Attention ATF, FBI, or Secret Service agents.

[TWiley]

go to http://www.michiganmilitia.com/ You will notice two things. First, they had a "post-election" readiness meeting. Second, you will notice the statement "10 weeks may be all we have"

Before what? Before a Black Man takes office? This constitutes a threat against the president-elect of the United States of America. As a taxpayer and US Citizen, I demand you take action against these clowns or become complicite in their crime.

This is the same group that bombed Oklahoma City. Their threats should not be ignored.

Furthermore a racist employee at a gunshop - that has been called "the militia's arsenal" for decades - publicly threatened Obama after flying the United States Flag upside down as a signal to call for reinforcements. The fact that this employee has worked at the gun shop for 25 years should prove that the owner understands and approves of, his radical viewpoints.

It is time to review Mr Hamples federal liscense to sell firearms. We do NOT need mentally ill individuals or businesses, selling firearms. The source of the hard-core racist literature also sold at their gun shop should be investigated for potential threats.

http://www.record-eagle.com/archivesearch/local_story_3...

When you look at the picture, you will notice the little malitia man painted on the building.

[juno jones]

1. K&R! n/t

[MichaelHarris]

2. that's one horrible website

I can't wait to start messing with them, they have a Myspace page and everything

[Recursion]

3. "Are you now, or have you ever been...

...a militia member?"

Is this somewhere we want to go?

[TWiley]

7. no, but don't forget Oklahoma City

What is the best way to deal with radical right-wing politics? Palin was a brilliant addition to their ticket due to her appeal within this crowd. Buchannan framed the militia to be the bulwark against "anti-christian" government during the Clinton years, and we can expect a resurgance. Waco, Ruby Ridge, Oklahoma City, the Olympics bombing, Rudolph the Abortion clinic bomber, and others were a direct result of the growth of this radical sector.

Ignore them and hope they go away? Prosecute and drive them underground? I certianly do not know, but I do sincerely feel someone should check into it.

[Recursion]

9. Ruby Ridge was a year before Clinton took office

And Waco was planned by Poppy's team. But, yeah, we take the heat for them. Sigh.

I don't know the answer. But our stance on guns -- and I don't mean our policy stance, I mean our cultural stance on the left -- is just adding fuel to the fire.

[TWiley]

10. I dont know the answer either.

One poster suggested that the story did not warrent the hype I was pushing. I dont know how else to word my concern. Should I edit the subject line somehow while I still can?

[Recursion]

11. It's the firearms context that troubles me

I think if our party better understood what our actual record on gun rights was, we would be more understanding of why some of these people think the way they do.

[JanMichael]

4. They watch them constantly

Timothy McVey and his friend what's his name ensured that Federal agents would be watching them constantly. I bet they can't go to the bathroom without a note being put in a file somewhere.

God, I would hate to see what's inside their heads. I would have nightmares for years.

[Leftist Agitator]

5. 10:30 am: Gun shop fires employee

http://www.record-eagle.com/local/local_story_312102950.html

TRAVERSE CITY — Officials at a local gun and lock shop fired an employee for flying the American flag upside down as a political statement and using a racial slur to describe President-elect Barack Obama, they said.

Rod Nyland of Traverse City was fired Thursday from Hampel's Inc. after about 25 years of employment there, and about a day after he referred to Obama as a n-----, said salesman Jack Fellows and locksmith Tom Hampel.

"He's out and we've taken actions to apologize to the community for his action," Fellows said.

Fellows and Hampel, son of owner Karl Hampel, spoke with the Record-Eagle today. They said they were embarrassed by the incident and wanted to publicly apologize.

[alfredo]

26. The owner may be smart enough to realize that African American money

is as good as Euro American money.

[MadHound]

6. Umm, this isn't deserving of the freak-out that you're pushing

Yes, these people are RW idiots. Paranoid fundy freaks. But they are not advocating killing anybody, they're ten week project is apparently to go into survival mode on Jan. 20 because they believe that Obama's inauguration will somehow set off the Apocalypse or something like that. These people are not planning to kill anybody, they are planning on holing up somewhere for some indefinite period of time.

Oh, and McVeigh didn't come out of the Michigan Militia organization. He was more of a loner, though he did hang around the edges of the Christian Identity Movement, and drifted around the West and Midwest, but there's no evidence that he hung with the Michigan Militia folks.

Look I think that these guys are loony tunes, but they are not threatening Obama nor anyone else. The only thing they're doing is getting ready to hole up come January, and frankly I think the sooner, and longer, the do that, the better.

[TWiley]

8. well, even ignorant people are bright enough

to "veil a threat".

exactly what does the phrase

"10 weeks may be all we have" mean? hmmm, that sounds suspiciously like the time when Obama gets sworn into office.

[MadHound]

12. If you click the link and read,

You'll find out that it's a contest for who can construct the best paranoid freak-out survivalist scenario by January 20. Here's part of the rules: "There are roughly 10 weeks between the 2008 election and the swearing in of the new President. This contest will consist of developing a 10 week plan for your fellow citizens to prepare for the worst. Consider seven categories: Rifle, ammunition, food, medical supplies, transportation, field gear, and shelter. You will compile this into a plan and e-mail it to us. Package your plan for varies levels of available funds, and consider ways that you can effectively convince non-militia types to implement this plan."

These people are planning on holing themselves up for the duration, not shoot Obama. You're over-reacting, and by contacting the proper authorities with your paranoid suspicions, all you will do is alienate these people even further. It's due to shit like this that Ruby Ridge and Waco got started, something that Obama doesn't need coming into office. Let these fools fade away into the backwoods and revel in their paranoid fantasies, they're not disturbing anybody, and the only harm they're causing is to themselves.

[dems_rightnow]

19. Thank you for being sane

There's no threat there, veiled or otherwise.

[TWiley]

20. Interesting analysis

It may even be the correct interpretation. It may also be true that I am "over-reacting". Hopefully, the proper authorities will look into it, maybe they will even conclude that I hold "paranoid suspicions" as you suggest. I simply do think it would be prudent to investigate it. It is their job to figure this stuff out, and I am sure they can.

Not sure they will fade away if ignored though. Sometimes a situation is calmed down when positions are challenged, and they can escalate if left unattended.

[Xenotime]

13. I agree. This sort of speech needs to be taken down

Imagine what children who see this must think and how scared they will be.

[MadHound]

15. Great, another one who wants to take down speech that they disagree with

Geez people, I saw speech that was just as bad a freak-out on the left, here on DU after Bush won. All these people are doing is just that, freaking out over the election. They aren't threatening to kill Obama, all they are doing is repeating lies and bullshit, and preparing to withdraw from society into their own little conclave. Let 'em do just that, that's my thought, less idiots for the rest of us to deal with in the real world.

Sorry, but the First Amendment applies here, and these people can say what they please in this vein. If we continue to "think of the children" then we'll have nothing left on the internet except Barney the Dinosaur and other such pabulum.

[TWiley]

17. You can say "Fire" but can you say it in a crowded building?

Furthermore, I don't know the technicalities, but making "veiled threats" is also illegal. I would assume part of the defination would include that it could be interpreted in different ways. Remember too that the Oklahoma City Bombing was concieved, planned, and executed by their members.

You would have to step inside that particular gunshop to completely understand my concern. Radical political groups are one thing, radical literature is another, flying a flag upside down, is yet another, making racial comments to the media is yet another, placing all of these elements inside a gun shop lisenced by the Federal Government creates a totally different scenario.

[MadHound]

24. Where's the "veiled threat"?

All that is on that website is a contest for developing survialist plans, photos of gatherings, and meeting notices, along with invitations for people to come by if the feel like it. There are no calls to violence, no veiled threats, nothing. Yet you're freaking out on it for no good reason. These people have been around for years, doing the same shit, and nothing more sinister has happened that the fact that they've had to go to court for refusal to pay taxes.

Look, I can understand that if you're not used to these sorts of groups or websites, you might feel a bit intimidated and such. But the fact of the matter is that these people are exercising their First Amendment rights of free speech and freedom of assembly. The Black Panthers, Yippies, SDS and many others on the left have done the same thing. Do you also condemn their actions?

Sorry, but you're in the wrong here calling for action by Federal or state agencies. Like I said earlier, all such a freak out on your part would do is give Obama the gift of a Waco or Ruby Ridge type event for his inaugural day. Is that what you want?

Let these paranoid whackos go do their thing, and let them fade away. Anything else is counterproductive and unconstitutional.

[pnorman]

14. I (hesitatingly) concur.

That URL was defective, but here's it's home page: http://www.michiganmilitia.com/ Take note that links to Thomas Paine and David Thoreau are also given, as well as the ACLU on the Patriot Act!

I have NEVER been as concerned about the physical safety of a President (or President-elect) as I am now! I DEMAND that the proper authorities monitor such groups with the utmost diligence, but that's all --- ie: NO preemptive Ruby Ridge type raids! But hanging the American Flag upside-down falls within Free Speech! That it's been protected one-sidedly up to now, changes nothing.

pnorman

[Poll_Blind]

18. That's why they posted it at DU instead of actually contacting the FBI.

So many bullshit posts at DU like this OP. It's just masturbation of some bizarre political sort.

PB

[TWiley]

22. well, being the o.p. I do disagree

evidently, you feel domestic terrorism is a fantasy, and no threat. Maybe Lincoln, JFK, Bobby, MLK, Oklahoma City, Anthrax mailings, unibomber, Rudolph the abortion clinic bomber and other events like these were figments of a wild immagination commited by the sane people who did not belong to any radical organizations.

Maybe the purpose was discussion of something other than your bizarre masturbation fanasies.

[formercia]

16. I wouldn't worry too much

You can bet a good number are FBI agents operating undercover. Hmmm, perhaps you should worry....

[aikoaiko]

21. Do you really think SS, FBI, etc are not watching these guys, others, and even us?

:shrug:

[TWiley]

23. well they have not been very successful at avoiding

world class catastrophe's like 911, or the intelligence that justified the Iraq war have they? I thought they might need all the help they can get.

[RichardRay]

25. Oh come on, these guys are a complete flipping joke.

One petite Secret Service woman dressed to attend a formal evening event would leave them laying around on the ground wondering what happened. Do they have the potential to do harm? Sure. Are they realizing that potential in any meaningful way? Nope. I know people who are into this stuff, and, I promise you, they're an issue for the juvenile courts, not the FBI, the Secret Service or the ATF.

[MsRedacted]

27. But if you are concerned don't post it on DU. Idiot. That gives them more attention.

They might even get picked up by a search engine via this thread.

IF YOU ARE REALLY CONCERNED MAKE A PHONE CALL!!!! DON'T DRAW ATTENTION TO THEIR CRAZY ASS PSYCHO CRAP. THEY"LL RECRUIT MORE PYSCHOS.

BTW . . .I didn't look at the site -- don't want to dignify them or this post.

I wish a mod would delete this thread.

[PBass]

28. This is 2nd amendment-related paranoia on their part...

They think Obama's going to ban certain types of firearms. They think 10 weeks is the window to buy certain types of automatic rifles, etc.

[tnlefty]

29. I'm not surprised by the extreme racist language/literature. I try

to keep an eye on the groups that around me and who is friendly with whom. Yesterday I was looking around and found a really nasty bunch (Keltic Klan) that is Scottish/Irish. They have a link to A.R.M.'s, some of their friendly's in the US, and the Michigan militia was listed.

I found an article about them and in the body of the article it mentioned that they are monitored.

[Cetacea]

30. Please don't confuse criminality with mental illness. K+R

If they are intending to harm Obama, then they are participating in Criminal activity/intent.

If they are depressed and angry because they got their asses kicked on November 4th they should seek counseling from Bill Frist.