WTF California? You're supposed to be the progressive state.

[Barack_America]

Yesterday:

-Colorado defeated a measure to define life as beginning at fertilization

-South Dakota struck down a nearly comprehensive abortion ban

-Missouri approved a clean energy measure

-Washington approved physician-assisted suicide

-Michigan not only legalized medical marijuana, but loosened restrictions on stem-cell research

...and...

-California approved a gay marriage ban?

:wtf:

But hey, at least y'all voted to ban chickens from being kept in cramped cages.

So let me get this straight...chicken rights? Yes. GLBT rights? No?

I am an unwavering supporter of animal rights, but come on, this is ridiculous and unacceptable. I'm at a loss to see how the same electorate could approve both of these measures on the same ballot.

I've seen a lot of blame regarding this embarrassment placed in the laps of California's African American voters, and there is undeniably prejudice in the black community regarding GLBT persons. Let's just be frank about that. But I ask you, what did the California Democratic Party do to try to convince African American voters to strike down Prop 8? What did progressive organizations do to try to reach out to black voters? That's what I want to know.

Do I see prejudice here? Absolutely. But I also suspect a poorly organized and operated campaign to inform and discourage prejudice.

I am not familiar with the detailed politics of the Prop 8 struggle, but I want to learn what happened here because this has to be undone. Prop 8 is a black mark on my experience of this election. As much as I am elated today, I am equally saddened by the news coming from California. And I have to wonder, couldn't we have seen this coming?

http://www.sfweekly.com/2008-10-08/news/will-black-neighborhoods-in-s-f-support-the-gay-marriage-ban-again/">Will black neighborhoods in S.F. support the gay marriage ban — again?

Let me just clarify before I post this, that I am in no way criticizing California DUers. I know which side of the issue you all are on. But the California Democratic Party? Well, that's a different story. If anyone has seen a good postmortem about how this travesty occurred, I'd love to read it. Thanks.

I have a feeling that I'm about to get seriously flamed here, so let me prepare myself....okay...I'm ready.

[slackmaster]

1. California is a large, diverse, and complex state

Calling us "the progressive state" does not present anything close to a full picture.

[Le Taz Hot]

2. Between the Mormons, Knights of Columbus,

the christofascist churches and, sadly, the African-American and Hispanic communities, we couldn't mount enough of a counter effort this time. We're not done yet. Trust me.

[EFerrari]

17. Do you know a site where we can see those numbers?

I can't seem to find any. Or, maybe they just aren't up yet.

[Le Taz Hot]

32. I think we both know they're not up yet.

The KOC & the Mormons stated outright they were funding all the "Yes on 8" stuff. Same with the fundy churches -- regardless of the congregational race. As for African-Americans and Latinos, are you seriously going to deny there is prevalent anti-gay sentiment in both communities? If so I would be surprised. You and I disagree often but I've never known you to be disingenuous.

[EFerrari]

37. No -- you're misunderstanding or, I'm not clear. I'm trying to figure out

what happened and where, that's all. I'm not defending anyone or anything, I just want to know where the work either failed or wasn't done or needs to be done.

[Le Taz Hot]

72. OK, I totally misread that.

Senior Moment.:blush: Anyway, it's the only answer that makes sense. Obama won California by 24 percentage points. I think it's a safe bet that African-Americans and Latinos turned out in record numbers to vote for Obama. BUT the Latino Faithful tend towards the Catholic church more than any other Christian denomination and, as we know, the Catholic Church (through the KOC) provided a large amount of funding on the "Yes on 8" campaign. Likewise, among the African-American faithful, most belong to Baptist and Southern Baptist churches who also preached against gay marriage and funded the "Yes on 8" campaign. Finally, at some point, the anti-gay sentiments among these two groups really HAS to be addressed within those respective communities.

[EFerrari]

76. That's true. Another point of entry is -- wtf happened to San Francisco voters.

Only half of us voted? And what about GOTV? Why did it pass in flaming LOS ANGELES by about 1%?

I want to see what happens when early and absentee ballots are counted. Three no votes from my (Latino, Catholic) family are sitting in a stack somewhere.


Newjock's OP made me cry -- because he's right and it feels terrible. WTF, San Francisco?!

[Barack_America]

29. That's what I've been hearing. That the "Yes on Prop 8" forces completely out-organized.,,

The "No on Prop 8" efforts. Out-organized and out-funded.

[goodgd_yall]

97. I think the NO on Prop 8 campaign was complacent

It saw the polls showing No ahead early on and were overly confident.

[onehandle]

3. Free Republic is based in California.

And the Terminator is their Governor.

A lot of stupid, stupid people live in California.

[succubus.blues]

4. A lot of stupid people.

Go outside of the Bay Area and LA and it's a completely different state...red, red, red.

[onehandle]

7. Yeah, but it wasn't just the red areas that recalled Davis and elected Arnold twice.

"It's cool to have an action hero as Governator."

Sheesh!

[Le Taz Hot]

10. And a lot of VERY SMART PEOPLE

live in California but let's just ignore them. Thhhhpppppttttt!

[onehandle]

11. I am quite sure there are.

They need to be driven to the polls.

[Le Taz Hot]

19. Being from Georgia, I'd think you'd want to clean up

your own back yard before trying to clean up someone else's.

[onehandle]

27. Puh! We're a lost cause.

It's the 1950s here again in the deep south.

[toadzilla]

101. yeah like me, and all my friends...

we all voted no.

[MarkInCA]

52. Don't forget

Frerepublic is based in Fresno, CA which elected Alan Autry as mayor.

Bubba is my mayor (not for long) and Terminator is my Governator.

I also wondered last night what the hell happened to my state. Then I remembered who bankrolled 8.

[Le Taz Hot]

74. Oh, Christ!

McCain won Fresno county by a whole 26 VOTES in Fresno County. Fresno County went for Clinton in '92 and '96. Quit this shit! Quit alienating the Central Valley! We sure as hell had a higher turnout that SAN FRANCISCO!

FreeRepublic may be based in Fresno, CA but THEIR MEMBERS ARE ALL OVER THE FUCKING WORLD, INCLUDING, I MIGHT ADD, FROM YOUR CITY! Did you not hear ANYTHING your president said last night??????????????

[goddess40]

5. It's a sad day for California's history

It's no different than denying adult couples of different races, religions or whatever reason the right to marry.

Wisconsin, where I live, is no better. Two years ago the haters got the same nasty agenda on our ballot and the haters came out in droves to vote for it. I hang my head in shame.

[JuniperLea]

6. I understand your frustration, however...

The DUers in CA are not a full representation of her citizenry. I voted no, and as a CA DUer, I resent being chastised along with those who voted yes and most likely do NOT post on or read DU. How about channeling all that righteous indignation into something positive in the way of continuing the fight.

[Barack_America]

14. .

From the OP:

"Let me just clarify before I post this, that I am in no way criticizing California DUers. I know which side of the issue you all are on."

[JuniperLea]

41. Uh huh...

Let me criticize you, but I'm not criticizing you.

I'm a native Californian. Sorry if I take issue with your taking issue... I am angry with my neighbors here who voted yes on 8... and I also know NONE of them read DU... so I find it a huge waste of time trying to battle peopel who aren't even here.

[Barack_America]

50. Unless you were an integral part of the plan and implementation of "Defeat Prop 8" efforts.

I'm seriously not criticizing you.

[JuniperLea]

66. I'm sorry...

I'm really mad about this myself. Mostly, I'm upset because it is clear from my perspective that so-called Christians were the main force in defeating this. They don't seem to realize that their hatred and fear of homosexuals and homosexuality is not even close to being Christ-like, and their reaction to their fellow children of God is disgusting to me. They are doing exactly what Christ taught against doing. Like judging. Like bearing false witness against their neighbor (one of the Big Ten!) with all the lies in their ads. If God had wanted to force laws upon all, he would have. I could go on and on... but I'm disgusted.

[AsahinaKimi]

94. Thank you for that...

I agree..

[shanti]

8. don't target us here on DU!

we didn't do the damage...

[Barack_America]

20. I specifically stated that I was not targeting DUers.

What I would like to know is how an important part of the progressive platform failed in a state previously able to promote important progressive ideals.

I suspect the California Democratic Party needs to reevaluate how it reaches out to minorities on issues that may not be supported by their churches.

[Romulox]

9. What's so "progressive" about California?

I've never seen a place so stratified by wealth and racial division as Los Angeles. :hi:

[tjwash]

18. Take a trip down to San Diego...puts LA to shame in that area.

And then you have the OC, which makes Texas look like Berkley.

[flamingdem]

12. CA has many progressive Latino voters who are catholic or evangelical

That's my guess as to how this happened.

[EFerrari]

13. There's still 3-4 million votes to count. No on H8 is not conceding.

[Barack_America]

38. That's the most encouraging bit of news I've heard all day.

Thanks for that. I'll be following this closely.

[ProgressiveFool]

15. Looks like we'll have a use for that "I'm Sorry" site after all

I'm sorry, it definitely does diminish the overall victory quite a bit.

[tjwash]

16. I know...we suck.

Again.

[Barack_America]

24. Nope. Not you. But I can't see this as anything other than a blow to the CA Dem party.

Serious mistakes were made here and we need to figure out what they are. Remember that saying, "As goes CA, so to goes the nation"?

For once, that is a frightening idea.

[Ichingcarpenter]

26. The California Democratic Party officially said to vote No on the proposition

but the church pulpits said to vote yes

[Barack_America]

35. And they did what to get around the pulpits?

As they certainly knew that they would have to reach out to those voters another way?

I'm really not trying to trash the state of CA, but this is extremely jarring to me. CA has been ahead of the curve on so many progressive issues, so to see it regress so stunningly is, well, stunning. I fear that this will embolden proponents of similar measures in other states. I fully expect to be voting on a similar measure in PA in 2010. Not only voting on such a measure, but actively working to defeat it. And considering my city and state relies on African American votes driven by African American churches, I hope you can understand my concern.

[Ichingcarpenter]

40. Well maybe you can get a progressive/proposition on the ballot in your state

And address the problems of your own state's bigotry.

[AlCzervik]

44. well said.

it's not like we didn't try here and we'll keep on trying until everyone has equal rights.

[Barack_America]

59. That's fair enough. And it probably would be smart for PA to head this off at the pass.

We know it's coming.

You can be sure that I'll be checking in on what's going on in this state and be lending my support big-time.

[tjwash]

63. Hey...if you can learn some lessons from our defeat out here, use them for your state.

I hate to say it...but it was like the commercial aspect of it out here was marketed poorly, and targeted the wrong audience.

We elected, as is usual with us Dems, to take the high road in the issue, and tried to be polite and nice about it. We tried to just show just the facts of the debate; and we got our asses handed to us. The commercial aspect on the yes side was all about fear, lies, and preying on peoples inner prejudices. We ended up going into defense mode because of that almost immediately, instead of attacking them again and again, like we should have, and beating them over the head with their lies for all to see.

Maybe we need to try and hire James Carville or someone for advice on marketing that kind of stuff to voters.

[tjwash]

57. Hey now...our church received the Eleonore and Oliver Powell Award

For GLBT concerns AND we have been performing Gay and Lesbian marriages in our church. So...not ALL of the churches had a hand in the passage of this measure. Some of us were actively working against it.

But the conservative denominations do outnumber us greatly. That part is a fact of life, unfortunately.

We are starting the new attack on this travesty against the most basic of human rights starting today, and the official lawsuit against the decision should be getting filed in 15 minutes and counting.

[Iggo]

70. I live in L.A. County...

...and I watch a ton of TV and listen to the progressive radio staion. I never saw one No on 8 ad on TV. I hear they were out there, but I never saw one. But Yes on 8 was everywhere! Television all day long. Plus 10 times a morning on the Stephanie Miller show on the radio...another 10 times a day on the Rachel Maddow show in the afternoon, and probably all day long in-between (I dunno...I have a job.) I could only afford to give a hundred bucks to the cause and that sucks. Yes on 8 spent their money on visible and audible stuff. But where was all the money for No on 8 spent?

I suspect: bad organization, a lousy battle plan, and an "eyes-on-the-prize" mentality that tied their hands point where they (the democratic party leadership) were afraid of driving away the heavily catholic brown votes by coming out too strongly for the civil rights of gay people.

Cowardly? Pragmatic? Both? Does it matter?

[ContinentalOp]

77. I think if you lived here you wouldn't be surprised.

It's really not shocking at all that this passed.

[EFerrari]

79. Shocked the hell out of me. Everyone I talked to knew about it.

In and out of the city.

I can't help thinking that every thought somebody else had it covered and there was a LOT going on this election. Embarrassing.

[ContinentalOp]

85. This is the state that brought us Reagan, Schwarzenegger, Prop 187, etc.

And with Orange County, San Diego, and a big Catholic Latino population, this outcome shouldn't be very surprising to anyone.

[Zhade]

103. Ironically, Schwarzenegger was AGAINST prop 8.

NT!

[goodgd_yall]

98. The more liberal regions of California are out of touch with the other areas

It's like living in a protective cocoon. I wasn't surprised because where I live it was clear Yes on 8 had a lot of support.

[EFerrari]

112. L. A. County usually brings in progressive votes.

I know this state enough to know how red / bigoted some parts of it are. But, what happened in Los Angeles? If it passed there even by 1%, we screwed up.

[XemaSab]

21. There was NO democratic organization outside the big cities

:banghead:

[Barack_America]

25. That's a big problem.

Thanks for pointing that out.

Do you happen to remember your source? I really am interested in reading more about this.

[XemaSab]

45. My source is me

:P

I'm in Redding right now, and I've lived near Fresno before.

Here in Redding the Democratic party is totally split into factions, and the guy who IS democratic party headquarters is totally useless.

We tried to get an Obama sign for the front yard, but they were totally out.

We had to order stickers online. Last night there were TWO victory parties with about 75 people each.

We did not get ONE phone call other than Obama hitting us up for money and a McCain robocall. The only doorknockers and mailers we got were for city council.

As far as Prop 8 goes, I've seen a LOT of yes signs and NO no signs here... it's like it was running unopposed in this area.

I seriously suspect a lot of Democrats here don't even bother voting because they feel like their votes won't matter.

Right now I am feeling angry at the local party, the state party, and the national party.

Our congressional candidate was outspent by some egregious figure like 20 to 1, and he went down to flaming defeat, 60-40. He got NO national money.

It's like everyone knows Redding is a conservative area, so they just pass us by and it stays a conservative area. And it will CONTINUE to stay a conservative area with no party organization or action here.

:(

[Barack_America]

81. I forgot to thank you for this summary.

Sorry, I'm a bit out of it today. Slight hangover, sheer exhaustion and swollen eyes.

But I found your account very interesting, if not a little discouraging. I think it speaks to an apathy that we Democrats are really going to have to sit up and notice now that we are no longer "underground". We can't assume that just because we are now technically in the majority that every leftward nudge we give this country is going to take a fight from ALL of us.

(And I'm not suggesting that you, yourself were in anyway complacent, I'm talking about your account of how the CA Dem party operated in this election)

[XemaSab]

54. Here's an article about the congressional race:

Herger was the overwhelming fund-raising front-runner in the race against Morris.

Herger raised more than $880,000 this election cycle, according to the electronic filings he submitted to the Federal Election Commission.

That was more than 20 times the $43,000 raised by Morris.

http://www.redding.com/news/2008/nov/05/herger-leading-in-congressional-race/

[Kickin_Donkey]

106. Ha-ha, Wally is your rep, too?

Wally's been in office going on 20 years and hasn't done a single thing of note. He's simply a tool.

I saw him in person a couple of weeks ago, and he talks, dresses, and acts like a seedy drunk. Very dull-minded.

And, yes, he keeps getting re-elected because he has an "R" next to his name. We live in Wally World.

[XemaSab]

107. Yeah, Wally's a tool

Jeff would have been such a good rep, too.

I don't know what the hell is going on here. :(

[EFerrari]

39. I didn't even get updates from HRC. Did anyone else?

Maybe somehow I got bounced from their list? They found out I'm straight?! lol

[cboy4]

43. I didn't even get updates and I'm demanding an

explanation from them.

[EFerrari]

46. Now I feel really bad because I was paying attention to the wrong props.

:(

I just didn't know ANYONE who was voting for this POS and all the signs I saw were anti. And this is one of the most conservative hoods in San Francisco.

[Ignis]

68. Even in the East/South Bay, there was little organization.

I didn't see a large number of "No on 8" signs until ELECTION DAY!

:banghead:

Too little, too late.

[goodgd_yall]

100. I saw Yes on 8 TV ads over and over

too many to count. Whereas it was probably 6 times that a No on 8 ran. I was wondering why we didn't have more visibility.

[Cleita]

22. We've got too many religious wackos in the state.

I was tempted to put signs up in front of the Yes on 8 lawn signs, stating "Religious bigots live here!" But I knew they wouldn't have lasted and I could have been cited for trespassing. I still want to do something like that to the people who backed this law to point out their bigotry.

[OnionPatch]

116. Boy is that the truth!

I moved here after living in Ohio, Pennsylvania, Florida and Texas, and I can honestly say, I have never been so surrounded by religious whackjobs as I am here in the "Inland Empire." (San Bernardino and Riverside Counties.)

[ailsagirl]

23. There are a LOT of rural areas-- and many of those who live there

are staunch conservatives. Even so, it kind of surprised me too.

[cherokeeprogressive]

28. What I can't wrap my mind around is that McCain got a little more than 3.6 million votes and Prop 8

got 5.1 million yes votes. Over a million and a half voters seemingly voted for Obama, AND yes on Prop H8te.

How did this happen? I wish I had an answer.

[PatSeg]

34. I brought this up in another thread

There was a direct mail piece with Obama's picture on the front, making it look like he was FOR prop 8. Also there were a lot of misleading advertisements and flat out lies about the proposition. An obscene amount of money was put into the advertising blitz and most of it was deceptive. I really believe not everyone realized what they were voting for.

[donco6]

110. That's the question for me, too.

I can only conclude - *non-fundamentalist* Christian types who are OK with Obama (fundamentalists would probably never vote for him), but have been told gays will destroy marriage.

[AlCzervik]

30. We know we suck, we're not happy and I should have worked harder.

it's not enough to give money and have signs, i should have been out protesting.

[devilgrrl]

31. Anything away from the coastline is freeperville.

:-(

[Brewman_Jax]

33. Why are black people the only ones blamed for this?

they're only 6% of the state population and getting the majority of the blame? Why is no other demographic group being talked about? :grr:

[Barack_America]

36. I'm blaming the organization of efforts to defeat Prop 8.

With minority-outreach being just a component of what I suspect was a larger failure.

My goal of the OP was actually to discourage the Prop 8 nightmare being blamed just on African American prejudices. To do so is not only unfair, but dangerous in going forward to defeat similar (and now emboldened) measures in other states.

[Brewman_Jax]

67. A massive organization

including LDS and the Catholic church, from what I've read.

[Iggo]

53. I believe the bigger blame rests with...

...my people, the slightly lighter brown (than black).

I still think it sucks that such a huge percentage of minorities, including black people AND los chicanos, voted against civil rights, though.

[Barack_America]

60. .

I still suspect that an equally large problem is how the Democratic party approaches minority voters about such issues. You all are as complex an electorate as anybody else and I don't think the Democratic party in general does a good enough job tailoring messages and strategies specifically enough. I don't think the "reach blacks through African American churches" is going to be the most effective way of garnering support for GLBT rights. But it seems that Democratic leaders by and large are a bit clueless about how to proceed otherwise.

Sorry, I'm just rambling now. :blush:

[roody]

95. Plenty of white people voted for h8.

[Iggo]

109. That is a fact.

[ContraBass Black]

88. Convenience and predilection.

[The Craw]

113. Mike Malloy spent his whole radio show last night blaming black people

Normally i'm a huge Mike malloy fan, but last night he spent much of his show blaming black people for this measure being passed- I was shocked that such a progressive exposed a very ugly racist streak..

[MalloyProducer]

115. malloy on Kathy's login

This is a goddam lie. I did NOT spend "much" of my show blaming black people. I quoted an exit poll that said the MAJORITY of AA voters in CA voted in faor of 8. Today that was confirmed by the election board in California.

Why would this poster lie? Are you a right-wing troll? Shame on you for lying. That's what Republicans do. And you suggest I "exposed a very ugly racist streak . . .?" Are you out of your fucking mind?

- Mike Malloy
Nova M Radio

[The Craw]

118. There was a great deal of venom aimed at black people

Mike, it may not have been your intention to blame black people, but that is how you came accross on that particular show...

[slor]

42. I thought we were going stamp that with a...

big ass NO. But to tell you truth, there are quite a few closed minded idiots out here. And I moved from Cincinnati, OH, which is ripe with bigots, to Northern CA, which in parts, is not much different.

[EFerrari]

49. It passed by a hair in Los Angeles! That should NEVER have happened

because we know we're going to lose inland.

[MarkInCA]

47. LDS...end of story n/t

[indie_voter]

58. exactly. f'kers. n/t

[PatSeg]

48. Here is the direct mail piece I referred to in previous post

The reverse side has four black ministers' pictures and positions on Prop 8. "Dennis Kucinich and Mike Gravel are the only Democratic presidential candidates that support gay marriage. (then in bold and underlined) Obama does not support gay marriage.

[Barack_America]

56. Yes, thank you.

I did see that. I'd love to know what the response to that was. A direct mailer "correction"? Radio? TV?

Those are the sorts of questions that I'm hoping to find answers to. How we can keep this from happening again. That sort of thing.

Thanks for your post.

[PatSeg]

65. You're welcome

I saved it because it was so outrageous and it is only ONE of many pieces I've received. Evidently the Pro's had the money and backing needed, though I don't think people anticipated how overwhelming their campaign would be. I wish now I'd saved all the mail I've received. I've never seen this much propaganda for any proposition before.

[EFerrari]

62. Wow. n/t

[Taverner]

51. Yeah I know - we fucked up

Hopefully our court will rule 8 unconstitutional ...AGAIN

[SpookyCat]

55. I am beside myself.

I can't believe this bullshit passed. I can't believe my state allowed it to pass. I'm born and raised here in the Bay Area, and I have never been more ashamed of my state.


Rest assured we will continue to fight in whatever way we can. I guess it's for the courts now.

Fucking amazing to me.

[Barack_America]

61. Aw, I'm so sorry.

I really am. I don't know what else to say, other than Rick Santorum was my Senator while I lived in Philadelphia, so I understand a bit of how it feels to be so disconnected from the rest of your state.

:hug:

We'll make it right, somehow. All of us. This is not California's burden alone.

[SpookyCat]

84. ........

:hug:


thanks...that's nice...

[MindPilot]

64. ten's of millions of tax-free dollars from out-of-state LDS churches

we were quite simply out-gunned. The prop h8 proponents managed to convinced the electorate that it would protect their children from gay pedophile cross-dressing kindergarten teachers.

[SoCalDem]

69. What so many of these "people" don't even realize, is this..

For MOST of us over 40, we ALL had teachers who were "confirmed bachelors"...or "old maids/spinsters"...or "widows/widowers"..

And MANY of them have a spot in our hearts as "favorite teacher"...what we did not know about them, is that many of them were probably gay. There were no fancy computerized background checks back then, no investigators prying into every nook & cranny of their lives..

Gay people have historically gone into teaching, in great numbers, since it offered a stable (usually union) job, and since many of these people had no families of their own, those class kids, were like family to them, and they poured every ounce of energy into helping those kids (their kids) learn all they could..

It's only been fairly recently that so many have "declared themselves" or in some cases, been rudely "outed" by vindictive people with an axe to grind.


Looking back into my own past, I firmly believe that Miss Templeton was probably gay. She was my 7th grade English teacher. She was a very pretty woman of about 45. We always asked about her family..did she have any kids..

Her stock answer to us was, that she didn't have time for kids or family of her own, because she was too busy teaching all of us..and WE were all her kids.. I know she had a roommate, because she did not drive, and after school, her "roommate" would pick her up... and their faces lit up when they saw each other... She never "made us gay"..she just made us smart:)

[EFerrari]

78. Same here. My favorite teacher who said I could write in fourth grade.

Lesbian. She only made me a little gay. lol

And my mom is 75 and straight and following this closely as I am or more so. (My mom had this great experience when she was getting sober. About 60 days in, she found out her two sponsors were Lesbians. And she said, "How could you do that TO ME?" -- lol. They didn't turn her but they laughed and did some consciousness raising and the three are still great friends.)

[diamidue]

90. My son was home from the San Francisco Bay Area

this past week and he got on his cell phone to tell his friends how many YES on 8 signs were here in inland No. CA. He was stunned. He couldn't believe that he didn't see ONE sign for "NO on 8" the entire time he was here visiting. It was such a different scene where he lives in the Bay Area.

Arnie and 4 former CA governors came together to go against this measure. Sen. Diane Feinstein came out against it.

Religion just instills fear in people I guess.

[gardenista]

71. I only really know what's going on in my county, and we were NOT

let down by blacks and hispanics here in Contra Costa.

http://results.enr.clarityelections.com/CA/Contra_Costa/9041/13267/en/md.html?cid=0192

It's the conservative western part of the county that supported and voted for prop 8.

Most people outside the state don't understand that we have a massive suburban, exurban, and rural conservative population, and they are energized by this issue.

However, had we gotten a better turnout, even in SF, of urban voters, we would have had a chance to defeat this steaming pile of bigotry.

We will not give up.

[W_HAMILTON]

73. The feelings I have for California...

...are the same sorts of feelings most citizens of the world would have had if John McCain won our presidential election last night.

I'm so disappointed. As I said in another thread, being a Southerner and seeing discrimination constantly, I always looked up to places like California, that seemed so forward-thinking and accepting of everyone.

Oh well.

[Barack_America]

80. That's actually a pretty good summary of how I feel as well.

:hug:

[dana_b]

75. we are a far from perfect place

there are a lot of rural areas, conservative areas like Orange County and we are very diverse in our population. We're bound not to get it right all the time. Not making excuses, just sayig it like it is. In my own family, we have moderates (brother and his family), leftist libs (me and my kid) and religious fundies (sister, uncle and their families). We all live in California and are even related! Seriously, we're not that different than the rest of you.

[AsahinaKimi]

96. In the neighborhood where I live..

I didn't see many Obama signs.. and no McCain signs but I did see No on 8 signs.. and traveling around the city of San Francisco, I saw more No on 8 signs then anything. I don't know what happened. I can say that the newspaper ASIANWEEK endorsed NO on 8. Whether or not people saw that and read about it, I don't know.

[Johonny]

82. compared to the last time it was up to vote

This prop barely passed. California is coming a long way compared to almost every other state on this issue. It would help if a major religion came out in favor of civil marriage... but I'm not holding my breath.

[goodgd_yall]

83. I've always ranked Vermont and Massachusetts as more progressive than Cali

I actually find the Prop 4 defeat yet the passing of Prop 8 to be the most irritating. There's a lot of people who argued for "parental rights" as a reason to pass Prop 8, but then when it came to abortion, they don't care? It's the inconsistency that's maddening. I think, though, there were people who voted only for Prop 8 and nothing else on the ballot, but I'd have to check the numbers to see if that is supported.

[Rockholm]

86. New England is much more progressive.

[torgos_pizza]

119. Massachusetts still has it's fair share of right wing bigots

All of Boston talk radio is right wing, the Boston Herald is right wing, and there are still bigots in South Boston- Boston has come a LONG way since the busing crisis of the mid 1970s, but the right wing filth still exist...

[Rockholm]

122. That is quite true.

[fascisthunter]

87. because this is a Religiously Motivated Initiative, I feel it's Unconstitutional

they are stepping on our Separation of Church and State...

Checkmate

[blues90]

89. I've been in southern calif since 1981

I can't say this state is blue at all.

People here were stupid enough to allow Davis to be recalled after we got rid of the repub governers.

I got this robo call at 6 pm last night using a clip from Obamas speech where he said that marriage was between a man and woman and this call was to vote yes on prop 8 when all the candidates stood there and defended this insane man and women only marriage crap which I thought was insane in itself.

My wife and I voted no on prop 8.

With so many things wrong in this country something like this prop 8 should have never been on the ballot except the freakish idiots put it there. They give and they take it away and it's not right.

People who feel they have the right to tell couples what to do can kiss my ass. It is religious garbage.

[PatSeg]

91. Examples of some of the Yes for Prop 8 signs seen in

the Sacramento area: Proposition 8 = Less Government, Proposition 8 = Free Speech, and Proposition 8 = Education!

Then add a barrage of mailers, phone calls, and implications that Obama supported Prop 8! 74 million dollars of campaigning to discriminate against fellow citizens.

[varelse]

92. I couldn't tell you

everyone I know here is also making the :wtf: face and wondering what the hell happened. I'm also irritated that we allow a simple majority vote to pass amendments our state's constitution. It should require at least a 2/3 majority vote (and they'd never get that).

The only good news from California is that it looks like the younger voters were opposed to this amendment while the older ones were in favor of it, so time is on our side. I hope there's something we can do besides wait for the bigots to die off, though :(

[Imagevision]

93. Does this mean Ellen and Portia aren't legally married?

[Initech]

99. Meet the scary motherfucker behind Prop 8:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4372100

This guy makes John Hagee look sane by comparison.

[Ladyhawk]

102. Two words: Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Seriously, you might as well call the Sierra Nevada Foothills the "bible belt" of California. It's where I live and you'd swear you were in the South.

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/results/county/#CAP00map

Take a gander.

[Zhade]

104. He opposed it.

I know, I couldn't believe it either.

[EFerrari]

105. hey -- I have a question for you.

Do those numbers for L.A. County look right to you?

It passed by abut 1%

[busybl]

108. I think people are panicking for no reason

this will never stand up in court. challenges have already been filed.

[Bill McBlueState]

111. The "Yes on 8" ads must have been effective

They painted Massachusetts as a smoking hellhole where young children are forced to learn about the rights different people have. That prospect must have scared a lot of California voters.

[Barack_America]

114. Or the "No on 8" ads too few and far between.

But what you said about the ad campaign in MA is interesting and I'll look into it.

Now that this has passed in CA, I'm certain that we'll be seeing something similar in PA before long. Better start the oppo research now.

[Barack_America]

117. Post #115.

Check it out.

[defendandprotect]

120. You're right ...but lots of tax-exempt $$$ from Mormons---!!!

We haven't quite yet rid oursdelves of religious fanatics--!!

[upi402]

121. Ahnold is governor, and Raygun was...nuff said