30 years ago a high school diploma could get you a job paying $8 an hour

[Crazy Dave]

Today a friend of mine who works at chiropractor's office said she's gotten over 200 applications and resumes for a part-time assistant position they advertised last week that only pays $8 an hour and she said at least a third of them are from people with various associate and bachelor degrees.

[Liberal_in_LA]

1. An acquaintance applied for a low paying med asst. job. was told there were 400+ apps ahead of hers.

[Crazy Dave]

8. Yeah, that's the one all the diploma mills and late night TV commercials are soliciting

Don't get me wrong, I think it's a great trade but the schools only care about getting people enrolled and collecting the tuition. The commercials are done real fancy and make you think that within eight months you can have a high paying job with benefits in a field where there is a shortage of qualified personnel. The reality is after school they send you to a temp agency and you stand in line behind the 400+ apps. for $8 an hour which usually goes to "someone with experience".

[Liberal_in_LA]

9. Exactly. that's the type of cert she's finishing up & realizing how competitive the market is

[Greyhound]

41. "Competitive" corporate speak for another glut on the market. n/t

[Dr.Phool]

17. Haven't you heard? The airlines are hiring!

Yes, the airlines. That's what it says in my classified ads.

Must not be those same airlines that are cutting flights, laying people off, and going out of business.

[Crazy Dave]

21. Our local AT&T and one insurance company used to do that here

You'd hear about 400 - 700 people getting laid off then look in the paper and see that they were hiring with paid training.

[Vanje]

24. Sure!

....."and if you send a check or money order for 79.99 to a post office box , we'll send you a list of sure-thing of job listings."

[Lydia Leftcoast]

57. During the Reagan recession, I applied for a part-time job at a bookstore

and there were 200 applicants, some of them with Library Science degrees.

[Art_from_Ark]

66. During the Reagan Recession(TM),

I applied for a lot of newspaper-advertised jobs that didn't even exist! They just wanted applications! :banghead:

[imnothere]

2. Man, that sucks...And I went back to school and got my BA last winter!

LOL

[Crazy Dave]

3. Welcome to DU imnothere

And good luck :hi:

[imnothere]

7. Thanks! I am trying to stay positive because it doesn't help to wallow

I believe that things will happen for the best at a certain time.

[Vanje]

4. I work as a research tech at a university field facility

I have a BS in the field.
I make about 8.50 an hour.

[Vanje]

They should be ashamed to pay so low

and I should have more self respect than to accept it.

[Ozma]

25. But if you had no other reasonable choices....

Perhaps you live in an area with a lower cost of living, but at Harvard and MIT, the minimum they pay any staff is now about $11./hr including undergraduates for part time work. Of course, they can afford to, but someone with a degree usually gets more than $11.

[readmoreoften]

73. Unless you're an adjunct professor, then you really earn nothing.

At NYU, they said I earned $93 an hour for every course I taught. That translated to about $4000 a course since I was only paid for in-class teaching. I had to purchase my own class supplies, books, computer, etc. and at one point adjuncts were expected to pay for their own photocopies for students. One day I had to choose between eating and making copies of a journal article for my class. I'm not joking.

[a la izquierda]

82. adjuncting is a joke

those poor folks get such abuse...
most universities (state ones, anyway) are cutting them left and right to save money.
thank god i haven't graduated yet. and i teach in a field of history that is still in fairly high demand.

edit: thick skull because it's early.

[readmoreoften]

85. I won't do it anymore. I've taken other work. I'm glad I don't have to.

There's something special about being so horribly abused by a "caring non-profit institution of social betterment."

[kirby]

5. It is a high tech world now n/t

[Greyhound]

44. Look at the next reply. n/t

[SoCalDem]

71. High tech qualifications - Low tech wages..n/t

[Greyhound]

6. Same story everywhere.

I have a BS, top of my class (3rd), over 10 years experience, and I'm applying for entry level positions and going up against people with Masters and Doctorates and even more experience. I'm told that any technical position advertised gets from 50 - 400 apps the first day.

And "our" leaders are in favor of increasing the 401(k)/L-1 visa caps!:grr:

Yeah kids go to college, it's the ticket to your future (running a fast food restaurant).

[Crazy Dave]

12. And being in debt the rest of their lives

What a shitty way to begin life as an adult or plan a family. Forget buying a home too because it will take 30 years to pay off the $60k - $100k+ loans making $8 -$10 an hour at Home Depot or Wal-Mart.

But they do get a nice piece of paper to look at on their wall :sarcasm:

[Greyhound]

32. I'm not even worried about that anymore. I don't make enough to pay income

tax anymore, so there's no refund and I have nothing left to take.

They fuck all for their loans.

[taught_me_patience]

14. What city are you looking?

Why are you applying for entry level positions with 10 years of experience? Have you considered moving to a city with more opportunity?

[Crazy Dave]

16. Again you talk about what you know so little of

Pack up the wife and kids, sell the house in a market that won't sell, pull some money out of your ass for moving expenses and a new house to move into and then poof...you'll have a job.

You give piss poor and unrealistic advice even if you mean well.

[truedelphi]

22. I have gotten that advice too - it really sucks

First of all, this imaginary city with all the jobs, if it exists, why wouldn't a person send their resume into one of the Human Resource centers in that city via email rather than moving??

Second of all, the people who give that advice are usually unhappy with their lives. You and I are somehow a substitute for their unhappiness, as they imagine YOU or I making the move they are too scared to make.

[Crazy Dave]

27. Yeah...it's so easy to throw bullshit like that out everywhere

You also get the, "well I'm doing great so things are not as bad as you say they are" type attitudes.

It's like a show I was watching with these so-called "financial experts" a few weeks ago when the host asked them, "what should a person do if they just lost their job and are behind on their mortgage?". All three of these unrealistic idiots were saying things like, "they should start putting away at least three months of their salary" and/or "go back to school and get a degree", etc. All bullshit and all in their own fantasy world.

No wonder the problems this world has gets ignored for so long.

[taught_me_patience]

42. I'm very happy with my life

and that's why I recommend that option to people. I spent my entire life savings (and even went into a little debt) to move to Los Angeles. I spent $700 on a plane ticket (while unemployed) to have one interview for a job in Los Angeles. I left my entire family and friendship network behind (2000 miles away) to move to a city where I knew nobody. I know what it's like to make a sacrifice.

Los Angeles is a very transient city. I've made many friends who have similar situations to mine. They sacrificed their lives elsewhere to move to Los Angeles to make a living. They are also successful and happy with their choice. So... I'm offering advice that has worked for me and for many friends. I'm not delusional to believe that there won't be great sacrifices, because I've had to go through them myself! Also, moving to a city is not for everybody. It is a very competitive job market right now. If you don't have the desire, talent, or drive to make it, then you won't. If you do... then create your own destiny in areas of the country that provide the opportunity to do so.

[earth mom]

50. Funny, but my husband & I had to leave the L.A. area because jobs paid so little & rent was sky high

We moved North and it was a good decision in the end, but we struggled here too for several years until my husband landed a great job.

At this point in time, I'd say the job market everywhere in this country is part luck and part who you know.

Not education or job experience.

[truedelphi]

52. I am glad your move worked out for you, but I am betting that your situation did not include

Selling your home at a substantial loss
Pulling your kids out of a community and school system they are happy in
And last but not least, I am betting you are under 45 years of age.

When you are over 45, especially once you are in your fifties, you find it very hard to find work.

IF you have a degree and years of experience, they will tell you you are over qualified.

Or else that you aren't what they are looking for (meaning that your age will skyrocket their health insurance premiums)

[readmoreoften]

74. When you say you left your "family" do you mean "mommy and daddy" or "wife and kids"?

There's a big difference between being a recent college grad working at a university co-op and "leaving your family and friends" for a job interview and "leaving your wife and kids" to head off to LA.

Sure, most of us single folks here pay out the ass to go on interviews in other cities. That doesn't mean homeowners and married folks in their 30s-60s have the same options. Grow up.

[taught_me_patience]

83. Get a life

I'm giving advice that will maximize sucess for talented and driven individuals. I don't give a shit what the excuse is for staying in a shitty city with no jobs. If you don't maximize your chance of success, then suffer the consequences. The point I was making is that people can't expect to hang around their shitty home towns and expect high paying jobs to come flocking to them. There are sacrifices that have to be made and one of the big ones, in my opinion, is moving to a large city where there is more opportunity.

I was giving an example of struggles that I've had to overcome to create opportunity for myself. All you contribute is your fucked up judgement of my circumstance (of which you have no idea). What a jerk.

[readmoreoften]

84. So I'll take that as "I left mommy and daddy's house."

You're an arrogant prick and I'm calling you out. Who the fuck do you think you are? You have some nerve underestimating the sacrifices other people have made for their careers. What makes you think that everyone on this site is so 'beneath you' and that their economic woes stem only from their fear of moving to a big city.

Frankly, I've spent enough time and 'risk' on my own career to call you out. You have no right and your advice is the advice of a 20-something know-it-all. Cities are full of applicants willing to take "risks." One of the smartest moves has been to GET OUT of major cities like NY/LA and move to smaller towns like Charlotte, Austin, or Oklahoma City.

[Greyhound]

23. Already done, multiple times.

in the last 7 years; LA, Chicago, Phoenix, Portland.

Same story every time, get the job, build the department, 9 to 12 months later, train the replacements or just get laid off as it is sent to, usually, India.

And as a special parting gift, I get to pay for the privilege by financing for the corporate welfare to eliminate my job.

I'm Applying for everything, but entry level gets the only responses. What is really happening is the the jobs are just not being filled, they pretend to try to hire an American while petitioning for another H-1(b) slave. For example, I've seen the same job advertised at a well known shoe manufacturer for the last seven months.

What are you looking for, and where?

[newtothegame]

36. I would steer away from the big cities...

Even $10-12/hr is nothing with the cost of rent and parking in a big city. I have to pay to park my car while I'm at work, because there is no public transportation that works with my work hours. I'm paying to work!! While I understand there are more jobs, the big-city jobs are also the most likely to be outsourced I think. Thus, I've never understood moving to the most expensive cities in the country to try to find a job; it's kind of like the homeless that hitch-hike here to Iowa. If you are homeless, why would you hitchhike to a place that gets down to 0 in the winter?

edited for spelling

[Greyhound]

38. Because that's where what jobs (in tech) there are, are. n/t

[taught_me_patience]

40. Big cities are where the jobs are. n/t

[taught_me_patience]

43. That's a tough situation

Good luck. I wish you the best.

[PVnRT]

31. How do you move without money?

Just curious.

[SoCalDem]

72. You liquidate your "stuff" and keep starting over

:(

[JJ]

81. Beijing, or New Dehli?

[pstokely]

69. Doesn't a college degree make you overqualifed for burger flipping jobs?

nt

[Greyhound]

70. Well, from what I've heard In-n-Out is the best fast food company to work for and

I've foolishly moved out of their market. I haven't applied to any fast food places yet. I'll let you know.
:hi:

[taught_me_patience]

10. Where is this office?

I think that people have to realize that if they want to make more money, they're going to have to move to cities that are growing. There has been a shift in the labor market that is becoming more and more pronounced. The high paying jobs are in cities.

[Crazy Dave]

13. Uhh...it is in a large city

Sure, that's what people broke and in debt need to do. Just pack everything and the family up, sell the house (yeah right) and move to another city :wtf:

[Vanje]

26. OK!

Lets all move to Mombay! (Bombay)

[The2ndWheel]

11. There are more people, and most aren't needed

Your job can be outsourced, so that's access to even more people. Your job can be done more efficiently, so that's fewer people that are needed. Your job can be automated, so that's fewer people that are needed. If more people have a highschool diploma, that makes that diploma worth less, and the same with college, and any other schooling.

Human beings aren't needed as much, other than to consume the cheapest possible products(that can be made anywhere, by anything), so human beings are worth less. Economically speaking.

[Crazy Dave]

79. That is a very profound and very accurate statement

Maybe that's why people in the US are forced to pay tens of thousands of dollars (or more) just to stay alive or to even stay healthy.

I wish we could recommend replies :thumbsup:

[CountAllVotes]

15. 30 years ago I was making $5.00 an hour

and it was considered to be a good job with benefits. I don't where the $8.00 an hr. figure comes from. :wtf:

Btw - I had a high school diploma at the time and was attending college at night working on my B.A.

[Crazy Dave]

19. Back then you could get jobs with the railroad and various manufacturing plants

Hell in 1979 I made $6 an hour cleaning the floors at a meat packing plant part-time after school.

[CountAllVotes]

30. not if you were a woman

you were rather confined to doing secretarial/office work was my experience.

Hasn't changed a hell of a lot either I am very sorry to say (degree or no degree!). :mad:

:dem:

[Crazy Dave]

37. I totally understand now...sorry

:hi:

[Hannah Bell]

68. 1978: $6.16/hr, entry clerk-typist, Boeing. It was about $1 higher, & better benefits,

than clerk-typist for small firms.

[TahitiNut]

49. The Social Security Wage Base was $17,700 in 1978 ... about $8.85/hr

That means that more than 90% of workers earned LESS than that ... hardly a high school diploma with little or no experience.

http://www.ssa.gov/OACT/COLA/cbb.html

[marlakay]

18. Most of the jobs in my town now are at min wage which

is around $8.50 an hour here in WA state. But there are no new jobs...so??

[HughBeaumont]

20. In 1978, $8.00 = $25.00/hr in today's dollars.

More buying power for the middle/working/poor classes = we all do better.

Not a hard concept, unless you're a well-monied selfish greedbag bastard who thinks the billions and the toys will go with them when he dies.

[hfojvt]

28. that sounds like a myth to me

23 years ago I graduated from a University and my first job only paid $8.57 an hour. I was a GS-7. My partner, who got hired with me, had a 4 year degree in computer science and he started as a GS-5. So he made something like $6.70 an hour. Of course, we were also promised promotions every year up to GS-12, but he started below $8 and I was not much over it.

Of course, I did have a friend who worked at a grocery store and made $9 an hour, but he had been there for about 8 years and it is not like those jobs were easy to get.

[CountAllVotes]

33. I was a GS-4

and yes, I was making about $5.00 an hr. tops. It was even less than that when I first took the job - ~$4.00+.

:kick:

[hfojvt]

58. but did that job require a college degree?

It probably was considered a pretty good job too at the time. I know I was saving tons of money as a GS-7. Of course, I could not afford a house and did not have a car.

[CountAllVotes]

65. no, it didn't require a college degree

it was my first job. Starting salary was $5,996.00 per year in 1975. It was a crappy state-of-the-art job for a woman at that time. It sucked I must admit but was better than the $3.00 an hr. one I had the year before that that had no benefits.

:dem:

[nichomachus]

29. Well, the truth is

that 30 years ago, a high school graduate was better prepared than the typical graduate of a junior college and, sad to say, many college graduates of today.

[Blue_In_AK]

34. Today a high school diploma got Mark Begich a seat

in the Senate -- but he's one of the lucky ones, and no doubt benefited from Alaska's unique opportunities and his own exceptional qualities. And, of course, he came of age in a different time. He graduated from Anchorage's alternative Steller Secondary School in the late '70s and has taken some college courses, but never got a degree. He started his own business at 18 and has never looked back.

But I agree with you, the employment situation today is dire, and I don't know what the kids with the huge student loans are going to do to pay them back. A lot of them must question whether it's worth it to spend all that money for an education when there's no guarantee (or maybe not even a hope) of getting a better job.

[JaneQPublic]

35. $8/hr 30 years ago? Not where I was living then.

Thirty years ago, I had a bachelor's degree, and after 9 months of job-hunting, the best job I could find paid only $4.65/hr.

At least it was better than minimum wage. I worked for that while still in college, and it was only $3 and change then, if I remember correctly.

[Profprileasn]

86. Not $8 for me either

I started at around $5.50 an hour. Maybe it depended on the field?

[Cleita]

39. Thirty years ago, as a medical assistant, I would have told them to take

their $8 an hour and stuff it. No kidding. I was making $25 and hour. Even today, I have a part time medical assistant's job that pays $12 and hour and I only do it because I'm a retiree and have other income. I have an associate degree not a bachelors.

[Crazy Dave]

46. I understand

As little as 15 years ago the average salary for my work was $10k more a year than it is now and good health insurance that covered the entire family whether you had one kid or ten was only $27 a week through my employer at the time.

I've recently had to dumb-down my resume just to get called for interviews.

[Maine-ah]

45. Better off taking a job waiting tables

you take the slow nights with the good ones, but on a good week I can make 600 bucks. Unfortunately in the winter it's about 400. I don't have to claim all of it. On the nights I bartend I can make anywhere from 80-100 plus 7.25 per hour.

[Crazy Dave]

47. When times are good people drink, when times are bad people drink more

;-) :hi:

[ContraBass Black]

48. I easily made $8 as a high school graduate 3-5 years ago.

[Crazy Dave]

51. Yeah but that's what a lot of people were able to support a family with back then

Try raising a family now and buying a home with $8 an hour and with $70k in student loans to pay back

[sarcasmo]

53. Welcome to the new Amerika. 200 people for one part time job, scary!

[sarcasmo]

54. Dave, what State? Michigan it would be 500 people.

[Vinca]

55. 30 years ago there were all kinds of manufacturers in our area:

a shoe company, handbag company, paper products plant, book bindery . . . among others. They had been in business forever and people could graduate from high school, take a job at one of the plants and make a wage sufficient to buy a house and raise a family with no problem. Thanks to trade policies and greed, every single one of the factories has been run out of business by cheap, Chinese goods. The decent paying jobs are gone, replaced by service sector jobs. Want fries with that?

[sarcasmo]

59. You can't even get into a Mcjob here in West Michigan.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

56. Yes, and $8 was a GOOD wage 30 years ago

The minimum was somewhere in the $3 range.

Wages are ridiculously low. When the translation market was slow last year, I got word of a library job at the University of Minnesota. It required reading knowledge of Japanese and Chinese and computer skills, was full time, and paid, as I figured out when I did the math, $22,000 a year pre-tax.

The last time I made $22,000 a year as a translator was about 1994, and if I had gotten that job, it would have left no time for supplementing my income, so even with state benefits, it would have been a comedown.

Fortunately, the translation market picked up again. :-)

[bob4460]

60. I have a good answer I think

Only buy if made in the USA !!!

[Crazy Dave]

61. That's a scam these days too

It was on 60 Minutes one time how the Wal-Mart "Made In America" shirts were really made. They were bought somewhere in Asia, shipped here to a factory in the US where they sewed the "Made In America" tag on them and then put them in plastic sleeves for retail. Those two process or even just one of them legally qualified the product to be labeled and sold as "Made In America"

[Joe the Liberal]

62. That wont work though,,,,,

It's unrealistic, hardly any of the products we buy are made in the US anymore. Finding anything to buy that is made in the USA and is priced right, is hard to find as well.

[boomerbust]

63. Not 30 yrs. ago but 10 yrs. ago

I quit my non union job of 28 yrs. and I had three different companies begging me to come and work for them. And I was in my mid forties at the time. Became disabled in 2002. Applyed for a dish washing job last summer and was almost laughed at when I was interviewed. Ya times have changed as far as employment goes in the richest country in the world.

[buckettgirl]

64. Heh

I made $8/hr when I was 18 years old, doing computer tech support for compaq (we were outsourced by compaq). That was in 1999. It was the best paying, non-hard labor job for someone without a degree - shoot, they even hired some high school students.

I won't ever have to worry about being without a job. I'm an RN. I have a Bachelor's degree. There will always be a need for nurses, so I know I picked the right profession. But I cannot imagine EVER having to go to work for $8/hr again... EVER. That's WHY I went to school, and I just cannot imagine anything happening that I would have to go back to something like that.

I feel for those with an education that find themselves in that position. It must feel degrading; but I understand that you gotta do what you gotta do.

[Crazy Dave]

76. Put some money aside because...

I know a civil engineer who thought the same thing. The schools are flooded now with people getting various medical degrees and soon the job market will be flooded too. And since it's the insurance companies that actually run our health care system and dictate costs, like many and just about every industry out there laying off the higher paid and long term employees to hire the younger, in debt and more willing to work longer hours for less pay, college graduates, so to will follow the health care for profit industry.

[Art_from_Ark]

67. 30 years ago, in my home town,

with a high school diploma you'd be lucky to find a $5/hour factory job, especially if you had no connections. Store jobs were paying at or close to minimum wage, which was around $3/hour. You could probably get a construction job for $7/hour, but it was usually seasonal, and you could get the ax at any time.

[B Calm]

75. 28 years of cheap labor conservatism and this is where we are! Top 5%

are doing very well though! Yesterday I took an old contract union book into work and showed my right wing co-workers what I use to make back in the early 80s back when I was doing non skilled work. I'm non union skilled worker now and making the same kind of money I was back then. Too boot the cost of living today is a lot different than it was in the early 1980s.

[Crazy Dave]

77. A friend of ours this weekend said his father made $25k working for GM in the 70s

And his retirement is even more this day. Not sure what my wife's uncle did at GM 20 years ago but he made $60k. I heard that their new employees not only lack the job security their parents had, they're only making about $14 an hour these days. I can't point to figures that verify that, just what I've heard on several NPR shows.

[kojak]

78. PhD gets you a little above that

I just got a job at an electronics store and there were over 800 applications for 3 positions. The group interview consisted of 50 people. One of the other 2 who got hired was laid off and has been a network administrator 20 years. He has a PhD in applied physics. Job pays $3/hr and 1% commission selling computer parts and accessories. Looking at people's commission sheets, total compensation is ~9.50/hr on average in a very high cost of living city. Of course if you include the 2-3 hours each day you spend merchandising and off the sales floor, you make towards minimum wage.

[Crazy Dave]

80. Welcome to DU kojak

Good luck and thanks for sharing your story :hi: