I'm hearing a lot about "Western European-style socialism" lately

[many a good man]

Obama wants to restore marginal tax rates on the wealthiest to what they were Pre-Bush, and he is accused of ushering in "Western European-style socialism." I hear this time and time again from the McCain campaign and it is repeated ad nauseum by talking heads on the airwaves.

There are many lines of argument to counter this absurd proposition. But once, just once, I would love to hear an exposition on a comparison between the European and American experiences of social democracy.

In this country social welfare is always framed as taking from hard working Americans and giving to the lazy do-nothing ones. Aside from the coded racist implications of this message, it rings with a lot of truth. The fact that it does is an enormous embarrassment to the left. The embarrassment also stems from not presenting a viable vision for social democracy.

In Europe, EVERYBODY benefits from the welfare, not just the poor. Everyone gets high quality health care (with no worries of personal bankruptcy) and everyone (qualified) can get a nearly free higher education. Early childhood and elder care is also addressed much better than here. These are viewed as issues of basic morality in the civilized world.

Instead, in the United States, liberals must defend themselves against these false accusations and discount the possibility that the majority of American would embrace Western European-style social democracy, if only they knew what it really was. Instead our leaders pretend to agree with the false notion that it is something evil and immoral.

Before Democrats can fully embrace such a thing we must educate the populace and have a fair and fact-based conversation about the alternatives. Perhaps if next Tuesday really does usher in a new politics, we can eventually finally begin such a conversation.

[Trajan]

1. The same misdirection over and over again ...

I do wish Obama would have made a direct refutation of this line of attack .... This is the time honored tradition of the right wing condemning Democrats as 'socialists' and 'communists' even though it is quite clear they are neither ...

Quite clear, that is, to those who dont sink that chunk of red bait deep between their cheek and gum ...

We need to promote our own brand, without strawman and lies from the right wing ...

I would like to see that happen soon after Obama takes office ....

[SammyWinstonJack]

2. That conversation is long overdue!

:applause:

[codjh9]

3. Check out 'The European Dream', by Jeremy Rifkin. n/t

[many a good man]

6. Read it. European corporations have no problem competing w/Americans

The biggest bug-a-boo is always the worry that business will lose it's dynamism and innovation. Facts have proven that old canard to be utter horse shit.

I think there are many better spokesman that Rifkin. Like Will Dutton's The Myth of American Prosperity and others.

[zbdent]

4. Ever notice that

hoping for affordable health care = absolute support for Communism and Socialism?

supporting unions = absolute support for Communism and Socialism?

supporting public education = absolute support for Communism and Socialism?

asking for honest reporting = absolute support for Communism and Socialism?

and yet ...

advocating torture/death penalty for speaking out against the policies of the government, invading a country on a whim, demands for total submission of the workforce to the demands of the few, concentration camps, illegal wiretapping, illegal arrests, controlling the media through intimidation, etc. ...

is only considered "fascism" by the "deranged far-left loonies"?

[fascisthunter]

5. "EVERYBODY benefits from the welfare, not just the poor"

same here

[kenny blankenship]

7. OK. Fair enough! If Obama wins it's Western European-style socialism forever

That's the deal on offer, as the McCain Republicans understand it now.

And after they lose on Tuesday I'm going to MAKE SURE they stick by that understanding. You said it was SOCIALISM. With an exclamation mark. You were the ones who insisted on spelling it out like that. If Obama won that meant socialism you said. OK, the country just ratified "Socialism" (exclamation mark) in a landslide (exclamation mark).
Get ready to love it or leave it.

[many a good man]

8. LOL! The American people have spoken!!!

We have our mandate! Love it.

[many a good man]

9. Oops! double post

I was overtaken by exuberance