*******OFFICIAL BAILOUT HEARING THREAD # 3**********

[shadowknows69]

CSPAN 3
<http://www.c-span.org/watch/cspan3_rm.asp?Cat=TV&Code=CS3>

Q+A Starting

[alfredo]

1. Thank you.

[slipslidingaway]

2. So where did the 700 billion number come from? Has anyone

asked that question?

Thanks for the threads.

[shadowknows69]

3. Dodd asking for specifics on "what if we don't act?"

[Captain Hilts]

6. Dodd's an ace. I'm glad I sent him money during the primaries. nt

[shadowknows69]

4. Sounding a little nervous there Ben

[DemReadingDU]

8. Paulson is shook up too, can't get out the words

[shadowknows69]

5. Great, what did we learn from that question?

NOTHING

[Gin]

11. based on their answers...there is time to review all of this... IMO

[shadowknows69]

13. I don't think the CEO's of these companies are gonna go hungry in the next week

[babylonsister]

7. Has anyone asked Paulson about his personal interest in seeing

this bailout succeed? I got distracted; it's also on m$nbc at the moment.

[barbtries]

38. i'm also trying to listen for some questions

about why this plan requires congress giving him absolute power. has it been asked?

[LSK]

45. he would like banks to function, even Neocons need them

[babylonsister]

60. Can you trust a Wall Street veteran with a Wall Street bailout?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4057103&mesg_id=4057103

and...

Conflict Of Interest? Report Says Goldman Sachs ‘Among Biggest Beneficiaries’ Of Paulson’s Bailout

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4061595

[cyberpj]

9. Paulson asked if he consided any other proposals - he nodded yes - Sen Shelby asking

what other proposals were considered.

[cyberpj]

15. 1. "a lot of work with dealing with forclosures" 2. a case by case proposal -

as we looked at this we said the root cause is housing and housing correction.

some said stick capital in the banks.
we have dealth with some that way.
but then said the right way is not using guarantees or injecting capital but instead using market mechanisms.

again, I share some of the frustration I feel here.

As we looked and consulted, we said, ultimately until the biggest part of the housing correction is over there is no way to have a stable financial system.

and more substantiation of the method they picked.

[cyberpj]

16. Now Bernanke's turn to respond - firms we're dealing with now are not failing but

contracting and in order to address the liquidity of the market -
we'r ebetter off trying to address root causes.

Also touted his 'financial disaster' credentials.

[MorningGlow]

10. ROFL! Shelby--"You did consider other proposals...?"

Paulson: "Uh...yeah...uh. Yep."

LIAR!

[shadowknows69]

12. Wow Shelby asking what other plans they considered

Good question. Bullshit answer coming, but good question.

[MorningGlow]

14. Ub ub uh ub...

Yeah, lots of stammering and blinking there, Paulson. LIAR!!!

[Gin]

17. I am glad Hank cares about me. Liar

[Gin]

21. we are doing this to protect "The System"....gee I thought the system was

broken...ergo we need a bailout.

[Mist]

18. Paulson on rationalizing buying foreign assets: well, foreigners are

doing business with us, so it helps our system overall. (Did I get that right?)

[MadrasT]

19. "This is all about the American taxpayer"

"This is all we care about."

I call BULLSHIT. :grr:

[cyberpj]

22. I was offended by that as well.

[GoodSpud]

23. I second that call n/t

[bdamomma]

55. Paulson said that.

he only cares about 38 million he made there as EX CEO of Goldman Sachs.

these people make me sick.

this debt will explode all over us if they do this bailout.

disaster capitalism.

[AngryOldDem]

72. Like hell it is.

And that pissed me off. While I may not be a Wall Street Wizard, I recognize pure, unadulterated BULLSHIT when I hear it, see it, and especially SMELL it.

How the hell can they say that when they are still defending CEO compensation and telling some homeowners, "Tough shit...you may be foreclosed on anyway"?

My only consolation is that I don't think most of the finance committee is buying this either.

While I know I'm committing financial suicide by saying so, everyday I am more of the mind to just let the goddamned markets FAIL.

A part of the bailout should be a complete criminal investigation of all the CEOs, CFOs, COOs, fund managers, etc. Then a special wing of a federal pen should be renamed Wall Street, where they can go and cheat, lie, and steal all they want (while playing golf, of course).

Once again, the little guy gets fucked. Royally.

[cyberpj]

20. Paulson said dealing with complicated securities with various asset classes

which require different measures.

We need to deal with all level of banks.

Trying to develop mechanisms to create value to induce private capital.

I keep noticing how often they say "try" and "may" and "hope" - protecting themselvs from more failure blame.

[Mist]

24. Yeah--their line, post election: "Well, we TRIED." nt

[Gin]

31. I noticed that too...it sounds so dire..NOT......get it done by Friday....

another sky is falling routine from these clowns

[cyberpj]

25. Shelby - how do you justify bailing out banks that are root cause of this problem?

They will more than likely profit dealy from this.

Paulson repeats he shares the frustration and that it's much better than the alternative.

Says he is angry at what got us here.

But by far this solution is the best for taxpayers because consequences are worst.

[Wilber_Stool]

26. I think being charged with

fraud though the world court has something to do with this. It wouldn't be too hard to prove.

[MorningGlow]

27. Shelby! Dude is holding Paulson's stinky feet to the fire

"What if it doesn't work?" :applause:

[barbtries]

28. okay.

no way should this guy get this passed. it is a scam. i am convinced that it is a scam.

have to add: i'm sorry this has happened. i wish i wasn't here doing this. this is for the good of the country.

i don't believe him. he's lying. it's all part of a piece, the whole shebang, what they been doing all along.

[MorningGlow]

34. Agree

Way to much stammering and stuttering and blinking going on. Paulson's a blithering idiot at this point.

A bit off topic--eewwww what was with that lizard tongue of Paulson's just now as he went to take a drink? That's gonna give me nightmares!

[Mist]

29. Paulson says "this problem has been brewing for a long time." While you and your

financial buds just sat and watched, right?

[cyberpj]

30. Shelby - what if it doesn't work - your others didn't.

Paulson says Fannie and Freddie save worked.

Paulson says saving AIG prevented calamity.

Repeats again this will get to the root cause (housing) and free up capital and invite confidence.

[Roland99]

67. But the housing prices have dropped which have left those derivatives worthless now.

Can't fix housing prices for YEARS!

This is such a boondoggle for the elite.

[Solly Mack]

32. He didn't ask - what does the plan do...he asked, what if it doesn't work

[cyberpj]

33. Regrettably not every homeowner will be able to stay in their home. But

the plan will make financing available.

[L. Coyote]

35. "dealing with the root cause" ROFLMAO

[SmokingJacket]

36. I have a question: Would buying up all the bad debt mean

all the *future* bad debt, too? Because surely there's more defaults to come.

Or is it just setting the needle back to zero?

I see they want to buy up bad consumer and student debt too... If there are going to be institutions that take on bad debt, where does it stop?

[Solly Mack]

37. I agree with consequences...but not now

[cyberpj]

39. Continues to put any "fixing" back on congress pointing to totally outmoded regulation system.

[cyberpj]

42. Now says most shoddy mortgages were regulated at the state level.

[mikelgb]

40. wow

Johnson

[gateley]

41. Paulson keep saying that it "better than the alternative" --

has anybody spelled out what would actually happen if we didn't agree to this?

[closeupready]

48. or HOW it's going to be paid for????

??

[LSK]

53. yes

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=4027506

[MorningGlow]

43. OMG Paulson was "shocked--SHOCKED"

Ohhhhhh I've gotta :rofl: or I'm gonna :cry:

[MadrasT]

50. Shocked. My. Ass.

:rofl: :puke:

[Mist]

44. Paulson claims that the regulatory system didn't keep up with the financial system. He has a point,

BUT, it can't be said enough that this criminal administration has believed in NO regulation.

[Gin]

49. hmmm...future administrations let exist....interesting

g

[cyberpj]

46. In terms of compensation, lots needs doing but Paulson submits we can't do those quickly enough

to get this system going.

[Solly Mack]

47. lolol there wasn't the kind of regulations in place to boost a free market

lolololololol


that's what he basically just said

regulation was one thing...the system was another...so the regulations weren't in place for the system in use

[Mist]

59. What mendacity--there has been a "NO OVERSIGHT, NO REGULATIONS" administration in place

for 8 years. I wish they'd stop wringing their hands and saying "gee, we had "outmoded" regulations." You had NO regulations, and none of you seemed interested in supplying them in the financial industry, regardless of what the criminal mal-administration was doing or not doing. You were supposed to "police yourselves," right?

[Solly Mack]

61. Exactly! I about fell out of my chair when he said that

[cyberpj]

51. Paulson: guess what, taxpayers are already on the hook - if this system is not fixed

they're already going to pay

[MorningGlow]

54. Yeah--sounded like a threat to me

Major strongarming going on. This dude pisses me off. :grr:

[shadowknows69]

57. So if we're going to pay anyway

Why give them the money? Let the chips fall. The only way to win against a bluff is to call it.

[cyberpj]

58. Now you just KNOW they'll say we'll pay MORE through failure than this attempt to save.

[MorningGlow]

83. Yeah, I love Paulson's threats

Well, the taxpayers are on the hook anyway, so give us the money. :wtf:

[shadowknows69]

52. Just flat out extorting us

Nobody gets any loans if we don't get our way now!1!

[cyberpj]

56. That's about all I can blog y'all - I've had my fill of demands with no substance. Later taters.

[shadowknows69]

62. Reverse Auction

So it's an auction but nobody but the US Treasury can buy.

[LSK]

76. yes because the whole idea is for the Govt to clean up the securities

They are removing bad loans from the securities. The banks want to unload these questionable securities.

[kentuck]

63. We're dealing with "complex securities"...

Too complex you for you peons to understand. Just give us the damn money, assholes!

[Gin]

64. exactly......................

[shadowknows69]

66. So complex they took three whole pages to explain it originally

[shadowknows69]

65. THREAD FOUR HERE

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4066682>

[Roland99]

68. You could probably go 100 posts between threads

Not much graphics going on...well...I say that and look at my sig. he he

[shadowknows69]

71. I know but I might have to leave the party soon

Between my pain meds and trying to understand this economic mumbo jumbo I may pass out soon lol.

[Roland99]

74. I'm down to half dosage on my meds.

hang in there. ;)

[LSK]

70. 100 posts is usually the baseline for a new thread

[shadowknows69]

73. We live we learn

Appy polly loggies.

[LSK]

69. many people are confusing issues

I understand that many securities contain bad loans of different types. I just realized why student loans and other loans are involved also.

I wish the Senators would stop confusing the issue with separate bailouts.

[LSK]

75. Paulsons problem is that he cannot explain himself

[babylonsister]

78. Or is afraid to. nt

[LSK]

80. no, I think he just cannot explain himself and the Senators are confusing things

From what I read from Hamdenrice's explanations and what he has said, I think I understand what he wants to do, but everyone is confusing issues with AIG and other bailouts with this plan.

I think he is really scared of the banking system completely collapsing or freezing and even Neocons need banks to function.

[babylonsister]

82. See post #60, and why

is this suddenly so dire? I have no sympathy for him; he must have skirted his responsibility for us to be where we are now.
Who should be held accountable?

[LSK]

87. because potentially banks stop moving money around

Please read hamdenrice's posts:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=4027506

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=4059821

[babylonsister]

90. I've referenced HR's posts. Here's a different POV:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4062078&mesg_id=4062242

[LSK]

92. I do not agree

If the plan works right, the taxpayers will actually make money off of this. They are buying questionable securities at a discount (this is where banks take a loss), then they are taking the bad loans out of these securities and selling good new securities for a profit.

It just seems so simple to me and I cant figure out why others dont get it??? Have we been so bamboozled by the Bush admin that when they actually try to do something correctly we dont trust them???

Boy called wolf too many times and now the wolf is here and we dont believe him.

[babylonsister]

93. You are so right! I have a very difficult time believing them

after what they put our country through, through lies.

But why are you so ready to believe them when even many rethugs don't? Here's two, for starters...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=4061915

And what about Paulson and his connections? It smells bad to me.

[LSK]

94. I am not going by Rethugs opinions of this because they are mostly shit for brains

And it seems to me that many Senators do not understand this as this has nothing to do with Bear Stearns, AIG, Freddy Mac bailouts.

[BraneMatter]

77. the market today...

appears to be levitating (slightly up) in place as the hearing goes on.

Goes to show, I guess, that no one is sure how this bailout will look in the end or what its effect will be...

And listening to Paulson, it's obvious that the "assets" here are so "complex" (his words - Oh, what a tangled web they wove!)that there is no rational price discovery mechanism. (In other words, we don't even know what the trillion dollars is buying!) That just means they have mixed up the good with the bad to the point that no one knows how to value the securities they might want to purchase.

Just lovely. So Paulson wants "leeway" as to how, exactly, the assets will be auctioned off. We should just "trust" the experts to make the right call, protect the taxpayers interests, and to not show any favoritism.

This stinks.

[Wilber_Stool]

79. And because this has to be done at record speed

nobody will know what the fuck they are buying and what it is worth. I've got a car that doesn't run. Can I sell them that?

[LSK]

81. do banks rely on your car to back interbank loans?????

:shrug:

[LSK]

84. what strikes this to me is that Paulson HATES having to do this

He does not want the Govt anywhere near the markets so for him to do something like this must mean he is legit and there is a real problem.

[bushmeister0]

88. Newt Gingrich yesterday on ATC

"I think that Secretary Paulson has shown almost no understanding of how a democracy operates. His initial draft would have given him $700 billion of your tax money with no oversight, no judicial review, no accountability. I mean, we're not a dictatorship."

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=94900671

[LSK]

Hagel is right, there is a lot of misunderstanding here

[bushmeister0]

85. Who are these "experts" Paulson is talking about?

He sounds like Ross Perot.

'We got reports, we're going to get under the engine and do, do, do.'

[LSK]

86. he is going to need a lot of people to go through the mbs and remove bad loans

[LSK]

89. dude can you please explain how banks use MBS

You are killing yourself.

[bushmeister0]

91. Eliminating conflicts of interest?

First thing is to get Paulson and Bernancke out of the picture.