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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:13 PM Original message |
CIVIL UNION for all... gay straight, black, white, you get the picture |
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shadowknows69 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:16 PM Response to Original message |
1. That is what all marriages are by definition anyway |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:18 PM Response to Reply #1 |
4. Small difference from other nations |
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Why Syzygy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:15 PM Response to Reply #4 |
22. But, clergy can ONLY perform weddings |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:45 PM Response to Reply #22 |
41. And I want to take that authority away from them |
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Why Syzygy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:52 PM Response to Reply #41 |
58. I'm not in California ... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:11 AM Response to Reply #58 |
69. It was a red herring, but it worked because of how things are done |
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Why Syzygy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:21 AM Response to Reply #69 |
74. I've been posting |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:26 AM Response to Reply #74 |
77. That is what the domestic rights legislation tried to do in california |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:24 AM Response to Reply #41 |
98. You do not take power away from them... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:58 PM Response to Reply #98 |
111. Do you live in Cali? Did you watch the adds? |
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annabanana (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:16 PM Response to Original message |
2. kind of my take too. . |
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REP (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:17 PM Response to Original message |
3. I'm with ya and have been for a while |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:19 PM Response to Reply #3 |
6. Thanks and that is what the fist bump means? COOL |
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marmar (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:19 PM Response to Original message |
5. Agreed. Either marriage for everybody or civil unions for everybody..... |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:33 PM Response to Original message |
7. Legally, marriages exist throughout the world |
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gollygee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:37 PM Response to Reply #7 |
8. You need to copy and paste this in about a dozen threads |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:18 PM Response to Reply #8 |
49. I know. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:07 PM Response to Reply #7 |
13. You are not appeasing them, in fact they will fight harder to keep it |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:15 PM Response to Reply #13 |
48. Clergy is not the issue, |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:33 PM Response to Reply #48 |
51. Take my word, the moment you start the process to remove clergy |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:09 AM Response to Reply #51 |
68. This has not been done in other places |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:16 AM Response to Reply #68 |
70. I understand but at the very least we need to completely remove the |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 09:48 AM Response to Reply #70 |
103. I don't care if you remove the clergy from the legal process. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:52 PM Response to Reply #103 |
109. This should be a state matter from start to finish |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 02:19 PM Response to Reply #109 |
117. I am not mistaking it at all. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 02:43 PM Response to Reply #117 |
118. And all I am saying is that at this point sacramental marriage |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 04:34 PM Response to Reply #118 |
121. No objection from me for that change... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 09:00 PM Response to Reply #121 |
125. Then we fundamentally agree, we are working for equality |
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Ms. Toad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 09:05 PM Response to Reply #125 |
126. You're welcome. |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:49 PM Response to Reply #13 |
57. Marriage is a civil affair... |
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IndianaJones (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:39 PM Response to Original message |
9. I'd rather get rid of it all together than have gays participate? nt. |
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DrZeeLit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:44 PM Response to Original message |
10. Funny... that's what I was thinking this morning. Why not? The whole "union" thing is for taxes, |
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kdmorris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:10 PM Response to Reply #10 |
16. Marriage is not a church union |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:14 PM Response to Reply #16 |
20. It is not but the clergy has the RIGHT to officiate marriages in the US |
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kdmorris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:38 PM Response to Reply #20 |
36. I understand what you are saying |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:43 PM Response to Reply #36 |
39. Actually marriage was not a civil institution until the Enlightenment |
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kdmorris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:26 PM Response to Reply #39 |
50. Are you just talking about US history? |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:38 PM Response to Reply #50 |
53. Yes marriage happened also in 7th Century BCE judea... but I am talking RECENT |
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DrZeeLit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 02:06 PM Response to Reply #10 |
116. I think I'm following everyone, but if not.... (not being dense, just tired, I guess) |
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Gwendolyn (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 09:44 PM Response to Original message |
11. I must be dense, cause I still can't wrap my head around it. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:05 PM Response to Reply #11 |
12. not quite, from personal experience the civil union in Mexico is exactly that |
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Gwendolyn (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:39 PM Response to Reply #12 |
37. What in your mind is the diff between civil marriage and civil union? |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:48 PM Response to Reply #37 |
43. Word simply... very technically the civil union is economic and civil in nature |
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JackBeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:07 PM Response to Original message |
14. If there was any time in our history to capitulate to the fundies |
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gollygee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:08 PM Response to Reply #14 |
15. ROFL! |
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JackBeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:22 AM Response to Reply #15 |
75. Glad to see someone could appreciate the nuance. n/t |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:10 PM Response to Reply #14 |
17. By taking away their power by influencing the way we speak of this |
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JackBeck (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:12 PM Response to Reply #17 |
18. Gay marriage WAS legal in California. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:18 PM Response to Reply #18 |
23. It will be legal again, simply put, their overreached and this will have to go to |
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HarukaTheTrophyWife (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:20 PM Response to Reply #23 |
24. Marriage is a legal term in this country |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:25 PM Response to Reply #24 |
28. I will... my marriage was performed by a rabbi and it is |
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kdmorris (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:13 PM Response to Original message |
19. No |
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gollygee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:15 PM Response to Original message |
21. Fundies do not want gay people playing their reindeer games |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:21 PM Response to Reply #21 |
25. Yes you get it, why they will FIGHT this change and removal of all clergy |
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gollygee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:22 PM Response to Reply #25 |
27. Proposal 8 almost passed |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:29 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. Because this is not starting a new initiative. This will have to be done at a |
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gollygee (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:31 PM Response to Reply #31 |
32. You are kidding yourself if you think that will ever pass |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:35 PM Response to Reply #32 |
35. MY AGENDA? okie dokie.... |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:21 PM Response to Original message |
26. It's a civil marriage now. Changing it to civil unions for all wouldn't appease the nutjobs. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:26 PM Response to Reply #26 |
29. But they have the power to actually influence the civil world since |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:32 PM Response to Reply #29 |
33. No, people think there is a power attached to it. Each state determines the qualifications |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:54 PM Response to Reply #33 |
45. And if this is a secular state, so they tell me, why should clergy even |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 11:10 AM Response to Reply #45 |
105. It's nothing more than a convenience |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:59 PM Response to Reply #105 |
112. Sometimes conveniences have more into them than people realize |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 04:14 PM Response to Reply #112 |
119. I don't argue that clergy should continue to get this convenience. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 04:17 PM Response to Reply #119 |
120. Perception is reality |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 04:48 PM Response to Reply #120 |
122. I think most people who've been married know that the state paperwork is needed. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 05:31 PM Response to Reply #122 |
123. I am talking about people, the average joe |
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Gormy Cuss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 05:54 PM Response to Reply #123 |
124. Again, every person married in a religious ceremony know that state paperwork must be signed. |
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kenny blankenship (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:27 PM Response to Original message |
30. Most of the countries like that had revolutions fought in large part against their churches |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:33 PM Response to Reply #30 |
34. I know the history and in mexico it was not one but three civil wars |
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:41 PM Response to Original message |
38. Petty Semantics. There Is No Need. Marriage Is Already A Civil Law. Gay People Should Be Able To |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:44 PM Response to Reply #38 |
40. The semantics have meaning, and I support it, but I also understand |
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:59 PM Response to Reply #40 |
47. They Have No Power That Differs From The Power Anyone Else Can Have. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:46 PM Response to Reply #47 |
56. It is HOW they act |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:54 PM Response to Reply #40 |
59. You are capitulating to the fundies... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:17 AM Response to Reply #59 |
71. No I am not, I am short circuiting them out of the system |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:30 AM Response to Reply #71 |
78. Marriage is already a civil affair.... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:42 AM Response to Reply #78 |
86. Wait, you telling me that your marriage, would not involve |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:48 AM Response to Reply #86 |
90. WOW! |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:50 AM Response to Reply #90 |
91. Actually the conversation will go like this |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:08 AM Response to Reply #91 |
96. What the state calls it means a lot. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:02 PM Response to Reply #96 |
113. I am told that people are not married until they have a religious ceremony |
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WhollyHeretic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:46 PM Response to Original message |
42. IT WOULD NEVER PASS. No one would go for it and there is no need |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:52 PM Response to Reply #42 |
44. civil rights should never be left in the hands of the mob |
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WhollyHeretic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 10:57 PM Response to Reply #44 |
46. To say it would never pass is living in what I like to call "reality" |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:42 PM Response to Reply #46 |
54. Yeah well, in that same reality I would not have been able to |
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Maven (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:58 PM Response to Reply #54 |
64. You could get married because of a court decision which included you in the EXISTING INSTITUTION |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:19 AM Response to Reply #64 |
72. It is not foolishness, or if it was... pray tell me why |
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Maven (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:30 AM Response to Reply #72 |
79. because they are hate groups |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:36 AM Response to Reply #79 |
83. Wrong... they don't hate you |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:56 PM Response to Reply #44 |
60. You are the one ceding power. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:37 AM Response to Reply #60 |
84. Once again, what you call this varies from country to country |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:25 AM Response to Reply #84 |
99. Ceding language is ceding power. (n/t) |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:07 PM Response to Reply #99 |
114. Yep that is why the catholic church went to war in many places |
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sakabatou (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:37 PM Response to Original message |
52. And all benefits from marriage should come with civil unions |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:43 PM Response to Reply #52 |
55. Exactly |
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FreeState (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:57 PM Response to Reply #55 |
61. Including the benefit of calling it what it is? A civil marriage? n/t |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:32 AM Response to Reply #61 |
82. Some nations call it a civil marriage, see Canada |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:57 PM Response to Reply #52 |
63. This is so fucked up... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:30 AM Response to Reply #63 |
80. You are telling me that you cannot find a preacher that will marry you in |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:17 AM Response to Reply #80 |
97. I do not want a goddman preacher. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:24 PM Response to Reply #97 |
115. So why are you so afraid of removing clergy from the equation? |
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Siyahamba (890 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:57 PM Response to Original message |
62. Marriage for all is working fine in Canada. |
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SidDithers (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:02 AM Response to Reply #62 |
67. Sometimes the simplest solutions are the best ones...nt |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:20 AM Response to Reply #62 |
73. Which is EXACTLY what needs to happen here |
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Why Syzygy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Nov-06-08 11:59 PM Response to Original message |
65. I was searching Obama's new site for some good news on this issue .. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:22 AM Response to Reply #65 |
76. that's why you need the little piece of paper |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:01 AM Response to Original message |
66. We already have that. It is called marriage. |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:32 AM Response to Original message |
81. I am straight. Quit trying to take my marriage away from me. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:38 AM Response to Reply #81 |
85. Before the state, absolutely, your rights are not affected |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:47 AM Response to Reply #85 |
88. No. You are proposing that I would no longer be married. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:54 AM Response to Reply #88 |
92. Whatever dude, you are too married to the language and do not want to even |
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piedmont (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:46 AM Response to Original message |
87. Not just no, but FUCK NO. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:48 AM Response to Reply #87 |
89. you misunderstand, they can marry |
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piedmont (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:58 AM Response to Reply #89 |
95. There may not be a difference to you, but I think most... |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:40 PM Response to Reply #95 |
106. It works in many other countries |
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Gwendolyn (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:27 AM Response to Reply #89 |
100. Canada allows a choice, as we do. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:43 PM Response to Reply #100 |
108. That is because people think of civil union the way that many a states |
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ContinentalOp (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:54 AM Response to Original message |
93. If marriage is a religious thing then I want a divorce. I would gladly take a civil union tomorrow. |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:56 AM Response to Reply #93 |
94. Yet we have granted them the right to perform this civil ceremony |
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Luminous Animal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 01:29 AM Response to Reply #94 |
101. Clergy is not the only ones empowered BY THE STATE |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:41 PM Response to Reply #101 |
107. The point is CLERGY should not be empowered, get it now? |
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Independent_Voice (222 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 05:07 AM Response to Original message |
102. That's pie-in-the-sky thinking |
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nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 12:56 PM Response to Reply #102 |
110. You can call it civil marriage if you want to, or pink tutu |
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aikoaiko (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Nov-07-08 09:52 AM Response to Original message |
104. Makes sense to me, Government has no place in "religious marriages", but rather civil unions |
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DU AdBot (1000+ posts) | Thu Apr 18th 2024, 01:58 AM Response to Original message |
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