What this bailout looks like to this working man.

[angrycarpenter]

For most of my life I paid zero attention to the economy. I had no pension plan or 401K. Stocks and bonds were exotic creatures that rich people played with and had nothing to do with my life of laboring for a paycheck.

I remember my total disinterest in the subject. I remember how I felt during the S+L crisis. Even the economically ignorant man I was could not miss the significance of the government giving money to rich people who were in danger of going broke. I now know that it was much more complicated than that but that is what it looked like to me. There can be wisdom in simplicity.

It is my theory that if you can get rich enough to go several million in debt then the other rich people will make sure that you remain rich to be able to pay it off. Look at George Bush. They will not allow one of their own to become one of the lower class.

I believe that there are two Americas. It is easy to see when you are near the bottom. We have little time to find nuance in life. We are forced into either/or choices every day. There is no one taking care of us or looking out for our interests, we are used to it.

Few of us ever realistically expected to become super rich. We believed that hard work and a simple checkbook understanding of economics could add up to a secure life. But as I started to work towards that goal something was not working. I could never get past the bills for the necessary things to save money for the extras. Every upward path started in the hole, in debt. I was perhaps a fool for never taking on debt as a young man to build credit but at the time it seemed like a good idea. I balked at taking on debt believing that a frugal lifestyle would be a good substitute. For years I simply saved for the things I needed and it worked. Well frugal has turned into just plain poor. There is no longer the possibility of saving for the things that I want. My salary has been steadily going down while prices go up.

A large middle class was the carrot that made working class people get to work and excel at their jobs. Many of us made the jump. The side effect is that the middle class tried to jump up a class too. These foreclosed MacMansions that I have been building for the last few years are silent reminders of a host of broken dreams. These people had dreams, there is nothing wrong with that, but trying to jump up in class by simply taking on massive debt seems like lunacy to me.

So now that we are about to pay the price for dreaming big all I can do is shake my head. Our "strong" economy was based on empty promises that debt alone was a thing to base an economy on. No capitalist seemed to think that sending jobs away and beating down wages could cause a lot of people to default on loans. That wages that did not keep pace with prices would slowly strangle us with debt that could not be repaid. seems like a no-brainer to me. We are all about to become the victims of the trickle-down theory.

If we were persons like corporations are than we would have already been bailed out. The working class has been in recession for years and no one seemed to care. But now that there is a danger that rich people may lose to this insane system of belief that a piece of paper is worth more than a factory of busy workers are they finally doing something about it. The rich will make sure that the rich remain so. Like always all of the money will go to the top with all of us to pay the bill.

If just one rich person became poor I would feel a lot better about this. This is still trickle-down economics. It will do what what it always does. Widen the gap between us and the people who think they own us. As long no one is punished hard for their greed and no policy is reexamined, I see it as grand, grand, grand theft.

[lostnotforgotten]

1. Well Said!

eom

[HCE SuiGeneris]

2. Geez...

you have very successfully substituted your nail gun for a chisel.

Well sculpted. :thumbsup:

[panader0]

3. Thank you angrycarpenter

I am in the same boat with you, except that I am basically a bricklayer. I started at age 20, bought land, busted ass for years, (I'm 58). I still live week to week, still have to work hard to make ends meet. You said a mouthful.

[angrycarpenter]

8. I accepted years ago

That I would work until the day I died. I never thought for a minute that there would be a shortage of work for a skilled tradesman. Now what? Idle hands are the devil's workshop.

[MadrasT]

4. Sir, you hit the nail on the head with this:

If just one rich person became poor I would feel a lot better about this.

:toast:

[CoffeeCat]

5. Main Street is going to implode...

...just as Wall Street is imploding now.

We are going to see massive pain and agony coming from the upper-middle and middle class--for the very
reasons that you outlined. At least half of the upper-middle and middle class folks were inflating their
income by using credit cards and using their homes as ATMs--and squandering the money on things that they
could not afford.

Our entire Main Street way of life was propped up on borrowed dollars.

Now, that spigot is going to turn off. Man............do people realize what is going to happen to
the economy when the spending stops?? Massive, plate-shifting implosion.

People are maxed out on their credit cards. They have switched from "buying" mode to "paying off" and
"saving" mode. People aren't getting those home-equity loans for furniture, granite counter tops and
vacations.

The demand curve for almost everything non-essential is going to shift downward and to the left. Less
demand for everything. I can't even fathom the number of restaurants, gift shops, furniture stores,
books stores, travel agencies, specialty stores, and big-box retailers that this will significantly
impact. Unemployment---through the roof!

You did well, staying out of debt.

[coalition_unwilling]

6. I liked this a lot. - The only thing I

would add is that the wealthy amassed their wealth by extracting the surplus value from millions of workers just like you.

Lenin argued that a class can exist in itself without acting for itself. The key, I think, is to forge class consciousness as an absolute prerequisite to a class acting in its own interests.

[angrycarpenter]

9. somehow

we need to be able to discuss the problem of class without bringing Marx and Lenin up. I know that they came up with the concept of class struggle but to most Americans just saying those names will negate your argument to matter how well founded.

[coalition_unwilling]

10. Understood. "Marx" and "Lenin" are bad words to the

general American populace. I do find their insights useful in understanding some of what is happening. I'm not sure even Marx or Lenin could have predicted the circumstance we are now facing. (Lenin probably more so than Marx, since Lenin had a good understanding of imperialism.)

[Historic NY]

7. Why would you bail out a company that squanders its assets...

us common folk got screws by the bankruptcy & credit card bills so tell them to go to hell. We should not bail them out let them fail. How bad can it get for us?