’t want us to hold them accountable for their colossal blunder, they just want a trillion dollar ($1,000,000,000,000.00) blank check from us so that they can try the same thing again.

I say now is the time to take our country back. Now is the time to take our dreams back. Now is the time to take our future back from all those who think that “Greed is good” and that we don’t matter.

If they want our help, it must be with strings attached:

• It’s time to elect a new leadership to the White House that puts people first – put Obama in – show Republicans the door. If we keep voting for more of the same leaders we will get more of the same results.

• Demand real regulation of key national industries like banking, investments, healthcare, telecommunications, airlines, and energy.

• Break up these big monopolies that are “too big to fail” and enforce the Sherman Anti-Trust act. Prohibit any more buyouts of companies not already in Chapter 11 bankruptcy.

• Restore common sense bankruptcy laws in this country – if they’re too big to fail, we should have the same kind of protection too – reverse the recent changes to bankruptcy laws that are strangling families finances.

• Put caps on credit card interest rates that are prime + 5%. These companies are making obscene profits and trapping regular people in debt for their entire lives and giving them no chance to get ahead.

• Cap executive salaries to some reasonable ratio of the lowest salary paid by that company – I would say 250 to 1 is reasonable to me. If the stock room clerk makes $20,000/yr, the CEO should make no more than $5 million. Many of those responsible for this mess are walking away with tens of millions in bonuses and golden parachutes while their employees get to file for unemployment and use up their dwindling savings and find an even lower paying job.

• Raise the minimum wage to exceed the poverty level by a significant amount. At the very least it ought to be $10/hr – which is what the 1969 minimum wage would be today were it adjusted for inflation.

• Make those who profited the most in short term capital gains pay the most to clean up the mess. The motivation to turn a quick buck on Wall Street has short circuited the real productivity in our economy and created a hollow economy where little real wealth is being created in terms of actual goods and services and substituted a phony paper economy in its place.

• Require those who sell goods and services in this country to abide by American health, safety, labor and environmental laws unless they can demonstrate that their own laws constitute a higher standard. Tax any company who moves offshore to avoid these American laws an equivalent amount plus a penalty to create a financial disincentive to doing so. They are avoiding the costs but we end up paying them with tainted pet food and vegetables and lead based toys for our children.

• Pay off people’s defaulted mortgages first and let that money “trickle up” to the lenders rather than paying off the lenders and leaving the borrowers hanging. This way Wall Street gets its money but Main Street gets it first.

• Make affordable health care and education universal basic rights of all Americans, not commodities to which only the rich can afford.

We are all in this boat together – if they’re “too big to fail” – it’s time that the rest of us start mattering again.

Sincerely,

Douglas J. De Clue
Democratic Activist
Orlando, FL


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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
12. wow
We are not worthy
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. You're right, Raygun, 41, Clinton, and Idiot Frat Boy, as well as the "leadership"
of both parties did this with full knowledge before hand where it would lead.

That said, it is our fault for being so fucking stupid we will believe any shit that is told to us as long as it is accompanied with assurances that we might also win the lottery.

Go ahead and lie, cheat, & steal, it's alright if you win.



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Tangerine LaBamba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:37 PM
Response to Original message
8. Actually (and I hate to say this),
but it began under Jimmy Carter.

The Airline Deregulation Act of 1978 was during Carter's Presidency.

And we all know how well THAT has worked out, don't we?
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ramapo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. Sadly you're correct
And Clinton bought in big-time. He signed a lot of just awful legislation
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:03 AM
Response to Reply #8
16. Why do we ALWAYS have to blame a Democrat, BULLSHIT IT IS RAYGUN'S FAULT
all of it.
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Tangerine LaBamba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:28 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. Huh?
Oh, that was a joke. Got it.

Very funny. Right?
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #18
21. No it wasn't a joke, what was a joke was your insertion of Carter's
deregulation of the airlines into the thread, it didn't start ANYTHING, RAYGUN fucked this country, him and every one of his ConJob buddies. THAT was my point, and it isn't a joke.
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Tangerine LaBamba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 07:37 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. Well, tough as it is for you to swallow,
you cannot deny history. The Airline Deregulation Act of 1978, which was controversial when it was first proposed, opened the door to the further deregulation that took place under Reagan.

That's just history. Denying it won't change it. I helped write the Airline Deregulation Act.
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. So all of this is Carter's fault, is that your point?
Give me a break. I think I KNOW where your true feelings lie, and if you think for one minute that blaming Carter OR Clinton for this mess validates you conscious, bullshit, puke somewhere else.
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Tangerine LaBamba Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #24
26. It's clear you're having trouble
with reading comprehension. Clinton?

My simple point - which seems to elude you - so your vulgarity really, as pathetic as it is, is unwarranted (a big word, I know, but ask someone to look it up for you) - is that the trend towards deregulation began during a Democratic administration. I understand that you are having trouble comprehending that.

Ask someone on your little bus to explain it to you. They'll help you. Lord knows you do need help.

And now, you are disappeared.

<click>
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DainBramaged Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. U TWO (2) D-O-U-C-H-E B-A-G
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 09:13 PM by DainBramaged
Condescending prick. Typically Rethuglian in your responses.

And nice profile, did you write your journal yourself, or did the White House press staff help you?
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Cary Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
10. It's our fault as a nation.
Deregulation actually started with Carter, but Reagan did incredible damage.

Clinton was pragmatic. A lot of his acquiescence was probably necessary.

Clinton had brains. If Clinton was our president the past 8 years we would not be in this mess.
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Hubert Flottz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
11. McCain wants to use Reagan's pen to write every American off...
that don't earn at least 5 million dollars a year.
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juno jones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-22-08 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
13. I graduated in '81 into a changed country
No jobs, my hometown in IL was dismantled in a few years and everything shipped elsewhere. Nothing is left there but a shell of a town centered around a Wal-mart (per my sis's last visit. I haven't been in years) The emerging philosophy at the time and unfortunately held by many was that it was OK to be selfish.

Between the poverty and the narrow-mindedness I became part of a diaspora that many here can identify with.
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JCMach1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
17. Yes it is... this is the end-game of Reaganomics!
Bring a shovel... Reagan is dead!
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dana_b Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
19. 100% correct!
a hero to those money lovin', self absorbed idiots who caused this fiasco we're in and the root cause of our woes as seen by many here.
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Ishoutandscream2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
20. Agreed. It was the beginning of the end for the middle class
Not only voodoo economics, but you knew what a fucker he was when he fired the air traffic controllers. What an SOB. And thankfully, a dead one at that.
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misanthrope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 07:41 PM
Response to Original message
23. Damn Skippy!...
...History will be less kind to him than the media was four years ago.
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LaPera Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-23-08 08:13 PM
Response to Original message
25. Reagan (as republican always do) promised everything to working Americans on a silver platter and
Edited on Tue Sep-23-08 08:20 PM by LaPera
so many progressives ate it up, Reagan told everyone the Democrats & Carter were weak...but that he'll make America strong again....moderates ate it up. Reagan promised deregulation for corporations & business "untie their hands" and we will all prosper...and most everyone I know (including people who call them self "liberals") ate it up, with thoughts of riches dancing in their heads.

But as always only the rich and corporates got richer....The workers and middle class got poorer!

People never learn...they still vote for the candidate and believe every lie the candidates tell them...when will people learn to vote party ideology, which has a long history and NEVER lies!!

Republican ideology is based on corporate fascism, as their ultimate goal they are trying to achieve, Reagan helped it along and they reached it with complete republican rule for six years...now it's decades if ever away from reversal.

I know so many who voted for Reagan not once but twice and then voted for Clinton twice...Reagan sucked them in with thoughts of greed & selfishness....I will never vote for a republican on any level and never have....I understand ideology....how many can say the same?
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