I Sense a Disturbance in the Force...

[catnhatnh]

Because there are two full forces vying for the Republican soul. The lesser has put up a clownish ticket to lose while accepting this weeks bailout-they will be content to cashout and live through a 20 year Democratic ascendancy that will be a second FDR re regulation deal. They will be content to take their winnings and start decades from now their narratives of Democratic "taxing and spending" and "loose morality" hoping just one more time again to raid the treasury as they did before the great depression and then ,well, last week.

The second set are the scary ones. Those are the Bushies. An election is arising, the people hate him and his choice is either to accept an election that no matter what the outcome would mean he will no longer be the "deciderer"-and therefore prosecutable. Behind him lies a cadre of never elected movers and shakers equally culpable under law for formulating a war of aggression. And thats a hanging crime.

We are not talking hyperbole here-Capital crimes have been committed under the Nuremberg standards, and each dead Iraqi civilian endorses this. A shit load of old white boys are as culpable under law as Mengele, Hess, Speer, Goering, and Himmler. Lies were told and our Blitzkrieg (Read:shock and awe) differs only by lattitude and longitude from the fall of Poland and Nazi "reprisals".

So the question is this-Does Bush run off to non-extradition in southern climes or hang tough and go for the final putsch-Hallliburton camps with the suspension of the election and betting he won't miss even one patriot in the round-ups.

I'm not sure what the answer is...

[Mojorabbit]

1. The mood in the country is ugly

If done correctly... he could be in big trouble.

[jaysunb]

2. You're not alone.

I've pondered ( and posted ) on both issues. This is one time I'm hoping I'm dead wrong.

[pocoloco]

3. Holding a wild card.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=2382566

[catnhatnh]

5. Yep

But the Hague is the Hague and need not be re-elected. Our own governmental branches....Phffftt...the judicial selected him and the legislative fellated him.

[glinda]

4. they are gonna go for the whole Kielbasa

They face charges if they allow the Dems to succeed. They fear for their lives. So they will ruin ours. That is what I think anyways.

[Postman]

6. Nothing will happen.

If McCain wins, obviously nothing will happen. He's part of the criminality.

If Obama wins, he's been running on a unity platform. He'll let the criminals go scott free. He's got his own criminal war in Afghanistan he wants to prosecute.

[curious one]

7. I am not sure what will happen but history will give him all the credits he deserve!

[WhiteTara]

8. moving the military in place

is rather ominous and then, there's snarling Cheney.

[dgibby]

12. definitely not in our best interest!

[EmeraldCityGrl]

9. Bush bought a hundred thousand acres in Paraguay in 2006...no extradition treaty.

http://rogueimc.org/en/2006/10/7408.shtml

[dgibby]

10. No longer an option

They have a new, socialistic gov't that is not Bush friendly.

[dgibby]

11. I pick what's behind door #2

Why would they work so hard to gain so much power just to give it up and exit stage right? When pigs (with or without lipstick) fly!

[Usrename]

13. You are not alone.

They will not go quietly. That much should be clear. Capital crimes, to be sure.

The danger is real. With all the research that's been done on social networking, I'm pretty sure their roundup lists are superior to anything that's ever been seen before. It wouldn't take much, perhaps as little as on in a thousand.

That might be only three people rounded up in my town.

But then what? Who do we call? Who do we complain to? Who do we point are pitchforks at? Do we go after the local police chief? People think that because we are a well-armed society, this type of roundup would not be possible. But the question is, who do we aim our weapons at? The local sheriff is only enforcing a few terrorist warrants. No big deal. There will be no leadership anywhere except for that which come though the coup.

Without the ability to organize, what can be done?

This is some scary stuff to think about. It would take at least a generation for people to organize, if ever.

I don't know the answer, either...

[Selatius]

14. The former (the cool calculating corporatist) is as dangerous as the Bush Brownshirt, IMHO.

Both of them, ideally, should be smashed. Nowhere in Europe would people allow a government to be pulled so far right as it has been in the US that it wouldn't be considered a return of fascism by people who saw fascism first hand 60 years ago.

The Germans have millions of dead soldiers in their cemeteries; the French have white crosses on the shores of Normandy; and the Poles have Auschwitz and other death camps as a reminder of what happened last time people allowed an ultra-nationalist corporate oligarchy to ascend to power.

People like Bush don't get that far in Europe today, simply because many people still remember the horrible price of inaction, of not confronting an aggressive cadre of people bent on power. Between 40,000,000 to 50,000,000 died in Europe by the end of the last world war. People over there do not soon forget that, not after such a catastrophic toll.

The only reason why it came to America is because Americans have not known that kind of devastation wrought on American soil. If Americans had bled as much as any of the European nations did or even Russia, which suffered the greatest loss of life out of all of the Allied powers, maybe this country would never have become so far right as it has become.

[Chulanowa]

16. The Civil war

A massive, bloody conflict, fought over what amounted to proto-fascist ideals.

Trouble is our history books have whitewashed (literally) that segment of history so thoroughly that you would never know it was anything other than greys and blues shooting at each other on an empty field somewhere.

[Hardrada]

17. The equivalent of the number of Civil War dead (the percentage)

in modern US is 15 million dead. Yeah, we've had our Verduns and Somme battles too too but so long ago and with what now seems quaint weaponry. Not so quaint when you are hit in the face with a chunk of iron shrapnel (iron did not splinter as much as steel projectiles and did more massive damage). But the war has been so romanticized as to be almost hidden. Even recent movies have done their share of idealization. (Gods and Generals for one). And, of course, there is the whole Lost Cause/Tara/Gallant Southern Cavaliers ethos (not even in the past as William Faulkner noted) and it was only a blink of an eye ago when TV and Movies showed Happy Darkies on the Old Plantation!

[dgibby]

15. I sense that your are right.

The ions are misaligned in the atmosphere.

[Th1onein]

18. Can you explain this statement, please?

"...hoping just one more time again to raid the treasury as they did before the great depression and then ,well, last week."

Why do you say that? Can you please explain how the Republicans raided the treasury before the great depression?

[catnhatnh]

21. In '29 no overt act...

just the hollow overvalue of the market leading to the crash. This time they have used the deregulated market to repeat the crash but now plan to extend it with a bailout. The point is the Republicans LIKE the idea of moves like the "Tulip Mania" that allow the "smartest" and least ethical to both participate in the mania and bail out in time to preserve their gains from a worthless inflation.

This one is about housing (mortgages) and home values doubling even in an area where neither land nor home building supplies doubled. Past the lack of actual intrinsic gain in value, you realize that the plan was Ponzi-like...make it look lucrative and invite new players. Land was up 50 percent and building supplies maybe 25 percent, while a completed home was maybe 3 months away, but the "smart money" was to buy an existing home doubled in value over the last 3 years?

The media sold it...to this very evening they air shows like "Flip This House" that are never about the acquisition of a permanent asset but rather about using a credit line to produce undeserved wealth...they plan to "own" the house 8-12 weeks and realize a 50% or higher profit...the "best" from the show have several properties they are juggling. So 3 or 4 times 4 "flips" per year times 100k as a guess towards starting prices at would be Any least a 600-800K profit per year for acting as a general contractor....And oh, yeah, their time and labor were costed into the projects-they got paid just like general contractors. The OTHER 600-800K was just a bonus...

So they were clever, and earned well and gamed the deregulated credit. It's over now except the finding of the hollowed out values of mortgages the encouraging media caused consumers to buy. The smartest "flippers" jumped out last TV season.

The losers of course were those not wise enough to flip or finance-mortgage lenders and "builders" (read:flippers) both said they where buying a sure win. They bought not knowing the mania would end and they would wind up with worthless flower bulbs and broke. The flippers ran with their cash and the mortgage lenders will be bailed...

So in a way you are right-this isn't '29-this is worse.

[The Stranger]

19. I agree -- and no wonder I woke up feeling so inexplicably good today.

I'm sure that by tomorrow I'll probably come around.

[AntiFascist]

20. I honestly don't believe that Bush has the where-with-all to pull this off...

he certainly doesn't have the charisma of a Hitler. There likely are people putsching for this, however.