Contact Nancy Pelosi right now and demand impeachment

[mudesi]

THE TIME FOR EXCUSES IS OVER

The Democrats have majorities in the House and the Senate, and the election is over. The time has come to do the right thing. The evidence is overwhelming.

Ms. Pelosi, we demand that you impeach, charge, try, and convict George W. Bush, Richard Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld for committing the crimes of

1) Deliberately misleading the nation into a preemptive, illegal invasion of a sovereign nation without provocation, in direct violation of international law.

2) The deliberate exposing of an undercover CIA operative.

3) The illegal detention of Prisoners Of War without due process, in direct violation of international law.

4) Illegally spying on American citizens without warrants in direct conflict of the Constitution of The United States of America. (A crime which George W. Bush has publicly confessed to)

5) The condoning of torture, in direct violation of international law.


Don't reply with "what's the point", or "it's a time for healing", or any other such nonsense. I understand that there were political reasons to not impeach or hold criminal investigations. But those reasons are moot now. Justice delayed is better than justice denied. These people need to be held accountable for their crimes. I want them in prison. Now.

[mike_c]

1. hear hear! We cannot rest until the war criminals are brought to justice!

Recommended!

[oldtime dfl_er]

2. I agree with this

The whole bunch of them should be tried for war crimes.

[Kashka-Kat]

3. IS IT TRUE that if Bush pre-emptively pardons everyone they can't be prosecuted later?

Seems like I read that somewhere. Which means it's imperative that something be started NOW to prevent that from happening. If for no other reason then for posterity and for the historical record - we need to know what happened and learn from it and move on.

[Countdown_3_2_1]

29. Its Happened Before. The precedent is set. (nt)

[Independent_Liberal]

34. From what I understand, pardons can be challenged in court.

So they're not necessarily the final say in things.

[dems_rightnow]

42. You're quite wrong there

The power to pardon is granted in the Constitution, and that power is absolute.

[Independent_Liberal]

43. I heard differently from a few experts.

I can't remember exactly where I heard it, but I know the source was credible. If I find anything relating to this, I'll be sure to post a follow-up.

[dems_rightnow]

46. Please do.

It's been judicially ruled an absolute power. The power to pardon is left solely to the discretion of the president, and cannot be reviewed or overturned by any of the other branches of government.

[yodermon]

55. Bush can pardon at the stroke of a pen so impeachment can't prevent that unless

impeachment proceedings are done in secret, and the conviction in the senate is done in secret.

However, Mass pardons by Bush is very risky, because those pardoned cannot plead the 5th amendment if compelled to testify about abuses of power by Bushco.

Also, impeachment should still be carried out, even against those pardoned, because according to the Constitution impeachment also does the following: "disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States" In other words they cannot sneak back into power as did some of the iran contra/bcci crooks from the reagan/poppy years.

[amdezurik]

4. I don't give a damm what photo's they have of her

or what compromising positions they are, Nancy has forgotten SHE DOES NOT COUNT, the Constitution does

[petgoat]

20. How can you accuse Nancy of such selfishness that she'd sell out her country for her own reputation?

Maybe the photos are of her grandson.

[amdezurik]

valid point...

:P

[petgoat]

40. "About that favorite nephew of yours who wants to get into Harvard Law...."

That's the kind of talk that comes from unregulated wiretaps.

And the Democrats and Obama have done next to nothing to protect us from them.
Not only have they not done away with the powers, they haven't promised not to
use them.

[ixion]

5. agreed... Pelosi needs to grow a spine and do her freakin' job

rather than sitting there shivering like a chihuahua.

[onenote]

10. actually, she has been doing her job

You just don't understand what the job of the speaker is, apparently.

Its not to tilt at windmills or lead the party down a path it doesn't want to go. Pelosi can and does count votes. And its a lock that there aren't the votes to move to the next stage for impeachment (which would be a resolution passed by the full House instructing them to conduct a full blown impeachment inquiry).

And its the last thing Obama wants -- shift the narrative from his amazing victory and hopes for the future to a pointless quest aimed at the past.

Not. Going. To. Happen.

[ixion]

18. the job of every elected official: UPHOLD THE CONSTITUTION

Pelosi has failed miserably at this, and as a leader, IMO.

[onenote]

6. not going to happen. and most people don't care

[bdamomma]

9. it's not water under the bridge

but I hope some justice comes to these SOB's they can't walk away freely.

[arikara]

12. Unfortunately you are probably half right

it probably won't happen.

But...

People Do Care.

[Greyhound]

17. To our international embarrassment and historic shame, thank you very much.

"Amerika 2.0, where good enough is good enough and right and wrong are merely inconsequential notions subject to the convenience of the moment".

I'm so proud.
:puke:

[petgoat]

22. "most people don't care about the constitution and neither do i" is a low-road position.

You should be ashamed of yourself, onenote.

I'm ashamed of you.

[onenote]

32. Sorry. But I'm just telling it as it is.

And if you're ashamed of me, I guess you also are ashamed of our President-Elect. Because I guarantee he has no interest in seeing a debate over impeachment during the 10 weeks leading up to his taking the oath of office.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-06-28-obama-impeachment_N.htm

[petgoat]

36. I am ashamed of a nation that won't repudiate in the strongest terms the international thuggery

of its elected chief executive.

Bush made clear his contempt for the law, for the international community,
for our system of government through checks and balances, for democracy,
for the American people, and for simple human decency.


We must have accountability. If Bush is allowed to leave office as if
nothing had happened, our culture will suffer.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

7. No Way. It Is An Absurd Notion.

99% of Congress would find it absurd.

It would be the quickest way to make us look like partisan fools and plummet the good vibes that are currently going around.

[RobertSeattle]

11. Agreed

[cynatnite]

21. Absolutely right. n/t

[annarbor]

50. thank you....

No chance in hell that Barack Obama or the new congress is going to spend one moment addressing issues other than the economy, the war and our fucked up health care system. I'm willing to bet that impeachment isn't even on their radars....

[mudesi]

60. Good vibes? Who cares?

What is it with you anti impeachment people?

Do you deny that Bush has committed crimes? If not, then why are you against his being held accountable for those crimes?

The election is over. There is literally nothing to lose politically. Nothing.

Except "good vibes", I guess. :eyes:

[petgoat]

61. There's nothing partisan about defending the Constitution from Bush's imperial precedents. nt

[nichomachus]

8. Whatever you do

don't hold your breath

[bowens43]

13. It's not going to happen and it would be a very bad move.

It's past. It's over. Let it go. Most people would see it as a silly political stunt.

[petgoat]

23. It's not over. Bush has established the precedents of Imperial executive powers.

Unless impeachment removes them from the presidential toolbox,
they will remain, waiting for some Chief Pandora to assault our
grandchildren with them.

The Constitution is only a piece of paper unless it's defended,
and the only way to defend it is impeachment.

[leftofthedial]

14. Hear! Hear!

Although I expect we'll hear nothing but "kumbaya" from the "democrats" now.

They'll have another version of their "real agenda" to focus on. Justice would just be a distraction don't you know, and would poison the well of bipartisanship.

[bvar22]

15. Don't waIit for Nancy to do anything.

Support an International Reward:

I will donate $500 to ANY organization that will place a Bounty on Bush/Cheney to be paid to anyone who provides concrete evidence that leads to their indictment or arrest.

A small, transparent trust located in a neutral country like Switzerland could administer the fund. If the BOUNTY is promoted internationally, it would quickly grow to Mega-Millions.

The fund would also be tasked with running full page Wanted For War Crimes ads in major Global newspapers every 3 months until the Bounty is awarded or depleted.

I believe that such a fund would be wildly popular worldwide, and provide the administrators an opportunity to make a little money.
I have neither the resources or skills to institute such a fund, but like I said above, I am willing to donate $500. I also believe that there are at least a million more worldwide (extreme minimum) who would also be willing to donate....that adds up to some serious money.

Wanted
for
WAR CRIMES


A $500 Million Dollar Reward will be paid to any individual, organization, or country that provides concrete information leading to the arrest, or the issuance of an Internal Arrest Warrant for War Crimes committed by George Bush, Dick Cheney, Colin Powell, Condoleezza Rice, or Donald Rumsfeld.

It is clear that the Opposition Party (Democratic Party) and the US Justice Department will do NOTHING to hold the criminals accountable.
A private organization representing Citizens of the World would have better results.
After observing the response to Michele Bachmann's appearance on MSNBC, I have no doubt that such a fund a HUGE success.

Even if Bush/Cheney are never arrested, a Mega-Million Dollar International Bounty would certainly keep them looking over their shoulders, curtail retirement travel plans, AND serve as a warning to future "Unitary Executives".

It would also put a nice ribbon around the Bush Legacy.

[Atman]

16. You are not a strategic thinker

Do I think Pelosi should immediately begin impeachment hearings? In a perfect world, yes. But it's far from perfect.

For starters, Obama won the White House. But the GOP is still firmly in control of the media. The only message that will get out is ultimately the message the GOP media wants out. They'll start hammering him very quickly, setting us all up for 2012 and how the crazy negro man fucked up the economy and the war, blah blah blah. Nancy could call for Bush's head on a stake, and the Media will make it out to be merely a vindictive revenge-fest.

Why bother? Get ALL our ducks in a row first.

.

[BrightKnight]

19. The political price would be very high and by the time you did he would be out anyway. - n/t

[petgoat]

26. The country must repudiate Bush's crimes through impeachment and criminal proceedings.

The world hates us for fucking up the global economy. How come our
predatory lenders get to screw everything up?

We need to show ourselves worthy of their respect.

Bush's invasion of Iraq was illegal and a war crime.

Any footdragging on Obama's part, any slow withdrawal, will be
participation in Bush's war crimes. Keeping the peace in Iraq
is not our job. It's the UN's. If Obama doesn't begin total
withdrawal in January, he will be not just complicit in but a
participant in Bush's war crimes.

[mudesi]

52. What price?

The election is over. Obama has won. The Democrats have won.

Do you really think 4 years from now Americans will even remember/care?

Not to mention that any American against impeachment shouldn't really be considered American.

[Why Syzygy]

24. What's more,

he is up there with his pen dipped in blood and signing everything Cheney puts in front of him. By the time Obama takes office, abortion will be illegal. This is not an over statement. He needs to be REMOVED.

[proud2BlibKansan]

25. Yes Yes Yes a million times Yes

:)

[Irish Girl]

27. In a just world, criminals are held accountable

The thought is certainly nice, but the majority of Congress have been spineless fools up to this point.

[Bake]

28. Hmmm ... impeachment = incarceration?

"I want them in prison now."

Impeachment simply results (at best, or worst, depending on one's perspective) in removal from office. Incarceration is another thing altogether.

Ain't gonna happen.

Bake

[petgoat]

38. Is that what you tell your kids? "Sorry, there are bullies in the world, and nothing can be done"?

"Get used to it!" Is that the message you want your kids to get? "Bite your lip
and accept injustice with dignity!"

"Congress is spineless, nobody cares about the Constitution, nobody will honor
their oaths of office, and that's how it's supposed to be"?

"You too can grow up to be President to violate your Senatorial oath of office
before you even swear in as President"?

[Bake]

54. No, I'm pointing out that impeachment does not lead to incarceration, ever.

Some people don't seem to understand that. Impeachment and criminal prosecution are two entirely separate things.

And I'm also pointing out the political reality that Bush is gone in two more months. You couldn't get impeachment done in that length of time, and it would make our party look like petty little people bent more on revenge than on moving the country forward. With the economy in the crapper, people care more about their livelihoods than about impeaching somebody who's going to be gone soon anyway. If Congress has the time to pursue impeachment, why don't they have the time to fix what's broken with the economy?

Hold them accountable? Bullshit. It would never be seen that way. And it would paralyze Congress and the nation. And we'd get our asses handed to us in the mid-terms. Do you really want to piss away the hard-won majority we now have? That's ludicrous.

Bake

[petgoat]

56. Bush will not be gone in two months. All the imperial powers he usurped will remain in the toolbox

of future presidents unless they are removed by impeachment.

This is not about getting Bush. It's about taking down the precedent
that will otherwise be established that torture, wiretapping, and
demonstrated contempt for democracy and law are OK.

How does that make us look petty? Why can't we explain that it's a
matter of principle?

Paralyze Congress and the nation? How? Did the Clinton impeachment
do that? You make up your facts.

[crickets]

30. Impeachment, International War Crimes Trials, *something*.

Something needs to be done. To let them just walk away is unconscionable.

[Fireweed247]

31. We cannot afford Bush...if we do not impeach him...

We will continue to have to pay him $400,000 per year for the rest of his life, and pay for his secret service guys.

[Independent_Liberal]

33. A little message to the "not gonna happen" crowd: Yesterday proved anything is possible.

Don't tell me it can't be done. We elected our first black president.

[mudesi]

37. Unbelievable, isn't it?

That there are still people who think it can't happen and/or think it's a bad idea, even after the election is over and there is literally nothing to lose politically.

[Pastiche423]

35. Her contact page:

http://www.house.gov/pelosi/contact/contact.html

[petgoat]

39. That's for her SF constituents. Citizens-at-large must comment at the Speaker's page.

http://www.speaker.gov/contact/

[Pastiche423]

41. Thanks for the info!

[onenote]

45. she just was overwhelmingly re-elected

her own constituents preferred her to pro-impeachment cindy sheehan.

You're dreaming if you think she, or a majority of Democrats, or Barack Obama, have any interest in launching an impeachment effort during the 10 weeks left before Obama takes office.

[RobertDevereaux]

44. k&r, god dammit!

[El Fuego]

47. YES!

[muriel_volestrangler]

48. It needs 17 Republican (inc. Lieberman in that) senators to vote to convict

Which are the ones you think will convict?

[LWolf]

49. Why is she likely to listen right now,

when she hasn't listened since she declared impeachment "off the table" two years ago?

[mudesi]

51. Because Obama has won the election

They have absolutely nothing to lose now. Nothing.

IMPEACHMENT IS NECESSARY. They have committed criminal acts.

[LWolf]

53. I don't see the difference, myself.

The election is an obvious reflection of the Bush administration. Are you suggesting that people would like his record better if we impeached him before the election was done?

[mudesi]

59. I'm suggesting he be held accountable for his criminal actions

Shocking concept, I know.

[LWolf]

63. I've been suggesting it since '03.

I'm still suggesting it. I ask again:

Why would Pelosi suddenly reverse direction and become a defender of the Constitution?

[Mari333]

57. out of sight, out of mind

people have too easily forgotten Shock and Awe, the thousands of soldiers who died for nothing, the millions of Iraqis who died for nothing. Bush admin should be held accountable. If not, a precedent is set that anyone can get away with what they got away with.
I am amazed so many have forgotten what he did and how many people his admin murdered.

[trayfoot]

58. This ship sailed a long time ago. Sad, but true.

[historian]

62. been there done that

from the moment she said no impeachment i have about 25 signatures demanding she do just that. Not even a response. I have a very bad feeling about her.