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It's not about morals, it's about government.

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C_eh_N_eh_D_eh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-11-08 10:11 PM
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It's not about morals, it's about government.
To our fellow human beings on the religious right:

We could argue until the cows fly home about whether gays should be allowed to marry, or about whether women should have the right to choose, and nothing would be accomplished for either side. Moral beliefs, ours or yours, cannot be swayed by debate. So instead, let's look at the issue in a more logical context than "is this or is it not a sin?", and thereby find a more convincing argument for why legislative measures like Proposition 8 are a bad idea.

The real question about Prop 8 is not "Is same-sex marriage a sin?", though many people on both sides of that question have framed it as such. The real question is, "Should the government be allowed to decide who can and can't be married?". If the government has the authority to deny marriage rights to homosexuals, then they also have the authority to, should they take it into their heads to do so, deny marriage rights to blacks, immigrants, Catholics, people making less than $100k a year, you name it. Why? Because Prop 8 opened the door for them, that's why.

It's the same for abortion. Roe v Wade wasn't about legitimizing abortion. It was about establishing individuals' right to decide what goes on inside their own bodies, rather than letting the government decide for them. If the government can overrule a woman's choice to not carry a child, then what's to stop them mandating that everyone have RFID tracking chips implanted in their heads, or that 90% of children born to Christian families be sterilized at birth? Nothing but their own consciences. You won't trust the government to let you own a firearm; are you going to trust them with this?

Much of America's history has been about people struggling against an authority that didn't recognize them as people. You don't think women, or gays, count as people? Fine. It's your right as a human being to believe that, whether I agree or not. But don't go supporting laws that say some people aren't people, because as sure as I'm sitting here typing this, sooner or later some politico is going to say YOU don't count as people, and then those same laws will be turned against you. I don't want that to happen to you, me, or anyone else, and if keeping that power out of the government's hands means I have to put up with people I hate or disagree with (for whatever reason) having the same rights and freedoms as me, then it's more than worth it.

Now, some of you may be thinking, that would never happen to me, because I'm a Good God-Fearing Person and a Real American. Unfortunately, the United States of America is not a theocracy, and its laws are not founded on a rigidly defined set of moral values. There are many among the religious right who would like to turn it into such, and they're welcome to try. But until then, the US government is highly mutable, with a rapid rate of staff turnover, and you never know what they'll be championing or denouncing a year from now. You don't hand someone a gun unless you're damn sure they won't point it at you.

I don't know much of the Bible, but of the passages I am familiar with, my all-time favorite is Matthew 22:21. Give to Caesar what is Caesar's, and give to God what is God's. There's a lot of meaning in that sentence, including the idea that there are some powers and authorities that earthly governments just shouldn't have. We may never agree on what's right or wrong, or what God wants us to do, but can we at least agree that the "gubmint" can't be trusted?
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bluethruandthru Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-11-08 10:17 PM
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1. Great post! Thank you!
You're exactly right that this is the way these types of issues must be framed!
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